[Hourglass of Zihaja D&D 4e] Heroes on a Sea of Swords OOC

[Grey_Wolf_c]

I've removed Enchant and Disenchant, and updated the sheet with the new totals. That said, I think the person with Knock should be Rahman - it requires an arcana check to be any good. I'll keep it for now, just in case - besides, it is cheap to buy and perform, so it's no big deal.

Grey Wolf

[Reverent-One]

I'll donate 800 gold for components as well, split however you like.

[Grey_Wolf_c]

Originally Posted by Reverent-One

I'll donate 800 gold for components as well, split however you like.

400 for arcana and 400 for nature might work best for everyday uses, but if you die and need a res, we won't have enough unless we pawn your armour.

That said, I'd expect Shadow Elf to want for each of us to keep count individually. Although on the other hand that might get messy. Still, if we are running after another ship, we can all pitch in 10 gp to get some winds in our sails, and once the battle looms, 80 to make sure our ship survives. It doesn't sound too bad, as long as we get some loot out of it to cover our costs. Think about it like insurance.

Grey Wolf

[Belthasar]

I just went to the shop and bought:

1000 gp of Sanctified Incense (Religion)
1000 gp of Mystical Salves (Heal)
600 gp of Rare Herbs (Nature)
600 gp of Alchemical Reagents (Arcana)

I'm not a ritualist but these may come in handy.

PS: I still have 800 gp in my pocket, just in case.

[ninja_penguin]

I'll have to get my rituals all fixed and in shape tomorrow. I do think knock would be a good idea, I have the feeling that Rahman is going to become our resident lock-picker as well, I think I'll pick up thievery next time a feat comes around, as that qualifies him for a lot of alchemy as well.

[Shadow_Elf]

You guys are aware that a ressurection costs 5000 gp at paragon, not just 500 gp, right? Also, I think that it would be just fine to keep all the components in one big pot - as long as everyone keeps contributing to the pool regularly, I don't see a problem with it being one pool for everyone.

[ninja_penguin]

Originally Posted by Shadow_Elf

You guys are aware that a ressurection costs 5000 gp at paragon, not just 500 gp, right?

Ayup. Cursed semi-sentient death gods!

Oh, and just a quick question: In the event of random shenanigans, would Spirit Idol function as a stop-gap if we couldn't get a gentle repose in, provided Rahman destroys the idol before attempting the res?

[Belthasar]

Originally Posted by Shadow_Elf

You guys are aware that a ressurection costs 5000 gp at paragon, not just 500 gp, right?

Hmmm... Good point. Then I suppose I'll trade some of the other components for more mystical salves. My purchase would look like this:

1700 Heal
500 Arcana
500 Religion
500 Nature

Originally Posted by Shadow_Elf

Also, I think that it would be just fine to keep all the components in one big pot - as long as everyone keeps contributing to the pool regularly, I don't see a problem with it being one pool for everyone.

Either way, we need to keep a sum of all of the ritual components.

[Grey_Wolf_c]

Originally Posted by Shadow_Elf

You guys are aware that a ressurection costs 5000 gp at paragon, not just 500 gp, right? Also, I think that it would be just fine to keep all the components in one big pot - as long as everyone keeps contributing to the pool regularly, I don't see a problem with it being one pool for everyone.

The biggest problem with a common pot is the logistics of it - someone has to be in charge of it, initially we will not all have the same amount, and thus cannot contribute all the same.

On the other hand, those are minor difficulties. I can easily build a table, stick it in a post somewhere, and keep updating it as we go along. My OCD tendencies really like that kind of accounting, so it's not a big deal for me.

As to initial pooling, I suppose we can all poll the amount the largest common amount, and we use that until we ran out, at which time hopefully our fighters will have enough loot to be able to buy some more... if it turns out we actually use the rituals, which when all's said and done, usually don't get much use in the first place (although maybe at these high levels we might; never having played past level 11, I couldn't say).

And yes, I am very much aware that the God of Death has progressive taxation ideas - thus why I mentioned that if one of the warriors with little pocket money buys the farm, we may need to pawn the armour to get his soul back.

Edit: OK, lets see if this works:

Moved to my first post in the thread, for ease of use and finding.

Edit 2: I checked Teshiq's char sheet, but I couldn't figure out just how many components of each type he has - I'm thrown off by the "Extra (name)" lines. So I'll wait until A'den clarifies to add his numbers.

Edit 3: Since I've got my table-creating tools out, I think I'll add one for our ship name voting, lest we forget about it

PC	First Preference	Second Preference	Third Preference
Reverent-One	Azure Mirage	Midnight Mirage	Blue Mirage
Grey Wolf	Midnight Mirage	Blue Mirage	Azure Mirage
ninja_penguin	Blue	Midnight	Azure
Belthasar	Blue Mirage	Midnight Mirage	Azure Mirage
A'den	Midnight Mirage	Blue Mirage	Rancor Mirage
Scylfing	Blue Mirage	Midnight Mirage	Azure Mirage

Grey Wolf

[Scylfing]

Um, I only put 400 GP each into Arcane and Nature components, and none into the others. I can offer up another 600 though in whatever components are needed.

[Grey_Wolf_c]

Originally Posted by Scylfing

Um, I only put 400 GP each into Arcane and Nature components, and none into the others. I can offer up another 600 though in whatever components are needed.

Oh, sorry, I'll change it now. We are not as short as I feared in the Mystic Salves department, so if you don't buy any it won't be too much of a problem (to clarify, I saw you had put 400 in those two, and thought to myself "hum, he'll probably not mind distributing them equally amongst all four. I better say something" and then forgot to actually say it. Sorry for that.) Actually, never mind that. not sure what I was thinking. I may have got my sheets confused.

Edit: I think I took the number from here, and then divided it more-or-less equally amongst all columns.

The rules for component use are: the "total" is the virtual common pot. As we use rituals, I'll remove from everyone equally. If anyone goes into negative, they'll know they're operating on credit, and need to refill their part of the pot. Personal uses ("can you disenchant this magic weapon"; "I seem to be dead, can you res me"; "I need to be able to speak their language for the next few hours") would be credited to the only person to receive the effects of the ritual, of course. I think this should work quite well, and be flexible enough that micromanagement won't be necessary.

Edit 2: Those of you that have bought potions, you could consider returning some of them and taking raw materials instead. With the create potion ritual, which I believe someone has, you can have the flexibility of choosing what potion you want as you need them (although keeping a few already crafted makes sense, of course).

Grey Wolf

[Shadow_Elf]

I would argue that a ressurection is only a personal expense if it is the individual's fault that they died. (i.e. "Oh, I have fire resist, I can probably wade through the lava long enough to reach the other side... or not"). If death takes place in an encounter, it is probably not that person's fault alone that they died (could be any mix of factors, such as an enemy shedding a defender's mark, me putting too many monsters/too many encounters, the whole party opting not to rest often enough, etc.), and the second case, where it is a group responsibility to recover the character, is probably a lot more common than the first case.

In general, however, my DMing policy is to let the PCs handle their own economics and wealth distribution strategies, so I will let you guys do whatever you want, as long as you're all in agreement. I really have no interest in meddling with the accounting, it makes my brain hurt .

[Scylfing]

No problem. Go ahead and put me down for 300 each in Mystic Salves and Sanctified Incenses too then.

And I quite agree with Shadow_Elf re: cost distribution for Raise Dead (unless, as said, someone dies due to their own foolishness). At 5000 GP it's a bit much to swallow for a case of bad luck, and we're all in this together after all.

[Reverent-One]

On the ship name, I like Azure Mirage, then midnight, then blue.

[Belthasar]

In the worst of the cases we could trade arcane reagents or other components for more mystical salves in case of an emergency.

[A'den]

Its right under my Item List:

Alchemical Reagents: 510 GP
Mystic Salves: 6090 GP
Sanctified Incense: 3715 GP
Rare Herbs: 0 GP

As the party cleric I'll keep my components in my bag of holding thus will have them handy should the inevitable happen.

Vote:
Midnight Mirage
Blue Mirage
Rancor Mirage

[Grey_Wolf_c]

Originally Posted by A'den

Its right under my Item List:



As the party cleric I'll keep my components in my bag of holding thus will have them handy should the inevitable happen.

Vote:
Midnight Mirage
Blue Mirage
Rancor Mirage

Could you buy some herbs, too? There is quite a few nature rituals that I will be doing - probably just in case, before a fight - that you will want to be part of (walking on water, breathing water, water gift, etc.). At least until we get on dry land, which may or may not be soon after the start.

Grey Wolf

[A'den]

Yeah no problem I could throw 400 GP that way.

Rare Herbs: 400 GP

[Shadow_Elf]

Hey, I thought I would do a little post about the various NPCs aboard The Adjective Mirage. Here are the main ones - you guys can feel free to make up names and whatnot for inconsequential crew as you desire.

Captain Shaur al-Farid

Spoiler

This vampire-cursed half-marid human woman has lived on the seas all her life. She has a quick wit and sharp sense of humour. She confides in few, except her first mate, Caal One-Eye. She wears a three-pointed hat on her bald head, and wears a necklace featuring teeth of various sizes - everything from the teeth of crocodiles from The Provider's Oasis to sharks of the ocean, and including the fangs of the vampire that assaulted her mother while Shaur was still in the womb. Her skin is blue, and she favours the shamshir as her weapon.

First Mate Call One-Eye

Spoiler

This eyepatch-wearing lizardfolk man is staunchly devoted to his captain. He is quiet and reserved, but stern, and he favours a pair of mean cutlasses.

Cook "Duke"

Spoiler

The chubby human with the cheery disposition is known only as "Duke" by the crew. He is proud of every meal he puts on the table for the hard working crew and takes his job very seriously. If he had to fight, he'd probably favour a cleaver.

Quartermaster Kalam Delat

Spoiler

An ex-assassin turned militant manager, this sleek, dark-furred gnoll has a murderous gleam in his eye. He seems to owe the captain for some past deed, but he doesn't resent it - it is clear the mysterious man holds naught but respect for her. For his suboordinates... suffice to say, they stay in line when this predatory official is on the deck.

[Grey_Wolf_c]

Originally Posted by Shadow_Elf

Hey, I thought I would do a little post about the various NPCs aboard The Adjective Mirage. Here are the main ones - you guys can feel free to make up names and whatnot for inconsequential crew as you desire.

How big a ship are we talking about here? One, two or three-mast? Square sails or triangular? Crew size?

Also, I was meaning to ask, how technological is this world? I'm assuming pre-gunpowder, in which case ship-to-ship combat will be a matter of boarding and ballistas, but confirmation would be appreciated.

Grey Wolf

[ninja_penguin]

All right, so I've removed Enhance Vessel, endure elements, summon winds, and water breathing. That frees up 1,905 gold. Then I added knock, which takes 175, so I think that leaves me with 1,730 gold remaining. Tack that onto the 1,200 I'd put aside earlier gives me 2930 gold.

So let's go with 1,400 Alchemical reagents, 600 rare herbs, 600 mystic salves. I'll keep the remaining 330 around for random expenses.

Also, vote preference: Blue > Midnight > Azure

[Shadow_Elf]

Okay, I decided to use the following system to determine the winner of the ship name vote: First pick is worth 2 points, second is worth 1, third is worth zero. Under this system, the result is a tie, between The Blue Mirage and The Midnight Mirage. Like Grey Wolf C, I'm a sucker for alliteration, so I'll be choosing The Midnight Mirage in the tie breaker, barring any complaints about my scoring system.

In addition, I have not though out all of the details of the ship, but I am thinking square sails, two or three masts (leaning towards three) and 30-40 crew + Hunters and Officers, which makes 40-50 crew overall. How does that sound, for those more nautically savvy than I?

I expect to have the IC thread up within the next few days, possibly even tonight.

[Grey_Wolf_c]

Originally Posted by Shadow_Elf

In addition, I have not though out all of the details of the ship, but I am thinking square sails, two or three masts (leaning towards three) and 30-40 crew + Hunters and Officers, which makes 40-50 crew overall. How does that sound, for those more nautically savvy than I?

I have no nautical knowledge at all, but this is the Internet, so I went googling for answers. I was interested to discover that the standard trading ship for the time period was the carrack, which came in all shapes and sizes (eventually, the carrack type evolved into the galleon). This guy has plenty of info on the subject (search for carrack to get to the appropriate point). The biggest he describes is a British behemoth of a ship: The Mary Rose. 105 feet long, 37 feet wide, 1500 tons. Main mast was 114 feet tall and 9 feet in circumference. It had some 500 crew.

On the other end of the scale was the more famous (to me, anyway) caravel. This was a much smaller and lighter ship, far more suitable for pirate hunting, I think. It also evolved from an arabian ship (the qârib), so it is very appropriate to the setting. It seems they could be big enough for three masts, and depending on the need would have triangular sails for enhanced maneuverability or square for speed. A two-mast ship would have a crew of about 20 (Columbus' Pinta and Niña had 20 each), so that's smaller than what you are looking for. But since the Midnight Mirage is probably not rigged for transoceanic voyages, it can afford to be bigger, smaller (proportional) hold and carry more personnel.

A quick search for caravel crews keeps bringing up Columbus' ships, though, so I'm uncertain how much crew the largest ones would carry, but I would say it is perfectly reasonable that a pirate hunter ship that was three masts could easily carry 40 people (Columbus carried 40 people on his second trip, most of them colonists).

Edit: I moved the Ritual Components table to my first post of the thread, to make it easier to find in the future.

Grey Wolf

[Scylfing]

Hmm. I wouldn't want to try to fit 40-50 people into a vessel that's still only about 60' long and 20' wide. A crew of 20 with 4 officers and 6 marines seems about right for a caravel, while 40-50 would be more appropriate for a 250-ton carrack or galleon, and since we're presumably not looking at ships outfitted with cannons here, we probably don't need to go with the larger category.

Rigging would most likely be square front and mainsails with a lanteen mizzen for speed and maneuverability.

[Shadow_Elf]

The IC Thread is up! Here we go for real now! Make sure you all subscribe to both threads and find a way that works for you to keep yourself appraised of what's going on, because I intend for this to keep moving at a respectable pace.

EDIT: As for crew, 20 sounds about right. I was really just making up numbers off the top of my head. And the carrack sounds like the ship for us. All of the officers except Cook are also combat capable, but the Hunters are, obviously, going to be doing most of the battling. The ship is equipped with a single ballista on the foredeck, equipped to fire either hull-piercing bolts or alchemical weapons.

[Grey_Wolf_c]

I was going to introduce this in IC, but when it came time to do it I realised that it would require someone else to be in on it, so I might as well do it here:

Anyone that is in Amirah's line of view can request telepathic talk by some subtle hand signal (I'm thinking two fingers to the temple). Amirah will send a brief "Yes?" which opens communication. Given that Amirah has passive perception 28, she wouldn't miss that. This would be particularly useful when she is up in the Crow's Nest, because then no-one need shout, but it obviously can be very useful in many other situations.

Also, unless the conversation is private, Amirah will project it to everyone in the vicinity, so even if I am talking to, say, Medinah, anyone can join in, unless otherwise indicated. This is mostly a practical thing, so that no-one feels excluded.

I suspect that in a tense situation (i.e. battle) an argument could be done that she wouldn't have the time to individually project to everyone what everyone else is saying (although, on the other hand, traditionally telepathy communication is much quicker), so I'll let Shadow Elf rule on that one, and in the mean time only abuse telepathy in character-driven (non-urgent) role-play.

Finally, Amirah at some points will be talking about her swarm as a group of individuals. I'll try to make it clear from context, but to help I will also write "we" with a capital letter (as I did here).

Edit: Re: Ship

I would think that a Carrack would be too unwieldly to be a good pirate-hunting ship. Also, once you've reduced the crew size, even a 2-mast caravel would be quite big enough (and would be faster and more maneuverable than any carrack, if I'm reading the wiki right).

Grey Wolf

[Scylfing]

I was wondering about that--the requesting telepathic conversation thing--so I'm glad you mentioned it, good idea.

[Shadow_Elf]

I'm thinking that there has to be some limits on the telepathy, because she's not getting it from any mechanical source, right? Provided none of her feats/class features/equipment provide actual telepathy, she has the following limitations:

- She must make a Stealth or Bluff check opposed by the higher of Passive Insight or Perception from those around her to hold a private telepathic link
- She can only communicate with things she can see telepathically
- She can only communicate in her known languages, even telepathically

Does that sound fair?

Also, once you guys actually start going place, I will do my job and help things along, but while you're all on the ship, there's not much I can work with. Feel free to use the City of God entries in the campaign setting for inspiration on where your characters go.

Additionally: Minor Quest Acquired!

Quest: Explore Muarzibet!
Details: Spend a day preparing for the voyage ahead in any way you see fit.
Rewards: Quest XP!

[Grey_Wolf_c]

Originally Posted by Shadow_Elf

I'm thinking that there has to be some limits on the telepathy, because she's not getting it from any mechanical source, right? Provided none of her feats/class features/equipment provide actual telepathy, she has the following limitations:

- She must make a Stealth or Bluff check opposed by the higher of Passive Insight or Perception from those around her to hold a private telepathic link
- She can only communicate with things she can see telepathically
- She can only communicate in her known languages, even telepathically

Does that sound fair?

Also, once you guys actually start going place, I will do my job and help things along, but while you're all on the ship, there's not much I can work with. Feel free to use the City of God entries in the campaign setting for inspiration on where your characters go.

Additionally: Minor Quest Acquired!

Errr... It is mechanical. It wouldn't cross my mind to give her such a powerful ability without backing it. The power comes from her Medallion of the Mind (AV2 68 lvl 14):

Property: You gain an item bonus to Insight checks equal to the medallion's enhancement bonus. Property: You can communicate telepathically with any
creature you can see. Those willing to communicate with you can send thoughts back to you, allowing two-way communication. This telepathic communication fulfills the requirement of a class feature or power that a target be able to hear you.
Power (Daily): Free Action.
Trigger: An enemy you grant combat advantage to hits or misses you.
Effect: The triggering enemy grants combat advantage to your allies until the start of your next turn.

Other than that, well, I agree with points two and three (well, two is a given, since it's part of the item's description), but hopefully you won't force point one now that it is mechanical-backed.

Grey Wolf

[Shadow_Elf]

Oh, I am so sorry. I assumed it was just a fluff piece you wanted for the character concept, and I did not realize that you'd gotten an actual item to do the trick. The only issue I see there is that to maintain the character concept, you'll have to always have a Medallion of the Mind, but that's manageable.

Sorry for the mix-up .