Lords of Creation: Omnigenesis [OOC] - Page 23

Elricaltovilla · 10-09-2012, 02:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by C'nor

The thing is, they're not just a legendary race. They're powered by a legendary concept that, from my reading of it, means that a large, by mortal standards, chunk of a deity's power and essence is being used to power something.

I admit, I'm certainly not entirely impartial, and if that's the ruling made (though I'd like a third opinion on it, if possible), I'm not going to argue, but it seems strange to say that something like that can't be fluffed as making them look like demigods, even though, obviously, it provides none of the mechanical benefits.

I don't remember the AP breakdown of the Halcyon and the Steelthorns/Briarhearts but it's kind of irrelevant at this point.

My initial argument was and is that no matter how powerful you make a mortal, its still just a mortal and the difference between mortals and gods is obvious. Hence why they use completely different combat systems and a god is immediately assumed to win any combat between a mortal and a god.

C'nor · 10-09-2012, 02:24 AM

Darklord:

Fair enough. Since Beget Demigod can be used on Artifacts, according to what was said about the Halcyon, can it also be used on a race, similarly to the False Sparks from BW-ES?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Elricaltovilla

I don't remember the AP breakdown of the Halcyon and the Steelthorns/Briarhearts but it's kind of irrelevant at this point.

My initial argument was and is that no matter how powerful you make a mortal, its still just a mortal and the difference between mortals and gods is obvious. Hence why they use completely different combat systems and a god is immediately assumed to win any combat between a mortal and a god.

Point on the names: All of them are Steelthorns. Xia's may or may not have a special name, but Alynaia's are Sufferhearts. The Briarheart is the shielding mechanism for the Halcyon.

On the Steelthorns appearing as demigods:

And yet, you argued against mortals dying automatically from combat between a mortal and a deity. Using that as evidence that no matter how powerful a mortal is, the difference between them and a deity is obvious seems rather hypocritical to me when you didn't want that to be so in the first place.

Lord_Asmodeus · 10-09-2012, 02:29 AM

DarkDM I think you might have missed my response again

Elemental · 10-09-2012, 02:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by C'nor

On the Steelthorns appearing as demigods:

And yet, you argued against mortals dying automatically from combat between a mortal and a deity. Using that as evidence that no matter how powerful a mortal is, the difference between them and a deity is obvious seems rather hypocritical to me when you didn't want that to be so in the first place.

The way I interpret deity versus mortal combat is that it's up to the deity whether or not they destroy the mortal or mortals in question. They'd always win, but they don't have to kill.

C'nor · 10-09-2012, 02:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Elemental

The way I interpret deity versus mortal combat is that it's up to the deity whether or not they destroy the mortal or mortals in question. They'd always win, but they don't have to kill.

"Dying" may not have been the best term, yes. That's my interpretations as well. But in any case, that's still exactly what he was arguing against.

TheDarkDM · 10-09-2012, 02:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Darklord2831

I don't know if I count as impartial, considering my bias against the Halcyon and such. But I'd rule in Elric's favour. They can have as much power in them as they want, but it's no different from any other legendary race. They can't seem like demigods unless you want to spend AP to make them all Demigods, or use a Boon action to make them all seem like Demigods.

I agree with Darklord. The Steelthorns can seem as powerful to mortals as you like, but no Divine, living bonfires of primordial creation that they are, is going to mistake a gathering of flickering matchsticks for an equal.

And LordAsmodeus, I do seem to have an awful habit of that. In my defense, I read your statement that it deserved investigation as an exeunt - I shall correct it.

C'nor · 10-09-2012, 02:59 AM

Alright. Though I'm not sure where you're getting 'equal' from, since we didn't say they were mistakable for actual divines...

And since you're on, might I have an answer about my question involving Beget Demigod?

Elemental · 10-09-2012, 03:06 AM

My opinion as an opinionated individual would be that creating a race and then making the entire race somehow a demigod wouldn't work unless they had some kind of over consciousness to be the actual demigod.
On the other hand, you could grant them a divine mandate. Less combat bonus, but same AP grant.

C'nor · 10-09-2012, 03:19 AM

I was thinking more along the lines of "Any individualized member of this race might be a demigod", much like how any named character could have a False Spark.

TheDarkDM · 10-09-2012, 03:26 AM

Lords of Light, attack pattern Delta!

Gotham · 10-09-2012, 03:59 AM

How do Gods heal?

Elemental · 10-09-2012, 05:11 AM

Wait... We have an attack plan?!?!?!?!

TheDarkDM · 10-09-2012, 05:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gotham

How do Gods heal?

I can only speak from Godhood, but I believe that's where using Risus in these games came about, so it might apply. If I remember correctly, you were assumed to be fully healed so long as you didn't drop to 0 in the previous fight and you had a reasonable amount of talky down time between combat. In your case, I think you're back up to full.

More experienced LoC Mods please feel free to interject.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Elemental

Wait... We have an attack plan?!?!?!?!

Of course! We're the gods of order and I'm god of war - have to name the attack plans.

*edit*

TheChanger, I hope that was a sufficient introduction for Ordon?

Elemental · 10-09-2012, 05:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheDarkDM

Of course! We're the gods of order and I'm god of war - have to name the attack plans.

*edit*

TheChanger, I hope that was a sufficient introduction for Ordon?

Technically, I'm neutral on law/chaos... But what the hey, Valmyr's in charge of the attack plans.
I was simply shocked that we had one.

Anyway... Velharan moved to block the axe strike, taking twelve damage.
His wake of fire dealt only two damage to Moglin.

Promise · 10-09-2012, 06:00 AM

Elemental
I'm not going to post again just yet, I want to see if Arathor decides to join in on the fight or not.

Xondoure · 10-09-2012, 06:01 AM

Elemental Ame's still trying to talk to Velharan.

Elemental · 10-09-2012, 06:03 AM

@Promise: Perfectly alright. Valmyr's still charging anyway.

@Xondoure: Apologies. The rules say I can only be in two places at once.

Xondoure · 10-09-2012, 06:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Elemental

@Promise: Perfectly alright. Valmyr's still charging anyway.

@Xondoure: Apologies. The rules say I can only be in two places at once.

That accounts for multiple time frames?

Elemental · 10-09-2012, 06:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Xondoure

That accounts for multiple time frames?

I don't know. Time travel is always confusing.

Xondoure · 10-09-2012, 06:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Elemental

I don't know. Time travel is always confusing.

I was mostly assuming the conversation Ame started after being created could be continued, after which Velharan goes about his business as scheduled.

Snowfire · 10-09-2012, 06:22 AM

Ok, so I just did something fun for the Steelthorns that should - I think - make them appear definitely more divine than mortal. Not Gods, but not mortal either.

C'nor, if you want we can split the cost for that action and give the Steelthorns the ability to call on both Alynaia and Xia - or both, which could be amusing.

Also, considering how close the two are working together, would you like to make that a quasi-official statement via pantheon?

C'nor · 10-09-2012, 07:54 AM

Talk about multiple personalities... I pity the poor Steelthorn who gets both at once. Especially since having the memory of being Lady Pain is sure to mess them up anyway. But splitting the cost sounds good to me, as does forming a pantheon.

What shall we call ourselves?

Snowfire · 10-09-2012, 08:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by C'nor

Talk about multiple personalities... I pity the poor Steelthorn who gets both at once. Especially since having the memory of being Lady Pain is sure to mess them up anyway. But splitting the cost sounds good to me, as does forming a pantheon.

What shall we call ourselves?

And that's what the empathic web is for. And I would think that - if they were in Sufferheart form - they could just take it. I'm seeing the Steelthorns as the Alecto and Megara components with the Sufferhearts acting as Tisiphone. If you get the Fury references at least.

Ok, if you pay one point I'll form the Pantheon and then burn my final three to get Xia her fourth domain. As for name... Suffering and Steel? Possibly Sisters of.

Edit: On the subject of the Hedge, I would say that the reason you need to expend AP to find it again is just that. You find it, breaking through the Hedge, but then you leave. At which point you're outside of the Hedge again. You know where the Halcyon was, but it moves. And the void is huge. You can go to where it was, but that won't really help against something that can basically teleport.

Maugan Ra · 10-09-2012, 09:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Promise

Elemental
I'm not going to post again just yet, I want to see if Arathor decides to join in on the fight or not.

Which he is. Moglin has to fight his own battles... but three gods against one, with the one being of his own blood, right in front of him? Yeah, nuts to that. Eat their flesh!

So, for that first round of rolls, square Moglin's and Valmyr's rolls off against each other, and Arathor's versus Velharan?

mystic1110 · 10-09-2012, 09:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheDarkDM

I can only speak from Godhood, but I believe that's where using Risus in these games came about, so it might apply. If I remember correctly, you were assumed to be fully healed so long as you didn't drop to 0 in the previous fight and you had a reasonable amount of talky down time between combat. In your case, I think you're back up to full.

More experienced LoC Mods please feel free to interject.?

The Dark Dm is so correct it hurts

Quote:

Originally Posted by Snowfire

Edit: On the subject of the Hedge, I would say that the reason you need to expend AP to find it again is just that. You find it, breaking through the Hedge, but then you leave. At which point you're outside of the Hedge again. You know where the Halcyon was, but it moves. And the void is huge. You can go to where it was, but that won't really help against something that can basically teleport.

Mypoint is if you spend 2 AP to get into the hedge, and then in your [Xia's] next post the hedge moves away, you shouldn't have to spend 1 AP to follow it. I'll grant you if the god moves away by his own will or forced out though

Quote:

Originally Posted by Xondoure

Hey mystic, would you be okay with it only ever raining in Arlom when Ame is present?

Yes

(Also busy day, so people waiting for responses by me... you'll have to wait till idk 10/11 EST? Sorry

)

Promise · 10-09-2012, 09:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Maugan Ra

Which he is. Moglin has to fight his own battles... but three gods against one, with the one being of his own blood, right in front of him? Yeah, nuts to that. Eat their flesh!

So, for that first round of rolls, square Moglin's and Valmyr's rolls off against each other, and Arathor's versus Velharan?

Also going to wait for The DarkDM and Elementals opinions on this before I post. Le procrastination!

C'nor · 10-09-2012, 09:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Snowfire

And that's what the dmpathic web is for. And I would think that - if they were in Sufferheart form - they could just take it. I'm seeing the Steelthorns as the Alecto and Megara components with the Sufferhearts acting as Tisiphone. If you get the Fury references at least.

Ok, if you pay one point I'll form the Pantheon and then burn my final three to get Xia her fourth domain. As for name... Suffering and Steel? Possibly Sisters of.

Edit: On the subject of the Hedge, I would say that the reason you need to expend AP to find it again is just that. You find it, breaking through the Hedge, but then you leave. At which point you're outside of the Hedge again. You know where the Halcyon was, but it moves. And the void is huge. You can go to where it was, but that won't really help against something that can basically teleport.

I should. I really, really, should. But it's been far too long since I did anything with the Greek myths; all of my recent stuff has dealt with the Morrigna, save for a tiny bit involving some of the Norse deities. However, having looked them up just now, I'd say that the Sufferhearts certainly have a fair bit of Alecto in them, in that they they tend to be rather... relentless... when provoked, though unfortunately, information on Tisiphone was rather minimnal.

As far as just taking it, maybe. Sufferhearts are, overall, the most mentally and emotionally messed up of the Steelthorns. They carry a piece of the embodiment of all pain within them, as the very thing that gives them life, so that strongly tinges their personalities, at the very least. Even with the empathic web, these are not well-adjusted people.

On The Hedge, Snowfire is correct. You break through the veil it puts up, and as long as you stay within sight or other detection of it, you can find it. Since, when it's just jumped, it causes ripples, of a sort, at its point of departure, which vary depending on where it's going, and also weakened the barrier between those two points by a small amount, which the Hedge, respectively, can't entirely mask or fully repair, it costs less to do so if you were tracking it when it did so, but the fact remains that it's protected by the Hedge, and you lost track of it for a short time.

Maugan Ra · 10-09-2012, 10:13 AM

Huh. You know, I was quite sure I made a post where Arathor spawned sentient and mobile trees, and have them the ability to manipulate the natural world around them. Only I can't seem to find the relevant post anymore. Curious.

Edit: No, wait, found them. Page two, at the very bottom. Can I get the Ents and their magical concept added to whatever charts we were using?

Hank McBadass · 10-09-2012, 10:17 AM

Hey, would anyone like to create Nous?

Also, it seems like Arlom has given a general invitation to allow gods to travel through him and act within him, but how would one contact him? Or is that even necessary since Nous wouldn't even know that Arlom was a god? It seems like the one place all the mortals can get to, albeit difficultly, without having to build a new infrastructure.

bryn0528 · 10-09-2012, 10:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Maugan Ra

Huh. You know, I was quite sure I made a post where Arathor spawned sentient and mobile trees, and have them the ability to manipulate the natural world around them. Only I can't seem to find the relevant post anymore. Curious.

Edit: No, wait, found them. Page two, at the very bottom. Can I get the Ents and their magical concept added to whatever charts we were using?

Yes, which is what I'm hinting at here. Also, swarms of animals have the ability to manipulate their environments too, which is the tree o' birds.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hank McBadass

Hey, would anyone like to create Nous?

The Marquis can do so, should you not mind. Anyway in particular?