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Homebrew Design Roll up your sleeves and get working: there's lots of homebrewin' to be done! Post your custom creation for critiques or review those of your peers.

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Old 01-08-2011, 09:44 PM   Top  -  End  -  #1
Hyudra
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Default Community Based Monster Classes VI

Community Based Monster Classes VI

For the player that wants to play D&D and be a monster, there's often a bitter pill to swallow. Maybe you're expected to deal with a kludgy level adjustment? Or perhaps the monster class they've already put out there has less-than-full HD per level? Or maybe there's just no LA or monster class option for that obscure monster you're so keen on, and you're forced to throw something together and beg your DM for its acceptance. Whatever the case, you're inevitably imbalanced one way or another. The session ends and people will often find themselves thinking things would have worked more smoothly if that monster hadn't been there to muck up the works.

No more!

In this thread, you will be able to play as any monster you want by entering these monster classes as though they were regular classes. Huge stat bonuses and screwy HD have been done away with, monsters with abilities that would throw campaigns into disarray (24/7 petrifying gaze! Woo!) have been rebalanced and made suitable for play. Monsters have been tweaked for your playing enjoyment.

If you love these monster classes, like so many do, there are two ways you can help out. You can critique or you can submit new monster classes.

The nebulous goal of this thread is to create a playable monster class for every monster in official material. Is that doable? Maybe not, but it's a good boundary to work within. For people wanting to work on monsters that aren't from official WotC material, there is a spin-off project, our homebrew edition. This spin-off project's main purpose is to make monster classes for PEACH'd homebrew monsters. Make sure to check them out!

General FAQ
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The rest of the rules are split into three parts. Use Guidelines will teach you all the general rules for using these Monster Classes in a game, with specifics on changing size or multiclassing several monster classes (unintended by the project, but people are liable to try it anyways). Critique Guidelines will explain how you can help the project by commenting on other people's monsters. The Homebrew Guidelines state how you can help us by making your own Monster Class.


Use Guidelines

You take these Monster Classes just like you would any other class, such as wizard or rogue. Each level of the class develops your abilities as that particular monster. Normally you should take the first level of a Monster Class at level 1, but in some cases you might wish for your character to transform into a monster, in which case you can take it at a later level. After that, you may multiclass freely; for example one might take 1 level of troll, then 3 of barbarian, then a second level of troll, then another level of barbarian.

Upon taking the first level of a monster class, you lose all other racial traits: what this means is that while you may select a race in character creation, you lose that race when you take your first level in a monster class. You do not gain any traits or bonuses from being a race, as the first level of a Monster Class replaces both class and race. That said, the monster classes are typically a step more powerful than a standard class to make up for the lack of racial bonuses.

Growth Table
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Under normal circumstances you may not multiclass two Base Monster Classes. Below are some suggested rules should you decide to go against the grain and attempt such:

Multiple Natural Armor Bonuses
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Multiclassing Monsters
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Critique Guidelines

For any monster to be put up, it must be critiqued. By you! Here's how it works.

Monster approval is governed by a group of experienced or thoughtful homebrewers, known as the council. The council currently consists of Gorgondantess, Hyudra, and Magicyop. For any monster to be put on the list, it needs only to be approved by any two council members. The council is not a closed entity, if you wish to be a part of the council, send them a private message.

Further, the council are not the only ones who may critique-- we strongly encourage you to help others round out their monster classes. Especially if you hope to one day be on the council, you will only be chosen for the council if you critique often and critique well. Even for those not wishing to be on the council, critiquing others' work can improve the quality of your own submissions and may lead to you getting more critiques & faster approval of your own work. Someone who posts a monster and then doesn't post for two weeks while they wait for responses is going to get a less enthusiastic response than someone who is active and participating in the thread.

If you intend to comment on monster classes in any way, you should read the rules below and follow them.

Critiquing Rules
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How To Critique
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Homebrew Guidelines
Making a Monster Class is difficult, so don't think you can whip something up in ten seconds and get it posted. It may be long and hard to perfect it, but we'll help you through it. Follow these guidelines and you'll quickly be on your way. Remember to start out with Hyudra's class template so that all classes are in a standard format.

Submission Guidelines:
  • Apply for a 'license' before submitting a monster. To get a license (essentially an a-ok to post monsters from one of the council members), simply PM a council member to ask for one, and let them know that you have read this post & the homebrew guide/FAQs linked immediately below this list. If you already have one or more monsters on the official list, added since the summer of 2010, you are assumed to be a license holder. This is just to avoid people making mistakes that are warned against elsewhere.
  • Start small. If you are new to the project, don't submit a monster with a CR (and, as a consequence, a maximum level) greater than 5. Leeway can be granted (say, a CR6-8 monster), but ask if you're really keen on doing such. Long & involved monster classes coupled with inexperienced creators make for monsters that can take two or more months to wrap up, with constant revision and critique. Not fun for anyone. Learn the ropes first.
  • Has it been done already? Check that the monster you want to submit is not on the finished list, the unfinished list, the abandoned list or the called monster list. There's no need to put in the work if someone else has already got the job done.
  • Spellcheck, format check: Read over your finished work for errors. Ideally, you want to run it through a spellchecker (either built into your browser or copy/pasted into a word document), but if you've got a good eye for errors, that can be omitted. Similarly, check the design & format of your post against other recently finished monsters (Such as Saguaro Sentinel or Troll) to see if there's something you're doing too differently.
  • Be prepared to revise: Monsters that are submitted have to go through a review process to ensure we're putting quality work out there. For this reason, the council members will go over monsters and suggest changes.

A Guide to Writing Monster Classes: Copy-Paste Post Template, Design Guidelines, Changelog FAQ & Image FAQ

Last edited by Hyudra : 03-03-2011 at 05:29 PM.
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Old 01-08-2011, 09:45 PM   Top  -  End  -  #2
Hyudra
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Default Re: Community Based Monster Classes VI

Base Monster Classes
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Prestige Monster Classes
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Last edited by Hyudra : 03-16-2011 at 01:41 PM.
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Old 01-08-2011, 09:46 PM   Top  -  End  -  #3
Hyudra
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Unfinished Monster Classes
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Abandoned Monsters
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Called Monsters
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Last edited by Hyudra : 03-23-2011 at 07:25 PM.
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Old 01-08-2011, 09:47 PM   Top  -  End  -  #4
Hyudra
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Default Re: Community Based Monster Classes VI

Reserved post for additional details, new rules, news & featured monsters.

Previous Threads:
First Thread

Second Thread

Third Thread

Fourth Thread

Fifth Thread

Last edited by Hyudra : 01-08-2011 at 09:56 PM.
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Old 01-08-2011, 10:19 PM   Top  -  End  -  #5
EdroGrimshell
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Default Re: Community Based Monster Classes VI

Request for a class to create unique outsiders.
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Old 01-08-2011, 10:33 PM   Top  -  End  -  #6
Hyudra
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Default Re: Community Based Monster Classes VI

That's not really in the scope of the project, EdroGrimshell. If you'll note in the first post:
Quote:
"The nebulous goal of this thread is to create a playable monster class for every monster in official material. For people wanting to work on monsters that aren't from official WotC material, there is a spin-off project, our homebrew edition.
To everyone else: I've updated the list of unfinished monsters & called monsters. I'll wait until Gorgondantess is around with a minute or three to spare, and then we'll come to a conclusion about the monsters currently on the list (several are done, IMHO, but we haven't been able to do a proper council vote with MagicYop's unexplained absence).
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Old 01-09-2011, 12:06 AM   Top  -  End  -  #7
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Default Re: Community Based Monster Classes VI

You already noted the new unfinished monsters, I didn't catch anything you missed, but maybe somehow fit in the monstrous feats KB did (as well as the ones Gorgon did) in? Unless they're not in the scope of the project?

Dracolich, Shade Template, the original true dragons, shadow dragon, Yith Hound, Shadow Mastiff , and Vol were all requested.
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Old 01-09-2011, 12:13 AM   Top  -  End  -  #8
Mystic Muse
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I can't recall the advice for Illurien, I didn't see it in the unfinished monsters list, and I'm not sure where the advice is so I'm reposting her.

Illurien

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Last edited by Kyuubi : 01-09-2011 at 12:13 AM.
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Old 01-09-2011, 12:39 AM   Top  -  End  -  #9
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Default Re: Community Based Monster Classes VI

Hey, if you guys wouldn't mind throwing some ideas out for the Remorhaz, that would be cool too. I've kinda hit a mental block with it. Also, I'll try and have a review or two up by tomorrow. I've been slacking on that.
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Old 01-09-2011, 01:19 AM   Top  -  End  -  #10
Hyudra
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Antigamer View Post
You already noted the new unfinished monsters, I didn't catch anything you missed, but maybe somehow fit in the monstrous feats KB did (as well as the ones Gorgon did) in? Unless they're not in the scope of the project?

Dracolich, Shade Template, the original true dragons, shadow dragon, Yith Hound, Shadow Mastiff , and Vol were all requested.
Added the feats as 'other unfinished/uncritiqued content'.

Added more of the requested monsters.

Quote:
Illurien
  • Needs an image.
  • Bleh, 15 level class.
  • Source? Without it, can't look at the original monster for flavor & details. I had to look it up.
  • Telepathy out to 10' per HD is kind of crippling. That means not being able to talk to other people in the same room as you.
  • All skills should not be class skills. That gives you access to iajitsu focus, hypnotism, craft dreamweave item, and so on... skills with concrete in-game benefits that can really power you up. Also, it's the factotum's schtick that you're messing with.
  • The numbers in the table (particularly BAB) are screwy. Some are like +1 and others are like + 3 (with a space). It needs tidying.
  • Needs more flavor text in ability descriptions, so we've got a better idea of what's going on and why. You mention a tempest lash, but I frankly don't have a clue what that is, especially because there's no source listed.
  • I get the impression I already reviewed this, which is strange because some of the stuff I'm seeing looks like stuff I would've caught, before.
  • Tempest Lash:
    • The healing is perhaps a bit much. Consider that you're potentially delivering two 1d8+Str attacks, dealing 2d4 str mod damage and gaining 10-20 hp on each attack.
  • SLAs:
    • State, as you describe each level of SLAs, how many times they can be used a day. It's very unclear, as it's currently stated.
    • "The other mentioned SLAs are usable 1/day per spell level HD." is awkwardly worded.
  • Improved Body of Knowledge:
    • "purpose of overcoming DR and she simply needs to trance instead of sleep. " is weirdly worded. The trance thing is a thought of its own. End the sentence after detailing DR and then bring up trances after that, in a sentence of its own.
  • Storm of visions SU:
    • Ability needs a proper name, with capitalization (and if you're detailing (su), (ex), etc, do it consistently and use the standard formatting).
    • You mention watery droplets. I'm confused. Describe the abilities in a way that people who haven't seen the monster have an idea of what they're about.
    • "At 4th level, at the end of Each of Illurien's turns..." each should not be capitalized.
    • I don't like abilities that add a lot of rolling & bog down combat. Figure that you're 4th level. You've got 15 levels to gain to reach 20th level. To gain a level, assuming 4 standard, fair encounters a day, one must pass through 13.3 encounters. Right?

      So you're talking ~200 encounters to reach through level 20. Over those 200 encounters, in every single round, pretty much every enemy is going to have to make a will save or be dazed. Pass or fail, you're going to have to make the save again at the end of her next turn... that's a crapton of rolling. Depending on the number of rounds in the average combat, the frequency of combat based encounters and the number of enemies, you're talking 500-1000 will saves being thrown out there.
  • Home Plane:
    • I don't like that you named it for the player. Let the players name their own dark library.
    • Being able to transport to the library is fine. Not having a way to transport back is... inconvenient.
    • This strikes me as an ability fitting for a much higher level than 4th.
  • Infinite Knowledge:
    • Seems like a kind of overpowered version of Knowledge Devotion. The problem with skill-based abilities is that they either don't work at all (truenaming) or they're too easy to pump, granting ridiculous bonuses.
    • The 13th level bonus sucks. A bonus to AC granted around the time that AC really has started to decline in usefulness. I can't see smart players using it.
    • The 16th level bonus is weird and ill-fitting. I can't think of a better way to say it. "DCS" is confusing (Save DCs would be better, but still awkward), and there's really no precedent for an ability like it. Replace it?
  • Combat Expertise:
    • The thing about combat expertise is that, as a feat that's a prerequisite for so many other feats, it's one you take early or you just don't take it at all. As such, it is out of place at 5th level.
    • "If Illurien already has Combat advantage at this point, she can" ...
      What's combat advantage?
    • You reference cloud of foresight before the ability is granted, which is confusing. Consider moving the dodge bonus details to the cloud of foresight entry instead.
  • Damage Reduction:
    • "At 6th level Illurien gains damage reduction good equal to half her hit dice." -- I'd reword, as it's just clunky in the underlined part there. Look at other monsters for how they worded the DR entries.
  • Cloud of Foresight SU:
    • Ability name needs fixing.
    • "The miss chance increases by 10% every time she takes another 2 levels in the class for a total of 40% at 14th level. " - wording is awkward in the underlined part there.
    • So... I have 40% chance to dodge any attack at 14th level. I've also got the dodge bonus from combat expertise, so that's... 5%? 45% chance to avoid any attack. I'm also getting +5 to AC in addition to my existing bonus, so my AC is maybe going to prevent what? One in five attacks on its own? Seems a little much, numberwise. It strikes me that with some other abilities and/or concealment benefits, you're nigh untouchable (Say, warlock's entropic shield, as a start).
  • Improved Storm of Visions
    • Capitalize every letter of an ability name. So instead of "Improved storm of visions" it would be "Improved Storm of Visions".
    • I've stated why I don't like Storm of Visions, Dazed is actually a pretty crippling condition tacked onto the insane number of rolls being performed.
  • Knowledge Devotion:
    • Capitalize ability names.
    • What would happen if I, as an Illurien with skills stacked to maximize knowledge, huge int, int bonuses from levels in the class, item familiars granting +20 or more to the knowledge skill of my choice, picked up the Knowledge Devotion feat in addition to the bonuses granted here? Stacking! Too easy/intuitive to abuse.
  • Mind Sight:
    • Capitalize ability names.
  • Perfected Body of Knowledge:
    • Capitalize ability names.
    • "and to the fatigued and exhausted conditions.. " -- isn't a complete thought. Two periods at the end there.
  • Rejuvenation:
    • Kind of crippling if you don't necessarily get a choice in the matter. If I'm the BBEG trying to defeat the party, I'm going to kill the Illurien over and over, and run away after each time.
  • Perfected Tempest Lash:
    • I complained about the number of rolls with storm of knowledge, and I complained about the number of things that tempest lash got, goodie wise. I fear the experience tracking makes a full attack routine by the Illurien into a bit of a headache (You're rolling vs. ac, doing damage, recording damage to the monster on the sheet, rolling int damage, recording changes to the monster on the sheet, adjusting stats where needed, calculating hp gain, adding to your temporary hp pool, calculating XP damage, adding to your special XP pool... and you're doing all this potentially twice a round, several rounds in a row.
  • Perfected Storm of Visions:
    • Capitalize ability names.
    • Needs a bracket between the ability name and ability description.
    • Text is a little rushed.
  • Improved SLAs:
    • Too vague, a little rushed.
    • I can add, what? Two spells, period? Or two spells for each level?
    • The number of times it's usable per day is awkwardly worded.
  • Overall, needs polish:
    • Ability names should be bolded, capitalized, there should be consistency with use of (Su) and (Ex) throughout all abilities or none, there should be a degree of flavor text, the text is a little rushed and feels like shorthand more than proper descriptions made for readability.
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Old 01-09-2011, 01:29 AM   Top  -  End  -  #11
Mystic Muse
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I'm going to bed soon, so I'll address your points tomorrow. Thanks for the feedback though.

Last edited by Kyuubi : 01-11-2011 at 07:37 PM.
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Old 01-09-2011, 04:16 AM   Top  -  End  -  #12
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Manticore:

Might want to reread the stuff under the spoiler in spike volley, clean it up. There's a couple discrepancies from the editing.
Also, I was looking at some other monsters while reading this, and I was thinking... how would this stuff affect an iron golem? The spikes, I mean. Just think about it.

Skewer salvo: whuh! Again, the iron golem example: at 7 HD, you could just immobilize an enemy with one successful set of attacks if you took hooked spikes, so long as they had a move speed of 20' or less. The only thing that kept these spike abilities balanced is that it took so long to lay down more than a couple on an enemy. It would probably be better if rather than doing something like "max spikes/2", you did a subtraction. So, by 15th level, yeah, you're going to be launching a lot of spikes. This is a good thing. But 4 a round at level 7 is brutal- let the increased spikes start late and then increase at a good clip. Simply saying "2 spikes or max number of spikes minus 5, whichever is greater" should suffice.
Murderous impaler contradicts itself: there's a HUGE difference between ability score penalty and ability score damage.
I like launch impaler's new ability. At first I thought it might be a little too powerful, but then I realized it could only get abusable at level 15 or so, but by that time fighters become abusable. So, no problem. If someone wants to optimize their damage output, they can go right ahead.
Otherwise, looking OK.

Basilisk:
First thoughts... why does it get full BAB? And d12 HD?
Stone Eye:
Sedimentary gaze: it emulates a cantrip. A CANTRIP. Not worth a standard action when you can just be doling out 1d8+6. I mean, yeah, reflex save... but that only becomes an important thing at high levels. Actually, at low levels, lots of creatures have good reflex saves and poor fort saves.
Heavy glare: ...now I'm a little iffy that it may be too powerful, emulating not a cantrip, but a 3rd level spell.
Anyways, otherwise it's a bit iffy. Lots of rolling involved, lots of effects, lots of bookkeeping. I'd streamline it if I were you. Beyond that, at 1st level craggy look is honestly worse than sedimentary sight or heavy glare, and then at later levels it's far better than either! Pretty much everything in it is off, from the actual petrification (which keeps to the craggy look vs. sedimentary sight or heavy glare discrepancy), to the abilities. Good idea, though, just poorly implemented.
Eight clawed: Cool.
Tail Smash: ...Might want to be a little more deliberate about it. Maybe just "ignores hardness".
Slow Metabolism: good.
Geomorphic Gaze: I'd never use it. Battlefield control, yes, but pitifully low range, and small effects. A swift action would be better. Also, this obstacle mechanic is... odd. By RAW, you don't actually have to be behind the object for it to give you cover.
Deliberate advance: cool.
Subspecies: no abyssal?
Petrifying gaze: all really good, but... even more rolling...
Consider this: you take sedimentary sight, craggy look, and crushing glower. The rolls: attack roll, 2 different saves, some dexterity damage dependent on the attack roll, and then rolling for both strength, constitution and dexterity damage dependent on the fort save. Then all the bookkeeping for 3 reduced ability scores, part of it damage, part of it penalty, and the DR and hardness, and multiple different durations, and checking for petrification. STREAMLINE!
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Old 01-09-2011, 06:26 AM   Top  -  End  -  #13
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OK, I've added a few more abilities to choose from besides just a Divine Companion. Not sure how balanced they are so let me know, thanks.

For reference:
Lammasu
G. Protector
Quasi-God
Monstrous Feats
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Old 01-09-2011, 08:09 AM   Top  -  End  -  #14
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Default Re: Community Based Monster Classes VI

You forgot to add my entry on contracting lycantropy in the other thread. It's on page 26.
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Old 01-09-2011, 10:34 AM   Top  -  End  -  #15
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I'd like to try my hand at the cloaker.
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Old 01-09-2011, 12:33 PM   Top  -  End  -  #16
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I would like to request the Kythons (BoVD).
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Old 01-09-2011, 12:41 PM   Top  -  End  -  #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by radmelon View Post
I would like to request the Kythons (BoVD).
There are 3 4 Kython's done on the Base Monster list, any particular one you want?
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Old 01-09-2011, 12:42 PM   Top  -  End  -  #18
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Wow. I feel like a huge idiot. Sorry for wasting time.
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Old 01-09-2011, 12:44 PM   Top  -  End  -  #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by radmelon View Post
Wow. I feel like a huge idiot. Sorry for wasting time.
Don't worry about it, happens all the time (especially to me).
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Old 01-09-2011, 12:48 PM   Top  -  End  -  #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gorgondantess View Post
Manticore:

Might want to reread the stuff under the spoiler in spike volley, clean it up. There's a couple discrepancies from the editing.
I read it and reread it, and only saw one minor paragraph format that could be tidied up. One of the reasons we ask for critiques is because, after a considerable amount of time spent working on a monster, we're intimate enough with the entry that we'll overlook stuff. Can you be clearer?

Quote:
Also, I was looking at some other monsters while reading this, and I was thinking... how would this stuff affect an iron golem? The spikes, I mean. Just think about it.
I'll give it some consideration. The thought crossed my mind, I just wasn't sure what angle to take - my inclination was just to say "It'll affect an iron golem too, just refluff."

Quote:
Skewer salvo: whuh! Again, the iron golem example: at 7 HD, you could just immobilize an enemy with one successful set of attacks if you took hooked spikes, so long as they had a move speed of 20' or less. The only thing that kept these spike abilities balanced is that it took so long to lay down more than a couple on an enemy. It would probably be better if rather than doing something like "max spikes/2", you did a subtraction. So, by 15th level, yeah, you're going to be launching a lot of spikes. This is a good thing. But 4 a round at level 7 is brutal- let the increased spikes start late and then increase at a good clip. Simply saying "2 spikes or max number of spikes minus 5, whichever is greater" should suffice.
Thanks for the suggestion. You're right, I don't know what I was thinking.

Quote:
Murderous impaler contradicts itself: there's a HUGE difference between ability score penalty and ability score damage.
That's intentional. Note the 'further'. Each spike will subtract 2 con, but half of that gets mended when you yank out the offending spike, the other persists as ability score damage.

Quote:
I like launch impaler's new ability. At first I thought it might be a little too powerful, but then I realized it could only get abusable at level 15 or so, but by that time fighters become abusable. So, no problem. If someone wants to optimize their damage output, they can go right ahead.
Alright.

Quote:
Basilisk:
First thoughts... why does it get full BAB? And d12 HD?
I discussed that in the comments. I agree it may be a touch over the top, but it's ultimately a monster with little else going for it than the petrifying gaze. Pit it against an enemy that's immune and it's just got a substandard natural attack.

That would normally point to getting some fair Str & Con bonuses, for a creature with no fine manipulation or speech, but the hazard with con bonuses is that it's a creature with a con based special ability. If I give it 6 con over 5 levels, that's a +3 to all the DCs.

With Str and a substandard BAB, its last resort weapon (the bite) should at the very least be somewhat reliable, I figured.

I'll tweak it, though. BAB changed, strength bonuses increased in number. May lower HD size and give it more natural armor.

Quote:
Stone Eye:
Sedimentary gaze: it emulates a cantrip. A CANTRIP. Not worth a standard action when you can just be doling out 1d8+6. I mean, yeah, reflex save... but that only becomes an important thing at high levels. Actually, at low levels, lots of creatures have good reflex saves and poor fort saves.
Interesting, that last statement. Hrmm. I may have to change my approach here.

Quote:
Heavy glare: ...now I'm a little iffy that it may be too powerful, emulating not a cantrip, but a 3rd level spell.
True, but my thought was that you're affecting just the single target and you're targeting a consistently high save, which tones it down a bit.

Hrmm.

Quote:
Anyways, otherwise it's a bit iffy. Lots of rolling involved, lots of effects, lots of bookkeeping. I'd streamline it if I were you. Beyond that, at 1st level craggy look is honestly worse than sedimentary sight or heavy glare, and then at later levels it's far better than either! Pretty much everything in it is off, from the actual petrification (which keeps to the craggy look vs. sedimentary sight or heavy glare discrepancy), to the abilities. Good idea, though, just poorly implemented.
Damn! And I really liked the gameplay dynamics & flavor of it. Now I'm gonna have to find another approach to the ability.

Quote:
Tail Smash: ...Might want to be a little more deliberate about it. Maybe just "ignores hardness".
Doable.

Quote:
Geomorphic Gaze: I'd never use it. Battlefield control, yes, but pitifully low range, and small effects. A swift action would be better. Also, this obstacle mechanic is... odd. By RAW, you don't actually have to be behind the object for it to give you cover.
Reworded it from "These obstacles do provide cover, but only to creatures within 30' of it." to "These obstacles can provide cover, but only for creatures within 30' of it." Changed the range to be dependent on Strength bonus rather than HD.

Quote:
Subspecies: no abyssal?
Dunno what kind of passive bonus I'd grant in that department. Don't know it's entirely fitting as a subspecies, either.

Quote:
Petrifying gaze: all really good, but... even more rolling...
Consider this: you take sedimentary sight, craggy look, and crushing glower. The rolls: attack roll, 2 different saves, some dexterity damage dependent on the attack roll, and then rolling for both strength, constitution and dexterity damage dependent on the fort save. Then all the bookkeeping for 3 reduced ability scores, part of it damage, part of it penalty, and the DR and hardness, and multiple different durations, and checking for petrification. STREAMLINE!
Well, keep in mind that you're only dropping one effect a round, as a standard action. It's not that different from the manticore's spikes, in that respect.

I'm gonna sit back & brainstorm a new approach to the stone/petrifying eye abilities, though. I don't want to go the medusa route, because it's just so "doing the same thing every combat", and I want some flexibility in there. I'll see what I can come up with.

Preliminary changes made to both Basilisk and Manticore. Other comments welcome.

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Originally Posted by Betropper View Post
You forgot to add my entry on contracting lycantropy in the other thread. It's on page 26.
You're right. Added.

Might I suggest doing as is standard for monster entries, and putting an image down for any meaningful non-monster content? Just so it's more eye catching and comes across as a more serious entry?

So like, an image before the collection of monstrous feats, and one before the contracting lycanthropy entry.

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I'd like to try my hand at the cloaker.
Go for it. Added you to the called monster list.

Last edited by Hyudra : 01-09-2011 at 01:00 PM.
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Old 01-09-2011, 02:33 PM   Top  -  End  -  #21
mootoall
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Originally Posted by ScionoftheVoid View Post
Reposting the Gargoyle, which has been changed considerably since it was last given an official's critique (though not since my last request for critiques, for clarity):

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Comments are in blue!
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Old 01-09-2011, 03:08 PM   Top  -  End  -  #22
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Cloaker

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Last edited by Saidoro : 02-26-2011 at 09:26 PM.
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Old 01-09-2011, 03:19 PM   Top  -  End  -  #23
Hyudra
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Originally Posted by ScionoftheVoid View Post
Gargoyle
  • Don't make the creature name blue.
  • Class Skills: The Gargoyle
    ’s class skills (and the key ability for each skill) are Disguise (Cha), Hide (Dex), Listen (Wis), Spot (Wis).
    • There's an accidental line break there, between Gargoyle and 's.
  • Proficiencies:
    • You from the UK? Funny spelling of armor.
  • Gargoyle Body:
    • You state, in two separate areas of the text, that the claws do 1d4 damage, and that they get +1.5 x Str mod to damage. I'd just say they do 1d4 + 1.5 x Str mod damage.
    • You state "their secondary natural weapons (if any) add (0.5 X Str mod)." -- This may cause conflicts in the text of any natural attacks you pick up (say, from Horrid Monster or Creature of Legend) which might have different values.
    • Why is their natural armor so low?
  • Chiseled Armaments:
    • "A Gargoyle's form is constantly chipped and repaired, each time becoming more powerful." -- This is confusing and weird. Who or what's repairing it? Why is it becoming more powerful?
    • Butchery:
      • I'm being nitpicky here, but there's concrete advantages to be gained through this, beyond the natural attack. Consider that I could take 'hoof', gain two legs, and get a bonus to avoid being tripped.
      • The name Butchery doesn't quite fit the granted ability.
    • Oversized Weapons:
      • You need to state what happens to the claw damage die/str bonus/attack roll if another natural attack takes over.
    • I don't like all the OR in the list. It's visually distracting and annoying. Look at how the Basilisk lists the options, by contrast?
  • Ability Boost:
    • We're striving to standardize monster entries in format. I encourage you to look at other recent monster entries and see how they handled/described stat boosts.
  • Stone Skin Fortifications:
    • The effects on natural weapons seems out of place, given what the abilities purport to do.
    • Zealous Carvings is perhaps too good. That's a big bonus to saves.
    • Runecarved Body: Perhaps a little unwieldy. The bonus to damage is so small as to barely matter.
    • Reflective Scales: Weak at early levels (You can pick it up at 2nd level, at which point it's just a hide bonus), offers a very small window of passable benefit (Mid levels) and is then useless as you approach higher level (Where half of the enemies you fight are going to be able to see through your invisibility without a sweat.).
    • Metabolic Redundancy: Weaksauce. Consider that the anti-critical chance is so small as to not matter for a long time, (4% at 2nd level? 40% at level 20?) and criticals don't happen ~that~ often, so it's only going to help you out once a level? Twice a level? Then figure it's really only going to save your life or swing a combat in your favor what, one in five times? It just won't come up often enough to matter, compared to stuff like DR or a good resistance.
  • Freeze:
    • Most intelligent foes, I imagine, are just going to coup de grace the 'dead' gargoyle.
  • Improved Chiseled Armaments:
    • Not sure I like growth giving you free growth by HD. Also, the flavor of a gargantuan gargoyle is... weird. It kind of runs against the flavor of the monster & several abilities (ie. Freeze).
    • Visage: "If they fail the save they are immune to the gaze's passive form unless they leave the area and re-enter." What's this? Passive form?
    • Overwhelming Stench:
      • I wouldn't make suppressing it a free action, or you get some weird stuff happening. Make it swift.
      • You contradict yourself, stating:
        "Any two of the Gargoyle's natural weapons may also inflict sickening..."
        and
        "This effect is not added to natural weapons..."
        -- Be clearer in your sentence structure.
    • Petrifaction, I don't like - it's a whole lot of extra book-keeping and stat tracking/changes over the course of a combat. More when you're rolling the stat damage each round.
  • Carved Mobility:
    • I'd honestly just give it flight. Swim speed is so situational, and not many people are going to take burrow. The latter two don't really fit the gargoyle, either.
  • Stone Cold Metabolism:
    • It shouldn't be anything lower than a move action, actionwise.
    • Going from a free action to an immediate action is a downgrade, pretty much.
    • As is, you can turn to stone in response to an incoming attack, at high levels.
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Old 01-09-2011, 03:23 PM   Top  -  End  -  #24
Kobold-Bard
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Default Re: Community Based Monster Classes VI

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Cloaker

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Old 01-09-2011, 03:35 PM   Top  -  End  -  #25
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Default Re: Community Based Monster Classes VI

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Originally Posted by Hyudra View Post
[*]Proficiencies:
  • You from the UK? Funny spelling of armor.
You from america? Funny spelling of armour.
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Old 01-09-2011, 03:38 PM   Top  -  End  -  #26
Saidoro
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Originally Posted by Kobold-Bard
This might just be me but I hate stuff only getting 2+Int Mod skill points.
The original monster had 4 skills with listed modifiers and +2 int, I may increase it if shown a reason they need more.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kobold-Bard
Tail Slap is primary in the SRD, why the choice here? Too slow, make it 20ft.
The choice is because they later gain an ability to make iterative attacks with their bite and it seemed wierd to have them doing that with a secondary weapon. I realize it may well be too slow, I gave it engulfing leap and the ability to be carried more easily in an attempt to offset that, do you think it can be made workable through those abilities(possibly modified) or is the only way to have it not fail completely a speed boost?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kobold-Bard
Dislike the 24 hour part, unnecessary since they already get a Save.
The once every 24 hours thing is standard.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kobold-Bard
Make it only enemies. 6 rounds is a really long time, maybe 3?
The first part is probably a good idea, the second I'm not so sure about, it seems like the sort of thing you use when you have some sort of tactical advantage to stop them from hitting you, not an every combat thing. (I probably should let them continue doing it without using additional uses though.)

I'll probably wait until I've gotten a few more comments then change things all at once, Anyone else?
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Old 01-09-2011, 04:55 PM   Top  -  End  -  #27
The Antigamer
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Default Re: Community Based Monster Classes VI

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Originally Posted by bladesmith View Post
Remorhaz

Responses in Red

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All in all, a good first attempt. Some things need tweaking, but you captured the essence of a Remorhaz, and given it some unique abilities to up their game.
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Old 01-09-2011, 05:17 PM   Top  -  End  -  #28
mootoall
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Default Re: Community Based Monster Classes VI

For the Remorhaz, I'd make Ambush work, rather than as an ill-defined Fort save (what kind of bonus would "stable" creatures get?) you make it work as part of a bull rush maneuver.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Divide by Zero View Post
Hulking Hurler can get something like (10^83)d6 damage, which is many orders of magnitude greater than the number of particles in the universe.
Characters:
Spoiler


Homebrew!


Wow, it's been a while. Sorry for the unexplained absence!
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Old 01-09-2011, 05:20 PM   Top  -  End  -  #29
Hyudra
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Default Re: Community Based Monster Classes VI

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Originally Posted by Lix Lorn View Post
You from america? Funny spelling of armour.
Canada, eh.

Re: Remhoraz, or however you spell it, I love how it is getting all this feedback on abilities that the Purple Worm had first (and which were never commented on).
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Old 01-09-2011, 05:26 PM   Top  -  End  -  #30
Kobold-Bard
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Default Re: Community Based Monster Classes VI

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Originally Posted by Lix Lorn View Post
Good old canada.
Debatable, Canadian dude spat at me once.

And besides, have you ever seen a moose up close? Ugly mofo's.
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