Surge-wise: currently, shaping rolls are at normal difficulty. By the time Tyranim and Mani are done, it'll have gone up to +2 difficulty.
Gaius: you need to use an Excellency (or appropriate Shaping charm) to get extra dice when Shaping, the dice gained from Assumption Charms are for Creation-based deeds.
Call it... 2 die stunt? Seems about right. Since you're doing two things, add the dice to whichever roll you prefer (or split them). A Gossamer Combo is not an option, as they're both Combo-basic.
Assuming nothing further occurs, I'll post more of what takes place around the Manse within ~24 hours. Even if something occurs, I'll post - but it would be nice to have more things to respond to!
Gaius: you need to use an Excellency (or appropriate Shaping charm) to get extra dice when Shaping, the dice gained from Assumption Charms are for Creation-based deeds.
Ah, right. My mistake. ^_^o *reminds himself to pick up a Grace Excellency or two, sometime*
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Call it... 2 die stunt? Seems about right. Since you're doing two things, add the dice to whichever roll you prefer (or split them). A Gossamer Combo is not an option, as they're both Combo-basic.
Ack, you're right about the Combo.
And yay for my first Exalted stunt. I think I'll put both dice into Awakened Dream Manufacture, and set both Charms to permanent Exceptional (Diff. 4). Unless the quality's based on successes rolled (i.e. lower quality if fewer than 4, higher quality if greater); I wasn't clear if you set the difficulty before rolling dice, or roll dice and "spend" successes on what the Charm allows.
Also, I was wondering about the motes from stunting. Fair Folk stunt motes disappear at the end of the scene if they haven't been used, right? So, in this case, presuming both actions go as planned, does Mani get 4 "temporary" motes from stunting Awakened Dream Manufacture and then spend 3 of them on Essence-Forging Art (total mote cost: 3, 1 temporary leftover), or do the "temporary" motes come after using both Charms (total mote cost: 6, 4 temporary leftovers)? Not quite sure how it works.
Difficulty is set beforehand. You're trying to create the thing you envision out of nothingness, not assembling bits and pieces from mundane materials.
In terms of spending motes and regaining them from stunts, you get the motes back after spending.
So Essence Forging Art costs 3, you recover 4 - bringing you back to full (no battery Charms apply, so the 'extra' mote is lost), then Awakened Dream Manufacture costs another 3, leaving you down 3 net.
One of my previously stated houserules (somewhere, I swear): ignore the nonsense about stunt motes vanishing after a scene. It's horrible mechanics overhead, it makes Chungian mote attrition combat even more essential, it punishes people for stunting, and it's just plain Not Fun.
Instead, you must spend 1 mote every day on sustaining yourself (per the rules), and this mote cannot be recovered in Creation except by feeding Charms. Thus your maximum essence pool goes down 1 mote / day, but you can stunt yourself up to your (reduced) full over time. In the Wyld, your depleted pool recovers when your current pool is full - if you're Essence 2, and at 18/18 motes in the Wyld, the next mote you recover will bring you to 19/19.
So you need a little time (or a lot of stunts, which comes down to the same thing) in the Wyld to heal from prolonged Creation exposure, and munching souls remains a nice, fast way to do so. One scene of Ravishing the Created Form versus hours of respiration...
This way, Creation is still hostile, you're not punished for stunting, and you don't have to start tracking and arguing over committed motes gained from stunts, having an empty mote pool because you stunted the same 2 motes back over and over and so forth.
Edit: I gather rolls cannot be edited into posts, the reason being to ensure some sort of guarantee against rerolling until you get the desired result.
Difficulty is set beforehand. You're trying to create the thing you envision out of nothingness, not assembling bits and pieces from mundane materials.
Aye, that's what I presumed. Thanks for clarifying it for me.
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In terms of spending motes and regaining them from stunts, you get the motes back after spending.
So Essence Forging Art costs 3, you recover 4 - bringing you back to full (no battery Charms apply, so the 'extra' mote is lost), then Awakened Dream Manufacture costs another 3, leaving you down 3 net.
There we go, then. So, had I split the stunt dice, that would leave Mani down 2 net, right? (spend 3, get back 2; spend another 3, get back another 2)
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One of my previously stated houserules (somewhere, I swear):
Ah, there we go. I vaguely remembered an altered version you'd given, but didn't have the time to go hunting for it. Thanks for restating it. And I like it.
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Edit: I gather rolls cannot be edited into posts, the reason being to ensure some sort of guarantee against rerolling until you get the desired result.
Aye, I grokked the logic in handling things that way, I just could have sworn I'd seen someone edit in a dice roll... Or maybe it was editing something into a post with a roll?
Hmmm I'm thinking my post didn't happen did it. Gosh darn it. I need to post, now I need to find your hints to my dilemma. Pooh it was so set several days ago.
And whee, barter. Hope you're not opposed to it or think it unfair, Rik. Just pipe up if you'd prefer something more favorable to the Fox.
Barter is a pure love, Gaius. Better than Solar telling You:"Bow down."
Or NPC Raksha selling Yourself to him and making You pay him for You receiving the privilege of being his property.
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Originally Posted by Gaius
Also, sorry to hear that, Myll. :/ Always hate it when a forum eats a post... Here's hoping whatever you had in mind comes back to you soon.
I second this notion, Myll. We need to liven things up here a bit. And spring traps prepared by Mesch, too.
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Youth and strenght alvays lose to age and treachery.
Awekened Dream Manufacture(paper spy-bird, homonoculus level but remote vieving instead of poison effect and poor flight instead of combat ability)(10d10)[4][5][10][10][7][2][4][10][1][1](54)
If Meschlum allows such heavy modification of minions without spending Gossamer, that is.
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Youth and strenght alvays lose to age and treachery.
Meschlum, now I have another query for You. If I create Raksha who's assumption will be this of a Inn what kind of assumptions it should wear and would it need change Assumption to retreat into the Wood for mote-restoration ?
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Youth and strenght alvays lose to age and treachery.
Absent specific Assumptions, a Raksha is built around a core that is basically a normal sized humanoid. Aesthetics can be tampered with, bu you default to the abilities you'd have if you were such.
In order to be an inn, there are a few approaches I can imagine:
- Pick up lots of mutations, including a hefty amount of size, and an Assumption of Dreams and Passion for the core "I'm not a huge monster, but just n ordinary inn, honest!" aspect (possibly enhancing it with Fall of Night Shadows the Truth). In this case, you remain as mobile as an ordinary human, and can therefore (somehow) run back into the Wood at leisure.
- Find or create an inn (Principle of Worlds or Ordinary Object Conjuration are your friends here), and inhabit it via Assumption of the Land's Heart. The Assumption specifically restricts your mobility, turning you into, for instance, the hearthstone of the inn's main chimney, and restricts your perception and ability to interact with others. As long as the Assumption is active, you're rather stuck wherever the inn lies - and moving it could be a pain.
It isn't my call to make, but the former option sounds like the more convenient approach of the two, in addition to feeling the more inventive. Particularly since I recalled some talk of a Baba Yaga-style chicken-legged hut? Mobility's a nice thing, there.
... And speaking of fey concoctions with mobility, how might such a hut work with Unreal Shipwright's Method? (195-196/91) Would going for, say, a Fine vessel be enough? If furnishings/structure wouldn't be provided, would one or more applications of Ordinary Object Conjuration or Essence-Forging Art for the building and furniture (presumably most of the latter could simply be part of the building) do the trick? Or, as both are Combo-OK, could USM be put in a Combo with Principle of Worlds (presuming a Waypoint to shape when used) for a Serviceable territory?
Ah, and on your second solution with the Assumption of the Land's Heart and an otherwise immobile structure: presuming permanent objects/territory, could one not dismiss everything to Elsewhere, and then evoke them for a mote (or mote each; I forget what you're using as a houserule to prevent easy abuse) wherever else you wanted them? The permanent objects/territory I'm confident about, but a minion with that particular Assumption active... Though I guess just commanding it to drop the Assumption would do the trick. ... Unless I'm misremembering and dismissals/evocations don't work for raksha as I thought they did.
As an unrelated question that struck me: suppose a raksha sought to hide from pursuers that knew its face by putting its face everywhere. How powerful could an evoked Fine/Exceptional/Perfect Principle of Worlds-forged territory, The Kingdom of Me, pull that off? Could solid images of the raksha (and possibly the sound of its voice with their words) overlie each and every individual therein, not impeding them beyond their ability to tell who is who, or would it be limited to dressing everyone in garb like the raksha's (possibly up to a very impressive mask)? Translucent Dream-Sheathing Methodology could just make everyone look and sound like the raksha (until Willpower was spent, anyway), but I was wondering how well the territory alone could pull off that trick.
Unreal Shipwright's Method gets you something mobile. So if you happen to want a moving castle... Fine seems workable in terms of volume, to boot. It can't be combined with Principle of Worlds, as they're both Combo-Basic.
Inn-like furnishings can be created individually via Ordinary Object or Essence Forging, and I'll even allow Essence-Forging to create thematic sets of items, though at a higher difficulty / cost.
If the minion is one of your possessions, you can summon it into Creation. If it lacks a permanent Assumption, it will howl in agony and wither away into nothingness - unless summoned with an Evocation charm. If you want to command one of your minions to permanently inhabit the structure, you're fine.
In Creation, each thing you evoke costs a mote (I may be flexible on this, but it's expensive). In the Wyld, you get everything following a theme for one mote (much cheaper). So an Oneiromancy may be a better way to get furnishings. Or furnish your inn with permanent contents in the Wyld, make it mobile, and move out.
Principle of Worlds, on its own, isn't enough to disguise all people within as a specific (pre-set) Raksha (or other being). At Exceptional level, it'll meld the appearance of any targets within it with the features of the target being, so everyone looks fey-like.
Translucent Dream Sheathing Technology will add some power to the effect, though the cost gets fairly high and the impact is limited (large area of effect means lower penalties). An Oneiromancy would do this with no difficulty at all, either via Behemoth Forging Meditation to reshape mortal bodies, Fall of Night Shadows the Truth to conceal "being anyone but the owner of the Oneiromancy", or other options.
Unreal Shipwright's Method gets you something mobile. So if you happen to want a moving castle... Fine seems workable in terms of volume, to boot. It can't be combined with Principle of Worlds, as they're both Combo-Basic.
Glad to get an answer on the mechanics. Are you sure about the keyword, though? My copy of the errata lists Combo-OK for both.
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*creation and evocation clarifications*
Thanks!
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Principle of Worlds, on its own, isn't enough to disguise all people within as a specific (pre-set) Raksha (or other being). At Exceptional level, it'll meld the appearance of any targets within it with the features of the target being, so everyone looks fey-like.
Ah, I see. The examples given were a little... vague about outlining the scope, so I wasn't sure what you'd find appropriate for it. ^_^o Also, I misread 'surrounding the Creation-born ... with all the trappings of some arcane raksha holiday' as saying it was dressing them with all the yadda yadda, hence presuming costume changes were A-OK.
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Translucent Dream Sheathing Technology will add some power to the effect, though the cost gets fairly high and the impact is limited (large area of effect means lower penalties). An Oneiromancy would do this with no difficulty at all, either via Behemoth Forging Meditation to reshape mortal bodies, Fall of Night Shadows the Truth to conceal "being anyone but the owner of the Oneiromancy", or other options.
True enough. And of course, one can never have too much Oneiromancy (until one can, I guess). Might be fun to make its stats later. Just thought it wise to get a better handle on all the tools available: instantly evoking a territory with such an enchantment on it for as little as one mote (if permanent) would be a godsend if a raksha's short on the motes and/or Scenes to activate a spell.
Last edited by Gaius : 09-21-2011 at 01:48 AM.
Reason: [/color] tag instead of [/quote] >_<
Gaius, indeed ... Raksha can go and make even Solards envious.
Meschlum, sorry for delay ... and I found in our earlier conversations that You gave green light on combining Assumption of Land's Heart & Assumption of Earth Form to have walking castle.
Soo, I intend to create average Inn that will retreat into the Wood when tax-collectors come after Carel, and I wish it to collect Gossamer in the form of Ghostly Fires in the chimney. Since it'll be a Worker, crafting stuff will be easy for it.
For a gossip from another game, one with anti-Raksha people arranged against me. I befriended one of them, and distracted the rest with some desperately looking scheming. Namely summoning Tower o'Doom with all inhabitants necessary to make it a nice, and mote depleting, dungeon crawl. Plus a lot of heavy, expensive looking baubles to tire them out. Win, but ST told me to NEVER ever ST his dungeon crawls. I do not understand his reservation, as they survived.
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Youth and strenght alvays lose to age and treachery.
Gaius: Fancy that, Keyword-wise. The errata's Keywords and durations for these Charms look... odd.
With them being combo-OK only, it's now possible to perform a Combo, one part of which requires an entire season to complete while the rest is a martial arts attack? A permanent suit of Shaping Armor now lasts for one season? When creating a Fair Folk ship, it happens instantly (per Essence Forging Art) yet you have to commit motes to it for a whole season? Wha?
Houserule time, in order to make sense of what the errata might have been trying to do.
- The errata's Duration entries indicate the 'crafting time' associated to the Charms, NOT the duration of the products.
- Ring Crafting Charms (and Awakened Dream Manufacture) can be part of Combos that add successes or dice to the Crafting roll, if the purpose of the Combo is to increase the likelihood of crafting something. For a reason that only the Raksha understand, they do not count as Combo-Basic for this purpose, and so can be combined with a Combo-Basic Shaping Attack charm if desired.
- Multiple Ring Crafting Charms (and Awakened Dream Manufacture) can be Combo'd together, in order to create a variety of things in a short period of time (still likely to be seasons when gossamer forging is involved). If combined with dice adders, dice can (must, for Supplemental or Basic) be added to each roll being made.
- If used as part of Shaping Combat, basically by creating a persistent setting or characters, these Charms can be made part of a Shaping Combat Combo. The creation is instantaneous (even for things that would require seasons), but the created things do not outlast the conflict. Unless the crafter chooses to commit the motes for it at the end of combat, in which case the creation fades but will be fully completed after the required time.
- These charms cannot be parts of Combos involving any other Charms. Because while a Combo of First Martial Arts Excellency and Crafter's Arsenal, creating a horde of extras each time you punch someone is... amusing... it also breaks the rules all over the place.
As a side note, the Shaping Combat application is largely useless. Either it's compulsory, and non-Ring Fair Folk cannot shape the environment when engaging in Shaping conflict (bad), or it's superfluous, as you already warp the environment without needing to spend motes and flurries for it. Still, if you want to provide stunt fodder or a persistent (and unpopular) bit of setting...
Rik: Assumption of the Land's Heart will have you immobile as long as it's up. If you want to drop it, you need to define the conditions under which it is dropped - and have a backup available.
If you want to create said Commoner, you'll need to make the roll, though.
Since errata is... incomplete... I will explicitly permit something under permanent Assumption of the Land's Heart (and upgrades) to release the Assumption in the Middlemarches (or deeper in the Wyld), becoming capable of moving again (while still having the benefits / flaws of a permanent Assumption). Otherwise, it is pointlessly difficult for your minions to wreak havoc, be sent back to the Wyld, and eventually return.
Good news about the other game! Not killing them is good - it makes for more fun later. And (hopefully) less OOC animosity.
Ach, ok. What kind of roll I should made ? Craft(Glamour) ?
here : <rollv>10d10</rollv>
The problem with this other game stems from overall abusability of certain Raksha stuff that AUTHORS didn't decided to make clear for shaky-pants moaners. Or for people who hate complications, like me, and would wish for clear rulings.
For example, one of the Solars in this other game, is constantly troubled by the amount of stuff Fox can do (and since I were growing Ring and taking charms, he "hates" me for cheap charms too). For some unfathomable reason he dont understand my statements about CONSULTING crazy ideas with ST first.
After all, he let me create Tower o'Doom. Found it amusing especially time-bumps and delaying nastiness I projected.
Another problem I found in the other game, Assumption of Person's Heart lets Raksha to share "Charm and other active stuff effects". And I asked ST if it means that Creation born could be gifted with effects of Mad God Mien, that all my minions have or die, from my own hand, and if Assumption of Earth Shape can alter Creation-Born's natural "Assumption of Human". Since charm description says ... and I was given awkward silence.
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Youth and strenght alvays lose to age and treachery.
It's Int + Occult, using Ecstatic Reproduction Style (5 gossamer, many motes), which takes a full day (post errata). Difficulty for a Commoner is 5 as a base (more as the Wyld is less fluid here). So no minion this time around.
If you want an inn, you could demand one of the Voice (and provide it with gossamer), if you don't want to be the one rolling. It wouldn't be sentient, though.
And the Wood has reverted to its initial state, with all the advantages and issues that entails.
As for sharing things: Assumption forms - no. Or, rather, not quite. You don't get to warp their shape into versions of you, but you can grant them the (visible) benefits you get. Assumption of Earth form would not turn a mortal sharing it into an animated pile of stone, but could (for aesthetics) replace their eyes with rubies, enabling them to see in the dark.
Mad God Mien - likely not, as it's not a physical feature that can be shared. Possibly some resistance to Shaping effects, but no protection from Fate.
20m and Fox can spare them, leaving himself with 3 left. Rolling for ERS ... dang, I just lost 5 gossamer for nothing. Dice hate me.
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Assumption forms, I meant sharing mutations is ok, but cosmetic effects not really ?
I meant, it wouldn't make mortal look like Raksha "Pile of Rocks" but could give mortal rock-like skin and the altered appearance. Right ?
And I do not agree, MGM is the ONLY known to me effect that can put Shaped Raksha outside Fate. And I believe that it is under "share benefits" bracket.
If it really doesn't work like this, I'm in trouble since i promised something that seemed possible. And Fox broke Oath. [CENSORED].
Point is that if I keep Scarlet Empress in the Wyld she'll mutate into something and friend who asked me for favor will hunt me down for betrayal. *sigh*
Is it possible to make 3dot artifact that protects from Fate ?
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Youth and strenght alvays lose to age and treachery.
I'd allow appearance adjustments linked to a Raksha sharing bits of its power. It's a matter of what is shared: you're giving your mortal specific advantages (which I'd argue are physical), not transforming him. So if you give a mortal extra soak, a rocky skin is plausible. If you're giving dark vision from Assumption of Earth form, only his eyes are changed.
Post Errata, Heaven Rains Wisdom gives partial protection from Fate.
The inside of a Chancel is Wyld. Use that (optionally with a Freehold inside to restrict undesired mutations). Add Translucent Dream Sheathing Technology to make your guests sleep forever (or until convenient), to limit their opportunities for making mischief.
Spam Creation with minor Raksha under permanent Assumption of Dreams and Passion to look like your person of choice. They get +1 success to do so, and it's about time Fate got a DDoS attack.
Whether Mad God Mien can be shared is up to your GM - so I don't think it's currently relevant to this game, and it's a matter of interpretation anyway. My take on it is that the examples of what can be shared are physical aspects (breathing water, Assumption form benefits, mutations) rather than anything metaphysical. Though sharing Assumption of Dreams and Passion could contribute to a counter argument.
If you want to share Mad God Mien, I'd suggest making a Raksha (or Assumption form) that conveys it thematically. A Wyld scar on the back of your hand which gives its bearer enhanced combat skills is unlikely to work. A complex network of tattoos that covers the entire body and glows with Wyld energies... much more acceptable.
Or just have a really big Raksha with MGM swallow your target of choice. They're now inside an area that's outside fate...
If you want to share Mad God Mien, ... just have a really big Raksha with MGM swallow your target of choice. They're now inside an area that's outside fate...
The rest was good advice, but this one made me smile. ^__^
*sacrifices catgirl and a rules-lawyer in the temple dedicated to Meschlum. Now they'll dance/argue in pink outfits for his glory to their respective deaths.*
I know, Meschlum is the best. ^^
Also, I started menacing ST of the other game with displaying interest into becoming Ishavara myself. So far ST said several simple steps.
Involving big part of Creation in my Narrative. Work in progress.
Raising Essence to 8. Work in progress.
Involving Rakshastan in my Narrative. Planning.
Heh, getting Prince Lashee unleashed on UCS, again, is a nice prospect too if things get hairy. ^^
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Youth and strenght alvays lose to age and treachery.
By the book (and errata), Ishvara status is available to any Entertainer with Cup 4+. 3+ for Heroic Entertainers, and 2+ for Nobles. To go beyond Ishvara, increase Cup.
Step 1: learn Unsightly Rigor Approach (requires Cup 1)
Step 2: use Unsightly Rigor Approach to increase the Heart Grace. Anything added to the Heart Grace counts as dice added by a Charm, so (post-errata), you are limited to adding your Cup in dice.
Step 3: A Commoner has Heart 1. Add 4 from Cup, and you get a Shaped Raksha with Heart 5 - the current definition of an Ishvara.
Step 4: Spam the UCS.
Step 5: Notice that your Commoners only have enough motes to be Ishvara for 2 scenes, which is a bit short.
Step 6: Create an Oneiromancy with Manacles of Virtue.
Step 7: Spam the UCS with Ishvara that persist for a whole season.
Yes, it's silly. So? Currently, there is no other official way to get Graces over 5, and there are Charms that require Graces over 5... Which means it has to work.
Aye, I imagine becoming an Ishvara is something virtually all raksha hope for. Mani certainly does. Everyone else in the group, too, I suspect. Even the ones who don't care about the power spike wouldn't likely be opposed, given what it means for their personal narratives: becoming an Ishvara means one's story has become so compelling that reality itself is eager to play along.
But aye, not likely to happen for some time, if Holden's suggestion of 'Essence 8+ minimum' rings true. Then again, extensive hard mechanics for what they can do and how they work do not exist, so hello potential ground for homebrew country~
How to raise Your essence idiotic high, for dummies.
Negotiate with spirits that have Endowment charm. For example, Han-Ta(max 7 dots). Or Elemental Dragons(+5 dots). Or Yozis if You feel bold(guess how high ?).
Then forget Your end of the bargain, and change Your assumption to another. While faking Your death and claiming to be Your own descendant who just inherited all the stuff, so they shouldn't complain, right ?
Not to mention that it is suggested that traits limited 1-5 can be raised when Your Essence eclipses 5. For example, Dragon Kings can have Virtues up to 6. Thus logic demands that Raksha with Essence 5+ should have acess to Graces 5+.
Lunars have this evil Knack that lets them kill/devour rakshas to pump their Graces, after all.
How I envision Fox as Ishavara ? Treat Creation as Bordermarches for Shaping and respiring Essence. By paying 1 WP being able to perfectly cast Wyld Stunt. Being immune to creatures he didn't attacked in a scene, perfectly dodging them. Also ... ability to devour Souls and Rakshas, regardless of their enlightenment level. I think it sucks that Soul-Devouring Hunger works only on Essence 1 weaklings. How I'm suposed to menace Yozis/Neverborn/Solars ?
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Youth and strenght alvays lose to age and treachery.
I ship you/Anyone./Infernal Gardevoir from outside the playground, by Recaiden//ExtendedSig
Spoiler
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Originally Posted by Thanqol
It's not normal, of course, and what's actually happening in Comet Kicker's brain is that she's using regular murder as therapy for worse murder. There's a breakdown in the works and all it needs is one good, hard kick.
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Re: When Winter Wakes - OOC (Fair Folk)
I think I'll put both dice into Awakened Dream Manufacture, and set both Charms to permanent Exceptional (Diff. 4). Unless the quality's based on successes rolled (i.e. lower quality if fewer than 4, higher quality if greater); I wasn't clear if you set the difficulty before rolling dice, or roll dice and "spend" successes on what the Charm allows.
And I like it.
by Recaiden//
