Combat Advantage Question

[Ignatius]

If you have two creatures fighting with swords, one is standing on a table or other item that is higher than the other, does either of them have combat advantage?

Is the guy with higher ground in a position to bring more weight and power to bear have advantage?

Or does the guy who only needs to block from above and has a good swing at poorly protected legs have the advantage?

Is this DM's call, or are there actual rules?

[Daftendirekt]

Pretty sure this is DM's call.

[Kurald Galain]

Originally Posted by Ignatius

If you have two creatures fighting with swords, one is standing on a table or other item that is higher than the other, does either of them have combat advantage?

By RAW, no. There is no rule that gives either of them combat advantage, therefore they don't have it.

[Grogmir]

If its a PC then yes I would give CA.

Aint RAW though

[Leolo]

By RAW it depends on the table.

If the table grants combat advantage to anyone who is standing on it then this ruling is correct - if not it is not correct.

Obstacles in 4E can bring it's own effects, and like the question if you could "slip on this floor while running" you can not give a general answer that will be correct for all tables and all floors.

[KingFlameHawk]

Obi-wan Kenobi would say it does.

[Kurald Galain]

Originally Posted by KingFlameHawk

Obi-wan Kenobi would say it does.

Anakin's leg is cut off (save ends).

[evirus]

Originally Posted by Kurald Galain

Anakin's leg is cut off (save ends).

If you save do you get a nifty black power suit same round?

[Oracle_Hunter]

Originally Posted by Ignatius

If you have two creatures fighting with swords, one is standing on a table or other item that is higher than the other, does either of them have combat advantage?

Is the guy with higher ground in a position to bring more weight and power to bear have advantage?

Or does the guy who only needs to block from above and has a good swing at poorly protected legs have the advantage?

Is this DM's call, or are there actual rules?

There are no actual rules (IIRC) but I'd say it's a wash.

Why? Because then you run into situations when one target is taller than the other and you begin to ask "who gets CA?" Easier to just say "no effect" than to make a ruling that gives Giants automatic CA versus Halflings

[RTGoodman]

I wouldn't give full Combat Advantage, but in the past I've given a +1 bonus on attack rolls for having the high ground if I think it was particular cinematic (or if PCs have been having a long string of bad rolls). Most of my players were 3.x players before, and are used to the higher ground bonus anyway.

[DontEatRawHagis]

Is the table higher than 5ft? If not they are still technically on the ground.

[evirus]

Originally Posted by DontEatRawHagis

Is the table higher than 5ft? If not they are still technically on the ground.

That makes me wonder if the table WAS 5ft high, and there was an ally on the ground opposite to the enemy... would that count ask flanking? or would the ally have to be 5ft below ground to be "opposite" the enemy?

[Bagelz]

Is this something that was important in old editions?
Its come up a lot lately (in my gaming group, most of whom never played 3.x but did play adnd, and on other forums)

RAW there is no such thing as higher ground. You are either adjacent (even if this is one square diagonally up and over) or you are further away than adjacent.

even in my 3.x games higher ground modifiers never came up, not that the measly +1 would make a difference when prone/squeezing/helpless were +4's

That makes me wonder if the table WAS 5ft high, and there was an ally on the ground opposite to the enemy... would that count ask flanking? or would the ally have to be 5ft below ground to be "opposite" the enemy?

you're second is correct for medium creatures. Draw a side view and determine flanking as if it were overhead. for medium creatures you would have one in a diagonal square, and one in the direct side square, and they would not be on opposite sides.

for large creatures, who take up 2x2x2 you would be flanking until the table placed the player 10ft off the ground.