Torchlight II

[Avilan the Grey]

Has anyone played it yet? (I never played the first game) How does it stack up against DIII? To be fair I found DIII to be fairly boring quite quickly.

It (TL2) seems to definitely be worth the 18 euros ($20).

[AmberVael]

I've been playing since it released yesterday. My current character is an Embermage. The character started off kinda slow, but combat is much more interesting now that I can teleport and throw out homing columns of fire.

I can't compare it with Diablo III though. I didn't bother to buy that. But Torchlight II is definitely a decent hack and slash experience so far, if rather standard. It doesn't seem to have any noticeable innovations, but it is fairly polished, and where they have changed things I think they've changed for the better.

We'll see if my opinion changes once I've played it more.

[Saithis Bladewing]

Played it briefly in singleplayer and preparing for a big 5-player co-op LP tonight, should be fun. So far it's really promising, I also have Diablo III which I was underwhelmed by, so I'm hopeful for TL2, but I can't really comment on it yet.

[Tebryn]

Played 1 and now playing 2 and I can honestly say that the second game is a VAST improvement over 1. So much so that I'm glad I pre-ordered 2 before making my final judgement after 1. I wouldn't have bought it otherwise, a mistake I'm glad I didn't make. Also playing an embermage and not nearly as far as Vael but the hack and slash combat is at the very least cinematic enough to keep me interested.

I don't know about innovation as compared to other Hack and Slash games. The things I haven't seen in other games however include

1. Allowing your pet to buy potions, scrolls and items from a "shop", regardless of number. This was a HUGE problem in Torchlight, a game based on the items but never having enough Identify scrolls until the very end.

2. Skill Ranks were implemented. In the first Torchlight you could level up a move and it would get better. In Torchlight 2, the skills have totally been revamped with "Passive Skills" you can level and each power you own can be leveled up by ranks. Each rank gives a special something to the move, such as the first fire spell being able to bounce off walls at Rank 3.



Outside these things, Torchlight just had you going deeper and deeper into a single dungeon and while the areas changed a little it always reminded you that you were just on a single level. Torchlight 2, in it's opening act, has you going to at least three different regions with various side quests that send you into dungeons. The music is moody, the designs are clear and clever and the Optional Boss Fights are actually fairly tactical when you get to the harder ones. The inclusion of Multi-player is just icing on the cake really.

This is a definite buy in my humble opinion.

[AmberVael]

Yeah, it is definitely better than the first Torchlight, I'm just not sure it does it in a way that it is really new. Torchlight had at least one good new idea in making the pet, but I haven't seen anything like that in Torchlight II so far.

Also, I found a glitch. If I cast Blazing Pillar, and then immediately teleport with Frost Phase, the number of pillars suddenly doubles. I like this glitch.

[Tebryn]

Originally Posted by Vael

Yeah, it is definitely better than the first Torchlight, I'm just not sure it does it in a way that it is really new. Torchlight had at least one good new idea in making the pet, but I haven't seen anything like that in Torchlight II so far.

Also, I found a glitch. If I cast Blazing Pillar, and then immediately teleport with Frost Phase, the number of pillars suddenly doubles. I like this glitch.

Not sure what you mean by "Making the pet" but if it was meant that you had a pet that could run and sell things, that wasn't new to Torchlight. It was in Fate as well which is where they got the idea from as well as the Fishing concept and it's effects on your pet. The Pet was even a Cat or a Dog. As was the Retirement concept and the Fame Concept.

[Cynan Machae]

I've been playing an Engineer since yesterday, and while I played T1 (and enjoyed it) and D3 (still fun but missing something), T2 is so far really good. As someone said combat is much, much more interesting and all 4 classes are quite nice. It's easily worth the 20$. I have yet to try the multiplayer tho (having trouble loging in)

[Weimann]

I can't compare TL2 to D3, but in comparison to TL1 (which, admittedly, I still only have a couple of days playing experience of) I can say that they improved on the game in almost every respect, but did so by moving it very far away from what TL1 was.

I'm currently playing a level 14 Outlander with dual guns and a War build and wondering if I should have gone for glaives instead. I'm not sure if I like that there's just a limited respec option. Other than that, I've very few complaints about it. The world building is much better, the mechanical system is leagues more interesting to fiddle with and the skills are cool, if slightly tricky to figure out the use for at times.

[toasty]

Been playing single player only for now, but enjoying it a ton. Tried 3 classes: The Engineer, Berserker and Outlander. Haven't tried the Embermage yet, but will eventually.

Thoughts: Engineer Healbot op. Makes playing the Engineer easily the most entertaining thing is the world.

Berserker is interesting. Lots of healing abilities, but an emphasis on single-target damage, it seems, at least in auto attacks.

Outlander: Not a real fan. Seems kinda squishy. No healing abilities the way the other classes I've tried have so you 100% reliant on pots, which seems rather... boring/bad.

Can't makeup my mind between Berserker and Engineer, I really like both, Engineer feels easier to play, but the Berserker is so much more fun. I like getting enraged and killing everything.

Eight or so hours in, still very much feel like I've only scratched the surface.

[Jade Dragon]

Originally Posted by Tebryn

Not sure what you mean by "Making the pet" but if it was meant that you had a pet that could run and sell things, that wasn't new to Torchlight. It was in Fate as well which is where they got the idea from as well as the Fishing concept and it's effects on your pet. The Pet was even a Cat or a Dog. As was the Retirement concept and the Fame Concept.

I'm pretty sure Fate is by the same guys.

So it's sorta like Fate was T1, while T1 was T2, and T2 is T3.

[Cynan Machae]

Originally Posted by Jade Dragon

I'm pretty sure Fate is by the same guys.

So it's sorta like Fate was T1, while T1 was T2, and T2 is T3.

Yea I'm pretty sure as well that it's the case

[AmberVael]

Originally Posted by Tebryn

Not sure what you mean by "Making the pet" but if it was meant that you had a pet that could run and sell things, that wasn't new to Torchlight. It was in Fate as well which is where they got the idea from as well as the Fishing concept and it's effects on your pet. The Pet was even a Cat or a Dog. As was the Retirement concept and the Fame Concept.

Good to know! I hadn't even heard of Fate.

Originally Posted by Weimann

I'm not sure if I like that there's just a limited respec option.

Yeah, I'm not so fond of that either. If you want to let me switch around my latest three skills for free so I can test skills out, sure.
But if you want a REAL respec, you need something bigger.

Originally Posted by toasty

Been playing single player only for now, but enjoying it a ton. Tried 3 classes: The Engineer, Berserker and Outlander. Haven't tried the Embermage yet, but will eventually.

Thoughts: Engineer Healbot op. Makes playing the Engineer easily the most entertaining thing is the world.

Berserker is interesting. Lots of healing abilities, but an emphasis on single-target damage, it seems, at least in auto attacks.

Outlander: Not a real fan. Seems kinda squishy. No healing abilities the way the other classes I've tried have so you 100% reliant on pots, which seems rather... boring/bad.

Can't makeup my mind between Berserker and Engineer, I really like both, Engineer feels easier to play, but the Berserker is so much more fun. I like getting enraged and killing everything.

Eight or so hours in, still very much feel like I've only scratched the surface.

Hm, well, if you want my impression on the Embermage-

The Embermage is definitely good at taking down a lot of enemies. I haven't noticed massive single target damage, however. I've also noticed that they get a lot of very uncontrolled powers. You can throw three fireballs, but not really control their direction. There are certain homing spells, which you just fire and forget. So big masses of enemies are definitely where the Embermage is at its best, because no matter what those spells do, they'll hit something.

They don't have much in the way of defense though, at least skill-wise. Mostly I've been sticking with Frost Phase just to keep out of the way entirely.

What I am surprised about is just how easily a mana dependent class can go without mana potions. I'm sure I've used more health potions than mana, and I'm not exactly restrained in my casting- by which I mean I teleport constantly down corridors to speed things up and spam magma lance rather than hit things with my weapon (despite that actually being a very viable strategy with the Embermage- staves and wands do elemental damage, which focus increases). I do sometimes run dry, but the recover rate is really quick.

Largely, I've found that I don't need much in the way of defense. There really isn't anything out there that can survive five pillars of fire to the face followed up by spammed magma lances- except bosses. For the bosses, I just Phase dance all around their stage and keep shooting at them while staying out of their range.

Mostly, that's what you do with the mage. Stay out of range, blast everything until it stops moving, wait a couple of seconds to get your mana back (and I do just mean a couple- go pick up dropped items and then you're ready to go) and proceed.

[Tebryn]

Originally Posted by Jade Dragon

I'm pretty sure Fate is by the same guys.

So it's sorta like Fate was T1, while T1 was T2, and T2 is T3.

It's only kind of, really only just one dude who did Fate helped with Torchlight. Fate was made by Wild Tangent while Torchlight was made by Runic Games. Torchlight and Torchlight 2 being the only games Runic Games have made to date. So...it's not really like that at all.

The Lead Developer of Fate (Travis Baldree) , along with the Co-Designers of Diablo One and Two ( Max and Erich Schaefer) are the people who worked on Torchlight and Torchlight 2

Originally Posted by Vael

Good to know! I hadn't even heard of Fate.

It's a bit dated now, but really if you like Torchlight Two then...just stick with it. As mentioned above, the lead designer of Fate and Diablo 1 and 2 made Torchlight, so you're really getting the best of both games.

[endoperez]

Originally Posted by Tebryn

It's only kind of, really only just one dude who did Fate helped with Torchlight. Fate was made by Wild Tangent while Torchlight was made by Runic Games. Torchlight and Torchlight 2 being the only games Runic Games have made to date. So...it's not really like that at all.

Seven instead of one according to this site, but yeah, not nearly a whole company's worth.

[Avilan the Grey]

I think I will definitely get this on Tuesday, when my salary comes in.

[Saithis Bladewing]

Played a lot of Torchlight II lastnight, 5 player elite co-op and what a blast. I had a lot more fun with that than I ever had with Diablo III co-op, to be honest. We died a lot but made steady progress and never felt frustrated with the state of the game. Played an Engineer tank and found it was very strong, I was the only character able to stand up to the bosses and swarms of monsters we faced and keep going, although it took a lot of potion guzzling. I was surprised, though, at how buggy multiplayer's been on release. We couldn't get our games registered on the website at all on release day, and once we finally did get to play, we had a lot of troubles with disconnects and the server de-synchronizing the game, requiring us to rehost. Thankfully, it saved our progress through dungeons or it would have been a nightmare to go back through.

All in all my initial judgment is that this game is definitely worth 20 bucks, and I'm actually enjoying it more than Diablo 3. For me, this is more of a successor to Diablo II than Blizzard's version could have been, in spite of its graphic "cartooniness".

[Tebryn]

Originally Posted by endoperez

Seven instead of one according to this site, but yeah, not nearly a whole company's worth.

My main point was that the saying Fate was Torchlight 1 etc etc has just as much weight as saying that Diablo 1 was Torchlight 1 making Torchlight 2 actually Torchlight 4 by mere merit of it having people who made Diablo 1 and 2 on the team that made Torchlight and it's sequel. Calling them Spiritual Successors may be more apt, but even then it's a fairly tenuous link considering it wasn't ever the intent for them to be that.

[Kinslayer]

Been havin fun mowing things down as Beserker... But I've gotten to the Level 15-18 area, and suddenly I am too squishy to fight a mob of enemies without Beserk running. Need to work on that.

Beserker does play exactly how I've always wanted a Melee Character to play in a Diablo-clone, though. Brawling up close, fast and personal, and range isn't Just Better. Haven't gotten around to trying the new sweep mechanics, because I've been using the Punch sets, and autoattacking.

The skills don't seem overly tempting right now, so more FALCON PUNCH for me. Some of the high-end skills will need a good investment of points.

[Weimann]

Originally Posted by Vael

Yeah, I'm not so fond of that either. If you want to let me switch around my latest three skills for free so I can test skills out, sure.
But if you want a REAL respec, you need something bigger.

I'm torn on the issue, really.

On the one hand, I can appreciate the idea behind picking your spec once and for all. It's not something I'm fundamentally against. Also, I'm not sure if TL2 has an "endgame" or not, but the majority of the entertainment surely comes from the actual process of playing through the adventure, in which case, at some point, a respec will cease to be interesting due to your advanced progression. Also also, a spec which you've played which you've been gradually introduced to throughout the game will be more natural and easier to handle for a player, rather than one she got into at level 90.

On the other hand, I just don't have as much time as I used to. If, at level 15, I find that I might actually want to go for a melee build instead of ranged, I'd have to replay those 15 levels, and I'm not necessarily interested in doing that. I mean, it took me two days worth of my entertainment time to do that, which I won't get back.

Either case, the game is fully modable. I'm sure a respec mod will appear among the first things.

[Fredaintdead]

I bought the game today (about 3 hours ago)... this is the most fun I have had in a video game in MONTHS.
I've been playing the Berserker, and relishing in being a very angry wolfman wolverine-clone and laughing at my Bulldog Churchill because he's a complete boss.

So, to sum it up:
YAY!

[Thrawn183]

Is there a way to go all minion master like in Torchlight 1?

[Tebryn]

You'd want to go Engineer with a focus on the Construction line.

[Wookieetank]

Originally Posted by Thrawn183

Is there a way to go all minion master like in Torchlight 1?

And don't forget to teach your Pet summoning spells! I think at this point everyone in my group has "pets" for their pet

[Kinslayer]

Engineer has minibots, healbots, landmines, jackbot and probably other things, Bezerker has Healing Shadowwolf at 7(? I don't use Shadow Tree), Outcast has kills = batminions at 7, and Embermage has... Summon Additional Embermage. Getting it the latest out of all of them, at Level 42, Ice Tree.

Anyway. Having fun with Embermage now, since the deadly punchtrain of bezerker is kind of squishy and boring at the moment.

[toasty]

Originally Posted by Kinslayer

Anyway. Having fun with Embermage now, since the deadly punchtrain of bezerker is kind of squishy and boring at the moment.

This is why i like the Shadow tree. I've been maxing passive skills and the Shadow Wolf and the ... Healing dash/wolf form thingie. Whenever I run low on HP I dash around as a wolf until I have some HP and then I keep hitting them. Combine this with the Shadow Wolf and healing on crits+maxing Dex means I'm surprisingly tanky.

[Jaxile]

If my Shadow wolf can't keep me up, I have no business in meele.
Good thing my northern rage one shots every mook at my level besides bruiser mobs and champions. 260% increased ice damage will do that.

[Tebryn]

Perhaps this is just me, but is every Desert Level in Top Down Hack and Slash games just ridiculously harder than every other level?

[1dominator]

I can only contribute one tangential thing:
D3 was a pile o' crap!

Originally Posted by Tebryn

Perhaps this is just me, but is every Desert Level in Top Down Hack and Slash games just ridiculously harder than every other level?

Its all the jumping stuff.

[Reynard]

Originally Posted by Tebryn

Perhaps this is just me, but is every Desert Level in Top Down Hack and Slash games just ridiculously harder than every other level?

Related: I hate Roach Myrmidons.


But yeah, the desert area is a hell of a step up. I explored every inch of every area leading up to it, and was still a few levels behind the recommended when I went in to the Empty Quarter and the areas inside/after it.

This is as a two-handed weapon-focused Engineer, mind, who only points in seven out of nine passives and FLAME HAMMER and the healing bot because FLAME HAMMER is crazy good.

[Tebryn]

Originally Posted by 1dominator

Its all the jumping stuff.

Luckily only a few in this game. But the Jackledogs are awful. The worst things really are...well...below.

Originally Posted by Reynard

Related: I hate Roach Myrmidons.

Ya these. Also the small scarabs that the Ezrohir send out when they are just in swarms. I laughed my head off when they came out of the ceilings with at least 30 of them but that was until I realized...that it wasn't at all funny and retreated.

But yeah, the desert area is a hell of a step up. I explored every inch of every area leading up to it, and was still a few levels behind the recommended when I went in to the Empty Quarter and the areas inside/after it.

Glad to hear it isn't just me who felt that way. A little leveled up for the last level of Act 2 but I hold no hope for Grunnheim.

This is as a two-handed weapon-focused Engineer, mind, who only points in seven out of nine passives and FLAME HAMMER and the healing bot because FLAME HAMMER is crazy good.

Only played an Embermage to a high level so far, but Fire Embermage seems totally OP.