Yesterday was my first DnD game and I absolutely loved it, I leveled up and now I would like to start building my halfling roge in a more sensible manner, the problem is that I have really no idea and with the wave of choices I have it's a little bit overwhelming. We are playing 4th edition and my current build is as follows: Tyche Dandelion, level 2
Halfling, Rogue
Rogue Tactics: Artful Dodger
Rogue: Rogue Weapon Talent
FINAL ABILITY SCORES
Str 8, Con 13, Dex 18, Int 10, Wis 13, Cha 17.
Now I need to choose a new Feat and a new Power and I don't know where to begin, I also have 208gp to spend on the shop so any help will be greatly appreciate it.
First, I recommend retraining Sly Flourish for Deft Strike, as it is probably the most versatile Rogue At-will (unless you take Acrobatic Strike and Mark of Passage feat).
For your level 2 utility power, take Agile Recovery. It turns standing from prone from a move action to a minor action, whenever you want. This will save you time for the rest of your career.
As for your feat, there are quite a few you could take. If you're using the new character builder and the new essentials material, take Master at Arms. It gives you a +1 bonus to hit (with "Weapon" keyword attacks, i.e. all of yours) by tier (+1 heroic, +2 paragon, +3 epic) and you can switch weapons as a minor action. If you're not using Essentials, take Versatile Expertise and choose (light blade) and (crossbow). Gives the same bonus as Master at Arms, but no minor action switching.
And speaking of crossbows, buy one! While yes, you can throw daggers, a crossbow would do more damage and go further.
Thank you for your advice I will retrain and take your recommendations to level up there are so many choices that is difficult to see what is really useful.
Is the crossbow better than the sling? I got a sling because I thought it will allow me to shoot ammunition like stones when I run out of sling ammo, or that is not allowed?
Running out of ammo shouldn't really be a problem. AFAIK, there aren't rules for ammunition breaking like in 3.5, so you can just say you retrieve all your bolts after battle (unless the guys you hit/killed fell in lava, ran off, etc, thus making you unable to retrieve said bolts). Buy 20 or 30 bolts and you should be set. That said, there are a couple magical properties for bows that create their own ammunition, although I can't think of their names off-hand.
So, yes, crossbow is better than sling, based purely on damage.
Is the crossbow better than the sling? I got a sling because I thought it will allow me to shoot ammunition like stones when I run out of sling ammo, or that is not allowed?
Dagger > Crossbow > Sling.
If they are within range, the dagger is best. If not, a crossbow is a serviceable back-up. If you are carrying around a sling then I would like to sell you a piece of the Statue of Liberty!
Actually, let me just simplify things for you. Rather than me telling you everything that is good, bad, evil, or really sexy, I shall give you a link. Read the first 1 or 2 pages and that will help you on your way to smiting bad guys like a pro.
Good luck!
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I am a:
Lawful Neutral Elf Wizard/Sorcerer (3rd/2nd Level)
Ability Scores:
Strength- 12
Dexterity- 19
Constitution- 13
Intelligence- 17
Wisdom- 12
Charisma- 16
Link here
If you're not using Essentials, take Versatile Expertise and choose (light blade) and (crossbow). Gives the same bonus as Master at Arms, but no minor action switching.
Unless there was an update I missed, there's a problem here. Versitile Expertise allows you to select a weapon group and type of implement, not two weapon groups.
Unless there was an update I missed, there's a problem here. Versitile Expertise allows you to select a weapon group and type of implement, not two weapon groups.
Light Blade is an implement type. The feat never specifies whether the implement type has to be one that's an implement for your class.
Without derailing the thread, I'd have a chat with my DM before I tried it.
And a chat with WotC, since it's considered legal option by the Character Builder to pick two weapons or implements with Versatile Expertise. Of course, with the advent of Master at Arms, I would say it's not terribly broken.
And a chat with WotC, since it's considered legal option by the Character Builder to pick two weapons or implements with Versatile Expertise. Of course, with the advent of Master at Arms, I would say it's not terribly broken.
The character builder is a secondary rules source. Pretty much everything else takes precedence over it.
However, it is RAW legal because light blades are an implement type.
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Thank you Ceika for the wonderful Avatar avatar!
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I am a:
Lawful Neutral Elf Wizard/Sorcerer (3rd/2nd Level)
Ability Scores:
Strength- 12
Dexterity- 19
Constitution- 13
Intelligence- 17
Wisdom- 12
Charisma- 16
Link here
I recommend getting a magic dagger ASAP. You may not be able to buy it now but get it as soon as you can that way it will return to you when you throw it.
Another good option for a level 2 utility is Sneak in the attack as that gives you a second sneak attack damage on a turn from a friend.
slings are a decent weapon but for you it would be better to go with dagger throwing since you get a +1 to hit with them. Slings are better done if you going to specialize in them and the same goes for the hand crossbow.
Light blade expertise is a wonderful feat to take. It gives you a +1 to hit and a +1 to damage when you have combat advantage that scales with tier. Since you aim to have CA all the time that means that is free damage.
I'd be interested to know what makes this true, in your view.
Well, the most recent version of the LFR Campaign Guide found here.
Here's the relevant information from it, on page 15:
Spoiler
Primary Sources
The following sources are considered official for Living Forgotten Realms. In the event of a conflict between two primary sources, the most recently published rules apply.
• Official D&D Rules Updates (errata and updates are published at www.dungeonsanddragons.com; in the "Quick Links" sidebar, click on "Rules Updates")
• Any other rules updates posted on the official Wizards website (through D&D Insider or as news items)
• Printed D&D rulebooks (with the highest precedence given to the DUNGEONS & DRAGONS Rules Compendium™)
• Living Forgotten Realms Campaign Guide (this document)
• RPGA Character Creation Guide (contains general rules governing all D&D Organized Play programs)
Secondary Sources
The following sources are “official” in the sense that they are produced by Wizards of the Coast, and we encourage LFR participants to use them. However, these sources include game elements that aren't allowed in the campaign, so you need to confirm them with a primary source. For example, you can use the D&D Character Builder to create a character with a dragonmark, but the fact that dragonmarks are in the Character Builder doesn't make dragonmarks legal in LFR. Always double-check a secondary source against a primary source to ensure that you’re following both the rules of D&D (in general) and the campaign rules (in particular).
• The D&D Character Builder (available to D&D Insider subscribers at www.dungeonsanddragons.com)
• The online D&D Compendium (available to D&D Insider subscribers at www.dungeonsanddragons.com)
• Clarifications issued through the official Game Support team at Wizards of the Coast
While an argument can be made that this is only true for LFR, I feel it speaks highly of what Wizards thinks about the order of importance.
__________________
Thank you Ceika for the wonderful Avatar avatar!
Spoiler
I am a:
Lawful Neutral Elf Wizard/Sorcerer (3rd/2nd Level)
Ability Scores:
Strength- 12
Dexterity- 19
Constitution- 13
Intelligence- 17
Wisdom- 12
Charisma- 16
Link here
PB-fu may be lacking right now, but don't rogues get a bonus to shuriken (1d4-->1d6 damage die) that makes it highly valuable (with a +3 proficiency, this makes it a rival to the dagger, which has +4 prof with a 1d4 dmg die.)
PB-fu may be lacking right now, but don't rogues get a bonus to shuriken (1d4-->1d6 damage die) that makes it highly valuable (with a +3 proficiency, this makes it a rival to the dagger, which has +4 prof with a 1d4 dmg die.)
It's a trap. +4 to hit for 1d4 + sneak attack + modifiers is much, much better than +3 to hit for 1d6 + sneak attack + modifiers. Look at it this way: with a 1W power, you are giving up +1 to hit for 1 extra point of damage. That's a bad, very bad, deal. Even with a 3W power, you are giving up +1 to hit for 3 damage. That +1 to hit is so much more valuable than 1 extra point of damage.
The sling is a trap option for Rogues, unfortunately.
/edit - What you basically have to realize is that if it was just 1d4 vs. 1d6, the shuriken would be a decent option. But since you've got other things to consider (sneak attack, damage modifiers, riders on your powers), that +1 to hit becomes both more damaging overall (since you will hit more often) and more valuable to putting your riders on the monster (like daze or blind).
__________________
Thank you Ceika for the wonderful Avatar avatar!
Spoiler
I am a:
Lawful Neutral Elf Wizard/Sorcerer (3rd/2nd Level)
Ability Scores:
Strength- 12
Dexterity- 19
Constitution- 13
Intelligence- 17
Wisdom- 12
Charisma- 16
Link here
It's a trap. +4 to hit for 1d4 + sneak attack + modifiers is much, much better than +3 to hit for 1d6 + sneak attack + modifiers. Look at it this way: with a 1W power, you are giving up +1 to hit for 1 extra point of damage. That's a bad, very bad, deal. Even with a 3W power, you are giving up +1 to hit for 3 damage. That +1 to hit is so much more valuable than 1 extra point of damage.
The sling is a trap option for Rogues, unfortunately.
/edit - What you basically have to realize is that if it was just 1d4 vs. 1d6, the shuriken would be a decent option. But since you've got other things to consider (sneak attack, damage modifiers, riders on your powers), that +1 to hit becomes both more damaging overall (since you will hit more often) and more valuable to putting your riders on the monster (like daze or blind).
Well, for starters it shows how WotC feels about the order of importance for their own products.
Secondly, let's look at some definitions:
Primary source is a term used in a number of disciplines to describe source material that is closest to the person, information, period, or idea being studied.
In scholarship, a secondary source is a document or recording that relates or discusses information originally presented elsewhere.
What does this mean? Well, the primary source is errata and books. The secondary source is anything that makes use of those without actually having the authority to change it (otherwise it would be a primary source). The character builder certainly falls into the secondary source category; as a rules source, it merely points to primary sources but must be double-checked itself as it can have errors. The books can have errors too, which is why the errata comes first, then the books.
__________________
Thank you Ceika for the wonderful Avatar avatar!
Spoiler
I am a:
Lawful Neutral Elf Wizard/Sorcerer (3rd/2nd Level)
Ability Scores:
Strength- 12
Dexterity- 19
Constitution- 13
Intelligence- 17
Wisdom- 12
Charisma- 16
Link here
People have already posted the most mechanically sound battle options, but I feel like I must add one thing.
Roleplaying and out of combat. A crossbow might be better in the fight, but a sling is so much easier to conceal/disguise, if you're on a mission where not drawing suspicion would be a good thing. Same for other weapons. I may not have liked blowing a feat to gain rapier proficiency, but the way my character thinks, that obviously would have been the first feat he picked.
What's your character's personality and style of combat? Think of that, and the powers and feats you should choose should be obvious.
It's a trap. +4 to hit for 1d4 + sneak attack + modifiers is much, much better than +3 to hit for 1d6 + sneak attack + modifiers. Look at it this way: with a 1W power, you are giving up +1 to hit for 1 extra point of damage. That's a bad, very bad, deal. Even with a 3W power, you are giving up +1 to hit for 3 damage. That +1 to hit is so much more valuable than 1 extra point of damage.
The sling is a trap option for Rogues, unfortunately.
/edit - What you basically have to realize is that if it was just 1d4 vs. 1d6, the shuriken would be a decent option. But since you've got other things to consider (sneak attack, damage modifiers, riders on your powers), that +1 to hit becomes both more damaging overall (since you will hit more often) and more valuable to putting your riders on the monster (like daze or blind).
Actually, no, the shuriken is still a decent choice, if only for when your rogue is still closing to range.
+1 to roll basically means a +5% chance of hitting the target.
The die upgrade takes average damage (for the dailies, anyhow) from 12 to 15.
That's a +25% increase in damage.
Granted, there are times when the hit is more important than the damage (for landing extra stuns, dazes and the like), but for the first round of combat (where you can sneak attack everyone without needing a flank) and for any other time when combat advantage avails itself without a flank (leader abilities and such), the shuriken is a viable possibility (Especially since having combat advantage means that you're getting +10% to hit off the bat).
Actually, no, the shuriken is still a decent choice, if only for when your rogue is still closing to range.
No, tcrudisi's math is correct.
For starters, your example assumes that you're using a daily (which, most of the time, you're not) and that your daily does 3W damage (which most of the good dailies don't). Finally, you're ignoring the modifiers to the damage, such as from magic items and sneak attack. That's easily a +10 or more to damage, so by using a shuriken you're not going from 12 to 15, you're actually going from 22 to 24 (which is not anywhere near 25%).
Incorrect premises lead to an incorrect conclusion.
It's a trap. +4 to hit for 1d4 + sneak attack + modifiers is much, much better than +3 to hit for 1d6 + sneak attack + modifiers. Look at it this way: with a 1W power, you are giving up +1 to hit for 1 extra point of damage. That's a bad, very bad, deal. Even with a 3W power, you are giving up +1 to hit for 3 damage. That +1 to hit is so much more valuable than 1 extra point of damage.
The sling is a trap option for Rogues, unfortunately.
/edit - What you basically have to realize is that if it was just 1d4 vs. 1d6, the shuriken would be a decent option. But since you've got other things to consider (sneak attack, damage modifiers, riders on your powers), that +1 to hit becomes both more damaging overall (since you will hit more often) and more valuable to putting your riders on the monster (like daze or blind).
Slings were a trap prior to MP2 after that it is a decent option (though in most cases dagger is better). It has feat support (makes the sling a +3 d8 weapon), a fair PP, and a class option for an additional +1 to hit. It is not the best but it is not a trap.
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Newby needs help building a Halfling Rogue
so any help will be greatly appreciate it.
