Erfworld, The Thread.

[Coidzor]

I figured that though they had been losing, they'd been doing enough damage to make themselves into a problem for their neighbours, and, well, angering a large amount of people in a short period of time is rarely good for one's health.

[Killer Angel]

Originally Posted by Tvtyrant

I believe the "friend" will be Charlie and he is going to borrow money to get Tram made heir.

Could be, but Charlie is a mercenary, and after the battle for GK, he isn't exactly trusted by the coalition's leaders, so the word "friend" seems excessive.

[Mando Knight]

Also, most people won't lend you much if it looks like you're dead as soon as it's your opponent's turn.

[Killer Angel]

New text update

Spoiler

Ossomer + Archons = tough nut

[Coidzor]

Poor guy. He just wants someone to try out his jetpack.

[Sampi]

So, does Parson get to try the jetpack then, or does someone else?

[The Glyphstone]

Ace just gets better and better.

[Coidzor]

Originally Posted by The Glyphstone

Ace just gets better and better.

Well, you know, he's just in a place where he feels like he needs to be helpful now.

[ThirdEmperor]

Ace is awesome. It helps that he looks like Duke Nukem.

[herrhauptmann]

Originally Posted by Radar

One Deus ex machina (volcano) against the other (Charlie), so they had it coming.

I do not think that phrase means what you think it means. Literally, "God from the machine" something happens which had previously never been mentioned. Common example is the rich uncle dying and his will arriving just as the protagonist is sitting in the ruins of his home wondering how he's going to live. *Voila* Will arrives, protagonist is suddenly the sole heir to a very rich family member he never knew existed.


Maybe when they say "Never won a battle" they're referring to a city battle. Sure GK won a few battles against various field units that weren't prepared for an overflight of dragons, but never actually been able to take a city, or even hold one of their own vs a siege. I'd also guess that the 'quest for the tools' officially started soon after Stanley retook GK from the rebelling gobwins.

I'd say that there's such a distrust of charley, not because of his actions prior to the defeat of the RCC-1, but because of how Toolism is being hailed as the new faith. Something which Charley tells Jillian are just lies of GK when he first contacts her via thinkagram.
Though they could also just be afraid of trusting anyone attuned to a tool now that there's two on a single side now.

Has it ever been stated what the 4th Arkentool is?
-Hammer (looks like a kids squeaky toy hammer). Rocks out, controls dragons
-Pliers (needlenose pliers). Create and command decrypted
-Dish (big satellite dish). Possible powers: Thinkamancy, quick creation of Archons
#4?

[factotum]

Originally Posted by herrhauptmann

I'd say that there's such a distrust of charley, not because of his actions prior to the defeat of the RCC-1, but because of how Toolism is being hailed as the new faith. Something which Charley tells Jillian are just lies of GK when he first contacts her via thinkagram.

I think any distrust of Charlie comes from two sources:

a) We know that Thinkamancers have particular reason to distrust him, and they could easily be "influencing" the rulers of the various sides to share that distrust.

b) Perhaps more obviously, Charlie is a mercenary. He works for whoever is the highest bidder, not for whoever has the moral right (in their own eyes, if no-one else). That sort of thing tends to generate mistrust, because no-one knows if Charlie shares their views or not...

[Killer Angel]

Originally Posted by factotum

b) Perhaps more obviously, Charlie is a mercenary. He works for whoever is the highest bidder, not for whoever has the moral right (in their own eyes, if no-one else). That sort of thing tends to generate mistrust, because no-one knows if Charlie shares their views or not...

and, given the tricks Charlie performed during the battle for GK, the mistrust is well deserved...

[Stegyre]

Page 54 (comic) is up.

I'm thinking King Slately's friend is the Don, judging by how the Don is suddenly leaving the situation room with Bunny.

[herrhauptmann]

Originally Posted by factotum

I think any distrust of Charlie comes from two sources:
a) We know that Thinkamancers have particular reason to distrust him, and they could easily be "influencing" the rulers of the various sides to share that distrust.
b) Perhaps more obviously, Charlie is a mercenary. He works for whoever is the highest bidder, not for whoever has the moral right (in their own eyes, if no-one else). That sort of thing tends to generate mistrust, because no-one knows if Charlie shares their views or not...

-Hmmm, Thinkamancer influence, even if they're not part of a particular side? Hadn't thought of that actually.
- As for being a merc, I've met a few guys who get paid to fight (SCA, not blackwater), and despised or not, they're trusted to do exactly what they're paid to do. The problem with them is when the payer suddenly decides to betray or not pay them. (See Roger de Flor and Catalan company of the east)
-Plus Charlie thrives on his reputation far too much. If he's gettiing paid to do a job, he'll do that job to the letter (and enjoy it if he gets to cause mroe work for himself).

Originally Posted by Killer Angel

and, given the tricks Charlie performed during the battle for GK, the mistrust is well deserved...

What tricks did he pull that make people (not GK) hate him? Charging too high rates for service to Transylvito? Pshh. It's not like he's got set rates, he charges whatever he thinks the employer can afford. If they're desperate, especially rich and desperate, he'll charge more, just because he knows they'll pay.
All his other tricks worked against GK

I find myself in the uncomfortable position of defending someone whom everyone else seems to have agreed to hate...

[The Glyphstone]

Originally Posted by herrhauptmann

I find myself in the uncomfortable position of defending someone whom everyone else seems to have agreed to hate...

We're just all too Genre Savvy and know he'll turn out as the villain eventually.

[abadguy]

Hope Rob employs the Xanathos Gambit here :D

"Yes I knew the Thinkamancers were against me all along. This war was a ploy to lure them out! *evil laugh*"

I realised Maggie in her safari get up reminds me of Cassandra Nova *dun dun dun*

[Killer Angel]

Originally Posted by herrhauptmann

What tricks did he pull that make people (not GK) hate him? Charging too high rates for service to Transylvito? Pshh. It's not like he's got set rates, he charges whatever he thinks the employer can afford.

Transylvito wasn't the only one charged very high.
But i didn't say "hate". You don't necessarily hate a mercenary, but certainly you don't trust him, 'specially if he's known to raise the price of it's services during a war campaign, when you're in trouble.

Originally Posted by Stegyre

I'm thinking King Slately's friend is the Don, judging by how the Don is suddenly leaving the situation room with Bunny.

Indeed, Don was the best bet.

[NEO|Phyte]

Originally Posted by herrhauptmann

What tricks did he pull that make people (not GK) hate him? Charging too high rates for service to Transylvito? Pshh. It's not like he's got set rates, he charges whatever he thinks the employer can afford. If they're desperate, especially rich and desperate, he'll charge more, just because he knows they'll pay.
All his other tricks worked against GK

I find myself in the uncomfortable position of defending someone whom everyone else seems to have agreed to hate...

Charlie is hated/mistrusted because Wanda/Stanley are pushing their "The arkentools are the new Titanic Mandate" agenda, and Charlie happens to have an arkentool, so everyone is assuming he's on their side. I believe Jetstone was the main pusher of the rumors of said supposed alliance, but I'd have to go digging through updates to confirm.

[Gwyn chan 'r Gwyll]

If you look at history, mercenaries are rarely ever trusted. And with good reason: when they are trusted, a large amount of the time, they... mess up in some way. Sometimes they just decide not to fight, they run away, the decide the other side pays better, they sack your own village, there's no method of control, etc.

I wouldn't trust Charlie, just on the basis that mercenaries have no true allegiance, but to money.

[blackjack217]

Originally Posted by Gwyn chan 'r Gwyll

If you look at history, mercenaries are rarely ever trusted. And with good reason: when they are trusted, a large amount of the time, they... mess up in some way. Sometimes they just decide not to fight, they run away, the decide the other side pays better, they sack your own village, there's no method of control, etc.

I wouldn't trust Charlie, just on the basis that mercenaries have no true allegiance, but to money.

In erfrworld mechanics there is apparently no way to just give the other side the middle finger. Penalty clauses are apparently paid automatically. So he can't just switch sides without consequences. Also he probably has a good well deserved reputation as a mercenary provider.

[factotum]

Originally Posted by blackjack217

Also he probably has a good well deserved reputation as a mercenary provider.

If you can find where in the comic it says that I'll believe it. Nothing we've seen of anyone's dealings with Charlie suggests that he has a good reputation--Ansom pretty much used him at Gobwin Knob out of desperation!

[blackjack217]

Originally Posted by factotum

If you can find where in the comic it says that I'll believe it. Nothing we've seen of anyone's dealings with Charlie suggests that he has a good reputation--Ansom pretty much used him at Gobwin Knob out of desperation!

He has an excellent rep in the MK outside of the thinkamancers.

"You ever face one?" said Pierce. Then he held up his free hand and shook his head to wave off an answer Ace was forming. "Lemme rephrase that. You ever face three or four Archons working together? They're nuts. Daze you with Foolamancy, shock your commanders, mess with your mind... Maybe they can't do that much right now but their Foolamancy alone makes them hard to hit. We'd waste a lot of juice and arrows before we could shoot down that many."

Charlie provides elite mercenaries that can and do turn the tide of battle.

[Sweetie Welf]

Originally Posted by factotum

If you can find where in the comic it says that I'll believe it. Nothing we've seen of anyone's dealings with Charlie suggests that he has a good reputation--Ansom pretty much used him at Gobwin Knob out of desperation!

Charley's only good reputation is that he always keeps his deals. He only took Parson's offer after Jetstone willingly let him out of his contract. One can get a good deal with Charley, if one is smarter than him. Of course no one except Parson is. However, since most sides are lead by royals, they can't admit before themselves that they aren't smarter than him, so they keep on dealing with him.
From a meta gaming point of view Charley is that kind of challenge that you only can win by not playing. It was definitely one of Stanley's smarter decisions to never work with Charley.

[factotum]

Originally Posted by blackjack217

He has an excellent rep in the MK outside of the thinkamancers.

Charlie provides elite mercenaries that can and do turn the tide of battle.

That just proves that Archons are feared--it says nothing about Charlie's personal reputation.

[BRC]

Originally Posted by Welf

Charley's only good reputation is that he always keeps his deals. He only took Parson's offer after Jetstone willingly let him out of his contract. One can get a good deal with Charley, if one is smarter than him. Of course no one except Parson is. However, since most sides are lead by royals, they can't admit before themselves that they aren't smarter than him, so they keep on dealing with him.
From a meta gaming point of view Charley is that kind of challenge that you only can win by not playing. It was definitely one of Stanley's smarter decisions to never work with Charley.

Charlie always keeps his Written deals. Once a contract is signed, Charlie will always follow it to the letter. If the deal is as simple as buying a thinkagram or hiring a group of archons, you can generally trust him. Anything more involved than that, and you know he has an angle.

[Gwyn chan 'r Gwyll]

Mmm, true, I forgot about the whole penalty clause things. In that case, yeah, it's just cause everyone who deals with Charlie leaves with the feeling that they've just been played.

[slayerx]

Well that settles it, Slately DOES recognize Trem as the superior leader; not just out of all his children but himself aswell. He will make certain that if only one can continue on to lead, that it should be trem. Some major respect points going out to Slately for his heart felt plea

[factotum]

Interesting approach, but I got the impression Tramennis had already decided the fight was hopeless, which is why he sealed the doors to the atrium; if so, King Slately going in and attacking Gobwin Knob's forces is just adding to them via Decrypting.

[slayerx]

Originally Posted by factotum

Interesting approach, but I got the impression Tramennis had already decided the fight was hopeless, which is why he sealed the doors to the atrium; if so, King Slately going in and attacking Gobwin Knob's forces is just adding to them via Decrypting.

I think Trem only did that to hold off the enemy until he was ready... The enemy can attack at any moment and he still needs some time to make sure the king gets to safety... only when the king is safe will he decide to open the doors and fight, or flee the city. If trem had already decided yhe battle could not be one then he would not need to get his father to safety since the king could just leave with the entire army as they retreat.

[Killer Angel]

Originally Posted by factotum

Interesting approach, but I got the impression Tramennis had already decided the fight was hopeless, which is why he sealed the doors to the atrium; if so, King Slately going in and attacking Gobwin Knob's forces is just adding to them via Decrypting.

Don't know if Tram think the hope's gone, but if someone can still save the city, or avoid excessive losses, that's him.
If Slately is going to sacrifice himself and his troops, to save Tram, this will reinforce GK's side.