Thanqol Learns 2 Draw: Every Step Is The First

[Thanqol]

Hi, my name is Thanqol, and sometimes I'm a jerk.

One year ago I decided, out of the blue, that I was going to learn how to draw. The rule was simple - one picture every day, no excuses. I succeeded. I made it an entire year without missing an update. There's a youtube video of my progress here.

This is the second year of my challenge, and I'm going to continue it. Same rule. Picture every day, rain or shine.

I'm taking a bit more of a structured approach to this year's progress. I've made some good things, but I'm still deficient in a lot of the basics. I find one of the better ways for me to learn is theme weeks or months where I commit myself to topics and don't stray from them until the understanding has seeped in. To help me in this, I'm adopting a topic box where the current area I'm working on will be kept.

The current topic is:

Monster Manual Challenge

Pictures I especially like will go in on my DeviantArt account.

I am still a beginner, and still incredibly deficient in a lot of areas. I absolutely love advice, comments, feedback and suggestions.

I use a Wacom Bamboo Fun tablet and Paint Tool SAI.

Every day I have a music plug. Normally it's good stuff that I recommend you listen to. There are playlists of all the music I've listened to on this project.


I take requests. The more interesting your request, the more likely I am to do it and put more effort into it. Do not be shy about asking, I don't bite.

Here's to year two.

[flyingchicken]

Here's a request for: a low angle shot of two Tyrannosauruses fighting!

[the_druid_droid]

Bravo. Year one was a heck of a ride, and you even managed to bring some folks along for the ride. SiuiS is gonna get a hug when I meet him this summer for being one half the dirty duo that got me considering that I could maybe draw, and if I'm ever in Australia, I'm hunting you down for one too!

[Silviya]

*Applause*

Congratulations on doing this for an entire year! And that video you made of your progress is pretty neat.

The topic thing seems like a good idea. When you say body shapes, are you talking about general anatomy/poses/proportions/etc., or are you going to be working primarily on learning what the shapes of the body are, like the shape of the head and the torso and the hands etc.?

I'm not sure if I've suggested this before or not (actually, you might even be doing this already), but as far as learning anatomy in general goes, I would advise doing at least ten minutes of gesture drawings a day if you can, even if you're not specifically working on learning anatomy at the moment. Those ten minutes every day will really add up, and before long anatomy will become much easier.


And I really need to start taking my own advice and make a thread like this for myself. Maybe once the kittens are older and after I finish all the stuff that I have to do this summer . . .

[Kasanip]

Congratulations for a good year of art! I hope it is another good year of drawing for you!

[Story Time]

...all that I can think of to say is, "Pope Gregory would be thrilled."

You know...the Gregorian Calendar with Leap Year on it?


Your art is influential, Thanqol. Be happy with it, but also take care. Make the world a better place with what you have to offer.

[Elemental]

Congratulations on keeping to your goal.
That in itself is an achievement worthy of recognition.

I can't even get around to drawing something once a week, as much as I promised myself.

Therefore, stylised cookies for you. (::)(::)(::)

[Lix Lorn]

Originally Posted by flyingchicken

Here's a request for: a low angle shot of two Tyrannosauruses fighting!

This is a good request. You should do it.

[Thanqol]

Originally Posted by the_druid_droid

Bravo. Year one was a heck of a ride, and you even managed to bring some folks along for the ride. SiuiS is gonna get a hug when I meet him this summer for being one half the dirty duo that got me considering that I could maybe draw, and if I'm ever in Australia, I'm hunting you down for one too!

Thank you. Watch out for the dragodiles.

Originally Posted by Silviya

*Applause*

Congratulations on doing this for an entire year! And that video you made of your progress is pretty neat.

The topic thing seems like a good idea. When you say body shapes, are you talking about general anatomy/poses/proportions/etc., or are you going to be working primarily on learning what the shapes of the body are, like the shape of the head and the torso and the hands etc.?

General proportions work and an effective skeletoning/fleshing technique to help me achieve unique poses without reference.

I'm not sure if I've suggested this before or not (actually, you might even be doing this already), but as far as learning anatomy in general goes, I would advise doing at least ten minutes of gesture drawings a day if you can, even if you're not specifically working on learning anatomy at the moment. Those ten minutes every day will really add up, and before long anatomy will become much easier.

I shall endeavour to make it so.

And I really need to start taking my own advice and make a thread like this for myself. Maybe once the kittens are older and after I finish all the stuff that I have to do this summer . . .

You will never find a day better than today.

Originally Posted by Kasanip

Congratulations for a good year of art! I hope it is another good year of drawing for you!

Thank you!

Originally Posted by Story Time

...all that I can think of to say is, "Pope Gregory would be thrilled."

You know...the Gregorian Calendar with Leap Year on it?


Your art is influential, Thanqol. Be happy with it, but also take care. Make the world a better place with what you have to offer.

Thank you ^^ I haven't forgotten your grapes, I'm just looking for a day with enough time to do it right.

Originally Posted by Elemental

Congratulations on keeping to your goal.
That in itself is an achievement worthy of recognition.

I can't even get around to drawing something once a week, as much as I promised myself.

Therefore, stylised cookies for you. (::)(::)(::)

I'll put these with the rest.

Honestly, try for even a five minute scribble a day. It's like a promise to yourself to do better tomorrow.

Originally Posted by flyingchicken

Here's a request for: a low angle shot of two Tyrannosauruses fighting!

Originally Posted by Lix Lorn

This is a good request. You should do it.

Fine. (Quick lineweight experiment sketch)

Day 367: Busted Right On Down

And it begins. As expected, it's hard and I don't wanna do it but it's useful and improvement-y. I've got basic brush control and a good handle on settings, functions and what makes a good sketch so I've got no excuses, these technical things are what I need to learn next.

This was made using an application of the boxing techniques I've picked up from tutorials a while back, but it's about time to revisit them and start trying to apply it without the training wheels. Not only do I want to be able to structure bodies like this, I want to be able to understand the fundamentals well enough to start stylising.

Links

Time: 45 minutes
Music: Metropolis

[Hawkflight]

Can't go wrong with dinosaurs. :3

So, I was thinking ... would you be willing to draw a short multi-panel actiony comic as a request? I think it could be interesting to see how you structure such a thing with the characters from one panel to the next.

[Thanqol]

Originally Posted by Hawkflight

Can't go wrong with dinosaurs. :3

So, I was thinking ... would you be willing to draw a short multi-panel actiony comic as a request? I think it could be interesting to see how you structure such a thing with the characters from one panel to the next.

Maybe. Comics are a lot of work. Throw me your pitch, though, can't hurt.

Day 368: Consider This My Gift To You

Speedsketched a bunch of poses from Fate: Zero (watch it) as part of a larger bid to get the hang of posing and proportion at the stick figure/skeletoning level. I feel like progress was made, though I feel like I need to look at more disrobed figures. Might go back to spandexed superheroes, they're wearing virtually nothing after all.

Links

Time: ~1 hour
Music: Na Na Nothing

[Hawkflight]

Spoiler

Okay. The character is ... well, a typical anime girl. You get the sense that she could be a cool surfer chick if life had been more kind to her. As it is, she's an alley cat, a thief, skulks in the shadows and hides from everyone to avoid persecution. It makes her somewhat moe in a way, really.

Oh, she's also a copper dragonborn.

I'll leave the number of panels and structuring up to you, but it's basically a scene from Fist of the North Star. She's surround by an unruly mob, and she quickly jabs at each of them. Then she says, "I'm really, really sorry. But you're all already dead." Then a large panel of the entire mob exploding, Fist of the North Star style.

So what do you think? Can you do it?

[Thanqol]

Originally Posted by Hawkflight

Spoiler

Okay. The character is ... well, a typical anime girl. You get the sense that she could be a cool surfer chick if life had been more kind to her. As it is, she's an alley cat, a thief, skulks in the shadows and hides from everyone to avoid persecution. It makes her somewhat moe in a way, really.

Oh, she's also a copper dragonborn.

I'll leave the number of panels and structuring up to you, but it's basically a scene from Fist of the North Star. She's surround by an unruly mob, and she quickly jabs at each of them. Then she says, "I'm really, really sorry. But you're all already dead." Then a large panel of the entire mob exploding, Fist of the North Star style.

So what do you think? Can you do it?

Okay you want a multi-panel comic involving an attractive girl, a fight scene, dynamic poses, and dozens of background extras.

Spoiler

Would you also like me to do it left handed?

(More seriously, I'll give it a try, but I seriously possess none of the competencies to make that reliably happen so you stand a serious chance of getting something extremely sketchy/delayed)

[Hawkflight]

Left-handedness is optional, though good practice in case you ever hurt your right hand.
pressure pressure pressure pressure pressure
Hey, no pressure. I thought it would be good for both of us. I get a nice comic, and you get plenty of practice drawing characters, conveying a story, and understanding how characters relate to each other not only in the same scene, but between panels as well. Really, I'm thinking of you here. You're welcome.

[Thanqol]

Originally Posted by Hawkflight

Left-handedness is optional, though good practice in case you ever hurt your right hand.
pressure pressure pressure pressure pressure
Hey, no pressure. I thought it would be good for both of us. I get a nice comic, and you get plenty of practice drawing characters, conveying a story, and understanding how characters relate to each other not only in the same scene, but between panels as well. Really, I'm thinking of you here. You're welcome.

Are you antagonising me in my own drawthread?

That's awfully brave of you.

Day 369: Pony Wears The Cape

Urgh, this was the opposite of efficiency. Completely messed up that cape design, I should probably try it on a less moving object first. Other body type practise. Wrestlers are great models, they never wear shirts.

Otherwise a bit of a bust. Oh well. Sometimes it doesn't work out like it is in your head.

Links

Time: 1 hour
Music: The Approach

[smuchmuch]

congrat on thread 2.

Originally Posted by Thanqol

Fine. (Quick lineweight experiment sketch)

(Pretty good but not exactly a 'low angle' is it ?)

Day 367: Busted Right On Down

Links
http://img850.imageshack.us/img850/9207/day369.jpg

The two proportion squetches look good (left arm on the dude look a bit strange, though.)

Out of curiosity, where do you find your models ?

[Hawkflight]

Originally Posted by Thanqol

Are you antagonising me in my own drawthread?

That's awfully brave of you.

Yyyyeah, I should probably stop hanging around GLaDOS so much.

[Thanqol]

Originally Posted by smuchmuch

congrat on thread 2.


(Pretty good but not exactly a 'low angle' is it ?)

I couldn't figure out how to fit them both into the frame from a low angle.

The two proportion squetches look good (left arm on the dude look a bit strange, though.)

Out of curiosity, where do you find your models ?

Google Image Search.

Originally Posted by Hawkflight

Yyyyeah, I should probably stop hanging around GLaDOS so much.

The first step is to get me chronically reliant on you in some way. Then comes the abuse.

If you lead with the abuse then I can just troll you by, say, photoshopping a girl's face over Neo's for a few frames of Burly Brawl.

[Hawkflight]

Originally Posted by Thanqol

The first step is to get me chronically reliant on you in some way. Then comes the abuse.

If you lead with the abuse then I can just troll you by, say, photoshopping a girl's face over Neo's for a few frames of Burly Brawl.

True, but then what would you learn about friendship art?

[Halyat]

Congratulations on sticking it out for an entire year! I think that dedication will really pay off.

Working on a single aspect for an extended time is a really good idea, body shape especially. You should seriously consider doing a series of life drawings from people in everyday situations- people on the bus, your classmates, joggers in the park, whatever. Action poses and superhero kinds of stuff (as most of your non-pony drawings seem to be) are cool, but developing a sense of how people move their bodies in reality will really take your figure drawing to the next level.

[Thanqol]

Originally Posted by Hawkflight

True, but then what would you learn about friendship art?

That it can be used to troll uppity robots.

Originally Posted by Halyat

Congratulations on sticking it out for an entire year! I think that dedication will really pay off.

Working on a single aspect for an extended time is a really good idea, body shape especially. You should seriously consider doing a series of life drawings from people in everyday situations- people on the bus, your classmates, joggers in the park, whatever. Action poses and superhero kinds of stuff (as most of your non-pony drawings seem to be) are cool, but developing a sense of how people move their bodies in reality will really take your figure drawing to the next level.

Thank you! And yeah, life drawings seem like such a good idea in theory but I've found myself without the real time and setting to make that happen. I've started carrying my sketchpad with me more often in the hopes it'll improve my casual sketching.

Day 370: Along The Way

Long day, so not enormously drawtastic. Still, I feel pretty good about my progress today. My new sketching technique is so much better for proportioning stuff. I feel like I'm making real progress; sticking with a single topic like this has been a good idea.

I'm thinking expressions for next week. Been wanting to try them Lackadaisy tutorials properly.

Links

Time: 45 mins
Music: I Know Humans Exist

[Thanqol]

Day 371: Pony Break

Real practise hard, have a pony instead.

Links

Time: 2 hours
Music: Gilda's Theme

[Sean Mirrsen]

Originally Posted by Thanqol

Day 371: Pony Break

Real practise hard, have a pony instead.

Links

Time: 2 hours
Music: Gilda's Theme

Pretty hair, pretty eyes, very pretty glows, but needs some legwork (i.e. the legs need work, they're a little rough and the right hind leg seems to disappear behind the left fore leg when it shouldn't, given the size of the others), and something swallowed up the other ear, which should be visible from this angle, and the hairdo doesn't seem to be able to cover it. The back is also a little too flat. That's about all for critique. Pretty nice overall.

[Thanqol]

Originally Posted by Sean Mirrsen

Pretty hair, pretty eyes, very pretty glows, but needs some legwork (i.e. the legs need work, they're a little rough and the right hind leg seems to disappear behind the left fore leg when it shouldn't, given the size of the others), and something swallowed up the other ear, which should be visible from this angle, and the hairdo doesn't seem to be able to cover it. The back is also a little too flat. That's about all for critique. Pretty nice overall.

Good advice, made a few quick tweaks to fix. Thanks!

[Thanqol]

Day 372: Conflictsters

Back to the practise. Applying my systems, tutorials and lessons and feeling like it's paying off; I was able to structure these complex poses a lot better with a system than without.

Links

Time: 35 minutes
Music: Cemeteries of London

[SiuiS]

Originally Posted by Kairaven

wow, I noticed that you are approaching a year in your endeavor. now is the time to reflect and compare. Take a look at your day 1 drawing and then look at your latest. See the improvments? you have come a long way.

what's changed? is it an improvement? where do you think you still should work on? is there any habit that has been established?

your lines straighter? your curves smoother? how about time? Do you remember how long it use to take?


where to go from here? if you choose to continue.

I must say I am sorry I haven't been keeping track so I don't have much advice. However, here is one thing I think you should try next.

* * * Line composition - increase the thickness and width of the lines at certain points, it makes your curves fuller and addes some depth and texture to your line drawings. One of the things in some comics and cartoons is to use thicker lines on the outer edge of a line drawing. makes it pop out from the paper.
* *Have your line end at sharp points and rounded ends, depending on the drawing.

How? How does one change how lines end? I've never figured it out.

Originally Posted by Thanqol

Day 365: Betrayal

Once, there was a pony who learned to trust.

Big mistake.

Links

Time: 45 minutes
Music: This Is How It Goes

Hmm. I quoted this to call bull, then you explained it.
Cheater.

Originally Posted by Story Time

...sad things...are sad. * *I should really rant about how art is a philosophical tool to share feelings and meaning with others and how, "With great power comes great responsibility."

On top of all that is the question, "Is such a negative subject really the best choice for Day Three Hundred Sixty Five of drawing?" *.

Yes. I can't place it, exactly, but it fits. There is a ... Shift? And every new beginning is some other beginning's end.

Originally Posted by Raz_Fox

You'd think that pony, of all ponies, would have known better than to trust an actor. And therein's the rub, isn't it? Trust Invites Betrayal, and the gods are capricious and only want to be entertained.

Darn it, Thanqol. Now I see the world through an Arcadian lens, and we are the Gentry to the characters we create.

it's a sight better than your head playing gentry to you, though. Trust.

Originally Posted by the_druid_droid

Bravo. Year one was a heck of a ride, and you even managed to bring some folks along for the ride. SiuiS is gonna get a hug when I meet him this summer for being one half the dirty duo that got me considering that I could maybe draw, and if I'm ever in Australia, I'm hunting you down for one too!

Aw shucks, this made me get all misty eyed. I really need to find where I put that stoicism...

Originally Posted by Silviya

And I really need to start taking my own advice and make a thread like this for myself. *Maybe once the kittens are older and after I finish all the stuff that I have to do this summer . . .

Now, friend. Try now. There's always a tomorrow, always a one more thing, but Now is fleeting.

I would do it myself, but I currently physically lack the ability. But there really is no time like the present.

Originally Posted by Lix Lorn

This is a good request. You should do it.

It is!
Thanqol; imagine standing between and say, four yards to the side of said tyrannosaurs. Now look up.

Originally Posted by Thanqol

Maybe. Comics are a lot of work. Throw me your pitch, though, can't hurt.

They are actually not. You need
- a character you're willing to draw a billion times over
- a story
-maybe some camera angles

That's it. Let go of perfecting each panel; just do it. And this is like, the third or fourth comic request you've had to turn down. You're not hiding your lackings, are you ol' Hoss?

Day 368: Consider This My Gift To You

Speedsketched a bunch of poses from Fate: Zero (watch it) as part of a larger bid to get the hang of posing and proportion at the stick figure/skeletoning level. I feel like progress was made, though I feel like I need to look at more disrobed figures. Might go back to spandexed superheroes, they're wearing virtually nothing after all.

Links

Time: ~1 hour
Music: Na Na Nothing

Try looking for artistic nudes.
It may also help you with your everyone has double Ds "problem".

(note: not everyone considers this a problem)

Is that a Stephanie pony?

Originally Posted by Thanqol

Are you antagonising me in my own drawthread?

That's awfully brave of you.

Day 369: Pony Wears The Cape

Urgh, this was the opposite of efficiency. Completely messed up that cape design, I should probably try it on a less moving object first. Other body type practise. Wrestlers are great models, they never wear shirts.

Otherwise a bit of a bust. Oh well. Sometimes it doesn't work out like it is in your head.

Links

Time: 1 hour
Music: The Approach

I like the figure on the right, but can't tell if it's a girl or a very oddly built man; what could be breasts in a sports bra could also be big burly muscles.

-

I'm thinking. Thinking...
My end goal would not be the same as yours. I would need a routine that would help me with my end goals. A daily draw thread would not do that, but it would be something...

[Thanqol]

Originally Posted by SiuiS

It is!
Thanqol; imagine standing between and say, four yards to the side of said tyrannosaurs. Now look up.

All I imagine is the screaming.

They are actually not. You need
- a character you're willing to draw a billion times over
- a story
-maybe some camera angles

That's it. Let go of perfecting each panel; just do it. And this is like, the third or fourth comic request you've had to turn down. You're not hiding your lackings, are you ol' Hoss?

I like to think I'm quite open with my lackings.

The problem I have encountered in the past with comics is that I have to make the character look consistent between panels. Moreover, I have historically been bad at judging sizes and tend to make characters too tall or short relative to each other. It looks messy. Part of what I've been working on with the current topic is getting a lot of figures about the same size.

Try looking for artistic nudes.
It may also help you with your everyone has double Ds "problem".

(note: not everyone considers this a problem)

Hmm~mm, I've considered it but I have odd mental blocks against looking at naked people. Drawings of naked people are fine, but there's some trigger in my head that turns me away from looking at undressed real people. I'll see about finding a workaround.

Is that a Stephanie pony?

No. Been playing around with her design, but haven't settled on it or her colours.

I'm thinking. Thinking...
My end goal would not be the same as yours. I would need a routine that would help me with my end goals. A daily draw thread would not do that, but it would be something...

The drawthread is a vehicle to ensure that you make constant progress towards your goals, whatever they are. All goals are supported by daily practise.

[SiuiS]

Originally Posted by Thanqol

All I imagine is the screaming.

Right, right. You aren't assured of your own power and immortality.
Pretend they're like, herbivorous. I dunno, maybe the fight is a mating dance.

I like to think I'm quite open with my lackings.

The problem I have encountered in the past with comics is that I have to make the character look consistent between panels. Moreover, I have historically been bad at judging sizes and tend to make characters too tall or short relative to each other. It looks messy. Part of what I've been working on with the current topic is getting a lot of figures about the same size.

True. And despite all the flak, comics aren't a problem. They're a different art form. There is some overlap but really, it's like saying you're a bad writer because you can't direct a movie.

Hmm~mm, I've considered it but I have odd mental blocks against looking at naked people. Drawings of naked people are fine, but there's some trigger in my head that turns me away from looking at undressed real people. I'll see about finding a workaround.

That doesn't surprise me at all actually. It entirely fits what I know of your character. It will require some extra work though. Good luck.

No. Been playing around with her design, but haven't settled on it or her colours.

The drawthread is a vehicle to ensure that you make constant progress towards your goals, whatever they are. All goals are supported by daily practise.

Indeed. But for me thinking and integration are important parts of learning, which means if I want to improve, daily drawing may actually interfere with it. Or having something I'm okay posting every day? Irrelevant though. Think I've slipped from explanation to excuses.
I will have to get over my pride though. That will be the hardest part.

[Thanqol]

Originally Posted by SiuiS

Right, right. You aren't assured of your own power and immortality.

As far as you know.

True. And despite all the flak, comics aren't a problem. They're a different art form. There is some overlap but really, it's like saying you're a bad writer because you can't direct a movie.

Again, it's something I've been consciously working towards in a lot of ways. But it's still a bit of an end boss challenge.

I divide days into "Experimentation" and "Application" days. The experimentation days all add up when it comes time for an Application.

Indeed. But for me thinking and integration are important parts of learning, which means if I want to improve, daily drawing may actually interfere with it. Or having something I'm okay posting every day? Irrelevant though. Think I've slipped from explanation to excuses.
I will have to get over my pride though. That will be the hardest part.

I feel like the majority of this is nonsense. The process of typing up a post to explain what you learned each day forces you to reflect on what you've just done.

Day 373: With Poise; With Anger

A basic exercise - a bunch of characters of differing heights at alternately foreground/background positions. I feel like it was a significant success.

This has been a great experiment and a great week for learning. I wouldn't want to continue it much further without a break, but even though the majority of these pictures have been extremely sketchy and not great to look at they're going to help me a lot when it comes time for Application later.

Links

Time: 35 Minutes
Music: Nightfall

[Silviya]

Originally Posted by Thanqol

You will never find a day better than today.

Originally Posted by SiuiS

Now, friend. Try now. There's always a tomorrow, always a one more thing, but Now is fleeting.

I would do it myself, but I currently physically lack the ability. But there really is no time like the present.

You two both make convincing and also true arguments. Hmm. I've got a four week long pre-college art program thing in the summer, in which I will be doing art but I probably won't have any means to post any of it, so I'd
probably have to put the thread on hold for about a month, which is the main thing holding me back.

Honestly, though, this sort of thing would be really good for me. What got me to make real writing progress was the "700 words a day or shame list" that my writing group did a while back, in which everyone who participated had to report writing at least 700 words each day or be on that day's List of Shame. I was the only one to never be on the List of Shame, and I've never been more productive. So doing something similar with art is really what I need to stop being lazy and actually do art. The idea of making a thread like this terrifies me, because I hate all my art with a passion and hate showing it to people, because I'm always convinced that everyone will think I'm a terrible artist, but that's a fear that I need to face and get over, so that's another way that a thread like this would help. Anyway, I'll stop blabbing about myself.

Originally Posted by Thanqol

Hmm~mm, I've considered it but I have odd mental blocks against looking at naked people. Drawings of naked people are fine, but there's some trigger in my head that turns me away from looking at undressed real people. I'll see about finding a workaround.

Hmm, yeah, that could make things a bit trickier. There might be drawing sites that have models wearing tight yoga clothing and such? I haven't really looked, but I'd think there'd be something like that somewhere.



The practice pictures are looking good. One thing that I'd advise though, if you aren't already doing it, is trying to find where the subject is placing most of their weight. Most people stand with more weight on one foot or the other, or have their center of gravity off-center in some other way, and learning how to draw that can really help with making poses look less stiff, I've found.

Also, I think I've already posted this series of tutorials? If I haven't for whatever reason, here it is.


Working on expressions next sounds like a good idea. You may need to devote more than a week to it, though, or maybe do something like the thing I suggested with the anatomy practice, and just quickly sketch one face every day.

I'll probably have more tips for expressions for when you actually start working on them, but here's one that I found very helpful when I heard it: Draw heads, not faces. Yes, it takes longer, and you have to deal with getting the head shape right as well as the expression, which might seem like a pointless bother when you're working on expressions, but it really does help. You might end up making the face and the expression flat if you don't have a head to put it on, and if you draw too many headless faces, you'll learn how to do those well but when it comes to drawing a real head, it might end up looking really weird, like the face was just plastered on rather than being part of the head.


Edit, because Thanqol is a ninja: I really like that most recent drawing. Experimenting with different heights and body types is always good. And yes, even though these pictures are sketchy and such, they're great practice.