The final four captured runaways... are they the Ultimen of Project Cadmus, aka the former superfriends misfits?
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Considering Beetle's friend who got kidnapped had the surname 'Longshadow', I assume yes.
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I liked how they developed the two stories and I liked how they connected them together in the end.
Jaime´s struggle with the armor is great contrast between their points of view especially when you try to protect soeone you despise. I laughed a little when the final reveal is made on the story.
So, we finally got our female centered episode. I was wondering how much time it was going to take them. Simon and the rest didnt stand a chance. The girls completely kicked butt.
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Originally Posted by jidasfire
On a long enough scale, every OOTS forum discussion turns into a debate about alignment, Miko, or Familicide.
Frankly, a Wizard can suck even more than a Fighter could ever dream of sucking. A Fighter can stab himself to death, but only a Wizard could Plane Shift to some horrible far realm to be tortured for an eternity of insanity.
So the review on World's Finest pointed out something that I missed. It appears that in the time gap between season 1 and season 2, the country of Bialya (Queen Bee's country) absorbed the country of Qurac (that country the YJ team was trying to save in Season 1).
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Another new character? Really writers? The half dozen plus that you introduced at the start of the season weren't enough? Now we have to throw Bart Allen in as well?
So, yeah, that's frustrating. Can't say I really see what tossing the time travel angle in contributes either, other than opening the plothole of why the future wasn't fixed immediately when they're obviously going to win out eventually anyway.
At least we're getting progress on the Roy Harper plotline though. We'll see where that goes I suppose.
Zevox
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"We each decide our own sense of right and wrong. The rest, I leave to my sword." - Yuri Lowell, Tales of Vesperia
Loved the ep. It was a lot of fun seeing the entire Flash family together on screen for what I think is the first time ever. This episode pushed the plot forward quite a bit as well, with Wally struggling with his lesser powers, Bart being introduced (and trying to prevent an apocalyptic future), and the real Roy Harper being discovered at last.
The fact that the future wasn't entirely altered means that Barry Allen may actually die this season, as he did in the comics. Killing off a superhero as big as the Flash would be a gutsy move for a kids program and I'm looking forward to see where they go with this.
It seemed like the Kroloteans were controlling Neutron, but we never saw the aliens from what I can recall, but only heard their voices. So was it them? Why not show them? What's the secret?
All around an enjoyable episode, with an interesting villain in the "moded" Neutron, fun action, great character interactions. So far this season has been a blast. Can't wait for more.
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It seemed like the Kroloteans were controlling Neutron, but we never saw the aliens from what I can recall, but only heard their voices. So was it them? Why not show them? What's the secret?
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They referred to him as "meat", something previously done by Sportsmaster's partner.
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So, yeah, that's frustrating. Can't say I really see what tossing the time travel angle in contributes either, other than opening the plothole of why the future wasn't fixed immediately when they're obviously going to win out eventually anyway.
Zevox
Spoiler
The future hasn't been fixed because Impulse hasn't changed things enough. Saving Flash and joing the Team will play an important part, but something else in the present day also has to change before they can win. I'm no expert at who exactly can time travel in DC, but it will probably be Booster Gold or the Legion will appear later. Booster seems more likely considering we have Blue Beetle, but Booster Gold doesn't fit in a post-apocolyptic world without major changes.
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It seemed like the Kroloteans were controlling Neutron, but we never saw the aliens from what I can recall, but only heard their voices. So was it them? Why not show them? What's the secret?
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I'm certain it is supposed to be the Light's new partner. The kroloteans role in the plot is over after the Light nuked them, and everyhting about Neutron seems consistent with what had happened last episode and the start of this episode. Neutron was obviously an unwilling participant, so maybe he is one of the abducted runaways?
My theory?
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The partner is the Reach (this is very obvious, considering all the clues we have been given) and they, like the kroloteans, are on Earth because of the metagene. Maybe because Earth is the only planet with the gene, therefore the only planet that can develop superpowers (as opposed to other races, who only have their natural powers). THe Light are kidnapping people for the Reach to experiment on so that the metagene can be understood. The Reach want to use it for themselves, and I think the Light want it as part of their plan of 'evolving humanity' (if everyone has superpowers, there is no such thing as a superhero?)
Also, the fact that the Flash is somehow important makes me think that the season is going to end adapting Crisis of Infinite Earths (or at least stealing the death of Flash from that). In fact, considering Darkseid is also coming (Between Godfrey and the New Gods stuff that we have had, this is bound to happen), Darkseid might fill in the role of the Anti-Monitor as the big bad.
My only concerns with Darkseid as the finale is that Darkseid as big bad has already been down in JLU (though I think it could be done distinctly be Young Justice) and working out how to trump Darkseid as a villain in Season 3. Also, how would Darkseid fit into the whole metagene subplot?
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The future hasn't been fixed because Impulse hasn't changed things enough. Saving Flash and joing the Team will play an important part, but something else in the present day also has to change before they can win. I'm no expert at who exactly can time travel in DC, but it will probably be Booster Gold or the Legion will appear later. Booster seems more likely considering we have Blue Beetle, but Booster Gold doesn't fit in a post-apocolyptic world without major changes.
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No, the issue is that time just does not work that way. From the perspective of someone still in the time that Bart left, everything he and anyone else does in the past to change it happens instantaneously, and all changes they cause should immediately take effect. For that matter, he shouldn't even remember that history ever went any other way, since it should retroactively change his own history.
...actually, never mind. That line of thought leads me to the inevitable conclusion that using time travel to intentionally change the past should always result in a paradox: by deliberately changing the past you remove your own motive for doing so from existence, thus you would never go back in time to make the change, thus it would not be made, etc in the usual paradox circular logic chain. Which means you pretty much need to handwave all logic when dealing with time-travel stories of this sort.
Zevox
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"When I was ten, I read fairy tales in secret and would have been ashamed if I had been found doing so. Now that I am fifty, I read them openly. When I became a man, I put away childish things, including the fear of childishness and the desire to be very grown up." -C.S. Lewis
"We each decide our own sense of right and wrong. The rest, I leave to my sword." - Yuri Lowell, Tales of Vesperia
No, the issue is that time just does not work that way. From the perspective of someone still in the time that Bart left, everything he and anyone else does in the past to change it happens instantaneously, and all changes they cause should immediately take effect. For that matter, he shouldn't even remember that history ever went any other way, since it should retroactively change his own history.
...actually, never mind. That line of thought leads me to the inevitable conclusion that using time travel to intentionally change the past should always result in a paradox: by deliberately changing the past you remove your own motive for doing so from existence, thus you would never go back in time to make the change, thus it would not be made, etc in the usual paradox circular logic chain. Which means you pretty much need to handwave all logic when dealing with time-travel stories of this sort.
Zevox
Spoiler
First rule of time travel: The rules of time travel work according to what fits the plot best. TIme Travel probably shouldn't work like that, but they need to make sure the time travel fits the plot. They had to both explain that time hadn't changed too much from Impulse's actions, and they had to make sure Neutron was aware that nothing had changed, so that whatever future time travel plans they have are resolved. However, there are explanations for why Neutron remembers. For example, Neutron might be immune to the changes in time travel because he observed it. Everyone else doesn't know that time has been changed, so they have their memories overwritten, However, the act of observation makes him immune. It isn't a perfect theory, as you have to ask what happens to the memory of the present day Neutron.
It would be interesting to see whether they have actual rules for time travel, or if they are basically saying 'whatever makes things easiest to understand works'. If they are using the second interpretation, I have no problem, as long as it creates a good story. Doctor Who has managed to create many different time travel stories, despite never having a consistent system of rules.
On the second paragraph, that is where the multiple timelines rule works. It doesn't explain Young Justice, but the multiple timeline basically states that whenever you time travel, you create a new time line where a new set of events occur. The time travellers remember the old timeline because they came from the old timeline, but now live in a new timeline that exists parallel to their old one.
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They could be trying to follow the old LOST rule of "no matter what you try to change in the past, the universe always course corrects itself." Bart changed a little thing but nothing major - the Flash will still die, the world will still fall into apocalypse. And now Bart has no way of knowing that he didn't complete his mission.
So the reason the universe didn't change instantly for Neutron is that, in order to further change the future, Future-Neutron is going to have to do something else to further effect the past. Like go back in time himself, or send a message, or send Booster Gold, or something.
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They could be trying to follow the old LOST rule of "no matter what you try to change in the past, the universe always course corrects itself." Bart changed a little thing but nothing major - the Flash will still die, the world will still fall into apocalypse. And now Bart has no way of knowing that he didn't complete his mission.
So the reason the universe didn't change instantly for Neutron is that, in order to further change the future, Future-Neutron is going to have to do something else to further effect the past. Like go back in time himself, or send a message, or send Booster Gold, or something.
What a horrifying thought.
There isn't even a Ted Kord in sight to give moral guidance!!!
Spoiler
There is always the possibility that a certain speedster's arrival might be what set off the apocalypse in the first place you know!
Please remember that given the backdrop Bart will be relying that everything he's been told is all that he needs to know how to prevent what's happened and it doesn't take much to insure he doesn't know everything he needs to know let alone that by altering even that event he may have set things in motion that insure what he knows is no longer whats going to happen...
Yes my head hurts too!
There is always the possibility that a certain speedster's arrival might be what set off the apocalypse in the first place you know!
Please remember that given the backdrop Bart will be relying that everything he's been told is all that he needs to know how to prevent what's happened and it doesn't take much to insure he doesn't know everything he needs to know let alone that by altering even that event he may have set things in motion that insure what he knows is no longer whats going to happen...
Yes my head hurts too!
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That can't be right, because Impulse changed the future. Before Impulse went back in time, Neutron had his powers and needed a collar round his neck like the ones at Belle Reve to stop his powers. After Impulse went back in time, Neutron no longer needed the collar. THerefore, whatever caused the apocolypse is not caused by Impulse going back in time
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Another reason I thought those mysterious beings were Kroloteans: because what they did to Neutron fits their M.O.
In Green Lantern: No Fear, Hal Jordan encounters some Kroloteans that are described by his ring as follows:
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Point of origin: Sector 2812. A race of capitalist scientists from the planet Krolot known for their obsession with the re-engineering of technological and biological resources from other cultures. Earth's relatively young age would suggest the terrestrial species' genetic structures to be extremely susceptible to typical Krolotean evolutionary experimentation.
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Loved the ep. It was a lot of fun seeing the entire Flash family together on screen for what I think is the first time ever.
(I think, Batman:The brave and the bold, "Requiem for a scarlet speedster" had at least three of the flashes in one episode (who did figure time travel if memory serves),but I don't remember if Impulse was in it, though.)
As for the guys between their screen, rewatching the episode, they point a very human like finger at some point.
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(I'm wondering if the reach hasn't been redesigned for the show as just the scarabs living as some kind of parastic like lifeform, that would explain the 'meat' coments)
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Last edited by smuchmuch : 06-05-2012 at 02:58 PM.
Another reason I thought those mysterious beings were Kroloteans: because what they did to Neutron fits their M.O.
In Green Lantern: No Fear, Hal Jordan encounters some Kroloteans that are described by his ring as follows:
Yes, but that does not mean they are the only game in town... for instance the krolo's refer to another entity that they call "the competitors"... the fact that they refer to them as competitors would imply that they are in the same business as the Krolos. So both the krolos and the competitors are after the meta-gene
We also have to take the previous episode in account as the light was abducting people for their new Partner which is believed to be the krolo's competitor. And another detail we can add to that are that there are some references to previous DC series that may tells us what those abducties are for.
Spoiler
blue beetle's abducted friend just so happens to carry the name of LongShadow from the DCAU continuity who in turn was based on Apache chief from super friends (whome blue beetle's friend happens to bear a similarity too)... not hard to believe that a certain someone might get some size changing powers... in other words, the light's mysterious partner may be playing around with the meta-gene
Some people also think that one of the 4 abducties looks like Virgil Hawkins aka "Static"
And a reason why we might NOT think its the krolo's is that fact that they remained hidden... we've seen the krolo's enough that there is no point for the director to hide them from us. Also they did not sound lioke the krolo's... the krolo's have kind of screeching noise when they talk, when these guys sounded more like some kind of clicking.
I don't recall Darkseid ever being involved in meta-gene tech though, and I was thinking that the Light's mysterious new partner was somehow connected to Apocalypse. Hmm. Will be interesting to see who it is.
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What about what's his face from episode 1, Lobo or whatever? Which aliens is he supposed to be associated with?
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Frankly, a Wizard can suck even more than a Fighter could ever dream of sucking. A Fighter can stab himself to death, but only a Wizard could Plane Shift to some horrible far realm to be tortured for an eternity of insanity.
I don't recall Darkseid ever being involved in meta-gene tech though, and I was thinking that the Light's mysterious new partner was somehow connected to Apocalypse. Hmm. Will be interesting to see who it is.
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Darkseid will have something to do with the plot, I'm certain. Between all the appearances of the New Gods and the fact that Godfrey in comics continuity is an agent of Darkseid, I can't see why Darkseid won't appear. Though I have no idea why he would be looking into the metagene. Maybe the anti-life equation is hidden in DNA? Makes sense that it would be a part of DNA.
THough whatever the role of Darkseid and the rest of Apocalypse is, I am certain they are not the Competitor/the Light's new partner. Every hint suggests the Reach, and there is very little suggesting Darkseid (in fact, I would argue that the Light has been working against Darkseid by attacking Intergang)
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Originally Posted by Flickerdart
What about what's his face from episode 1, Lobo or whatever? Which aliens is he supposed to be associated with?
Spoiler
We don't know who employed Lobo yet, but they suggested that it was done by the Competitor to get rid of the kroloteans, and the Competitor is almost certainly the Reach.
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@Jarod:
(there's not point in spoiling their name, really.
The reach has already been sugested ont nhjsi thread as a likely candidate for the 'Competitor' and both episode 3 and 4 contains strong hints pointing in their directions)
So yeah, 99% chances it's them.
As for Apocalypse, unlikely. They will likely play a major role in the season, but I do'nt think they're present yet. (at rleast not by themselves)
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(in fact, I would argue that the Light has been working against Darkseid by attacking Intergang)
I think it's very likely.
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Last edited by smuchmuch : 06-05-2012 at 04:14 PM.
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Re: Young Justice (Spoilers)
Simon and the rest didnt stand a chance. The girls completely kicked butt. 
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