Dominic Deegan: Oracle for Hire, Mk. XLVI: A Tark of the Klones, Electric Boogaloo

[Sweetie Welf]

Originally Posted by Gez

Just wait, those are merely concept sketches. While Garth draws better than Mookie, he doesn't have a superior grasp on anatomy, posture, or costume design.

For example, the following two pieces were dug by people on the SA thread:
[snip]

Look at the proportions on the zombie fight picture, and of course the woman's legs which are just painful to look at. The costume design for the steampunky one speaks for itself.

Also, just look at the eyes here:

Well, at least it looks like it looks good. And it brings across the mood of the scene.

...but I can't unsee the broken leg.

[Humbug]

I think Garth's work is really good. I find the way the goons rip into his artwork disheartening. If they say Garth's work is mediocre, then seriously, my stuff is below mediocre by their standards.

[Oracle_Hunter]

Originally Posted by Humbug

I think Garth's work is really good. I find the way the goons rip into his artwork disheartening. If they say Garth's work is mediocre, then seriously, my stuff is below mediocre by their standards.

No no, his stuff is very pretty but it lacks a solid foundation in anatomy.

The muscle thing may be harder to keep straight without a lot of practice, but those legs and eyes... average humans should be able to see there's something wrong with those

[random11]

Originally Posted by Oracle_Hunter

No no, his stuff is very pretty but it lacks a solid foundation in anatomy.

The muscle thing may be harder to keep straight without a lot of practice, but those legs and eyes... average humans should be able to see there's something wrong with those

Are these two things consistent in all that comic, or are they obvious only in several strips?
If it's only a few strips, it can be seen as a mistake, and not as bad styling.

Either way, I don't really care about the art itself of a comic.
Sure, I enjoy seeing pretty things, but the important thing for me is to understand what's going on, to see things happen in the art and not just in walls of text, and to recognize who is who.

[Trazoi]

I don't know what it is exactly, but there's something about Garth's art that makes it feel somewhat sterile and lifeless. I don't know if it's the anatomy, the posing, the colouring & shading, or a combination of all of them, but flicking through his DeviantArt account there is something about his art that makes all his scenes look "dead". I wish I could put my finger on exactly what it is.

[Oracle_Hunter]

Originally Posted by random11

Are these two things consistent in all that comic, or are they obvious only in several strips?
If it's only a few strips, it can be seen as a mistake, and not as bad styling.

Either way, I don't really care about the art itself of a comic.
Sure, I enjoy seeing pretty things, but the important thing for me is to understand what's going on, to see things happen in the art and not just in walls of text, and to recognize who is who.

Well, it is multiple "mistakes" in a single page. That's not a good sign for the future artist of a comic -- attention to detail is the sign of a quality craftsman.

For me, art needs to, at a minimum, not detract from the webcomic. In DD it often does detract because the bland character-design confuses the narrative, the art fails to convey information (i.e. "show, not tell"), and distracts the reader with obvious shortcuts and sloppy workmanship. Any Webcomic which can avoid those pitfalls has "competent" art in my book -- early Schlock Mercenary is an example of the bare minimum I'd as for.

Garth's work is troubling because it is too glossy. The style feels copied from any number of Internet pseudo-manga Webcomics and does not feel like the product of a thinking artist. This is probably why Trazoi senses that it is "dead" -- it could have easily been made by an unthinking machine for all the originality of the quirks shown; quirks that make up an artist's style.

Now, the above is too harsh a criticism for someone who has not studied the work extensively (I have not) but it is the premonition of this future conclusion that tingles the critical portions of some of our brains. And, as I said before, it does not bode well that anyone who's work looks so polished would nonetheless publish characters with obviously wrong legs and misshapen heads -- it is an unsettling dissonance.

[Johnny Blade]

Originally Posted by Humbug

I think Garth's work is really good. I find the way the goons rip into his artwork disheartening. If they say Garth's work is mediocre, then seriously, my stuff is below mediocre by their standards.

I think I'll have to look at more of Garth's stuff before passing some sort of final judgment.
However, I think I can say with some measure of confidence that what you wrote about your work's quality in comparison to his is, well, bull****.

[Humbug]

Still, at the very least, Garth succeeds in making his art pretty.

And that's nice you think that Johnny.

[t209]

For my theory of art flaw in leg in zombie fight.

Spoiler

I think the artist deliberately put a broken leg on the female character to show that she have the ability to fight and stand even with broken leg and probably have the ability to regenerate it (think Plague Marine from WH40k minus fat belly and stench)

[Musashi]

Personal verdict:
Garth's art is much prettier, though I agree it lacks a personal touch.
The legs do bother me a lot. Hope he'll learn to fix that.
And I'm not sure I see what's wrong with the eyes. They're not perfect, but it looks more like a style quirk than anything. However, the fact I can't see what the big problem is makes me self-conscious concerning my own art.

[uncool]

Err.

The eyes aren't even close to level. And that's accentuated by the fact that her right eye just ends on a vertical line, rather than at an angle. At least for me it makes me think that the innermost point of the eye is where the eyelashes end - which is much higher than where the other eye ends. And if that's not true, then it looks like she has a really lazy eye.
=Uncool-

[Musashi]

Okay, I think I get it, thanks for the explanation.

[Nerd-o-rama]

Garth's art style looks like barely passable superhero comic stuff, to me (ask Rob Liefeld to draw you a foot and you'll see what I mean - not to compare him directly to Liefeld aside from the anatomy fail, of course, since Garth's got a more modern, less busy style overall. There's almost certainly a more recent mediocre superhero comic artist I could compare him to, but eh).

It puts him a step above Mookie, whose art at his best looked like the bonus sketches from the newest flavor of the week artist in the back of shonen jump.

[Ninjadeadbeard]

Being a person with no skill at art (even Mookie does it better) I rather like Garth's stuff. Sure it's unoriginal. Sure by industry standards it ain't a masterpiece of art. But honestly, it's clean and nice looking. If there was a little more caricaturish flair (like say Dresden Codak) I'd rank it pretty highly.

As is, quite a bit more than "one step better than Mookie".

[Acanous]

Is...Is that a Turian, bottom mid?

[Oracle_Hunter]

Originally Posted by Acanous

Is...Is that a Turian, bottom mid?

Nah, it has a silly neck and the crests are all wrong.

No, Gareth isn't actually copying ME -- and I don't really see it personally. It all looks vaguely familiar because the style is a composite of every contemporary sci-fi game, cartoon, and comic book in the last 10-15 years.

Which, I guess, is better that straight-up theft?

[Mewtarthio]

Originally Posted by Oracle_Hunter

No, Gareth isn't actually copying ME -- and I don't really see it personally. It all looks vaguely familiar because the style is a composite of every contemporary sci-fi game, cartoon, and comic book in the last 10-15 years.

Which, I guess, is better that straight-up theft?

It could potentially work as a deliberate homage. Of course, we've seen Mookie's attempts at "deliberate homages" time and time again. They range from incongruous plot-destroying tumors grafted into the story to outright rip-offs followed by a hastily added newspost saying "Yes! It was a deliberate homage! I'm so happy you guys noticed!"

[Trazoi]

Originally Posted by Oracle_Hunter

No, Gareth isn't actually copying ME -- and I don't really see it personally. It all looks vaguely familiar because the style is a composite of every contemporary sci-fi game, cartoon, and comic book in the last 10-15 years.

Mass Effect models itself on the Babylon 5, modern Star Trek, Battlestar Galactica type of sci-fi, so it's not as if it's a wild outlier in the genre. But it's a particular style - it's far more like Mass Effect than Biosock, Deus Ex or Fallout. I don't think it's a copy either but I'm sure at some point in the brainstorming process Mass Effect came up.

I'm also sure though that the art is not going to be the biggest issue. I'm far more deflated by "Project: Star Power". For Garth's sake that had better be a working project title.

[Gez]

Randomly browsing through Imgur, I find this (warning: rude language), and the top comment reminded me of this thread.

[Bobikus]

There are some ok thing about Garth's art that makes it a step above mookie's, but my god are those eyes on that one girl's face terrible.

[The Succubus]

...it's Space Luna......

[Trazoi]

Space Luna must have been peeved after she had those lights surgically implanted when she found out they put her abdomen lights in crooked.

[t209]

I think Dominic Deegan is only good if it is an anthology comic (One universe but many stories about its inhabitants). The same goes to this new comic. I don't think he can do it good for the new, Star Power comic, since he lack the grasp of military tactics (like charging down the hill like Orks instead of pounding down with arrow barrage first or sending a commando team).

[Cen]

Seriosuly guys don't you see it? it won't be space opera comic. It will be humanized pony space comic!

Spoiler

why you hate Derpy Hooves so much :(

[Trazoi]

Originally Posted by t209

I think Dominic Deegan is only good if it is an anthology comic (One universe but many stories about its inhabitants). The same goes to this new comic. I don't think he can do it good for the new, Star Power comic, since he lack the grasp of military tactics (like charging down the hill like Orks instead of pounding down with arrow barrage first or sending a commando team).

I think instead of a military setting, Mookie and Garth are going for the secret government imitative instead, since that is a completely underused element in both sci-fi and superhero stories.

Honestly, I'm actually a little surprised at how amazingly bland this comic idea seems to me. I was hoping this Friday page would give a clue as to what sort of stuff would be happening in the comic, but nope. I almost wish the "Star Power" name is a reference to the superheroine being a pop singer, because at least that's something.

[suzaliscious]

So I'm the only one looking forward to this then?

.......

Stop looking at me like that. Come on. You know if it isn't good it'll be ****ing hilarious.

[Veridis Quo]

Originally Posted by suzaliscious

So I'm the only one looking forward to this then?

.......

Stop looking at me like that. Come on. You know if it isn't good it'll be ****ing hilarious.

I'm looking forward to seeing how this new comic turns out, however I am wary. We've been reading Mookie's work long enough to have extremely low expectations for the writing and while I don't have any knowledge of Garth's work I'm holding my breath for something good. Emphasis on hoping.

[Sweetie Welf]

Originally Posted by Cen

Seriosuly guys don't you see it? it won't be space opera comic. It will be humanized pony space comic!

Spoiler

why you hate Derpy Hooves so much :(

What has Derpy done to you? Let her out of this, she's just a innocent bystander!

(I use every opportunity I have to show my ponymotes)

Originally Posted by suzaliscious

So I'm the only one looking forward to this then?

.......

Stop looking at me like that. Come on. You know if it isn't good it'll be ****ing hilarious.

I'm looking forward. I'm bored by DD, so it's good it ends. Also, I'm curious about what this will be exactly. Maybe there will be a promising start, before it becomes really crappy. I try to keep an open mind; you need to at least enjoy it a bit to snark it.

[Trazoi]

Originally Posted by suzaliscious

Stop looking at me like that. Come on. You know if it isn't good it'll be ****ing hilarious.

Mookie has to explain his plot to someone else now, so that should remove some of the issues that arise from not having an editor that make DD unintentionally hilarious. I'm afraid that the result will merely be dull.

Although Mookie is writing for a female protagonist this time round, which should be interesting by itself.

[Oracle_Hunter]

Originally Posted by Trazoi

Although Mookie is writing for a female protagonist this time round, which should be interesting by itself.

Wasn't Snowsong essentially a female protagonist