[BitP:R] BleachITP Reborn OOC Thread 19: Dempsey Rolling with SWORDS!

[Frozen_Feet]

@Kuroi:

a) I got that. The idea is that Hanny's releasing his grip when the piston is pushing towards him, to benefit from the movement. I used "crushed" because it was first verb to come to mind, though "hammered" might have been better in retrospect.

b) I'm saving description of the damage Hanny's acrued for the next post where Rouga has a good look of him - ie., one where his back isn't turned at him.

EDIT: Okay, I suppose I could get this off my chest: here are some old pictures I made of Elder a long time ago (It must be over a year now), plus some tidbits about her character design and history. The first one is a watercolor job of my original sketch, while the latter is a pencil drawn copy with small changes of expression to make her look a bit more intimidating.

Here's (once more) the pic of how Elder's looked up untill now.

Originally, Amada was intended to be Elder's Zanpakuto, and I designed her human form based on the black-and-white picture Callos chose for Amada (don't know who drew it, but kudos to that person). Unfortunately, Callos lost interest before that plotline could be developed, and the role was switched over to Hotaru.

Callos wasn't the first one I approached about this plot, though. The very first person I asked was strawberryman and suggested Valeria (why hello there, terry! ), but he said he had other plans for her. From the start, I wanted Elder's zanpakuto to be, if not good, then at least one of the more sympathetic characters, to make it that much more appalling when she'd murder them.

By the way, the darkness falling in my post alludes to Elder's wings. Here's a (poor) picture I made of her in her full Resurreccion.

Here a picture not drawn by me (and much better than what I can make), which I would've used for Elder and spared myself of the trouble, if I'd known of it when I created her character.

[KnightDisciple]

I should be caught up everywhere. Unless someone feels like throwing a fight at Vicente in HM, I guess.

[Kuroimaken]

*murders tumbleweed*

[Frozen_Feet]

Yeaaaaah, waiting for Draken to post before continuing in HM. Waiting for Dorizzit in Ep. 11.

As for SS or MW, Nicklance & Co, would it be allright to kick off remainders of Kido plot after the weekend? I could start the episode, just don't have ideas right now.

[maximus25]

There sure is a lot going on in HM.

So, now that Absalon has escaped with his life, he can have it taken from him by Cuerva. Yay.

[tgva8889]

Kuroi, I edited a continuation of Reikiku and Kazuma's game into my last post in the Sereitei thread. Feel free to respond or not if you'd like. Just thought I'd let you know, since the thread won't update for my edit.

[Keveak]

Originally Posted by Frozen_Feet

As for SS or MW, Nicklance & Co, would it be allright to kick off remainders of Kido plot after the weekend? I could start the episode, just don't have ideas right now.

Sounds perfect to me, I have no problem with that timing.

[Kuroimaken]

Let's hear it for the Maiden fans who are keeping up with the HM thread.

[CMOTDibbler]

In the Mortal World
*Tumbleweed rolls past*

...anyway, is there someplace I should be? I'll be making an episode soon for plot to happen in, but until then all my characters are in limbo.

[Nicklance]

Weekend is fine with me.

Kuroi, I've called Famine in. Let's see if we can get Genoveva out and let Lalita slink away and live another day.

[KnightDisciple]

Originally Posted by Kuroimaken

*murders tumbleweed*

...In my defense, this last weekend was not only meatspace gaming extravaganza, I also was playing Mass Effect 3 for the last week (beat it Tuesday morning).

I'll try to get in a post or two now. Not a whole lot for me to do though.

[Kuroimaken]

Originally Posted by KnightDisciple

...In my defense, this last weekend was not only meatspace gaming extravaganza, I also was playing Mass Effect 3 for the last week (beat it Tuesday morning).

I'll try to get in a post or two now. Not a whole lot for me to do though.

Chill dude, you weren't the only one not posting.

I know what being around a good game does to you. *stares at GA card*

[Frozen_Feet]

For the record, I also have that thing on my back.

[Draken]

Where will the Old Ghost go Now?

1 - Cinco
2 - Follow Lalita and Cuerva

One. Again. Things are not looking good for anyone.

[Kuroimaken]

Originally Posted by Draken

[Distrito Uno - A few moments ago]

Von Geister sighs at the incoming last ditch attack and flops to the side, sinking into the ivory of the streets like a horrendous mix of lobster and chilopod fish into water.

As he goes, the wall loses cohesion and the cero obliterates the empty street.

Von Geister's reiatsu briefly flares omnipresent, before vanishing almost entirely.

Spoiler

For that matter, Municipal Travel is the spell in question.

Distrito Cinco

Von Geister's reiatsu rumbles underneath the streets, like the fin of a shark appearing from the waterline.

Sorry, I can't help but think of this.

[Steilos]

Dempsey Rolling with ABSENTEEISM, FORGETFULNESS and PURE UNADULTERATED OBLIVOUSNESS!!

Hi, folks. It's been a while and really I have no excuse for this. Stuff happened and I wound up completely forgetting to play for... well, don't want to think about that. And then I forgot about it completely and took my sweet freaking time to unfreeze this game from my mental cryo-storage. My promises don't mean too much right now, but nevertheless I promise to make Mortal World slightly less boring. Slightly.

I don't know about my other characters, I really don't, but I'll try something. Good job they're conveniently situated in Hammerspace. Sorry about this, guys.

[Kuroimaken]

It's awesome to have you back, Steilos. I say we don't dwell in what's passed and focus on what's to be!

Namely Rouga's continuing annoyance of Ringo-chan Appolinar.

[Nicklance]

Frozen Feet, would you like to roll a dice to determine which District Lalita crashed into?

[Frozen_Feet]

Well, since Cuerva smashed him infront of the invading force, and the invading force arrived from opposite site of Distrito Diez...

... logic dictates they crashed somewhere into Distrito Cinco, actually.

[Draken]

Originally Posted by Frozen_Feet

Well, since Cuerva smashed him infront of the invading force, and the invading force arrived from opposite site of Distrito Diez...

... logic dictates they crashed somewhere into Distrito Cinco, actually.

Distrito Seis, actually.

[Frozen_Feet]

Oh. Well, that works too.

EDIT: A word of warning: the following is going to bore the crap out of you.

These calculations are fundamental to understanding Elder's point, but they're too long-winded to place in the narrative.

According to this site, 107,602,707,791 have been born since 50,000 BC, which is speculated as the starting point for humankind.

Suppose 1% of all dead humans become Hollows and make it to Hueco Mundo. This is a pretty bleak estimate, as only strongest of Hollows (per canon) make it across the void, so the actual amount of people becoming Hollows is much higher. So... 1,076,027,078 Hollows. A lot, but only about sixth of current human population.

Suppose 50% of these Hollows fuse into Gillians. Further assume it takes 100 Hollows to form 1 Gillian. So we now have 538,013,539 Hollows and 5,380,135
Gillian.

Suppose 1% of Gillian become Adjuchas. That gives us 53801 of them. So we now have 538,013,539 Hollows, 5,326,334 Gillian and 53,801 Adjuchas.

Suppose 1% of Adjuchas continue to become Vasto Lordes. That gives us 538 of them. So, 538,013,539 Hollows, 5,326,334 Gillian, 53,263 Adjuchas and 538 Vasto Lordes.

These numbers looks pretty big, don't they? But there's a few things that are yet to be factored in. First, remember: these are the totals for 52,011 years. On an average year, we only get roughly 10,344 Hollows, 102 Gillian and 1 Adjuchas. Vasto Lordes only emerge once in a century.

Second, that lonely lonely Adjuchas is hungry. It needs to eat other Hollows or it will regress. Assume it needs to feed only each week - 52 Hollows. And here we come to an interesting point: the yearly increase in Hollows is only enough to support 200 Adjuchas, out of which only 2 can rise to be Vasto Lordes. After this, no more Adjuchas or Vasto Lordes can come to being, since they eat all other Hollows.

But if this is the case... what's the deal with Forest of Menos? It just shouldn't exist. Never mind a Hollow city like Las Noches - there's barely enough for a Hollow village!

Of course, there are many ways you can adjust these numbers. For example, if Adjuchas fight each other so that only 100 remain at any given point, we have end up with (roughly) 5,166 new Hollows per year, and 52 Gillians per year.

So, in 52,011 years, from population of 1,076,027,078 people-turned-Hollows, we get 268,688,826 Hollows, 2,704,572 Gillian, 99 Adjuchas and 1 Vasto Lorde. A total of 271,393,498 overall. Now, let's be very optimistic here and assume 1% of all Hollows become Arrancar. So 2,713,935 Arrancars have ever existed. Sounding better, isn't it?

But we're still assuming none of our Hueco Mundo Hollows get wantonly slaughtered by each other or outside forces - they're immortal, that is. For contrast, only 6.5% of people to ever live are alive now. Since Hollows are biologically immortal, let's be generous and triple that number for them - to 19.5%.

This leaves us with roughly 51,870,378 ordinary Hollows and 523,943 ordinary Arrancar, 522,118 Gillians and 5,274 Gillian Arrancar, 19 Adjuchas and one-fifth of a Vasto Lorde.

This configuration is starting to look like it would fit our setting. Okay, so we have a few more Vasto Lordes (Geister, Cuerva and Rouga make 3) and I'm hazarding a guess abnormally high portion of our Adjuchas are Arrancars, but beyond that, it sounds about right. It has a few implications though:

a) Las Noches holds all or nearly all Adjuchas-level and above Arrancars in existence. No wonder Shinigami would worry about it.
b) Hueco Mundo is even emptier than it looks. Assuming it's as big as earth's land area, even in the forest of Menos you can travel for miles and miles without seeing a single Hollow.

I'm not suggesting these are our canonical numbers. As noted, even the base numbers of how many people have lived are speculative, it's very hard to calculate past demographics.

[Nicklance]

Interesting, but I think we can tweak the numbers a little.

For example, let's run with a slightly higher estimate of 2% of the dead population become Hollows, and during any given year with huge pandemics or warfare or disaster, like the Great Fire of London, Pompeii, Black Death etc etc. Those would be the years where there is potentially a surge of resources for Hollows to munch on. (And given how it is, we could also not discount a possibility that some of the greatest natural and man-made disasters are caused by Hollows).

As for other food sources, let's run with a statistically low but still significant number of Shinigami that fell to Hollows and vice versa. That would help toss a few more factors into the calculation pool.

But since this is anime, just add a 0 to all the numbers up there and we'll be in a very comfortable range.

[Kuroimaken]

I actually think it's more likely that about 10% of those who die become Hollows. This is for a number of reasons:

1) There aren't that many Shinigami on active Mortal World duty. Remember, Rukia alone was responsible for the whole of Karakura Town (which is more like a district if you stop to think about it; after all, WITHOUT counting shunpou and the like, the protagonists were able to go from one side of town to the other ON FOOT, RUNNING, without even breaking a sweat. Yes, this is anime we're talking about, but still).

2) Giving those Shinigami a 99/98% success rate is likely giving them WAY too much credit. We go back to Rukia: despite her having Shikai, making her a seated officer, she totally lost her **** facing a single Hollow when she met Ichigo - when she should have REALLY performed better. 90% is still fairly generous.

3) Earth is FREAKING HUGE, and we have humans living very, very far away from the populated centers the Shinigami are likely to patrol. Think eskimos, high sea researchers, people working oil platforms.

4) The Shinigami's ability to detect Hollows from Soul Society and relay it to Reiphones REALLY FREAKING SUCKS. And apparently they don't detect Pluses either. Remember Don Kanonji's first appearance? Ichigo had NEVER been anywhere near that hospital as a Shinigami.

[Frozen_Feet]

As noted, the 1% of all deceased ending up in HM is just those Hollows that aren't eliminated earlier. The actual percentage of dead people ending as Hollows is higher. EDIT: If you look up canon info, just the trip from Earth to HM is supposed to cull the numbers. Suppose every tenth person becomes a Hollow; you really think it's a low estimate that every tenth of them becomes like Grand Fisher of canon?

But while great disaster probably caused a sudden surge of Hollows, Hollows probably haven't caused many big events, since they're a very disorganized bunch and have very little reason to leave Hueco Mundo. Most of them are bestial or non-sentient (true up to Gillian level), and busy fighting and killing each other. And only Gillian level or up really have the power to cause major incidents, and as noted, they are in the tiny minority.

Also, the argument of there being very few Shinigami is more of an argument for people being able to move to heaven on their own, or at least being able to walk to Shinigami, rather than turning to Hollows. Ichigo would've seen way more Hollows and Shinigami (and ghosts in general) during his early life otherwise.

EDIT2: Also, while detecting Pluses by special spiritual senses might be hard, finding them is another thing entirely. Most Pluses are free to move after their deaths, with those becoming Land-Bound often remaing in the same spot for years before turning into Hollows (see the hospital event for details).

If you are dead and suddenly find yourself a ghost, where do you go? I'd imagine a lot of people would gravitate towards sites of local religion or other places traditionally associated with death (cemeteries, namely). In a modern setting, checking hospitals and like for recently deceased would also be just common sense for the Shinigami.

Think of how this applies to our setting: what is one of the most notable spiritual hotspots in Fushichou town? That's right, Houheiden Shrine. Which also contains a gateway for Shinigami to use.

In Bleach anime filler, we also find that there are natural Senkaimon leading to Soul Society. Well, where are these usually found? That's right, shrines.

So to pick up most Pluses, a Shinigami would have to walk through a fairly intuitive list of hotspots on his area.

[Draken]

There is a factor you ignored. Animals also become hollows (at least one filler episode had a non-menos hollow formed of two dog souls and we see the tiny hollow animal in Hueco Mundo), and the plus victims of non-menos hollows also become hollows.

This should inflate the numbers massively.

[Kuroimaken]

No wonder the Shinigami are crazy about Konsou.

[AnimeKid]

Plus there are those that don't want to move on as well. Some that may like there life in semi-immortality. Watching over family members and the like. After all spirits (I think? Need to look it up again) can still touch things. After all Tatsuki, far before she was able to actually see them, could still touch Acidwire (Orihime's brother) and actively acknowledged it, wondering what she was touching.

Add to the fact that they can posses animal if need be there would probably be a lot of people content with staying spirits. Also while Rukia's performance was poor remember that she was trying to defeat the hollow without hurting Ichigo's sister which was being held hostage by it. It didn't help matters when Ichigo came out of the house, arms still binded behind is back and Rukia had to cover his a*s.

[Frozen_Feet]

Originally Posted by Draken

There is a factor you ignored. Animals also become hollows (at least one filler episode had a non-menos hollow formed of two dog souls and we see the tiny hollow animal in Hueco Mundo), and the plus victims of non-menos hollows also become hollows.

This should inflate the numbers massively.

I'm ignoring animals souls for a couple of reasons:

a)There are no numbers of all animals born ever, even estimating that is impossible.
b)The human world is too empty of dead animals for them to regularly become even Pluses. I theorize, also based on buddhist influence of the setting, that most animals are reincarnated straight away. Animals becoming Hollows might happen, but I think it's much more expectional than humans becoming so.
c)Tiny Hollow animal don't really prove one way or another. I believe normal Hollows can be pretty much any size, so they might as well be human souls.
d)As Menos evolve, they gravitate towards human form. Same with Arrancar. I take this to suggest that majority of Hollows were indeed humans.

But if you do include animals, it does make the question Elder posed even more interesting.

[KnightDisciple]

Originally Posted by Frozen_Feet

But if you do include animals, it does make the question Elder posed even more interesting.

Dinosaur Arrancar!

Putting that aside...

I'm really hoping Allan kicks her teeth in or something. I'm tired of a character who's supposed to be a borderline Eldritch Abomination being nothing but a lecturer to the Shinigami who sounds reasonable. This is a soul-eating monstrosity, people! Surely we can balance "trying to cleanse the Hollow" and "not going bat**** crazy"!

[Keveak]

If I may add my thoughts to a discussion far above my wisdom, I think there might actually be another possible reason for why there is a distinct lack of animal plusses in the Mortal World. Namely that plusses only seem to stick around if they are attached to or held back by something from their mortal life.

It may simply be that most nonhumans don't have the cognitive complexity to develop any attachment this important in most cases, and thus there would only be very few spirits of animals who do not immediately go on to Soul Society and even fewer who become Hollows of any kind.

This is just my mad hypothesising, though. So feel free to correct me on something I missed in the manga so far. Such as the presence of animals in Soul Society, which would have to be at least similar to the Mortal World. ^_^'

Would be fun to play a nonhuman spirit, though.