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Old 01-29-2012, 08:31 PM   Top  -  End  -  #1
Grod_The_Giant
Ogre in the Playground
 
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: 
Pittsburgh and/or Oberlin
Gender: Male
Default More Magic, More Fun -- Sorcerer/Wizard Remixes (3.5, PEACH)

The wizard is arguably the most powerful class in 3.5 edition D&D, thanks to his nearly-unrestricted access to the most powerful spell list in the game. The sorcerer is "only" tier 2, due to more limited access to the list. Now, I don't think that it's possible to nerf either class down to Tier 3-- the sorcerer/wizard list is just too good. I've tried to weaken the wizard, but the main thing I'm trying to do here is to make the classes more fun. That means actual class features. That means making a clearer distinction between the two classes. That means (to me, at least) changing the prepared spells mechanism. I hold no illusions that these are significantly weaker classes-- if anything, my sorcerer is stronger. But the goal is fun-to-play Tier 2's. So, without further ado...

Sorcerer




Hit Die- d4
Class Skills- Bluff (Cha), Concentration (Con), Craft (Int), Diplomacy (Cha), Intimidate (Cha), Knowledge (arcana) (Int), Profession (Wis), Spellcraft (Int), and Use Magic Device (Cha).
Skill Points at 1st Level- (4 + Int modifier) × 4.
Skill Points at Each Additional Level- 2 + Int modifier.

LevelBABFortRefWillSpecialMax Spell LevelArcana/Day
1st+0+0+0+2Arcana, Heritage, Birthright14
2nd+1+0+0+3Heritage Power17
3rd+1+1+1+3Body Burn211
4th+2+1+1+4Magesight217
5th+2+1+1+4 325
6th+3+2+2+5Heritage Power334
7th+3+2+2+5High Arcana444
8th+4+2+2+6Magetouch456
9th+4+3+3+6 570
10th+5+3+3+7Soul Burn585
11th+5+3+3+7 6101
12th+6/+1+4+4+8Heritage Power6119
13th+6/+1+4+4+8 7139
14th+7/+2+4+4+9Perfect Sight7160
15th+7/+2+5+5+9Great Arcana8182
16th+8/+3+5+5+10Heritage Power8206
17th+8/+3+5+5+10 9232
18th+9/+4+6+6+11Body Fuel9259
19th+9/+4+6+6+11Imbue Arcana9287
20th+10/+5+6+6+12Heritage Power9317

Weapon and Armor Proficiency- Sorcerers are proficient with all simple weapons. They are not proficient with any type of armor or shield. Armor of any type interferes with a sorcerer’s gestures, which can cause his spells with somatic components to fail.

Spells- A sorcerer casts arcane spells which are drawn primarily from the sorcerer/wizard spell list. He can cast any spell he knows without preparing it ahead of time, the way a wizard or a cleric must (see below).

To learn or cast a spell, a sorcerer must have a Constitution score equal to at least 10 + the spell level. The Difficulty Class for a saving throw against a sorcerer’s spell is 10 + the spell level + the sorcerer’s Charisma modifier.

A sorcerer’s selection of spells is extremely limited. A sorcerer begins play knowing four 0-level spells and two 1st-level spells of your choice. At each new sorcerer level, he gains one or more new spells, as indicated on the table below. These new spells can be common spells chosen from the sorcerer/wizard spell list, or they can be unusual spells that the sorcerer has gained some understanding of by study. The sorcerer can’t use this method of spell acquisition to learn spells at a faster rate, however.

Upon reaching 4th level, and at every even-numbered sorcerer level after that (6th, 8th, and so on), a sorcerer can choose to learn a new spell in place of one he already knows. In effect, the sorcerer "loses" the old spell in exchange for the new one. The new spell’s level must be the same as that of the spell being exchanged, and it must be at least two levels lower than the highest-level sorcerer spell the sorcerer can cast. A sorcerer may swap only a single spell at any given level, and must choose whether or not to swap the spell at the same time that he gains new spells known for the level.

Unlike a wizard or a cleric, a sorcerer need not prepare his spells in advance. He can cast any spell he knows at any time, assuming he has not yet used up his arcana for the day (see below). He does not have to decide ahead of time which spells he’ll cast.

Sorcerer Spells Known
Level0 lv1st2nd3rd4th5th6th7th8th9th
1st 42
2nd 53
3rd 642
4th 753
5th 8642
6th 9653
7th 106642
8th 106653
9th 1066642
10th 1066653
11th 10666642
12th 10666653
13th 106666642
14th 106666653
15th 1066666642
16th 1066666653
17th 10666666642
18th 10666666653
19th 10666666664
20th 10666666665

Arcana- A sorcerer doesn’t use spell slots, as most spellcasters do. Instead, he has a certain number of arcana points per day, as indicated on the table above. Each time he casts a spell, he must pay a certain number of arcana points, based on the level of the spell he is casting, as indicated on the table below. If he does not have sufficient points, he cannot cast the spell. While waking and active, a sorcerer regains a number of arcana points per hour equal to his Constitution modifier. Eight hours of sleep (or trancing, or meditating, if the sorcerer is of a race that doesn't normally sleep) is sufficient to regain all expended arcana points. If awakened prematurely, a sleeping sorcerer can be judged to have regained Contitution modifier points per hour, as normal, plus an additional 10 points per hour spent sleeping.

A sorcerer may apply metamagic feats to his spells. If he does, he must pay the arcana cost for a spell of the modified level (although he does not increase the casting time). For example, an empowered magic missile would normally use up a 3rd level slot, so a sorcerer must pay 5 arcana points to cast the spell.

0-level spells (cantrips) do not cost any arcana to cast, and a sorcerer can cast all 0-level sorcerer spells he knows at will. However, if he casts more than (Constitution Modifier) cantrips in a single minute, he must spend one arcana point.

Spell Level0 lv1st2nd3rd4th5th6th7th8th9th
Arcana Cost01357911131517

Arcana points may only be used to cast sorcerer spells. Any prestige class that advances spellcasting also advances arcana. Items or abilities that grant bonus spell slots grant an equivalent amount of bonus arcane, as shown on the table above.

Heritage- A sorcerer’s power comes from some sort of pact or ancestry with magical beings. At first level, he selects a source of power: Aberrant, Abyssal, Aquatic, Celestial, Draconic, Elemental, Fey, Infernal, Necromatic, Primal, Shadow, or Starsoul. Each source of power comes with a special birthright ability. In addition, he gains a heritage power at 2nd, 5th, 10th, 15th, and 20th levels. This ability counts as the relevant heritage feat (if one exists) for the purposes of prerequisites. Heritage powers are described below.

Body Burn—Starting at 3rd level, a sorcerer may channel his own life force to boost the power of his spells. As a swift action, he may deal himself 2Xd6 points of damage, where X is any number up to his Constitution modifier. The next spell he casts has its caster level increased by X. For example, a sorcerer might deal himself 4d6 damage to boost the caster level of a fireball spell by 2. This extra damage cannot be prevented in any way, and always is subtracted from the sorcerer’s real hit points—temporary hit points don’t help. He may use this ability a number of times per day equal to his Constitution modifier.

Magesight (Su)- Starting at 4th level, a sorcerer can use the spell detect magic at will, with the following exceptions. As a swift action, he can toggle this ability on or off. He does not have to concentrate to keep it active, although unless he does he can only detect the presence or absence of magic. He can never be stunned by an overwhelmingly powerful aura. Otherwise, it works as the spell.

Magetouch (Sp)- Starting at 8th level, a sorcerer may use the spell identify at will. He does not need to provide a material component.

High Arcana— A sorcerer’s spellcasting power continues to increase by leaps and bounds, but his body remains frail in comparison. Spells of 4th level and above are considered high arcana, and are subject to additional restrictions.
  • A sorcerer may only cast (Constitution Modifier) high arcana spells of the highest level available to him. Every hour, he regains one potential spell of each level, and eight hours of rest resets the count completely. He may attempt to cast spells after he has exceeded the limit, but doing so is both difficult and costly. He must make a Concentration check (DC 15+ Spell Level x 2) to cast at all. If he succeeds, he casts the spell as normal, but takes Constitution damage equal to one-half the level of the spell he just cast. If he fails, he takes 1d6 damage per level of the spell he was attempting to cast, and the action is wasted.
  • Increase the damage when using Body Burn with a high arcana spell by one step, from 2Xd6 to 2Xd8.
  • Increase the cost of using Soul Burn with a high arcana spell to 2 points of Constitution damage per point of caster level cap increase.

Soul Burn—Starting at 10th level, a sorcerer’s ability to pour his life force into spells increases. As a move action, he may deal himself X points of Constitution damage, where X is any number up to his Constitution modifier. The next spell he casts has any relevant caster level cap increased by X. For example, a sorcerer might deal himself 3 points of Constitution damage to increase the damage cap of a fireball spell from 10d6 to 13d6. This extra damage cannot be prevented in any way. He may use this ability a number of times per day equal to his Constitution modifier. He may use both Body Burn and Soul Burn in the same turn to affect the same spell.

Perfect Sight (Su)- At 14th level, a sorcerer’s Magesight improves. He may now toggle the spell true seeing on and off at will, in addition to detect magic. He may not have both abilities active simultaneously.

Great Arcana—A sorcerer’s spellcasting power is the stuff of legends, but despite the cosmic wellspring of power within his soul, his body is only mortal. Spells of 8th level and above are considered great arcana, and are subject to the following restrictions. These new restrictions override those of high arcana. In addition, he no longer faces a restriction on the number of High Arcana spells he can cast.
  • A sorcerer may only cast (Constitution Modifier) great arcana spells of the highest level available to him, and (Constitution Modifier times two) great arcana spells of the second highest level available to him. Every hour, he regains one potential spell of the level, and eight hours of rest resets the count completely. He may attempt to cast spells after he has exceeded the limit, but doing so is both difficult and costly. He must make a Concentration check (DC 20+ Spell Level x 3) to cast at all. If he succeeds, he casts the spell as normal, but takes Constitution damage equal to one-half the level of the spell he just cast. If he fails, he takes Constitution damage equal to one-half the level of the spell he was attempting to cast, and the action is wasted.
  • Increase the damage when using Body Burn with a great arcana spell by two steps, from 2Xd6 to 2Xd10.
  • Increase the cost of using Soul Burn with a great arcana spell to 3 points of Constitution damage per point of caster level cap increase.

Body Fuel (Ex)- At 18th level, a sorcerer may sacrifice his own body on the alter of his magic. When affected by an anti-magic field or similar effect, he still cast spells by dealing himself Constitution damage equal to the level of the spell he wishes to cast, and making a DC 30+Spell Level Concentration check. If he has no Constitution score, he instead damages both his Strength and Dexterity. This damage cannot be prevented or reduced by any means.

Imbue Arcana (Su)- At 19th level, a sorcerer’s control over his own magical power is such that he can temporarily transfer a measure of it to an ally. As part of a ten-minute ritual, he may transfer up to twice his Charisma score Arcana points to a willing target. The benefits of the transfer last for ten minutes per point of the target’s Constitution score.
  • If the target is a sorcerer, he may use them to cast spells normally.
  • If the target is a spellcaster who does not use arcane points, the sorcerer may grant them extra spell slots—transferring 3 points grants them a second level spell slot, transferring 5 points grants them a third level spell slot, and so on (see the arcane cost for casting sorcerer spells).
  • If the target has no spellcasting ability at all, the sorcerer may transfer the ability to cast one spell. Doing so removes it from the sorcerer’s list of spells known, and inflicts Constitution damage equal to the level of the spell transferred to the sorcerer. The sorcerer regains knowledge of the spell at the end of the duration.

Heritages


Aberrant
Spoiler


Abyssal Bloodline
Spoiler


Aquatic
Spoiler


Celestial
Spoiler


Draconic
Spoiler


Elemental
Spoiler


Fey
Spoiler


Necromantic
Spoiler


Infernal
Spoiler


Primal
Spoiler


Shadow
Spoiler


Starsoul
Spoiler


Sorcerer Variant-- The Classic Sorcerer

For those who object to Arcana points.

Lose: Arcana, Imbue Arcana
Gain: Imbue Magic

Imbue Magic— At 19th level, a sorcerer’s control over his own magical power is such that he can temporarily transfer a measure of it to an ally. As part of a ten-minute ritual, he may transfer up to twice his Charisma modifier spell levels to a willing ally, who must participate in the entire ritual as well. The benefits of the transfer last for ten minutes per point of the target’s Constitution score.
  • If the target is a spontaneous spellcaster, he gains a number of bonus spells equal to the number of spells transferred. For example, if a sorcerer transfers 4 third-level spells (12 spell levels) to a Favored Soul, the latter would gain 4 additional castings of third-level spells. These temporary spell slots are used first, just like temporary hit points.
  • If the target is not a spontaneous spellcaster, he gains the ability to cast each transferred spell once as a spell-like ability, with a caster level equal to his hit die, and a saving throw DC based on his Charisma score.

Other Changes:
  • Spells per day as described in the Player’s Handbook
  • Bonus spells for a high Constitution modifier
  • Delete the first bullet point from High and Great Arcana.

Divine Sorcerer Variant— The Channel

The gift of magic manifests differently in every sorcerer, depending on their ancestry. A dragon-blooded sorcerer will have very different gifts from another mage who can claim the blood of a fey lord. Sometimes, that gift develops into an entirely different form of magic. The blood of gods runs in a Channel’s veins, granting them incredible divine might.

Loses: Birthright.
Gains: Domains, Domain Mastery

Hit Die: d6

Weapon and Armor Proficiency- Channels are proficient with all simple weapons and with light armor, but not with shields.

Spellcasting - As normal for a Sorcerer, except that the Channel casts divine spells, which are drawn from the cleric list.

Heritage- must be either Celestial, Abyssal, or Infernal.

General Change— replace all instances of Constitution in spellcasting and class features with Wisdom.

First Domain- At 1st level, a Channel chooses one domain and adds the spells to his list of spells known.

First Domain Power- at 5th level, a Channel gains the domain power for his chosen domain, with an effective cleric level equal to his Channel level (if applicable).

Second Domain- At 9th level, a Channel chooses a second domain and adds the spells to his list of spells known.

Second Domain Power- at 13th level, a Channel gains the domain power for his second chosen domain, with an effective cleric level equal to his Channel level (if applicable).

Domain Mastery- at 17th level, a Channel chooses one of his two domains. When casting spells from that domain, he may either Extended or Empower them (his choice, on casting the spell) without increasing the casting time or spell level. The choice of domain cannot be changed.
__________________
STaRS-- The Simple Tabletop Roleplaying System; my attempt at a generic rules-light system.

Homebrewer's Extended Signature

And check it out! I have a wiki, too! Aren't I fancy?

Last edited by Grod_The_Giant : 02-26-2012 at 07:32 PM.
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Old 01-29-2012, 08:32 PM   Top  -  End  -  #2
Grod_The_Giant
Ogre in the Playground
 
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: 
Pittsburgh and/or Oberlin
Gender: Male
Default Re: More Magic, More Fun -- Sorcerer/Wizard Remixes (3.5, PEACH)

Wizard




Hit Die- d4.
Class Skills- Concentration (Con), Craft (Int), Decipher Script (Int), Knowledge (all skills, taken individually) (Int), Profession (Wis), and Speak Language (Int), Spellcraft (Int), and Use Magical Device (Cha)
Skill Points at 1st Level- (4 + Int modifier) ×4.
Skill Points at Each Additional Level- 4 + Int modifier.

LevelBase AttackFortRefWillSpecial0 lv1st2nd3rd4th5th6th7th8th9th
1st+0+0+0+2Forms, Rituals31
2nd+1+0+0+3Summon familiar42
3rd+1+1+1+3Spell Trick, Knowledge Focus421
4th+2+1+1+4Bonus feat432
5th+2+1+1+4Spell Trick4321
6th+3+2+2+5Knowledge Focus4332
7th+3+2+2+5Spell Trick44321
8th+4+2+2+6Bonus feat44332
9th+4+3+3+6Spell Trick , Knowledge Focus444321
10th+5+3+3+7Stored Ritual444332
11th+5+3+3+7Spell Trick4444321
12th+6/+1+4+4+8Knowledge Focus, Bonus feat4444332
13th+6/+1+4+4+8Spell Trick44444321
14th+7/+2+4+4+9Fast Ritualist 44444332
15th+7/+2+5+5+9Spell Trick , Knowledge Focus444444321
16th+8/+3+5+5+10Bonus feat444444332
17th+8/+3+5+5+10Spell Trick4444444321
18th+9/+4+6+6+11Knowledge Focus4444444332
19th+9/+4+6+6+11Spell Trick4444444433
20th+10/+5+6+6+12Quickdraw Ritualist, Bonus feat4444444444

Weapon and Armor Proficiency- Wizards are proficient with the club, dagger, heavy crossbow, light crossbow, and quarterstaff, but not with any type of armor or shield. Armor of any type interferes with a wizard’s movements, which can cause his spells with somatic components to fail.

Spells- A wizard casts arcane spells which are drawn from the sorcerer/wizard spell list. To learn, prepare, or cast a spell, the wizard must have an Intelligence score equal to at least 10 + the spell level. The Difficulty Class for a saving throw against a wizard’s spell is 10 + the spell level + the wizard’s Wisdom score. Like other spellcasters, a wizard can cast only a certain number of spells of each spell level per day. his base daily spell allotment is given on the table above. In addition, he receives bonus spells per day if he has a high Intelligence score.

A wizard’s spells are divided into two categories, forms and rituals. Both terms are synonymous with “spell,” except when relating to class features. See below for details.
Forms- Forms are battle magic. A wizard may cast any form he knows without preparing it ahead of time. A wizard begins play knowing 10 zero-level forms and two first level forms. Each time he levels up, he learns two new forms of any level he could normally cast.

Upon reaching 3rd level, and at every wizard level thereafter, a wizard can choose to learn a new form in place of one he already knows. In effect, the wizard "loses" the old form in exchange for the new one. The new form’s level must be the same as or lower than that of the form being exchanged, and it must be at least two levels lower than the highest-level wizard form the wizard can cast. A wizard may swap only a single form at any given level, and must choose whether or not to swap the form at the same time that he gains new forms known for the level.

Unlike normal spontaneous casting, a wizard may apply metamagic feats to his spells without increasing their casting times.

Rituals- Rituals are utility spells. A wizard may cast any ritual he knows without preparing it ahead of time, however, doing so takes a great deal of effort.

First, a wizard must write the ritual in his spellbook. Doing so takes 24 hours, takes up one page/level of the spell, and costs one hundred gold per page. Rituals can be copied from other wizards’ spellbooks, from scrolls, or developed through independent research. Researching a new ritual takes two days per level of the spell, and costs 500 gold and 50 experience per level of the spell being researched. A wizard begins his career with (Intelligence Modifier) rituals in his spellbook.

Casting a ritual takes ten minutes per spell level. If the spell’s casting time is normally more than one full round, add that time to the total casting time of the ritual. Material components must be provided normally. At the conclusion of the ritual, the spell is cast normally.

The wizard may pay 25 experience/spell level to increase the duration of the spell by one step (rounds/level -> minutes/level -> hours/level -> days/level -> weeks/level). He may apply any metamagic feat he knows to the spell being emulated, taking the increased time to cast a spell of the adjusted level.

The spell a ritual is emulating must be of a level the wizard is normally capable of casting.
Familiar- At 2nd level, a wizard can obtain a familiar. Doing so takes 24 hours and uses up magical materials that cost 100 gp. A familiar is a magical beast that resembles a small animal and is unusually tough and intelligent. The creature serves as a companion and servant.

The wizard chooses the kind of familiar he gets. As the wizard advances in level, his familiar also increases in power.

If the familiar dies or is dismissed by the wizard, the wizard must attempt a DC 15 Fortitude saving throw. Failure means he loses 200 experience points per wizard level; success reduces the loss to one-half that amount. However, a wizard’s experience point total can never go below 0 as the result of a familiar’s demise or dismissal. A slain or dismissed familiar cannot be replaced for a year and day. A slain familiar can be raised from the dead just as a character can be, and it does not lose a level or a Constitution point when this happy event occurs.

A character with more than one class that grants a familiar may have only one familiar at a time.

Knowledge Focus (Ex)- At 3rd level, and every subsequent third level, a wizard gains a permanent +2 bonus to one Intelligence-based skill of your choice. These bonuses can be stacked, or they can be applied to different skills.

Spell Trick- Wizards have a smaller arsenal of battle magic than other spontaneous casters, but their mastery over the more technical aspects of the craft gives them an edge of petty sorcerers. At 3rd level, and every subsequent odd-numbered level, a wizard may learn a single spell trick from the list below. Alternately, he may select a spell trick he already knows and gain an additional 3 daily uses.

You may only apply one spell trick to any given casting of a spell. Each spell trick may be used a number of times per day equal to your Intelligence modifier. Applying a spell trick requires a swift action.

List of Spell Tricks
Spoiler


Bonus Feats- At 4th, 8th, 12th, 16th, and 20th level, a wizard gains a bonus feat. At each such opportunity, he can choose a metamagic feat, an item creation feat, a reserve feat (see Complete Mage), a spell trick feat (see below), or Spell Focus, or Spell Mastery. Other magic-related feats may be allowed as well, pending the DM's approval. The wizard must still meet all prerequisites for a bonus feat, including caster level minimums.

Stored Ritual (Sp)- At 10th level, a wizard learns how to ‘store’ nearly completed rituals for later use. When casting a ritual, he may spend 25 experience per spell level to store the energies in specially constructed vessel, such as a gemstone or wand. Constructing a vessel costs five hundred gold per level of the spell to be stored in it, but vessels can be reused. Stored spells last for one day per Wizard level. If the spell is not cast at the end of this duration, he regains two-thirds of the expended experience (the rest of the energy is lost to entropy). At any point while the spell is stored and available, he may take a swift action to trigger it. He then casts the spell as if it were one of his forms.

Fast Ritualist (Sp)- At 14th level, a wizard has figured out how to perform rituals quickly, when need be. A number of times per day equal to his Wisdom modifier, he may reduce the casting time of a ritual to one round per spell level, minus one-half his Intelligence modifier rounds. Doing so is an extremely inefficient process, and to compensate, the wizard must pay 50 experience per spell level.

Quickdraw Ritualist (Sp)- At 19th level, when using his Fast Ritualist ability, a wizard may spend an additional 25 experience per spell level to reduce the casting time to one full round.


School Specialization
A school is one of eight groupings of spells, each defined by a common theme. If desired, a wizard may specialize in one school of magic. A specialist wizard casts spells from his chosen school at +1 caster level, and he gains a +1 bonus to spell save DC with spells of his chosen school. Every level he gains access to a new spell level, starting at 1st, he gains a bonus form from his school. Finally, casting rituals from his chosen school only takes seven minutes per spell level, rather than ten. Alternately, he may take the normal ten minutes per spell level and pay 15 experience per spell level to increase the spell's duration by one step, rather than the usual 25.

The wizard must choose whether to specialize and, if he does so, choose his specialty at 1st level. At this time, he must also give up one other school of magic, which become his prohibited school. Spells of the prohibited school are not available to the wizard, either as forms or as rituals, although he can cast them from scrolls, wands, and the like. He may not change either his specialization or his prohibited school later.

The eight schools of arcane magic are abjuration, conjuration, divination, enchantment, evocation, illusion, necromancy, and transmutation. Spells that do not fall into any of these schools are called universal spells. Note: Detect Magic and Read Magic count as universal spells, and may be learned by any wizard, even one who has given up the divination school.


Divine Wizard Variant-- the Seeker


Loses/Gains- None as such;See below for changes
Special- A wizard may be both a Seeker and a Scribe-- the combination is known as the Archivist, and replaces the class of the same name.

Weapon and Armor Proficiency- Seekers are proficient with all simple weapons and with light armor, but not with shields.

Spellcasting- As normal for a wizard, except that the Seeker casts divine spells, which are drawn from the cleric list. In addition, because a Seeker leans his magic through study, rather than having it granted directly from a deity, he suffers from armor-based spell failure when wearing armor heavier than light or when using a shield.
Rituals-A Seeker seeks power and knowledge in from all avenues of divine magic. He may learn druid spells as rituals as well as cleric spells. However, doing so costs twice as much-- to research the spell, and to scribe it in his prayerbook-- and performing a druidic ritual takes him 15 minutes per spell level, rather than the normal ten.
Foreign Spell- At 3rd level, and every subsequent odd-numbered level, a Seeker may add a single ritual to his spellbook for free. Unlike normal rituals, this one may come from the sorcerer/wizard list, or from the druid list without the usual penalties.

Wizard Variant-- the Scholar

Loses- Summon Familiar, All Foreign Spell iterations.
Gains- Dark Knowledge, Dark Skill, Dark Mastery
Special- A wizard may be both a Scribe and a Seeker -- the combination is known as the Archivist, and replaces the class of the same name.

Dark Knowledge (Ex)- Three times per day, a Scribe can draw upon his expansive knowledge of monsters, granting his allies benefi ts against the creatures they face. Doing this counts as a move action. The secrets of dark knowledge pertain only to aberrations, elementals, magical beasts, outsiders, or undead. A Scribe unlocks new dark knowledge abilities as his level increases and can also call upon his dark knowledge more often, gaining one additional daily use for every two Scribe levels (4/day at 2rd level, 5/day at 4th level, and so forth).

Using dark knowledge requires a Knowledge check of a type appropriate to the creature faced. A Knowledge (arcana) check reveals secrets of magical beasts, Knowledge (dungeoneering) pertains to aberrations, Knowledge (religion) covers undead, and Knowledge (the planes) applies to outsiders and elementals. The DC of the check is 15. Most of the Scribe’s dark knowledge abilities increase in effectiveness if he succeeds on his Knowledge check by 10 or more. Dark knowledge can only be used once against any given creature.

The Scribe’s dark knowledge can affect a single creature or all creatures of the same race, depending on the effect used. A target creature must be within 60 feet, and the Scribe must be aware of the creature’s presence, although he need not have a line of sight to it. The effects of dark knowledge last for 1 minute, unless stated otherwise.
  • Tactics: The Scribe knows the general combat behaviors of creatures of that race, granting his allies a +1 bonus to attack rolls made against them. For example, a Scribe confronted by hydras who succeeded on his Knowledge (arcana) check would grant his allies the attack bonus against all the hydras they fought in that encounter. If the Scribe succeeds on his Knowledge check by 10 or more, then this bonus increases to +2. If the Scribe succeeds on his Knowledge check by 20 or more, then this bonus increases to +3.
  • Puissance: Starting at 5th level, the Scribe can use his dark knowledge to help his allies fi ght off the corrupting infl uence of other creatures. Allies within 60 feet of the Scribe gain a +1 bonus on saving throws against the affected creature’s abilities. If the Scribe succeeds on his Knowledge check by 10 or more, this bonus increases to +2. If the Scribe succeeds on his Knowledge check by 20 or more, this bonus increases to +3.
  • Foe: Starting at 11th level, a Scribe can direct his allies to attack vital spots of his enemies. On a successful Knowledge check, he grants them a bonus to weapon damage rolls made against the target creatures equal to 1d6 points of damage. If the Scribe succeeds on his Knowledge check by 10 or more, then this bonus increases to 2d6. If the Scribe succeeds on his Knowledge check by 20 or more, then this bonus increases to 3d6.
  • Dread Secret: By speaking aloud a dread secret of the target creature, a Scribe of 13th level or higher can dazzle a target creature for 1 round. Unlike other dark knowledge, this ability can be used only against a single creature. If the Scribe succeeds on his Knowledge check by 10 or more, then the target is dazed for 1 round. If the Scribe succeeds on his Knowledge check by 20 or more, then the target is stunned for 1 round (if the target is immune to being stunned but not immune to being dazed, such as most undead, then the Scribe can choose to daze the target instead of stunning it).
  • Foreknowledge: Starting at 17th level, a Scribe can better prepare his allies for the attacks of the affected creature, making it harder for the creature to land blows and successfully deal damage. Allies within 30 feet of the Scribe gain a +1 insight bonus to Armor Class and saving throws that applies to attacks by the affected creature only. If the Scribe succeeds on his Knowledge check by 10 or more, this bonus increases to +2. If the Scribe succeeds on his Knowledge check by 20 or more, this bonus increases to +3.

Dark Skill- At 7th level, a Scribe may use Dark Knowledge as a swift action.

Dark Mastery- At 19th level, a Scribe may use Dark Knowledge as a free action.

New Feats


Extra Forms
Prerequisite: Wizard 3
Benefit: You may learn up to two new forms of any level up to one level lower than the highest level you can cast. You must already know the spell you wish to learn as a ritual. You may learn cleric or druid spells in this manner, but you learn them at one level higher than normal. (thus, cure light wounds would become a second level spell). These spells are cast as arcane rituals; thus, this feat does not allow you to qualify for prestige classes as though you cast divine spells.
Special: You may take this feat multiple times. Each time, you learn two more spells.

Extra Trick
Prerequisite: Wizard 3
Benefit: You may learn one additional spell trick, or else gain an additional 3 daily uses of an already known trick.
Special: You may take this feat multiple times. Each time, you learn a new spell trick, or get more uses from an already-known one.
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Old 01-30-2012, 09:42 PM   Top  -  End  -  #3
Grod_The_Giant
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Just noticed that I forgot to post the sorcerer heritages. Whoops! They're up now, and 99.9% ripped from Pathfinder.
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Old 01-31-2012, 04:51 AM   Top  -  End  -  #4
nonsi
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With so many Spells Known and so much arcana to burn on the higher level spells (plus all those class features), your Sorcerer amounts to what people often refer to as Tier-0.
From 4th level and on, you need to cut down the Arcana/Day pool by half, otherwise the Wizard is no competition (not to mention any other class).

Last edited by nonsi : 01-31-2012 at 04:53 AM.
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Old 01-31-2012, 05:18 AM   Top  -  End  -  #5
Ashtagon
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I agree with nonsi here. Why would anyone ever choose not to play straight sorc or wiz 20 under these rules?
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Old 01-31-2012, 12:08 PM   Top  -  End  -  #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ashtagon View Post
I agree with nonsi here. Why would anyone ever choose not to play straight sorc or wiz 20 under these rules?
Why would anyone ever chose to play a straight sorcerer or wizard under the existing rules? I operate under the philosophy that base classes should be mechanically and flavorfully appealing at all levels. Prestige classes should be special, picked to fulfill your specific vision of the character, not because your base class is weak and/or boring.

Nonsi, the hypothetical tier 0 is reserved for things like the psionic artificer (can access literally every spell and power in the game, make dorjes with 9th level powers, recharge way more easily) or the beholder mage PrC (can cast I think 9 spells a turn, every turn).

My sorcerer knows 19 more spells than the original, yes (not counting cantrips; on average, an extra two per level). The total is still roughly compatible with the Favored Soul, with a slight tweak in progression so that he does gain new spells every level. He can go nova if he wants, but apart from the extremely slow regeneration, he loses out in terms of spells/day from the original sorcerer-- I calculated Arcana points adding up spell slots times spell level (a 1st level spell slot was worth 1 arcana point, a 2nd level spot was worth 2, a 3rd level slot was worth 3, and so on), but set the cost of the spell levels in arcana points equal to an unaugmented psionic power.
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Old 01-31-2012, 12:40 PM   Top  -  End  -  #7
nonsi
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Grod_The_Giant View Post
Why would anyone ever chose to play a straight sorcerer or wizard under the existing rules? I operate under the philosophy that base classes should be mechanically and flavorfully appealing at all levels. Prestige classes should be special, picked to fulfill your specific vision of the character, not because your base class is weak and/or boring.
I say this quite a lot (in so many words).
Click my sig (in this message and on, not earlier messages).
I believe you're really gonna like what you'll find there.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Grod_The_Giant View Post
Nonsi, the hypothetical tier 0 is reserved for things like the psionic artificer (can access literally every spell and power in the game, make dorjes with 9th level powers, recharge way more easily) or the beholder mage PrC (can cast I think 9 spells a turn, every turn).
A DM that allows a player to cast 9 spells / turn (even if the RAW supports it) is an idiot.
Period.
End of discussion.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Grod_The_Giant View Post
My sorcerer knows 19 more spells than the original, yes (not counting cantrips; on average, an extra two per level). The total is still roughly compatible with the Favored Soul, with a slight tweak in progression so that he does gain new spells every level.
This, on its own is fine.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Grod_The_Giant View Post
He can go nova if he wants, but apart from the extremely slow regeneration, he loses out in terms of spells/day from the original sorcerer-- I calculated Arcana points adding up spell slots times spell level (a 1st level spell slot was worth 1 arcana point, a 2nd level spot was worth 2, a 3rd level slot was worth 3, and so on), but set the cost of the spell levels in arcana points equal to an unaugmented psionic power.
When you can spam 10 spells of your highest level before shooting blanks, something's wrong.
The ability to manipulate spell points gives you incredible versatility.
Even with my suggestion implemented, I'd play one in a heartbeat and shoot for level 20, because having the right spell for practically any occasion means you spend a lot less than a character that needs to rely on proximity spells more often than not.


Edit: sig not updated yet. That one links to the previous version. You can find the updated version in the first page of the same forum. I'll update my sig later on today.

Last edited by nonsi : 01-31-2012 at 12:43 PM.
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Old 01-31-2012, 08:23 PM   Top  -  End  -  #8
Grod_The_Giant
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nonsi View Post
A DM that allows a player to cast 9 spells / turn (even if the RAW supports it) is an idiot.
Period.
End of discussion.
It's a monster-only class that has a beholder using each eyestalk to cast a different level spell. 9 spells/turn is the POINT, not an unintentional loophole. But yeah, agreed.

Quote:
When you can spam 10 spells of your highest level before shooting blanks, something's wrong.
The ability to manipulate spell points gives you incredible versatility.
Even with my suggestion implemented, I'd play one in a heartbeat and shoot for level 20, because having the right spell for practically any occasion means you spend a lot less than a character that needs to rely on proximity spells more often than not.
I feel your pain, and I just spent a little while playing with the math. I don't want to lose the unique system, and I think it can be balanced. How about these rules?

"Casting spells places incredible stresses on the body. When you have spent more than half your Arcana points, you are fatigued. When you have spent more than three-quarters of your Arcana points, you are exhausted. These conditions cannot be removed by any means except regenerating Arcana."

and

"The more you draw on your magical powers, the harder it gets. Each time you cast a spell of a given level, the cost of casting another spell of that level increases, as shown on the table below:
Highest spell level+5 points/casting
2nd-4th highest spell levels +2 points/casting
5th highest spell levels and lowerdoes not increase
"
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Old 02-01-2012, 02:34 AM   Top  -  End  -  #9
nonsi
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Default Re: More Magic, More Fun -- Sorcerer/Wizard Remixes (3.5, PEACH)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Grod_The_Giant View Post
"Casting spells places incredible stresses on the body. When you have spent more than half your Arcana points, you are fatigued. When you have spent more than three-quarters of your Arcana points, you are exhausted. These conditions cannot be removed by any means except regenerating Arcana."

and

"The more you draw on your magical powers, the harder it gets. Each time you cast a spell of a given level, the cost of casting another spell of that level increases, as shown on the table below:
Highest spell level+5 points/casting
2nd-4th highest spell levels +2 points/casting
5th highest spell levels and lowerdoes not increase
"
1. Full spellcasters are quite unimpressed by physical penalties - and even more so with level progression.
2. Balance-wise, the second part seems to be a mitigating factor (to some degree), but the higher the SLs, the less the extra toll is going to be meaningful. Furthermore, this will cost you heavy gametime bookkeeping.

I suggest you take a look at Surgo and Lord Blackfang's system. It's the only spell-points-like system I've ever encountered that's actually balanced (spell-points per-se never work - trust me on this one, I've seen literally hundreds of systems and they all fail miserably, because SLs indeed scale exponentially, so you either end up with too little or too much).
And on that note, my sig is now up to date, and in my house rules codex I've given Surgo and Lord Blackfang's system a nice finishing touch (among hundreds of other improvements to 3.5e).

But if you really insist on keeping your latest suggested mechanics, then I suggest that instead of [+5/+2/+0], you make it [Arcana-Cost/SL-Cost/No-Cost] respectively (e.g. an extra 5th level spell cast by a 9th level Sorcerer would increase the Arcana cost by +9, an extra 4th level spell would increase the Arcana cost by +4, and so on) - this way, it will not be ridiculously high at the very early levels and barely noticeable at higher levels.
OTOH, to not further encourage the 15-minute-workday, reset this extra toll on a per-encounter basis (or 10 minutes). And make it very clear that one should really not count on a 15-minute-workday, to prevent the players from going NOVA as they please.
If you're up to the bookkeeping, then this seems balanced to me.
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Old 02-01-2012, 04:07 AM   Top  -  End  -  #10
absolmorph
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Default Re: More Magic, More Fun -- Sorcerer/Wizard Remixes (3.5, PEACH)

Quote:
Originally Posted by nonsi View Post
With so many Spells Known and so much arcana to burn on the higher level spells (plus all those class features), your Sorcerer amounts to what people often refer to as Tier-0.
From 4th level and on, you need to cut down the Arcana/Day pool by half, otherwise the Wizard is no competition (not to mention any other class).
... What.
No, seriously.
What.
"So many spells known"? They get 1-2 extra known per spell level (at least in their current iteration).

Quote:
Originally Posted by nonsi View Post
A DM that allows a player to cast 9 spells / turn (even if the RAW supports it) is an idiot.
Period.
End of discussion.
Or they play with a group that doesn't follow your standards. Don't assume your play-style is universal.
Now that discussion can end.

Quote:
Originally Posted by nonsi View Post
When you can spam 10 spells of your highest level before shooting blanks, something's wrong.
The ability to manipulate spell points gives you incredible versatility.
Even with my suggestion implemented, I'd play one in a heartbeat and shoot for level 20, because having the right spell for practically any occasion means you spend a lot less than a character that needs to rely on proximity spells more often than not.
... Do you also complain about psions being able to manifest level 9 powers 20 times in a row without any bonus PP?
Honestly, this gives the sorcerer a little bit more versatility, but it's not giving them a huge boost. They can pick up a spell that fits their character but doesn't really have any other purpose without crippling themselves.
Also, this makes way more sense for someone who draws magic from within themselves than a vancian casting system; yes, they can cast 15 level 9 spells in a row (and only need to take 1 Con damage to cast a 16th), but then they're done for the day.

Increasing the Arcana cost of the spells for each casting seems like it's not really necessary; yes, they can cast a lot of their highest level, but those also consume a lot of resources. Keep in mind that lower levels have far more limited Arcana to spend, so with the chart you have now, Grod, a sorcerer could only cast 1 spell per day until level 3, and then cast 4 at level 4.
Even with nonsi's version, they only get 2 spells/day at level 3.
Given that (at the moment, at least), they can't get any bonus Arcana...
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Old 02-01-2012, 05:10 AM   Top  -  End  -  #11
nonsi
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... What.
No, seriously.
What.
"So many spells known"? They get 1-2 extra known per spell level (at least in their current iteration).
Read the whole sentence.
In the my next reply I said "This, on its own is fine."


Quote:
Originally Posted by absolmorph View Post
Or they play with a group that doesn't follow your standards. Don't assume your play-style is universal.
No, but after playing quite a bit since 1989 in most D&D systems, I have a reasonable idea about stuff that will totally trash a game session.


Quote:
Originally Posted by absolmorph View Post
... Do you also complain about psions being able to manifest level 9 powers 20 times in a row without any bonus PP?
Honestly, I don't do psionics, but psionics < spellcasting for more reasons than just the increased initial PP cost (maintenance cost for instance).


Quote:
Originally Posted by absolmorph View Post
Also, this makes way more sense for someone who draws magic from within themselves than a vancian casting system;
No need talking me out of vancian casting. I despise vancian casting.


Quote:
Originally Posted by absolmorph View Post
yes, they can cast 15 level 9 spells in a row (and only need to take 1 Con damage to cast a 16th), but then they're done for the day.
9th level spells are easily campaign-changers (Wish, Genesis, Miracle and many more). Spamming 15 of them a day is ridiculous.


Quote:
Originally Posted by absolmorph View Post
Increasing the Arcana cost of the spells for each casting seems like it's not really necessary; yes, they can cast a lot of their highest level, but those also consume a lot of resources. Keep in mind that lower levels have far more limited Arcana to spend
Which is the reason for my suggestion in the reply just above yours.


Quote:
Originally Posted by absolmorph View Post
Even with nonsi's version, they only get 2 spells/day at level 3.
Given that (at the moment, at least), they can't get any bonus Arcana...
And one level after, they can suddenly spam 5, but that can be remedied by playing with the Arcana pool values a bit (15 at level 5 and less than 25 at 6th will make things more gradual).
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Old 02-01-2012, 10:04 PM   Top  -  End  -  #12
Grod_The_Giant
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Default Re: More Magic, More Fun -- Sorcerer/Wizard Remixes (3.5, PEACH)

Quote:
Originally Posted by nonsi View Post
1. Full spellcasters are quite unimpressed by physical penalties - and even more so with level progression.
2. Balance-wise, the second part seems to be a mitigating factor (to some degree), but the higher the SLs, the less the extra toll is going to be meaningful. Furthermore, this will cost you heavy gametime bookkeeping.
True...

Quote:
But if you really insist on keeping your latest suggested mechanics, then I suggest that instead of [+5/+2/+0], you make it [Arcana-Cost/SL-Cost/No-Cost] respectively (e.g. an extra 5th level spell cast by a 9th level Sorcerer would increase the Arcana cost by +9, an extra 4th level spell would increase the Arcana cost by +4, and so on) - this way, it will not be ridiculously high at the very early levels and barely noticeable at higher levels.
OTOH, to not further encourage the 15-minute-workday, reset this extra toll on a per-encounter basis (or 10 minutes). And make it very clear that one should really not count on a 15-minute-workday, to prevent the players from going NOVA as they please.
If I understand this right, every time you cast, your highest level spell increases by (caster level), your second-fourth highest increase by (Spell Level), and there's no increased cost to lower-level spells?

Hmm. Since we're mostly worried about spamming the highest-level spells, how about one of the following:

"Using magic is exhausting, and the more powerful the spell, the more it hurts. Each time you cast a spell of the highest level you can cast, you deal yourself (1/2 spell level) Constitution damage. Each time you cast a spell of the second highest level you can cast, you deal yourself 2 constitution damage. These penalties only apply to spells of 5th level and above."
Spoiler

or

"Using magic is exhausting, and the more powerful the spell, the more it hurts. You may only cast (1/2 Constitution modifier) spells of the highest level you can cast before having to rest, and (Constitution modifier) spells of the second highest level you can cast. Every hour, you regain one potential spell of the level, and eight hours of rest resets the count completely. You may attempt to cast spells after you have exceeded the limit, but doing so is both difficult and costly. You must make a Concentration check (DC 20+ Spell Level x 3) to cast at all. If you succeed, you cast the spell as normal, but take Constitution damage equal to the level of the spell you just cast. If you fail, you take one point of Constitution damage, and your action is wasted."
Spoiler
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Old 02-02-2012, 04:51 AM   Top  -  End  -  #13
nonsi
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Default Re: More Magic, More Fun -- Sorcerer/Wizard Remixes (3.5, PEACH)

You got my concept right.
Its big plus is that it scales evenly across levels 1 - 20. It doesn't tax you for first use and it resets at each encounter.
So, on one hand you have a mitigating factor vs. overpowering, and on the other it doesn't drain resources too fast to promote 15-min-workday. As for SL -4 to your highest and south - of those you can spam to your heart's content (almost).
So by the time a sorcerer gains 7th level, he can cast 4 spells with no extra cost - and with level progression, you can do it at multiple encounters (just a bit of resource management - not too difficult with the Spells Known table you suggested)



My primary gripe with involving Con with spellcasting is that it's counter-intuitive to the concept of arcane spellcasters using their mental prowess over their physical abilities.
Also, now you turned the table around and suddenly it's not at all worth being a Sorcerer anymore (my aim was to find an equilibrium, not to cripple the class, or to force a spellcaster to be a bodybuilder to be functional on a practical level).
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Old 02-02-2012, 11:21 AM   Top  -  End  -  #14
Grod_The_Giant
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I'm not so sure about CL as an increasing cost, even if it resets after every combat. It just seems like more of a nerf than I really want, somehow, especially since 9th level spells will be obliterating game balance however I handle it.

A 1st level sorcerer has 3 points, after which he's forced to use either a crossbow or cantrips. The first casting of a 1st level spell would take 2 points. The second would take a hypothetical 4-- not going to happen without time to regenerate arcana, and that's not likely to happen in a classic dungeon craw scenario. Boom, you just made low-level mages even weaker. (There's a reason I delayed my systems until 5th level spells)

A 10th level sorcerer has 71 points, and a 5th level spell has a base cost of 9. The first casting takes 19 points (more than a quarter of his resources for the day). The second takes 29, 40% of the daily resources. Two turns, two spells, and two-thirds of points are gone. That's... not appealing.

A 20th level sorcerer has 270 points. The first casting of a 9th level spell takes 37 points (about 14%). The second casting takes 57 points (21%). The third takes 77 points (28%). Now we're up to three spells to consume around 2/3 of your daily resources.

The non-math related concern is that adding caster level to point cost means that your spells are actually harder to cast as you level up. That kind of scaling is great mechanically, but... I quibble with the fluff.

Quote:
Originally Posted by nonsi View Post
My primary gripe with involving Con with spellcasting is that it's counter-intuitive to the concept of arcane spellcasters using their mental prowess over their physical abilities.
Well, that's part of my vision of the sorcerer. The magic comes from his body and his heritage. The class is built around a Cha-Con dual-stat focus. He has to be touch to channel his magic effectively, because it hurts every time-- and if it's really strong magic, it burns.

Quote:
Also, now you turned the table around and suddenly it's not at all worth being a Sorcerer anymore (my aim was to find an equilibrium, not to cripple the class, or to force a spellcaster to be a bodybuilder to be functional on a practical level).
The Con-focus is central to the class, as I mentioned. I can see the first method being too much (if only when compared to to other casters), but what about the second? The second if we reduce the penalty for exceeding the limit to 1/2 spell level?
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Old 02-02-2012, 02:41 PM   Top  -  End  -  #15
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I think the worries of too many power points and spamming high level spells are really in the wrong direction. The Psion not only has higher base PP, but he gets bonus PP from his Int and will often have over 400 at level 20. He can spam tons of his 9th level powers if he wants, and they are pretty much just as broken as 9th level spells. We're talking stuff like Greater Metamorphosis (Shapechange+), Reality Revision (Wish), and Time Regression (You don't even want to know.) The Psion has to augment his low level powers to get full caster level, but this doesn't really affect how many high level powers he can manifest anyway (nor the more broken ones), so that's not relevant to the discussion really.

Honestly I don't like the direction you've taken the Sorcerer in terms of Spells Known vs Spells per Day. Now, he barely has more staying power than the old wizard, and he's traded it for a bunch of extra spells known. While this may be a beneficial swap in most cases, I don't think it's a thematic swap for the Sorcerer at all. I would ramp up Arcana/day severely (probably to Psion levels or above, and giving bonus Arcana/day for a high Con score) and if you feel the need to pay for it, ramp down Spells Known, possibly all the way to what he had before. You might also consider bumping the Arcana regeneration to something which will be significant after level 3, scaling it as (Con Mod)*(Caster Level)/N where N is a constant of your choice.

Some mechanical notes:
- True Sight is not strictly better than Detect Magic, since it doesn't do many things Detect Magic does. Because of this, you probably shouldn't completely "replace" the Detect Magic Ability

- Body Burn doesn't specify an action, and can easily be speed-healed with a wand of Lesser Restoration. This can be used to turn money into Arcana (outside of battle no less!), which is probably not the intent.
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Old 02-02-2012, 05:46 PM   Top  -  End  -  #16
nonsi
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Grod_The_Giant View Post
A 20th level sorcerer has 270 points. The first casting of a 9th level spell takes 37 points (about 14%). The second casting takes 57 points (21%). The third takes 77 points (28%). Now we're up to three spells to consume around 2/3 of your daily resources.
Ok, you didn't get me correct, my friend.
Your interpretation of my idea obviously means throwing the class into the garbage can (no wonder you thought it sucks).
I meant that (for a 17th+ level Sorcerer) the first 9th-level spell of an encounter would cost 17 points and that each 9th level spell thereafter would cost 17+17=34. The first 8th level spell would cost 15 points and each one after that would cost 15+8=23. And so on for levels 7th & 6th. For 5th level spells and south you'd just use the listed Arcana cost and that's it.


As for the way DeAnno describes the Psion (as I said, I don't do psionics), it is more broken than any spellcaster (even with the maintenance costs here & there), so it shouldn't be a basis for comparison (reminder: Pun Pun is also legit RAW).
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Old 02-02-2012, 06:13 PM   Top  -  End  -  #17
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As for the way DeAnno describes the Psion (as I said, I don't do psionics), it is more broken than any spellcaster (even with the maintenance costs here & there), so it shouldn't be a basis for comparison (reminder: Pun Pun is also legit RAW).
Psionics is tier 2, thanks to a limited power list, and individual powers generally being weaker than spells (the exceptions being those that copy spells, natch). The primary difference between the psion and the sorcerer is that low-level spells auto-scale, while psions have to augment them to keep them relevant. Nova potential can be mitigated by including the recommended 4-5 encounters a day.

I have used psionics in-game, on both sides of the screen, and find it to be a generally simpler, more intuitive version of spellcasting than wizard or sorcerer-style. It was never troublesomely over-powered, even when my campaign style left the players facing only 1-2 encounters per game.

---

Right now, I'm thinking about instituting my limit-on-highest-level-spells and adding in more Arcana points. I don't want to lower the spells known-- a limited spell lists has been the biggest complain most sorcerer players have had, in my experience.
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Old 02-02-2012, 07:18 PM   Top  -  End  -  #18
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As for the way DeAnno describes the Psion (as I said, I don't do psionics), it is more broken than any spellcaster (even with the maintenance costs here & there), so it shouldn't be a basis for comparison (reminder: Pun Pun is also legit RAW).
... You are wrong, but this isn't worth spending my time to write up a post explaining all the problems with this statement.

Personally, I don't see any problem with the sorcerer as it is right now.

I'd like to see the Wizard rituals, though.
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Old 02-02-2012, 08:34 PM   Top  -  End  -  #19
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I'd like to see the Wizard rituals, though.
The wizard rituals are spells. He has a limited list that he casts spontaneously from-- his forms-- and a normal wizard spellbook. He may cast any spell from his spellbook at any time, but the casting time is drastically, drastically increased. The mechanism is intended to allow him his hallmark versatility without the broken-ness of the current model. (and also because I hate preparing spells)

For example, a 10th level wizard needs to teleport his party across the continent to a port town. He pulls out his spellbook, sits down, and takes 50 minutes + 1 standard action to cast teleport. After the 50 minutes of ritual time, the actual mechanics of the spell work normally.
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Old 02-10-2012, 03:43 PM   Top  -  End  -  #20
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UPDATE 1, 2/4: After a little playtesting, I've updated the sorcerer with more arcana points, a revised version of the Body Burn idea, and more restrictions on higher-level spells.

UPDATE 2, 2/4: Added two wizard variants that together add up to the Archivist-- one gives divine spellcasting, the other adds dark knowledge.

UPDATE 3, 2/10: Added two sorcerer variants-- one for divine spellcasting, and one that does away with Arcana points entirely. (Also, consolidated my last few posts for efficiency's sake)
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Old 02-10-2012, 05:01 PM   Top  -  End  -  #21
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Randomized Magic is such a horrible trap that I think it shouldn't be an option even in system mastery rife 3.5e. As if it wasn't insulting enough to give you random spells, you get random spells of random level for something as valuable as a feat.
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Old 02-10-2012, 06:40 PM   Top  -  End  -  #22
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The wizard rituals are spells. He has a limited list that he casts spontaneously from-- his forms-- and a normal wizard spellbook. He may cast any spell from his spellbook at any time, but the casting time is drastically, drastically increased. The mechanism is intended to allow him his hallmark versatility without the broken-ness of the current model. (and also because I hate preparing spells)

For example, a 10th level wizard needs to teleport his party across the continent to a port town. He pulls out his spellbook, sits down, and takes 50 minutes + 1 standard action to cast teleport. After the 50 minutes of ritual time, the actual mechanics of the spell work normally.
So, the difference between a form and a ritual whether the wizard has used on of his 40 forms known to learn it to be able to cast it spontaneously?
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Old 02-10-2012, 07:37 PM   Top  -  End  -  #23
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So, the difference between a form and a ritual whether the wizard has used on of his 40 forms known to learn it to be able to cast it spontaneously?
He can cast both spontaneously; the difference is that rituals take an extra ten minutes per spell level to cast.
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Old 02-11-2012, 12:35 AM   Top  -  End  -  #24
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He can cast both spontaneously; the difference is that rituals take an extra ten minutes per spell level to cast.
Oh. Right.
But any spell can be a form and any spell can be a ritual?
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Old 02-11-2012, 10:06 AM   Top  -  End  -  #25
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Oh. Right.
But any spell can be a form and any spell can be a ritual?
Yes. Any suggestions for how I might clear up the wording?
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Old 02-13-2012, 04:44 PM   Top  -  End  -  #26
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UPDATE: Tweaked the Channeler variant, made Randomized Magic less crap, fixed the missing section of School Specialization, and threw in a whole bunch of new feats, mostly focused on a new mechanism: the spell trick.
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Old 02-26-2012, 07:40 PM   Top  -  End  -  #27
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Another update! Removed Random Spell altogether-- it's either too arbitrary to be good, or too abusive-- and added some language about what happens if a sleeping sorcerer is woken up early.

I'm also debating on whether or not to remove Foreign Spell from the wizard. On the one hand, dead levels, and being a general master of magic... on the other, he gets access to a new spell level at all of the "dead" levels but 19, and I can see protestations of abuse. Hmm... add it back in as a feat? Come up with a few more Spell Tricks and let the wizard pick off a list? Decisions, decisions.

Finally, considering making a feat/feat chains that offer some potential for other casters, or even non-casters to have a bit of access to rituals, 4e style. No idea how abusive that would be. Maybe attach an experience or material cost to the things.
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Old 02-29-2012, 11:00 PM   Top  -  End  -  #28
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So many updates, and so little commentary? Many sad faces.

Anyway, I came up with a few more spell tricks and made them a class feature. Foreign Spell was ditched completely-- you can still learn a few druid or cleric rituals, but you have to take a feat to do so.
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Old 03-01-2012, 07:09 PM   Top  -  End  -  #29
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I love these variants! Thank you Grod, world building will be a slightly easier process :).

If its not too much trouble I have a couple questions:

1. If your wizard variant was a prepared caster would you change anything?

2. If your sorcerers and wizards were in a low magic (like to the point where item creation feats are at 1.5 x required caster level) would you change anything?

As I said these are fantastic they add much needed difference between the mechanics of the classes spellcasting, thank you.
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Old 03-01-2012, 08:56 PM   Top  -  End  -  #30
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I love these variants! Thank you Grod, world building will be a slightly easier process :).
I've glad you like them!

Quote:
1. If your wizard variant was a prepared caster would you change anything?
Not really sure, since the entire point of the two-part build here was to avoid the inherit balance-difficulties (read, near-impossibilities) of prepared casting. My best thought to keep it from getting overpowered would be to make scribing more than, say, [Intelligence Modifier] forms/level cost experience as if you were scribing a scroll.

Although you raise a good point; I should do something to address how my wizard interacts with classic prepared-casting Wizard PrCs.

Quote:
2. If your sorcerers and wizards were in a low magic (like to the point where item creation feats are at 1.5 x required caster level) would you change anything?
If you really want low-magic, low-power, you might put them both on an adept-style casting progression, so that they top out at 5th level, and cut the sorcerer's Arcana point total in half.
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