Well, this is interesting. I'll get to writing up Zhou's response post shortly.
Though, getting Aya to willingly remove the mental influence is only one problem you possibly have here. The second is... well, you just told Zhou that we have reason to believe this guy is behind the social manipulation of Lookshy, so that it supports a cause it should be all rights hate.
Zhou's motivation includes 'Defend and uphold the interests and beliefs of Lookshy'. And now he knows where this guy is going to be tonight. He's also a registered member of the Subtlety Squad.
Orchid might have to be content with physical evidence for any further investigation.
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"Not trusting me might be the smartest decision you made since getting off of your horse."
Well, this is interesting. I'll get to writing up Zhou's response post shortly.
Though, getting Aya to willingly remove the mental influence is only one problem you possibly have here. The second is... well, you just told Zhou that we have reason to believe this guy is behind the social manipulation of Lookshy, so that it supports a cause it should be all rights hate.
Zhou's motivation includes 'Defend and uphold the interests and beliefs of Lookshy'. And now he knows where this guy is going to be tonight. He's also a registered member of the Subtlety Squad.
Orchid might have to be content with physical evidence for any further investigation.
"But Zhou, we need to find out who his backers are! And if we want to undo what he did, we need to know how he did it, and we need to be able to prove it to Lookshy!"
Orchid wants Lookshy to stop working with the Cleansing juuuuust as much as Zhou does Defeating all his plans is a much better revenge than just killing him. Although capturing him would be good. Which is why she's about to suggest they go seek backup from all those Celestials down the street, if Zhou doesn't do so first - she just didn't want to blindside the only person she actually trusts.
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Originally Posted by The_Snark
I must not argue on the Internet.
Internet argument is the mind-killer.
It is the little death that brings total aggravation.
I will face my annoyance.
I will permit it to pass over me and through me.
When it has gone past I will turn my inner eye to see its path.
Where the irritation has gone there will be nothing. Only I will remain.
He's demonstrated the ability to use enough social manipulation to alter the behavior of a significant number of Lookshyan higher-ups. We don't know how much more he's capable of.
Standard doctrine in these cases is pretty much 'kill him before he can say anything else'.
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"Not trusting me might be the smartest decision you made since getting off of your horse."
He's demonstrated the ability to use enough social manipulation to alter the behavior of a significant number of Lookshyan higher-ups. We don't know how much more he's capable of.
Standard doctrine in these cases is pretty much 'kill him before he can say anything else'.
If this is relayed to her, Eris will shiver (because it could apply to her just as well, if we're talking about Anathema with society-shaping social-fu), but she'll broadly accept the "too dangerous to live" argument as it applies to Elegance. But right now we have some time to prepare and a lot of potential allies, and if we have a chance to publicly reveal what he's been doing / find out who his backers are, she doesn't want to squander that.
Anyway, we can have this argument IC
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Originally Posted by The_Snark
I must not argue on the Internet.
Internet argument is the mind-killer.
It is the little death that brings total aggravation.
I will face my annoyance.
I will permit it to pass over me and through me.
When it has gone past I will turn my inner eye to see its path.
Where the irritation has gone there will be nothing. Only I will remain.
Okay, I think we're ready to go talk to the rest of the group, I'm just going to wait for a post from Aya first. If it's just huddling miserably in confusion and refusing to say anything or touch the gem, that's fine, but would be good to know how she's reacting to Orchid's questions/offer, when Illyceria gets a chance
It occurred to me (and also to Orchid) that there may be certain advantages in not breaking the UMI just yet (sorry, Aya!)
Also, Maugan, would Zhou have given his invitation to Eris when she asked (to hide in Elsewhere)? This probably won't matter, I am just asking due to mild paranoia
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Originally Posted by The_Snark
I must not argue on the Internet.
Internet argument is the mind-killer.
It is the little death that brings total aggravation.
I will face my annoyance.
I will permit it to pass over me and through me.
When it has gone past I will turn my inner eye to see its path.
Where the irritation has gone there will be nothing. Only I will remain.
Zhou has no patience for all this 'delicately dancing around the topic' concept.
I noticed Orchid just wanted to have a closed door between Aya and the world at large before we started saying nasty things about her favorite Fiend, and to make it slightly harder for people on the street to overhear... also, wanted to establish that Primal Elegance wasn't actually a Sidereal agent before we asked three Sidereals for help.
Oh, and putting up Judge's Ear Technique. I can hear the gasps of surprise now
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Originally Posted by The_Snark
I must not argue on the Internet.
Internet argument is the mind-killer.
It is the little death that brings total aggravation.
I will face my annoyance.
I will permit it to pass over me and through me.
When it has gone past I will turn my inner eye to see its path.
Where the irritation has gone there will be nothing. Only I will remain.
(At least the presence of a Green Sun Prince would probably distract attention from the Nocturnal, who in turn would likely distract attention from the Solar and Lunar...)
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Originally Posted by The_Snark
I must not argue on the Internet.
Internet argument is the mind-killer.
It is the little death that brings total aggravation.
I will face my annoyance.
I will permit it to pass over me and through me.
When it has gone past I will turn my inner eye to see its path.
Where the irritation has gone there will be nothing. Only I will remain.
Heaven doesn't care about the Solars and Lunars, so the only ones who would get attention are the Nocturnal and the Infernals....and then only if they went around displaying their powers. Otherwise, the gods, for the most part, couldn't care less, and the ones that would care aren't the ones you just run into.
Now, other Sidereals might care, but here we're saved by the Laws of Heaven, which essentially turns violence of any sort into a big no-no. And, well, few of them are going to actually be able to tell anything, unless people start showing powers.
Actually, the only one among us who is forbidden from Heaven at the moment is Pernumbra, but I'm not really sure she's with/in the party any more.
So, assuming the Nocturnal/Infernal don't go around flaring powers, they shouldn't get into trouble.
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He fears his fate too much, and his reward is small, who will not put it to the touch, to win or lose it all.
-James Graham, 1st Marquess of Montrose
Satomi by Elagune
Now, other Sidereals might care, but here we're saved by the Laws of Heaven, which essentially turns violence of any sort into a big no-no. And, well, few of them are going to actually be able to tell anything, unless people start showing powers.
Yes, it was other Sidereals I was mostly thinking about. Although don't the gate guards have some ability to pick up Creatures of Darkness or similar, or tell what kind of Exalts people are? (I thought there were reasons why it was hard for Infernals to waltz in... is it just that you only get automatic entry if you're a Sidereal / Eclipse / high-Essence?)
I'm not saying it's a bad idea. OOC I have a deep and abiding desire to visit Yu-Shan. The applause was genuine. It does seem like a fairly big trust gesture for most of the circle, but that doesn't mean it won't work.
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Originally Posted by The_Snark
I must not argue on the Internet.
Internet argument is the mind-killer.
It is the little death that brings total aggravation.
I will face my annoyance.
I will permit it to pass over me and through me.
When it has gone past I will turn my inner eye to see its path.
Where the irritation has gone there will be nothing. Only I will remain.
I find myself in the curious position of envying Terrestrial Charms. Specifically, Observer Awareness Method. Isa would kill for that.
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Originally Posted by Ifni
"Actually, do any of you have the ability to read Essence patterns, to figure out Charms and sorceries?"
Ironically, I think Aya is the only one who can do that. Not sure if she can use it on herself.
I've been wishing for a while now that I'd gone for Telltale Symphony instead of Survival charms and other miscellany I haven't used, but even if industrious feels like letting me swap things out it should probably wait for downtime.
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Last edited by The_Snark : 11-20-2012 at 04:32 AM.
I find myself in the curious position of envying Terrestrial Charms. Specifically, Observer Awareness Method. Isa would kill for that.
... hmm. *goes to look*
(I envy other people's Charms all the time. Charmshare is too tempting, even when dreadfully XP-inefficient.)
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Ironically, I think Aya is the only one who can do that. Not sure if she can use it on herself.
I've been wishing for a while now that I'd gone for Telltale Symphony instead of Survival charms and other miscellany I haven't used, but even if industrious feels like letting me alter my sheet it should probably wait for downtime.
I am hoping a little that the NPC Chosen of Secrets might have it
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Originally Posted by The_Snark
I must not argue on the Internet.
Internet argument is the mind-killer.
It is the little death that brings total aggravation.
I will face my annoyance.
I will permit it to pass over me and through me.
When it has gone past I will turn my inner eye to see its path.
Where the irritation has gone there will be nothing. Only I will remain.
Hah! I guess in a way I'm lucky that the things I want are firmly unavailable. Sidereal Charms are costly enough as-is.
"With One Mind is not worth having to buy the entire DB Linguistics tree at double cost, With One Mind is not worth having to buy the entire DB Linguistics tree at double cost..."
Stupid lack of Solar telepathy / covert communication charms
(Isn't everyone using Solar XP costs for this game? I thought we were...)
The_Snark, out of interest, are you working on a post? If you are, I will stay up and read another chapter of my book; if not, I will turn in. (I also do still want to have that conversation with Isa, although it's going to feel rather different if it happens in Yu-Shan )
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Originally Posted by The_Snark
I must not argue on the Internet.
Internet argument is the mind-killer.
It is the little death that brings total aggravation.
I will face my annoyance.
I will permit it to pass over me and through me.
When it has gone past I will turn my inner eye to see its path.
Where the irritation has gone there will be nothing. Only I will remain.
"With One Mind is not worth having to buy the entire DB Linguistics tree at double cost, With One Mind is not worth having to buy the entire DB Linguistics tree at double cost..."
I dunno, Dragon-Blooded Linguistic Charms are pretty cool. Voice of Mastery is a bit of a dud, but Voices on the Wind is excellent and Poisoned Words Technique is amusing (if risky)... [/temptation]
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Originally Posted by Ifni
(Isn't everyone using Solar XP costs for this game? I thought we were...)
I... am not sure.
I don't recall reading that, but if so, awesome - I think I have enough XP to raise Essence to 3.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ifni
The_Snark, out of interest, are you working on a post? If you are, I will stay up and read another chapter of my book; if not, I will turn in. I do still want to have that conversation with Isa, although it's going to feel rather different if it happens in Yu-Shan
I have a post in the works, though I can't guarantee it'll be up tonight because I'm still not sure exactly what Isa is going to say.
And man, I have no idea what Isa will think about going to Yu-Shan. It's one thing to talk to Solars and Lunars out in the field, but bringing them home to Heaven... urk. That lands her in a very awkward position.
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Last edited by The_Snark : 11-20-2012 at 05:06 AM.
I dunno, Dragon-Blooded Linguistic Charms are pretty cool. Voice of Mastery is a bit of a dud, but Voices on the Wind is excellent and Poisoned Words Technique is amusing (if risky)... [/temptation]
Go away, Ebon Dragon! I will not heed you!
(They are awesome. I suspect they're not 16-XP-each awesome, is all. It's probably a lot more efficient to social-fu a DB into minion Ally status.)
Now, certain spirit Charms, on the other hand... *eyes Aya's Slave-Spawn Summons*
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I... am not sure.
If that is the case, awesome - I think I have enough XP to raise Essence to 3.
I could easily be wrong. I vaguely thought everyone was using Solar BP costs at chargen, though.
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I have a post in the works, though I can't guarantee it'll be up tonight because I'm still not sure exactly what Isa is going to say.
Okay. I'll probably go to sleep and catch it in the morning. I am eager to see her reaction
(She can't go fight Infernals this evening! She has a date with Burning Waters! Clearly, of course, the solution is to invite Burning Waters to the play...)
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And man, I have no idea what Isa will think about going to Yu-Shan. It's one thing to talk to Solars and Lunars out in the field, but bringing them home to Heaven... urk. That lands her in a very awkward position.
Mmm, the occasional downsides of being Chejop Kejak's personal protege?
The odd thing? Right now, Orchid trusts Isa more than either of the other two Sidereals, because she knows Isa was telling the truth when she said she tried to protect Creation from outside threats, and that she sincerely wanted to explain when she suggested a private conversation. She doesn't have a good handle on Stormwrack and Child keeps dodging questions.
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Originally Posted by The_Snark
I must not argue on the Internet.
Internet argument is the mind-killer.
It is the little death that brings total aggravation.
I will face my annoyance.
I will permit it to pass over me and through me.
When it has gone past I will turn my inner eye to see its path.
Where the irritation has gone there will be nothing. Only I will remain.
(She can't go fight Infernals this evening! She has a date with Burning Waters!)
SERIOUSLY. Come on, world, do you know how long it's been since Isa had a date? Why you gotta be like this?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ifni
The odd thing? Right now, Orchid trusts Isa more than either of the other two Sidereals, because she knows Isa was telling the truth when she said she tried to protect Creation from outside threats, and that she sincerely wanted to explain when she suggested a private conversation. She doesn't have a good handle on Stormwrack and Child keeps dodging questions.
Her reasoning is largely the same as Symphony of Chimes: trying to manipulate Eris is just too risky. Better to play straight with her whenever possible, and try to put a good spin on things without actually being dishonest. Given the Intimacies-in-progress, it seems to be working...
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(They are awesome. I suspect they're not 16-XP-each awesome, is all. It's probably a lot more efficient to social-fu a DB into minion Ally status.)
I'm personally looking at Warlord's Convocation, which I think I'll see about picking up soon. It will allow me to basically start acquiring the equivalent of the Henchmen background, until I have my very own task force. Because fighting fair is for morons, and mobbing superior foes with coordinated assaults from teams of enemies is a time-honored Terrestrial tradition.
(Not that Zhou is a slouch in one-on-one combat. For a total of eight motes per attack, his Daiklaive attacks become something like 22 dice to hit, and a base damage of 22L. Four extra motes upgrades an entire flurry to deal Holy Damage, which is aggravated against creatures of darkness. I'll run out of essence fairly sharpish, but if I need to go all out, that'll about do it.)
Of course, recent events have led me to believe that investing in a social defense charm would be sensible as well....
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"Not trusting me might be the smartest decision you made since getting off of your horse."
SERIOUSLY. Come on, world, do you know how long it's been since Isa had a date? Why you gotta be like this?
Fighting Infernals together is a perfect first-date activity. *nodnod*
(Eris: Hey, wanna borrow my orichalcum-and-starmetal Infinite Resplendence Amulet? It can make any kind of outfit you want, you'll look awesome! (I mean, you know, if we were friends, like if you didn't want to kill me and lock my Exaltation in a box, AGAIN) And, um, if you reach into a pocket and pull out a non-working prototype necrotech device made out of screaming souls, don't worry, that happens sometimes, although I think I got most of them...)
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Her reasoning is largely the same as Symphony of Chimes: trying to manipulate Eris is just too risky. Better to play straight with her whenever possible, and try to put a good spin on things without actually being dishonest. Given the Intimacies-in-progress, it seems to be working...
Oh, it's working. Eris appreciates people who tell her the truth. Makes everything so much simpler - she has a really strong tendency to be conciliatory and try to build alliances, and it's just so much easier to find good solutions when people are being honest about what they're after. (This is one of the several reasons I really want her to hear the Bronze Faction party line from Isa - their underlying goal is something totally reasonable, but what they believe to be their best approach is completely unacceptable to her. So... that's a challenge.)
She also respects both Chimes and Isa for the fact that they were skilled enough to figure out her secret and discreet enough that they apparently haven't disclosed it inadvertently. Actual friendship probably requires trust, and might take a little longer to develop, but it's possible as well (more so with Isa than with Chimes, probably). Zhou managed it in remarkably short order, but had some advantages that Isa doesn't.
I take it Isa doesn't yet have a developing Intimacy to Eris other than the general "mistrust" one toward Solars/Lunars, or are you still thinking about how to characterize it?
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Originally Posted by Maugan Ra
Because fighting fair is for morons, and mobbing superior foes with coordinated assaults from teams of enemies is a time-honored Terrestrial tradition.
I think that is the Terrestrial tradition, actually
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(Not that Zhou is a slouch in one-on-one combat. For a total of eight motes per attack, his Daiklaive attacks become something like 22 dice to hit, and a base damage of 22L. Four extra motes upgrades an entire flurry to deal Holy Damage, which is aggravated against creatures of darkness. I'll run out of essence fairly sharpish, but if I need to go all out, that'll about do it.)
And this is why Orchid tries very, very hard not to spend Peripheral Essence. I probably need some more combat defenses that are not "hide behind the Subtlety Squad".
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Of course, recent events have led me to believe that investing in a social defense charm would be sensible as well....
Just let Eris go off and handle social combat with Fiends solo. That can't possibly go badly.
(Although honestly I suspect the conversation might rapidly devolve into a charmshare discussion, if they actually had full OOC knowledge "So, I can trade you Taboo Inflicting Diatribe... what've you got to offer?")
I was about to sleep. But lo, a post! *trundles off to IC to read*
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Originally Posted by The_Snark
I must not argue on the Internet.
Internet argument is the mind-killer.
It is the little death that brings total aggravation.
I will face my annoyance.
I will permit it to pass over me and through me.
When it has gone past I will turn my inner eye to see its path.
Where the irritation has gone there will be nothing. Only I will remain.
Incidentally, I'm assuming that Chejop has not told Isa he's not responsible for the Cleansing. It seems like a safe bet - trust or no, Chejop strikes me as a firm adherent of the need-to-know policy. The best way to keep a secret is not to tell anybody.
Well, the second-best way to keep a secret.
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Originally Posted by Ifni
Fighting Infernals together is a perfect first-date activity. *nodnod*
(Eris: Hey, wanna borrow my orichalcum-and-starmetal Infinite Resplendence Amulet? It can make any kind of outfit you want, you'll look awesome! (I mean, you know, if we were friends, like if you didn't want to kill me and lock my Exaltation in a box) And, um, if you reach into a pocket and pull out a non-working prototype necrotech device made out of screaming souls, don't worry, that happens sometimes, although I think I got most of them...)
Showing up in a dress that bumps her Appearance to 6 would make an impression! But I don't think those two are quite at the borrowing-each-other's-clothes stage yet.
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Originally Posted by Ifni
I take it Isa doesn't yet have a developing Intimacy to Eris other than the general "mistrust" one toward Solars/Lunars, or are you still thinking about how to characterize it?
Not sure. Orchid is being pleasant and likable and has Charisma 5, but she's also a little too good at prying secrets out of people for Isa's comfort, and there's that whole Solar thing to worry about. I don't think her feelings are consistent enough to count as an Intimacy; I wouldn't know how to apply it.
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Last edited by The_Snark : 11-20-2012 at 06:38 AM.
Incidentally, I'm assuming that Chejop has not told Isa he's not responsible for the Cleansing. It seems like a safe bet - trust or no, Chejop strikes me as a firm adherent of the need-to-know policy. The best way to keep a secret is not to tell anybody.
Well, the second-best way to keep a secret.
Yeah, that was my assumption too. Orchid's probably going to be pushing the "I think someone Yozi-Chosen may be trying to redirect your project for their own ends" line of thought, but nothing there requires the initial idea for the Cleansing to come from outside the Bureau.
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Showing up in a dress that bumps her Appearance to 6 would make an impression! But I don't think those two are quite at the borrowing-each-other's-clothes stage yet.
Nooooo.
(But it is half starmetal, so would be cheap and easy to attune, should this ever come up )
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Not sure. Orchid is being pleasant and likable and has Charisma 5, but she's also a little too good at prying secrets out of people for Isa's comfort, and there's that whole Solar thing to worry about. I don't think her feelings are consistent enough to count as an Intimacy; I wouldn't know how to apply it.
Yup, that's fair. We shall see. Possibly in Yu-Shan
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The_Snark
I must not argue on the Internet.
Internet argument is the mind-killer.
It is the little death that brings total aggravation.
I will face my annoyance.
I will permit it to pass over me and through me.
When it has gone past I will turn my inner eye to see its path.
Where the irritation has gone there will be nothing. Only I will remain.
Oh, neat. Need to page back through the thread to make sure I have the XP, but - Essence 3 ahoy!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ifni
"... thank you, Isa." Orchid's voice is quiet. "I appreciate your precision, and your honesty." She could have just said not to my knowledge. The answer she did give raises other questions, interesting ones.
Mind you, she also could have said "I don't think it was us," which would've pinged as misleading because she's not sure. Or "not to my knowledge, but my boss probably wouldn't tell me if it were true."
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Rerolling the first one: (10d10)[3][9][8][9][4][10][10][9][5][9](76)
EDIT: Much more like it. Aya is now within fate for a year and a day, and can cross the wards. For this scene, all rolls to determine whether Aya is lying get -1 to their target number.
Interesting. So that makes Aya count as being inside fate, thus allowing her past the wards... while also making it easier to fight her if it proves necessary. Sneaky fellow, Stormwrack.
Would have been nice if Telltale Symphony had worked, but I guess we can't have everything.
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"Not trusting me might be the smartest decision you made since getting off of your horse."
Pretty sure that the gate gaurds only look for buisness, essence 6(solars and Lunars) , or residency. Both Sidereals qualify for the latter, so everyone should get in.
And, as for the Creature ofttimes Darkness stuff, I don't think that would be a real problem. Demons and demonblooded both qualify, and neither of those seem like the things that would be restricted. The real threat would be if people thought she was an akuma.
With Sidereals, well, hardcore bronzes would have issues, but I don't think they would find out any tome soon. And, as I said, if they did there is nothing they could do about it.
If this is going to turn out to such a bad idea, any chance I could edit my post unlighted of this new information? I feel this is the sort of thing th character would know, yet doesn't due to it not being menntioned anywhere in the books.
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He fears his fate too much, and his reward is small, who will not put it to the touch, to win or lose it all.
-James Graham, 1st Marquess of Montrose
Satomi by Elagune
Eh, I wouldn't say there's nothing they can do about it (regarding hardcore Bronzes). I looked up the rules - unprovoked murder of a Terrestrial Exalt in Yu-Shan is Severity 2, it's not even bad enough to show up in a general audit. Unprovoked murder of a low-Essence Celestial is Severity 4, which is more serious, but it's still at the level of "teaching Violet Bier to a non-Sidereal", and I know at least one Bronze Elder has done that (for her favorite Immaculate). Security by obscurity might well work, but if we did draw the attention of someone powerful and unfriendly I wouldn't be relying on Yu-Shan law for protection. (The Solar and the Lunar might benefit from political considerations, of course; the Gold Faction and certain gods might get very upset about people killing/harming Solars/Lunars in heaven.)
As for Aya - if they can tell she's a Creature of Darkness (I wasn't sure on this one), any god with Measure The Wind (so practically all of them) can tell that she's an Exalt. That's a bad combination.
I didn't think it was a bad idea, and it has some possible advantages (like potentially being able to pull in really serious backup in the interests of stopping an Infernal from taking over Nexus), but it does seem a bit risky.
And sad eyes, Stormwrack, why do you have to roll so badly on your All-Encompassing Sorcerer's Sight equivalent? Ah well.
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Originally Posted by The_Snark
I must not argue on the Internet.
Internet argument is the mind-killer.
It is the little death that brings total aggravation.
I will face my annoyance.
I will permit it to pass over me and through me.
When it has gone past I will turn my inner eye to see its path.
Where the irritation has gone there will be nothing. Only I will remain.
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Re: The Return of the Scarlet Empress OOC
