World of Tanks II: Fighting, Bragging, Raging Edition - All aboard the Lemming Train!

[darksolitaire]

7.4, the patch no-one admits he likes, goes live tomorrow on EU server. Some main features include:

-French Arty, which does pathetic damage and yet manages to pack ungodly amount of OP in the eyes of average tanker.
-French TD's which have rather good penetration values and stock guns. I'll be playing those, thank you.
-Two new premiums, which seem to be well balanced. Jagdtiger will probably appear unbeatable to those who don't know weak spots, as it has 250 superstructure armor.
-HE shells that can knock out several crew members and modules, in my opinion, making arty all the more hated.
-Two new play modes, which will appear randomly. Make that T95 attacker in Assault/Defence, yes sir! If they would be selectable instead of appearing randomly, people would pick the best game mode for their current tank, and we would see 10 top tier TDs as defenders. That's just as bad.
-Nerfs and buffs, former to american heavies, which in my opinion deserved them, and latter to the KV-4, which most likely remains as terrible.

[Eldariel]

At least they're fixing damage models on a bunch of painful tanks (T-28's tracks ) and removing Komarin & Swamp (aka. Bull**** and Bull****ter; topright base in Swamp is way too easy to defend and Komarin pretty much requires competent scout players to be remotely enjoyable due to the wide open areas).

[Jimor]

So far, I'm liking the new battle modes, at least you get some variety. But man, the Assault version of Prokhorovka is BRUTAL. Attacking over the railway when the defending team already has the advantage of high ground with the hill?

[Renegade Paladin]

Originally Posted by Jimor

So far, I'm liking the new battle modes, at least you get some variety. But man, the Assault version of Prokhorovka is BRUTAL. Attacking over the railway when the defending team already has the advantage of high ground with the hill?

Yeah. It plain old doesn't work in pubs; too much of your team will just feed itself to the defenders. That kind of assault needs tight discipline and competent artillery support or it will not work, period.

[Erloas]

It must have been last thread because a quick check didn't find it... but someone mentioned a mod that I got and was using but can't remember the name of it now and I've got to re-find it when they get it updated for this latest patch.
It had the server side reticule, a damage log, and the tank lists were clearly differentiated between vehicle classes.

edit: Also I know they changed a little bit with the no-damage pens, is there something that is a bit more clear on what they changed?
And are engine fires more common because of it? I've seen a lot more on both sides since the patch.

[Grif]

I'm kind of depressed the SEA server remains stuck in the ancient patch of 7.2. Jesus, when will the admins here move their arse and update us to match the other servers?

[Brother Oni]

Originally Posted by Jimor

So far, I'm liking the new battle modes, at least you get some variety. But man, the Assault version of Prokhorovka is BRUTAL. Attacking over the railway when the defending team already has the advantage of high ground with the hill?

The Assault version of Malinovka rates up there too in my opinion. At least you get tree cover to half way up the hill and a big building to hide behind on the western flank, but trying to get across that last bit of open ground uphill, is just plain nasty.

[darksolitaire]

Originally Posted by Brother Oni

The Assault version of Malinovka rates up there too in my opinion. At least you get tree cover to half way up the hill and a big building to hide behind on the western flank, but trying to get across that last bit of open ground uphill, is just plain nasty.

Both are true. However, it seems that because people don't know how to play, the team attacking on the assault seems to win if the map sides are balanced Yesterday I saw a Maus attacking in Erlenberg when it was supposed to be defending

[Leon]

The best Defense is a good Offense

[Reaver225]

Actually, the best defense is a dead opponent.

Dead opponents very rarely kill you; the ones who kill you are often alive at the time of your death.

Not to say it doesn't happen. I've been on more than one end of a double-arty KO due to slow travelling shells.

[Erloas]

Yeah, I find it almost ironic that when it comes to attack/defend mission the defending players camp with as little travel as necessary in most places. However on a normal battle where you have an enemy base to defend as well people mostly push forward. Seeing as how probably 80%-90% of matches I'm in end in all tanks destroyed, and the majority of the base captures are when its only 1-2 players left per side and they cap rather then hunt the other person down.
And it seems odd that people actually play them that much differently because they really aren't. And its because of that that every attack/defend mission I've been in so far has been very one sided.

I've only got to play each of the new maps once so far, and the airfield I took one shot early on and didn't get to see any of it. It is surprising though how much different some of the older maps feel when all that has changed is that the teams have been rotated 90 degrees.


I had a few great games last night. One with my M41 where I got 5 kills and came close to winning it myself. Including taking out a M40 at point blank range when he just failed to kill me in the first shot. Then I somehow missed a PzIV right in front of me after he missed his first shot, but he was only at 31 HP left from having hit him earlier in the match. It was odd, my M41 had a bunch of good games last night but took forever to get my first win. I took out several heavies in one game with one-shot kills and they were both at full (850ish HP), but I missed Top Gun several times by a fraction of a second, ended up with 5 kills but there were 2-3 kills that I missed because the enemy died while my shell was in the air as well as coming very close but failing to kill one of the new french SPGs.
And in my KV-1 on a defend mission on one of the deserts (never remember the names) where I ended up surviving 19 shots when I wasn't even a top-tier tank. Including a Pz38a that was circling me for a while and couldn't even kill me from behind, as well as some T6 VKs, they got me almost dead but never managed to finish me off and they slowly got picked off by the rest of the team. I'm sure they were pissed, there is no way I should have survived that.

Speaking of the new french lines, all of the ones I've seen so far are tiny. The TDs can hide under the sides of larger tanks, my reticule wasn't even close to guaranteeing a hit against the SPGs. They are all just tiny and hard to hit.

[Yana]

I finally got the needlegun with the Panther earlier today, and it's certainly a huge improvement over the 88/56 that I had to suffer through for god knows how long. Actually being able to hit stuff at a distance and penetrating it as opposed to missing half the time and bouncing the other half makes for one huge difference.

The following screenshots are from Malinovka: Assault, which was a huge pain to slug through. If it werent for the fact that my opponents were terrible shots/had underpowered guns, and that I had the backup of one totally awesome Grille, I probably would have lost very quickly.

Spoiler

Still, I got my master tanker badge for the Panther, so I can't complain too much about the outcome... especially since Operation Bagration is making the tank profitable to play for once.

[Renegade Paladin]

Originally Posted by Erloas

It is surprising though how much different some of the older maps feel when all that has changed is that the teams have been rotated 90 degrees.

Campinovka isn't any different, at least in Encounter. Both teams ended up right across from each other on the field camping; they just had to drive further to get to the camping spots.

[groz_nez]

Originally Posted by Erloas

It must have been last thread because a quick check didn't find it... but someone mentioned a mod that I got and was using but can't remember the name of it now and I've got to re-find it when they get it updated for this latest patch.
It had the server side reticule, a damage log, and the tank lists were clearly differentiated between vehicle classes.

The server side reticule can be enable from game settings as of 7.4. The option to do this is a check box on the first page of the settings. This option is very nice, since hitting get easier as you know more accurate size of your aiming circle.

It seems like MM has gotten even crazier than before. Yesterday had at least two matches were MM pulled stunts like two tier 9 tanks on both sides, when majority of tanks were tier 5 & 6 . There also were no tier 8 tanks in the game.

Here is screenshot of the tier spread:

Spoiler

Here is another one in which KV-5s were supposed to have fun time slaughtering Tier 5 & 6 tanks:

Spoiler

[Erloas]

Eh, I've had more matches that were better for me at least. Seeing more T6 capped games, which is nice since I'm running a few T6s, where as before they almost always ended up in T7-9 games.

But both of those games, while slightly unusual, aren't out of line, as those are all common tiers to have grouped together. All the T4s are scouts or arties (or platooned). My guess would be fairly small queues, and the T8/T9s were probably the longest in the queue so the match was built off them and there just weren't more higher tier people to choose from. The queue doesn't generally get over about 100 and a match takes 30 people, so about 1/3. Then about 1/3 of the queue at any given time is T1-2. So really the match maker doesn't have a lot to build from. The only real way to fix that is to have the MM build lists more slowly, letting the queue sit closer to 200 or so, and having more time waiting for matches.


I've been having more good games lately where I'm making more of a difference. Not sure how much of it is me getting better and how much of it is just being in primarily T6 tanks. I'm down to only 3-5 losses over wins, which is good considering it was closer to 30-35 a few weeks ago. I think I'm sitting at about 2500 total matches so far.

The mod I got... not sure if it was actually the one I was looking for but it had most of what I had before, was the AIOMOD.

[psilontech]

I've already said this, but I must reiterate: I love my T-50. Always play it after a match where arty does terrible things to me as a kind of revenge.

Was in an arty heavy, high-tier match last night. I allowed the battle lines to develop and couldn't find a way in before a KV-4 decided to make an opening of sorts for me. He thundered into a line of heavies to draw their attention so I could slip past them and get into their base. Guy survived too, pulling back with about 40% health.

So I slip in through the chaos of everyone shooting at the scary tier eight to find all four or five enemy arty sitting there all nice and pretty while a VK3601(H) vainly tries to chase me. Killed three arty myself while allied spgs rained fire on the other two. Started to make my escape back to friendly lines when a lucky Tier-7 American TD finished me off.

Dead enemy arty raged a bit and I was momentarily satisfied in my arty-lust.
Got 1.5k experience (Non-x2) and the ace tanker badge. Can't wait for the T-50-2, despite the fact that I hear I will be losing money every match.

[Grif]

Huzzah! My server is finally being updated straight to version 7.4. See you guys after I tried out the new HE buff.

[Leon]

I have to say that i like Encounter battles a lot more than Assault.

[psilontech]

I would have to agree. Assault maps are generally painful, especially if you're on the attack.

Encounter can be fun though. I was in a game primarily populated by tier nines while derping around in my KV-2 on <The Map with the valley in the middle, Standard the only advancement us usually in the far North-West> when it turned Encounter. Only Tier-6 tanks were me and another KV-2 with a T-50-2 one below us. We decide that we're going to box the T-50-2 in with our massive bulk along the hiding rock inside the cap zone and wait for our inevitable death while keeping the scout physically, nearly unshootable.

Of course, we died pretty early on but I stuck around to watch the results of my handywork with the enemy team getting frustrated that they couldn't move up and take out the scout, not having enough time to push our wrecks out of the way before dying to the entire rest of our team sniping from the ridges to both the South and North.

-- Am I wrong, or does capping speed in Encounter max out at one or two people? The speed at which the counter went up didn't seem to be affected much, if at all, when my KV-2 brother and I bit the dust.

[Renegade Paladin]

Capping speed has always been capped at three tanks. Don't know if the cap got lower for Encounter.

[Leon]

I recall something on the WoT forums that discussed it as being fixed at the lowest value for encounter battles.

[Grif]

Originally Posted by psilontech

I would have to agree. Assault maps are generally painful, especially if you're on the attack.

Encounter can be fun though. I was in a game primarily populated by tier nines while derping around in my KV-2 on <The Map with the valley in the middle, Standard the only advancement us usually in the far North-West> when it turned Encounter. Only Tier-6 tanks were me and another KV-2 with a T-50-2 one below us. We decide that we're going to box the T-50-2 in with our massive bulk along the hiding rock inside the cap zone and wait for our inevitable death while keeping the scout physically, nearly unshootable.

Of course, we died pretty early on but I stuck around to watch the results of my handywork with the enemy team getting frustrated that they couldn't move up and take out the scout, not having enough time to push our wrecks out of the way before dying to the entire rest of our team sniping from the ridges to both the South and North.

-- Am I wrong, or does capping speed in Encounter max out at one or two people? The speed at which the counter went up didn't seem to be affected much, if at all, when my KV-2 brother and I bit the dust.

Having played a few match of encounter, I can attest to this. I'm not sure why they did so though, it seems to reward killing all tanks more than capping the point.

[Eldariel]

As it stands, Malinovka and Prokhorovka are almost unwinnable for attackers. Karelia seems quite fair actually, since attackers can use the hill to gain position. Those are the only Assaults I have significant experience in. I really wish attackers would have some material advantage (extra SPG, comparatively more heavies, something) on the hard assault maps to make it work.

Then again, I also wish I wouldn't have to play Himmelsdorf/Ensk/Ruinsberg with non-TD type artillery, so meh...

[darksolitaire]

Few days ago I tough Attackers in Prokhorovka were doomed to die. Now it seems defenders are the underdogs. Is this just random battles being randoms, or are people starting to learn how to play these battles?

Edit: hey, new tech trees. Looks like I'm buying VK DB, Arl 44 and AMX 12t back at some point.

[Jimor]

Originally Posted by darksolitaire

Few days ago I tough Attackers in Prokhorovka were doomed to die. Now it seems defenders are the underdogs. Is this just random battles being randoms, or are people starting to learn how to play these battles?

What it looks like there, since I was on the losing side of defense a couple of times, is the defending team not sending anybody to the northern rail crossing, which is out of visual range of snipers on the hill. And in general if a fail team on defense doesn't defend AT the crossings, then things can go badly very fast.

The same goes for Karelia on offense, everybody seems to love to go up the hill to snipe, but if nobody scouts the middle (and it's pretty much a suicide mission to do so), then you won't ever have any targets to light up, while a defense scout camping at the base of the cliff lights up the snipers for easy kills.

And Malinovka on defense has the same problem that if you don't have an advance defense on the northern crest by the church, and in the eastern woods, you're doomed to get picked off camping on the hill.

The tactics don't really change all that much with these new modes, it's still important to seize chokepoints and high ground, there's just an added element of urgency to also take care of the target base.

[Eldariel]

Originally Posted by Jimor

What it looks like there, since I was on the losing side of defense a couple of times, is the defending team not sending anybody to the northern rail crossing, which is out of visual range of snipers on the hill. And in general if a fail team on defense doesn't defend AT the crossings, then things can go badly very fast.

The same goes for Karelia on offense, everybody seems to love to go up the hill to snipe, but if nobody scouts the middle (and it's pretty much a suicide mission to do so), then you won't ever have any targets to light up, while a defense scout camping at the base of the cliff lights up the snipers for easy kills.

And Malinovka on defense has the same problem that if you don't have an advance defense on the northern crest by the church, and in the eastern woods, you're doomed to get picked off camping on the hill.

The tactics don't really change all that much with these new modes, it's still important to seize chokepoints and high ground, there's just an added element of urgency to also take care of the target base.

The different starting positions changes things a lot tho. Traditionally Malinovka is a fight for the hill...and now one team starts on the hill with full control. Prokhorovka is likewise dominated by the hill and one team starts on the hill now (not to mention, the other edge of the map is trivialized by base not being anywhere near there).

Regarding new trees, I really like the crossing from Tiger P to Ferdinand; provided I don't have a burning need to play Jagdpanther, I could go straight to Ferdi and skip JagdpzIV entirely. The new Russian med path looks interesting too.

[Grif]

The new French TD line so far is surprisingly good, even if you account for the traditional French "haha, you can't even run over a mailbox" thing.

[Erloas]

So what is the new dark red American tanks on the list?

Also it would seem that the VK3601 would change from a medium to a heavy with that new tree.

Also tonight has sucked so far. Lost 7 in a row so far tonight, haven't even got a single win. After all that work to tie up my win/loss ratio over the last few weeks.

[psilontech]

It seems I've switched up the T-50 into being my primary tank as of late. I just LOVE the little thing. Spottan, Arty Killin, and in the odd fun game with a tier five cap, killing everything that isn't a heavy.

In a tier-five capped game in the fast little bugger earlier Today. Did the usual of waiting (hoping) for enemy base to clear out to go bug the enemy SPGs. Run in after a few minutes, wipe out the four arty pieces sitting around while being wildly chased by a cardboard coffin and PzIV. Took out the T-28 first (Because I knew I could pen him) while wildly turning, looping, and juking. Took a single hit during all of this before turning my attention to the PzIV and his painfully slow turning turret, finishing him off after a bit of work on my part.

Not feeling like trying to cap and bringing unwanted attention onto myself I wander off into the hiding field to see if I can - Ooh, Marders and T82s just lit up! Bwahahahaha. Two T82s and a Marder get mercilessly circled before a churchill that was simply amazing at leading and predicting erratic targets comes up and finishes me off with a few very well placed shots.

Nine kills I believe it added up to, along with the scout award.

Just elited the little bugger, but I'm going to work on crew training for some time before I get the T-50-2. I don't know if I'll be able to give up tier five fights. Currently working out two crew members on camo, Commander on Mentor, and gunner on "More accurate whilst hauling buttocks" perk.

[Leon]

Originally Posted by Erloas

So what is the new dark red American tanks on the list?

Christie suspension Vehicles