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    Default Relationship Woes and Advice 21: Time To Go Bar-Hopping

    Welcome to the Relationship Woes and Advice thread, home of any questions you may have: romantic or familial or friendship, we'll answer (or try to answer) them all. Three years old and growing. As Pancake says, this isn't a trade economy- feel free to ask if you have a question, even if you haven't ever given advice and don't intend to start. We won't stone you or ignore you or anything. All we ask is to know how a situation ends up, either in this thread or through a PM.

    Here are the basics.

    The biggest bit of advice I've seen bandied around is the truest- no matter what else is true about the situation, always be yourself. It's no good to act like someone else, because eventually the true you will come out and the other person will not be happy you hid that from them.

    Rules Of Relationships:
    #1- Communicate. If you can't talk with your partner, it's probably not going to work.

    #2- Be yourself. Admittedly, if you have some really bad habits you should probably try to change them, but be honest about who you are. No one wants to find out they were loving a lie, and no one likes to live a lie (...well, normally).

    #3- Accept your partner. In mine, and other people's, experience you have to be able to accept your partner as they are, because they probably won't be able to change. Also, don't change drastically for someone. I've tried it, my friends have tried it, it doesn't work and it doesn't end pretty.

    #4- Hints. Do. Not. Work. Or they might, but the chance of that happening is limited. Some people are like me and just utterly oblivious unless it is blatantly stated, others are (also like me) and don't want to assume, and yet others don't care. You won't know which they belong to unless you actually spell out your intentions and/or feelings. I would consider this a corrolery to Rule #1 except that it comes up so often. Do NOT assume someone should know something from hints. Hints, by nature, are subtle. Clue Bats/Crow Bars/Mack Trucks are not. Try hitting them with one of those. ;) (No, not literally. I mean be upfront if you are trying to get someone to know something.)

    #5- Don't be desperate. You don't need to be in a relationship and the healthiest mindset is one where you are happy as you are, even if you do not have a significant other. Don't stay in a relationship that isn't good if you aren't happy, just because you want someone. This is detrimental to both parties in the long (and sometimes short) run.

    #6- Be a couple. Set aside some time every week to be together. Just an hour, if nothing else, where it's JUST you two. No computer, no others. Just the couple.

    #6.5- Maintain the relationship. Ask your partner every now and then how they are feeling, if they feel like the relationship is still going in a good direction, etc. Also, make sure you don't hide it if you have an issue with your partner or a relationship. The only way it can change is if you talk about it.

    #7- Let your boundaries be known. This goes for everything from intimacy to what you consider cheating to any other thing you can think of. Pretty much if it's something that would possibly upset you or your partner, let them know BEFORE a problem arises. An example would be letting your partner know you consider kissing cheating. They very well might think only intercourse is cheating. Having that known before anything potentially happens is a good thing.

    #8- Know the signs of an abusive relationship. Both men and women can be abusers, and if you recognize the signs early on you are more likely to be able to get out of a bad situation before it gets out of hand. It's never easy, but if you know the general red flags, it can help you to avoid the situation.

    A list - courtesy of Pheehelm

    RULES. YOU READ THESE.
    -Anything of a sexual nature, please PM to either myself or one of the regular advice givers. If you just want general opinions post something like: "I have this problem, but it is not board appropriate. Could one of you guys PM me?" I know from experience that you will in fact get help.

    -KEEP IT NICE. Disagreements are bound to happen, but please don't be rude.

    -Joking is all fun and games, within reasons. Please do not get derogatory.

    -We are not allowed to dispense advice that should be handled by a professional, including psychological or medical advice.

    I decided to put this up because, evidently, it was not apparent that these should be followed. I do not want this thread to be scrubbed again, and we were blessed to get it back.

    So please - play nice, and if you're not comfortable talking about things over the open board, PM one of the regulars (too many to mention), and I'm sure they'll be willing to lend an ear - or if you're not sure who to PM, post asking for someone to PM you, and you'll soon get a response

    -Syka

    Previous thread: Relationship Woes and Advice XX: One X Short of an Awesome Title

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    NecromancerGuy

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    Default Re: Relationship Woes and Advice 21: Time To Go Bar-Hopping

    Good title, we approve.

    Repost from last thread about rooms and blacklights and one's bed and guest etiquette and how to dissuade someone from calling one a slut as a form of greeting without resorting to violence:
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    Quote Originally Posted by Coidzor View Post
    Hmm... So I find myself at an impasse as to how exactly to respond to a girl taking a blacklight and sneaking into my room while I was out walking the dog and running the blacklight over my bed in an attempt to find something incriminating.

    This feels like a violation of trust and privacy at about 8 or 9 on the 1-10 scale.

    Any suggestions?
    Quote Originally Posted by NineThePuma View Post
    ... Did she find anything incriminating?
    Quote Originally Posted by Coidzor View Post
    Does it matter? She has no business checking into my bed, especially considering she is decidedly not welcome there.

    Quote Originally Posted by arguskos View Post
    ...uh... why'd she do it? What reason did she have? Simple curiosity of "hmm, wonder if Coid be gettin' some"? Was it for some stranger "imma be a ****" purpose? Have you asked?

    Additionally, have you said, "Hey! Don't do that kinda thing. That's pretty unacceptable."

    Finally, why do you really care? Is this a housemate or some random person? If it's a housemate, that's more of an issue, but can be solved with something called a lock.
    Quote Originally Posted by Coidzor View Post
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    Someone that I was fairly good friends with in Highschool but who has dropped down to acquaintance level good feelings through one thing or another. You may recall my mentioning a girl who was cheating on her fiance behind his back until she finally just couldn't be bothered and so browbeat him into staying with her while she started sleeping around openly rather than just on thesly.

    She's apparently trying to "slut shame" me now, which is kind of as annoying as it is hypocritical of her. I'd say this is probably related to her moving in with that one girl who decided to start making "whore," "ho," "hoe," and "slut" her go-to greetings towards me via facebook chat.

    I have yet to find a way to adequately convey my displeasure with that, as the only answer I can find to someone trying to "slut shame" me for being male is to do a violence upon them.

    One of the few downsides to people eroding gender roles, the *ahem* individuals who think that it means that trying to make slut shaming of men a thing is the way to go rather than getting rid of the stupidity of calling girls sluts for having had sex outside of wedlock once.

    Right now I only have the word of one other person who was in the house at the time and I was told this after the woman in question had departed. So I'm tempering my ire with the knowledge that it is possible that I am being deceived, and so I believe my appropriate response should include seeking confirmation of what exactly was going on there. Although, it's a rather sad indication of how our relationship has deteriorated that I trust the acquaintance I made a few months ago at Halloween about on the same level, possibly more, than I trust her word.

    Mostly I care because of 1. I can only ascribe ill motives to such an act and 2. I do not like my privacy to be violated like that. It's like going through a man's collection of images of his significant other in flagrante delicto, unless he's decided to dump those images on 4chan already, but even then you don't go through his computer to view them.
    Last edited by Coidzor; 2011-12-29 at 09:14 PM.
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    Default Re: Relationship Woes and Advice 21: Time To Go Bar-Hopping

    Who starts at 21 though? Fake ID's are the whole point of going to bars.
    Can only thank GitP for being so good for so long.
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    Default Re: Relationship Woes and Advice 21: Time To Go Bar-Hopping

    Quote Originally Posted by Mutant Sheep View Post
    Who starts at 21 though? Fake ID's are the whole point of going to bars.
    There's the meat market, the neighborhood pub where one can stop over and have a pint and a bite of something decent together and/or converse with friends without anyone having to play host or hostess, and the pool hall in disguise as bar types that I've discovered so far.

    I believe there's also ones where one goes to have a gin and tonic or two and listen to music, but I've yet to discover them personally.
    Quote Originally Posted by Keld Denar View Post
    +3 Girlfriend is totally unoptimized. You are better off with a +1 Keen Witty girlfriend and then appling Greater Magic Make-up to increase her enhancement bonus.
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    Default Re: Relationship Woes and Advice 21: Time To Go Bar-Hopping

    Coid: Let's break this into component parts:

    The names she calls you are a disincentive to talk to her again. I mean, I'm all for gender equity; if you'd slug a guy, go ahead and slug her. I just find that people do that **** for a rise. Either stop putting up with them, or stop taking their bait and giving them what they want.

    Searching your room like that would be a violation of your trust even if she were a housemate. And I say this as someone who understands that there are plenty of legitimate reason's to go into a housemate's room. I'd have to know her relationship with your other housemates to say anything for sure, but if you're the only one she's on any sort of terms with, you can tell the people you live with that she's not allowed in unless you expressly invite her. Trespassing after that should be treated like any other trespasser.

    The story as a whole sounds like someone acting out because they feel that they can without consequences. The exact details are probably more than the time/stomach lining you care to waste.

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    Default Re: Relationship Woes and Advice 21: Time To Go Bar-Hopping

    Ok, so. Met a girl through OKCupid, and we've been texting back and forth for a while. I like her, and it was obvious even to someone as oblivious as me that she's interested as well. Today, for our first irl meeting, she asked if I'd like to accompany her on a 3 hour drive from here to an errand she had to run and back. Disregarding one of the prime rules of first dates (don't be in a situation where you are the main source of entertainment for the other person), I said yes...with predictable results. It wasn't a complete disaster, but it definitely could have gone better. As eloquent, charming (or so she says) and long-winded as I am in text, I am...not always so in person, especially during first meetings. Thus, the evening was spent in pleasant but sputtering conversations once I realized that "holy **** I have no idea how to act around actual people", and I could almost feel myself running into the bar I'd set, knocking it over like so many Jenga towers toppled by an unsteady hand.

    She seemed disappointed, is the point I'm trying to make.

    And naturally, right now I am just filled with things I shoulda, coulda, woulda said. Just to make my failure complete. *headdesk*

    I mean...I know I'm charming, witty, and halfway to handsome on a good day. Today was just not a good day.

    I am, however, pretty sure that it can be salvaged. I am just unsure of how to go about that, and more importantly, how to ensure that I don't freeze up again. Help me, GitP. You're my only hope.

    Coid: just stop talking to her. People like that aren't worth your time, and you're not going to be the person to get her to change your ways. Perhaps one day she'll realize what she's doing is stupid and wrong and you can be friends again, but in the mean time it isn't worth enduring the shaming and privacy invasions, in my opinion.
    Last edited by Marillion; 2011-12-30 at 01:52 AM.
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    Default Re: Relationship Woes and Advice 21: Time To Go Bar-Hopping


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    Default Re: Relationship Woes and Advice 21: Time To Go Bar-Hopping

    Quote Originally Posted by Marillion View Post
    And naturally, right now I am just filled with things I shoulda, coulda, woulda said. Just to make my failure complete. *headdesk*

    I mean...I know I'm charming, witty, and halfway to handsome on a good day. Today was just not a good day.

    I am, however, pretty sure that it can be salvaged. I am just unsure of how to go about that, and more importantly, how to ensure that I don't freeze up again. Help me, GitP. You're my only hope.
    Welcome to my love life. There's a long list of things I should have said for one reason or another over the course of my last catastrophic romantic failure, and right at the top would be offering a slight heads up that I don't have quite the same talent for speech that I do for writing.

    Anyway, take this advice for what it's worth, knowing that my own endeavors in this regard haven't been particularly successful.

    You're charming, witty, and halfway to handsome on a good day? Then you'd do well to ensure that you next meet up with this girl on one of those good days. Chance favors the prepared mind after all. Invite her out to do something that's likely to nudge conversation toward a topic you're particularly comfortable talking about. Once you build up some momentum, you should be able to ride it in whatever direction the discussion goes in, and the fact that there's something to steer the conversation in the first place should mean that you won't be in the same awkward position of being the sole provider of entertainment.

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    Default Re: Relationship Woes and Advice 21: Time To Go Bar-Hopping

    Catching up with the end of the previous thread:

    Coidzor, about the masturbation thing, Dan Savage mentioned it in his column a bunch of times, and I read it from other sources too. And I tend to trust Dan Savage's column because he's pretty good about going to specialists and asking them about stuff.

    About the whle virgin thing, here are a few thoughts, but spoilered since it's kinda off-topic by now:
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    Moonshadow, I didn't say take control, I said take charge. What I meant was more along the lines of taking pressure off of their shoulders so they can just relax and enjoy. It's not about going "do this! Do that!" it's about trying things and seeing how they like them. Obviously they can say
    they'd like to try this or that, but for the actual technical aspects it's best to have someone show you the first time I believe. I was very happy to have my first time with someone who was experienced.

    Think for instance about a condom. Imagine a guy who has never put one on. Which is best, handing one to him and saying "figure it out" or putting it on him while explaining the important aspects, so that next time he can do it with more confidence?
    The same kind of logic applies. I'm more comfortable with the person who will let me show him than the one who will say "no, no, don't tell me, I want to do it on my own" and then fails at it and won't take any advice.
    Note that I said "the result might not be so good" and not "the result will not be good". It might be fine, and then I wouldn't have a problem with it, but yes, I would have apprehension if they start off by not letting me offer my experience, be it only to tell them what I enjoy, and prefer copying something they've seen in porn or something.
    By "the result might not be so good" I didn't mean "I won't enjoy the sex" by the way. I meant it might not be a good experience for them to fumble and get increasingly more nervous and self-conscious. At that point why should I stand still and do nothing rather than guide their hands (or other parts)?
    An of course the more awkward it is for them, the more awkward it is for me as well.

    Bottom line is, it's rare to know what you like on your first time, and how you like it. You're often not aware of all the options and there are things you've never felt before. I feel showing the different things so that they have a better idea of what they like best for next times is more constructive.


    And now that I'm caught up I hope I'll be able to stay caught up for longer this time :P
    Last edited by Lissou; 2011-12-31 at 03:15 AM.

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    Default Re: Relationship Woes and Advice 21: Time To Go Bar-Hopping

    You can enter bars at any age over here, some events have 14/16/18 but that's usually just the occasional event at clubs. And drink light alcohols from 16+ and strong from 18+

    The title, it doesn't apply to my country.
    But yeah, bar-hopping is good fun.
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    Default Re: Relationship Woes and Advice 21: Time To Go Bar-Hopping

    Quote Originally Posted by Lissou View Post
    About the whle virgin thing, here are a few thoughts, but spoilered since it's kinda off-topic by now
    You messed up your spoiler tags.
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    Default Re: Relationship Woes and Advice 21: Time To Go Bar-Hopping

    Quote Originally Posted by Marillion View Post
    I mean...I know I'm charming, witty, and halfway to handsome on a good day. Today was just not a good day.

    I am, however, pretty sure that it can be salvaged. I am just unsure of how to go about that, and more importantly, how to ensure that I don't freeze up again. Help me, GitP. You're my only hope.
    Well, it sounds like it was a comfort issue, and when you first meet someone in the flesh that you've been carrying on correspondence with, that's pretty stressful and so the ice doesn't always immediately break despite having had prior communication.

    I think most people would understand that, so as long as it wasn't a complete fiasco that made her actively hostile to you, a second meeting that can easily go better would be open to you.

    With Regards to Moi:
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marillion View Post
    Coid: just stop talking to her. People like that aren't worth your time, and you're not going to be the person to get her to change your ways. Perhaps one day she'll realize what she's doing is stupid and wrong and you can be friends again, but in the mean time it isn't worth enduring the shaming and privacy invasions, in my opinion.
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    Mostly I was just confused about the trying to shame me thing, since, well, I'm a guy. I've even pointed this out to them, but they don't seem to get it. I thought it was a brief, rather stupid interlude or injoke of some sort.

    As it stands though, I'm mostly just looking for suggestions for my spiel to her as I bar her formally from ever entering the house again, possibly even an explanation that might sink into her brain at some point, so that the thought that what she did was wrong might cross her mind.


    Quote Originally Posted by Reluctance View Post
    Coid: Let's break this into component parts:

    The names she calls you are a disincentive to talk to her again. I mean, I'm all for gender equity; if you'd slug a guy, go ahead and slug her. I just find that people do that **** for a rise. Either stop putting up with them, or stop taking their bait and giving them what they want.
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    I'd mostly been ignoring the two girls in this aspect, aside from pointing out that the woman who went from only having slept with 4 guys to having slept with 40, often back to back, in less than two week's time did not have a leg to stand upon for haranguing anyone about one night stands ever. So, except when a third party was requiring passing of information, I'd been ignoring the one that's been doing it the most (the other one just joined in one time to mock me and got promptly shut down for sleeping with anything that moves that isn't her fiance), but was kinda hoping that not getting a reaction from me would cause it to get old after pointing out that this was a very foolish thing, I've since made a single request to desist from such behavior. If either of them were guys I'd've already enacted casual violence upon them in order to at least cause them to conform to their stated ethical framework while in my presence, as one can do that without being branded an evil misogynist who must die.


    Quote Originally Posted by Reluctance View Post
    Searching your room like that would be a violation of your trust even if she were a housemate. And I say this as someone who understands that there are plenty of legitimate reason's to go into a housemate's room. I'd have to know her relationship with your other housemates to say anything for sure, but if you're the only one she's on any sort of terms with, you can tell the people you live with that she's not allowed in unless you expressly invite her. Trespassing after that should be treated like any other trespasser.

    The story as a whole sounds like someone acting out because they feel that they can without consequences. The exact details are probably more than the time/stomach lining you care to waste.
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    Indeed, the more annoying one(the one that snuck into my room, as the one who calls me whore is just kind of confusing, as it seems almost like she's parroting it after hearing someone use it as a term of affection and mock insult for banter purposes) has been living a life where people have been protecting her from consequences. She is quite lucky I did not find out until she had already left.

    I'm perfectly fine with people in my room, I've even doubled up with people in my bed when there's not been enough space to sleep, which I suppose is what prompted her to be a rude and nosy person and violate my trust. I rather dislike people getting into my porn stash or messing with my collection of a few treasured objects all the same though.

    Unfortunately, she's one of the main contributors to the planner new year's party that is being held here, so as much as I want to ban her from the house immediately, I'm going to have to wait until after New Year's or until I have more than hearsay even if the hearsay is pretty reliable in general.

    Because while she's on thin ice already with my other housemate, the third and final housemate here is head over heels "in love" with her and has been one of the people she's been using to avoid responsibility(like, say, instead of ever learning to drink responsibly, especially after she claims to have been date raped after drinking so much she blacked out, she designates one person to have to decide how much she can drink.... and then tries to drink everything in the house behind their back) and sponge resources, affection, and transportation off of, and he's been one of the few she hasn't paid off with her body to do so either.
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    I suppose she still has the social acumen to not want it known to the entire social circle that she trades her body in exchange for favors from strange men....
    Quote Originally Posted by Keld Denar View Post
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    Default Re: Relationship Woes and Advice 21: Time To Go Bar-Hopping

    Quote Originally Posted by Coidzor View Post
    There's the meat market, the neighborhood pub where one can stop over and have a pint and a bite of something decent together and/or converse with friends without anyone having to play host or hostess, and the pool hall in disguise as bar types that I've discovered so far.

    I believe there's also ones where one goes to have a gin and tonic or two and listen to music, but I've yet to discover them personally.
    Oh, there's rather a lot of bar types. For instance, there's the traditional sports bar. There's also the brewpub, which is often a fun experience. My personal favorite is the high end classic cocktail bar. Unfortunately, they are uncommon, but if you can find one, it's totally worth checking it out.

    Quote Originally Posted by Marillion View Post
    Ok, so. Met a girl through OKCupid, and we've been texting back and forth for a while. I like her, and it was obvious even to someone as oblivious as me that she's interested as well. Today, for our first irl meeting, she asked if I'd like to accompany her on a 3 hour drive from here to an errand she had to run and back. Disregarding one of the prime rules of first dates (don't be in a situation where you are the main source of entertainment for the other person), I said yes...with predictable results. It wasn't a complete disaster, but it definitely could have gone better. As eloquent, charming (or so she says) and long-winded as I am in text, I am...not always so in person, especially during first meetings. Thus, the evening was spent in pleasant but sputtering conversations once I realized that "holy **** I have no idea how to act around actual people", and I could almost feel myself running into the bar I'd set, knocking it over like so many Jenga towers toppled by an unsteady hand.
    Sounds awkward, but don't blame yourself too much...a three hour drive to do an errand is not the ideal suggestion for a first date, and honestly, first date awkwardness happens rather a lot.

    She seemed disappointed, is the point I'm trying to make.

    And naturally, right now I am just filled with things I shoulda, coulda, woulda said. Just to make my failure complete. *headdesk*

    I mean...I know I'm charming, witty, and halfway to handsome on a good day. Today was just not a good day.

    I am, however, pretty sure that it can be salvaged. I am just unsure of how to go about that, and more importantly, how to ensure that I don't freeze up again. Help me, GitP. You're my only hope.
    Well, first, don't beat yourself up too much over it. Going over better things you thought up after the fact is pretty normal, but it also rarely does much other than make you feel more stressed about it.

    Consider the worst possible outcome: You go your separate ways, but you've gained some valuable experience in dealing with people in unfamiliar and awkward situations. This is a useful, if hard-gotten skill. If this happens, at least you're better prepared for next time around, and nobody's the worse off for it.

    On the other hand, if the first date was a bit of a bust, and she's still interested, that's a good sign. Come up with a different sort of suggestion for another date, one in which you're hopeful that you'll both feel comfortable, and in which other topics of conversation will naturally present themselves. If the previous awkwardness comes up, blame it on an off day, apologize briefly, but don't dwell on it. Too much focus on the awkwardness just prolongs it.

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    Default Re: Relationship Woes and Advice 21: Time To Go Bar-Hopping

    Quote Originally Posted by Dallas-Dakota View Post
    You can enter bars at any age over here, some events have 14/16/18 but that's usually just the occasional event at clubs. And drink light alcohols from 16+ and strong from 18+

    The title, it doesn't apply to my country.
    But yeah, bar-hopping is good fun.
    I knew all this, but "RWA 21: Screw the Dutch" seemed a bit inflammatory. I think the US is the only place with a drinking age of 21 anyway.

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    Default Re: Relationship Woes and Advice 21: Time To Go Bar-Hopping

    Its strange to keep seeing my younger friends, who graduated two or three years after me, getting married.

    Especially since I have yet to have a lasting relationship, or feel emotionally attached to anyone for more then seven or eight months and I start to think that something is seriously wrong with me.

    "This is why it hurts the way it hurts.
    You have too many words in your head.
    There are too many ways to describe the way you feel.
    You will never have the luxury of a dull ache.
    You must suffer through the intricacy of feeling too much"

    — Iain S. Thomas
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    Default Re: Relationship Woes and Advice 21: Time To Go Bar-Hopping

    Quote Originally Posted by AtlanteanTroll View Post
    You messed up your spoiler tags.
    Thanks, fixed it.

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    Default Re: Relationship Woes and Advice 21: Time To Go Bar-Hopping

    Am I the only person around who can get a girl to agree to meet irl, seem enthusiastic about it, and then have her completely disappear? I mean no contact for the past month. Nothing. Nada. I'm beginning to seriously doubt my chances at ever being loved.
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    Default Re: Relationship Woes and Advice 21: Time To Go Bar-Hopping

    Quote Originally Posted by Sholos View Post
    Am I the only person around who can get a girl to agree to meet irl, seem enthusiastic about it, and then have her completely disappear? I mean no contact for the past month. Nothing. Nada. I'm beginning to seriously doubt my chances at ever being loved.
    It's the internet...that happens a lot. People are much more willing to make contact online than in person, because of the anonymity barrier...but once it comes time to make the transition to real life, a lot of people just don't want to do it.

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    Default Re: Relationship Woes and Advice 21: Time To Go Bar-Hopping

    Quote Originally Posted by Tyndmyr View Post
    It's the internet...that happens a lot. People are much more willing to make contact online than in person, because of the anonymity barrier...but once it comes time to make the transition to real life, a lot of people just don't want to do it.
    Its just annoying, because she seemed enthusiastic for several weeks and stuff just kept coming up (she got sick, exams). I'm probably also taking it harder because this sort of thing seems to happen to me a lot, even in real life. There must be something horribly wrong with me that makes people forget about me, but heck if I know what it is.
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    Default Re: Relationship Woes and Advice 21: Time To Go Bar-Hopping

    Quote Originally Posted by Sholos View Post
    Its just annoying, because she seemed enthusiastic for several weeks and stuff just kept coming up (she got sick, exams). I'm probably also taking it harder because this sort of thing seems to happen to me a lot, even in real life. There must be something horribly wrong with me that makes people forget about me, but heck if I know what it is.
    The putting things off bit, or the evaporation? The former sounds like someone who's just making excuses. I've saved a lot of time with one simple rule; if she breaks the date, it's her responsibility to set up the next one.

    The evaporation sounds like you're not striking when the iron is hot. Move early, and if she keeps you in limbo, don't give her any more thought than you would any other pen pal. If she's talking with you, it's likely that she's talking to other guys at the same time. You don't get the romcom gradual ramp up. You either get friendzoned, or you get forgotten entirely as all her time gets drawn in by the new beau.

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    Default Re: Relationship Woes and Advice 21: Time To Go Bar-Hopping

    In my experience, women are much more prone to making decisions on what they do based on how they feel about it, rather than how they think about it.

    If she's enjoying a conversation with you, then she's more likely to feel good about meeting up irl. Later on, when she's thinking about actually meeting up, if she doesn't feel good about it anymore, she'll just not do it. The justification of it comes later. (This also explains the MUCH higher tendency for women to ask questions like 'how do you feel about it', because it matters more to how most women tend to make decisions.).

    Once the decision to not meet up has been made, telling you she's changed her mind is *hard*. And since you're only online friends, she can simply not talk to you instead, which is much much easier.

    From what you've described, it sounds like you're doing something that makes her nervous or less excited about the meeting up, and that's causing the change of mind.

    Examples of things that could potentially cause this include:

    Bringing up the meeting/event regularly, making it seem like you're far more invested in the meeting than she is, causing her to feel nervous about it.

    Talking to her much more frequently after the meeting is organised, making her feel like you consider this a major step, again making her nervous about it.

    It's this kind of natural shift that you've probably been doing unconciously. She's interpreting it stronger than it is, and it's making her uncomfortable, which makes her change her mind about the meeting.

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    Default Re: Relationship Woes and Advice 21: Time To Go Bar-Hopping

    Quote Originally Posted by term1nally s1ck View Post
    In my experience, women are much more prone to making decisions on what they do based on how they feel about it, rather than how they think about it.

    If she's enjoying a conversation with you, then she's more likely to feel good about meeting up irl. Later on, when she's thinking about actually meeting up, if she doesn't feel good about it anymore, she'll just not do it. The justification of it comes later. (This also explains the MUCH higher tendency for women to ask questions like 'how do you feel about it', because it matters more to how most women tend to make decisions.).
    I hate to break it to you, pal, but males do that pretty often too. People of both sexes are equally prone to acting on "feelings" rather than "thoughts" (if it really is possible to separate the two). You can influence someone to invest money in something by manipulating their feelings rather than convincing them of the value logically, and there is negligible difference between the sexes on how successful this is.

    But there's certainly merit to the thought that outside factors influence someone's propensity to talk to you. No matter how much you like someone, if you are in a bad mood, you are less likely to attempt a positive interaction. And that leads to further desire to put off future positive interaction, since you had no desire to do it the last time. That's just life for you.

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    Default Re: Relationship Woes and Advice 21: Time To Go Bar-Hopping

    Quote Originally Posted by Reluctance View Post
    The putting things off bit, or the evaporation? The former sounds like someone who's just making excuses. I've saved a lot of time with one simple rule; if she breaks the date, it's her responsibility to set up the next one.

    The evaporation sounds like you're not striking when the iron is hot. Move early, and if she keeps you in limbo, don't give her any more thought than you would any other pen pal. If she's talking with you, it's likely that she's talking to other guys at the same time. You don't get the romcom gradual ramp up. You either get friendzoned, or you get forgotten entirely as all her time gets drawn in by the new beau.
    Joy and fun times. Anyone have any advice for the perpetually unloved?
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    Default Re: Relationship Woes and Advice 21: Time To Go Bar-Hopping

    Quote Originally Posted by Sholos View Post
    Joy and fun times. Anyone have any advice for the perpetually unloved?
    Stop persuading yourself it's your fault?

    Seriously though, it's largely luck. Just be awesome, remember that you're awesome, and keep meeting people till you find someone who realises how awesome you are. It's pretty clichéd, but it's not bad as advice goes.
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    Default Re: Relationship Woes and Advice 21: Time To Go Bar-Hopping

    Quote Originally Posted by Sholos View Post
    Am I the only person around who can get a girl to agree to meet irl, seem enthusiastic about it, and then have her completely disappear? I mean no contact for the past month. Nothing. Nada. I'm beginning to seriously doubt my chances at ever being loved.
    I've had that happen to me with friends that I hadn't seen in a couple of months.

    The last time I brought it up in the thread I was basically told that if I was lucky she wasn't actively going around and lying to every other woman I know behind my back for having attempted to contact her at all.

    The time before that was a friend from high school who accused me of wanting to date-rape her when I mentioned casually that it'd be good to see her again and that it'd been too long since we had under the unfortunate circumstances of her breakup with my freshman year room-mate.

    To put it mildly it's kind of crummy.

    So basically all you can do is drop it, put your best foot forward, and have some face to face interaction as much as you can to wear away any rough edges and, y'know, maximize potential with people in the area.
    Last edited by Coidzor; 2011-12-31 at 06:44 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Keld Denar View Post
    +3 Girlfriend is totally unoptimized. You are better off with a +1 Keen Witty girlfriend and then appling Greater Magic Make-up to increase her enhancement bonus.
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    Default Re: Relationship Woes and Advice 21: Time To Go Bar-Hopping

    Quote Originally Posted by DeadManSleeping View Post
    I hate to break it to you, pal, but males do that pretty often too. People of both sexes are equally prone to acting on "feelings" rather than "thoughts" (if it really is possible to separate the two). You can influence someone to invest money in something by manipulating their feelings rather than convincing them of the value logically, and there is negligible difference between the sexes on how successful this is.

    But there's certainly merit to the thought that outside factors influence someone's propensity to talk to you. No matter how much you like someone, if you are in a bad mood, you are less likely to attempt a positive interaction. And that leads to further desire to put off future positive interaction, since you had no desire to do it the last time. That's just life for you.
    There's a *major* difference in the frequency. I've spent 2 years watching to figure out what makes the 'battle of the sexes' such a constant, and that's one of the major differences I noted. Men adjust feelings based on what they can justify, women adjust their justifications based on their feelings. It's weird, but the results match reality to a surprisingly high accuracy.

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    Default Re: Relationship Woes and Advice 21: Time To Go Bar-Hopping

    Quote Originally Posted by term1nally s1ck View Post
    There's a *major* difference in the frequency. I've spent 2 years watching to figure out what makes the 'battle of the sexes' such a constant, and that's one of the major differences I noted. Men adjust feelings based on what they can justify, women adjust their justifications based on their feelings. It's weird, but the results match reality to a surprisingly high accuracy.
    Women don't have to be as result-minded because, at least at your age, men let them get away with it. So long as people will support and validate someone for what they're doing, why change? That's unisex.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Reluctance View Post
    Women don't have to be as result-minded because, at least at your age, men let them get away with it. So long as people will support and validate someone for what they're doing, why change? That's unisex.
    Indeed, the worst part is when you encounter someone like that and you're the one person who doesn't have pointless hots for them, so you actually tell them the truth about something and the entire world flips out at you like an ape who got eggs sunny side up rather than scrambled for breakfast.
    Quote Originally Posted by Keld Denar View Post
    +3 Girlfriend is totally unoptimized. You are better off with a +1 Keen Witty girlfriend and then appling Greater Magic Make-up to increase her enhancement bonus.
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    Default Re: Relationship Woes and Advice 21: Time To Go Bar-Hopping

    Ironically, the most attractive women, who have dozens of men every day falling over themselves to fulfil their every whim, will invariably be most attracted to the people who don't behave the way they want.

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    Default Re: Relationship Woes and Advice 21: Time To Go Bar-Hopping

    Okay, so, the girl whom I was talking to up until the end of November that I asked out and she suddenly had to bail and stopped talking to me?

    Well, she got back into contact with me a week ago and said that she wanted to start over. I was cool with this, so we've been talking for the past week and getting along great, and so I asked her out to lunch and a movie (because hey I figured we already knew each other from before and I didn't want to sit around and get friendzoned yadda yadda yadda) and she said sure. I was planning to hammer out the plans sometime this week after I got paid.

    Anyways, things going great, she wishes me a happy new year the day before in case she might not be around on new years... and now suddenly her new OkCupid account is gone again, but I didn't even get a "I'm sorry I have to bail again" message this time.


    So, I'm really confused, and hoping that it was just some sort of mistake, because there were no prior indicators to tell me that something was wrong and that she'd have to suddenly disappear again. So I'm just hoping that it was some sort of drunken shenanigans.

    I don't have any other way to get into contact with her except for an email address that she was supposed to add me to msn with but never did so I don't even know if it's the real thing or not.

    I'm so confused
    Witness my glory and know that when my darkness fades, if you yet live, it is because an ally does not.

    AN EMPTY SPOT WITHIN MY CRAW CRAVES YOUR FLESH, YOUR BONES BLED RAW!
    YOUR FEAR! YOUR FEAR! SO SWEET! SO STRONG! TO TEASE MY TONGUE, YOUR LIVES ARE GONE!
    YOUR ODDS UNFAVORED, MY WEB TOO STRONG! SPEED WON'T NEGATE A LINE STEPPED WRONG!
    YOU DARE? DARE SMITE THIS AWESOME BEAST? YOUR FATES ARE SEALED AS MY NEXT FEAST!
    HEED THIS BECK AND HEAR THIS CALL! FIGHT ME STILL, YOUR WILLS SHALL FALL!

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