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Old 10-01-2012, 06:10 PM   Top  -  End  -  #31
LeSwordfish
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Default Re: The War of the Shadow (Dark Heresy)

Gideon Van Haal

Background (Warning: Long)
Spoiler


Portrait
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Crunch
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TODO: Gear, changes for party synergy.
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Old 10-01-2012, 08:26 PM   Top  -  End  -  #32
Riddick
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Default Re: The War of the Shadow (Dark Heresy)

I may up my character acceptance from 3-4 to 5 considering the outpour of awesome I'm seeing here.
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Old 10-01-2012, 08:46 PM   Top  -  End  -  #33
LCP
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Quote:
Concerning Shield Robes, I had hoped no one would utilize that money source.
When GMing myself, I've always thought the simplest solution is not to allow their resale. They're items of faith; if you have no more need for them you should gift them back to the church.

Not meaning to spoil your fun, bluntpencil, but you've spent ~7,500 thrones where most of us have an upper limit of ~3,000 to spend. As he stands, Victor's got an effective soak of 15/16 on most locations (which since most NPCs can't score Righteous Fury means he's basically immune to small-arms fire), a shotgun that does 1d10+9 damage, a bolter and a power maul: he's going to make the rest of us irrelevant in any combat situation.
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Old 10-01-2012, 09:10 PM   Top  -  End  -  #34
Riddick
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^ Haven't looked to carefully at the sheets so far. So thanks for the pointing that out. Alterations necessary, good sir.
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Old 10-01-2012, 09:18 PM   Top  -  End  -  #35
ChaoticSky
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Default Re: The War of the Shadow (Dark Heresy)

Hizzah, the Adept is here!

WIP, crunch done, fluff to follow.
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Old 10-02-2012, 08:04 AM   Top  -  End  -  #36
Aneurin
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Default Re: The War of the Shadow (Dark Heresy)

Sounds fun; let's see if the die help me choose between concepts.

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Old 10-02-2012, 08:09 AM   Top  -  End  -  #37
bluntpencil
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Default Re: The War of the Shadow (Dark Heresy)

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Originally Posted by LCP View Post
When GMing myself, I've always thought the simplest solution is not to allow their resale. They're items of faith; if you have no more need for them you should gift them back to the church.

Not meaning to spoil your fun, bluntpencil, but you've spent ~7,500 thrones where most of us have an upper limit of ~3,000 to spend. As he stands, Victor's got an effective soak of 15/16 on most locations (which since most NPCs can't score Righteous Fury means he's basically immune to small-arms fire), a shotgun that does 1d10+9 damage, a bolter and a power maul: he's going to make the rest of us irrelevant in any combat situation.
That's true, but, again, I went with standard Arbites gear for the most part.

Selling an 'item of faith' hardly matters when he's an Arbitrator, not a Cleric. His item of faith is the Lex Imperialis. He didn't 'sell' it, he never had it in the first place, instead he was girded in holy carapace, distributing justice with his trusty shotgun and a prayer to He on Terra.

Now, compare him to the Guard character. He isn't as accurate at range. He's roughly as dangerous in melee (but does less damage, the shock version of the power maul doing less than a chainsword).

His thing is soaking damage (which he won't be dodging) and buffing the rest of the cell (Holy Radiance, Wrath of the Righteous and Divine Guidance). With him, the others do more damage. A Guardsman, for example, is already a better fighter than he. With him there, the Guard actually becomes more dangerous.

Comparing them and saying he will 'outshine' them is silly, I think, when you look at the final stats. One person mentioned thinking about playing a Battle Sister. They get power armour, bolters, meltaguns and power swords as standard issue (and rightly so). What I was going with was what would happen if other careers got their standard issue gear. Battle Sisters already get it, I figured Arbitrators probably should too. Guardsmen get their standard issue at level one, but, well, we all know that their standard issue sorta sucks when it really matters.

Last edited by bluntpencil : 10-02-2012 at 08:15 AM.
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Old 10-02-2012, 08:14 AM   Top  -  End  -  #38
bluntpencil
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Default Re: The War of the Shadow (Dark Heresy)

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I would like to request an Elite advance or two. Specifically, Charm and Decieve. In my head, Gideon is a sniper, but also a social assassin. He stands around at a party, regaling the group with his tales of daring-do on the battlefield, the classic bluff old soldier- but when the party retires to their beds, a particular noble, his wealth built on the trade of proscribed artefacts, finds Gideon in his room, knife out.

He has a few Peer talents, good fellowship, and the Noble Born homeworld boosting him... but Assassins can't take either Charm or Deceive until a few ranks after his current level. So i'd like to request Charm or Deceive, particularly Charm, as elite advances. I'd be willing to pay 200xp each, but would much happier if i could buy them for 100xp instead.

In addition, the background i'm writing makes me wonder if i can take Peer (Impressionable Young Women)
A good way to get deceive would be the 'Impostor' Background Package from Book of Judgement. It gives Deceive, Disguise and Talented: Deceive for 400XP, and should also fit the concept.

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Old 10-02-2012, 08:16 AM   Top  -  End  -  #39
LeSwordfish
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Default Re: The War of the Shadow (Dark Heresy)

It may not be an item of his faith, but i kinda don't see the redemptionists as a faction likely to say "What? Oh, whatever, man. Keep them. Our treat."
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Old 10-02-2012, 08:18 AM   Top  -  End  -  #40
bluntpencil
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It may not be an item of his faith, but i kinda don't see the redemptionists as a faction likely to say "What? Oh, whatever, man. Keep them. Our treat."
I would be going with 'he never had them in the first place', much like, say, a Stormtrooper never had flak armour in the first place. He always had Stormtrooper Carapace, as soon as he graduated from Stormtrooper training, and probably before. However, to create a starting Stormtrooper, you need to 'sell' the Guard equipment from the starting package.

Last edited by bluntpencil : 10-02-2012 at 08:19 AM.
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Old 10-02-2012, 08:29 AM   Top  -  End  -  #41
Aneurin
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Default Re: The War of the Shadow (Dark Heresy)

..forgot the reroll.

(2d10)[8]
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Old 10-02-2012, 08:37 AM   Top  -  End  -  #42
LCP
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I was just flagging up my opinion – I'm not the judge of the situation, so I won't argue it any further. If I was GMing I wouldn't be persuaded, but it's Riddick you need to persuade.

The only thing I'd point out is that it's possible to emulate Arbites "standard issue" without the bonus 5,000. I don't really understand the "standard issue" argument in the first place: standard issue for Dark Heresy seems to me to be the listed starting equipment. If we're going by tabletop minis instead then I want my free Omnissian Axe and servo-arm

In any case, it would certainly be a puzzle why Arbitrators who began their career as Confessors had standard issue kit, but those who rose through the ranks the regular way ended up 5,000 thrones' worth of kit short.
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Old 10-02-2012, 08:52 AM   Top  -  End  -  #43
bluntpencil
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Okay, an attempt to emulate standard-issue cheaper. I've went with standard Arbites standard gear instead of Confessor, to get a fair amount of cash.

FINISHED, AND WITH LEVEL APPROPRIATE GEAR.
The large text is for my benefit, so I can find the sheet.

Arbitrator Victor Gethsemane
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Old 10-02-2012, 09:00 AM   Top  -  End  -  #44
bluntpencil
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I was just flagging up my opinion – I'm not the judge of the situation, so I won't argue it any further. If I was GMing I wouldn't be persuaded, but it's Riddick you need to persuade.

The only thing I'd point out is that it's possible to emulate Arbites "standard issue" without the bonus 5,000. I don't really understand the "standard issue" argument in the first place: standard issue for Dark Heresy seems to me to be the listed starting equipment. If we're going by tabletop minis instead then I want my free Omnissian Axe and servo-arm

In any case, it would certainly be a puzzle why Arbitrators who began their career as Confessors had standard issue kit, but those who rose through the ranks the regular way ended up 5,000 thrones' worth of kit short.
Basically, I think the salary and equipment rules are dumb; especially for Scum, but also for those who would be issued gear, as opposed to buying guns and armour.

Regarding standard issue for Tech Priests, they are Enginseers, specifically military Tech Priests assigned to the Guard. The majority of =I= Techies are probably civilian with specialist know-how.

Arbitrators, however, (unless on special assignment) are always seen in carapace armour with power mauls and the like. The base 'Arbitrator' career doesn't accurately represent an Adeptus Arbites member, even going by the fluff in the Dark Heresy books. It better represents a planetary Enforcer... a regular police officer, not an Aribtrator. Even its proficiencies are lacking, any Arbitrator should know how to fire a pistol, after all: they are their main weapon, apparently.

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Old 10-02-2012, 09:44 AM   Top  -  End  -  #45
LCP
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Quote:
Regarding standard issue for Tech Priests, they are Enginseers, specifically military Tech Priests assigned to the Guard.
"Enginseer" is the name of Rank 4 for tech-priests; my character is Rank 5. "Arbitrator" is the name of Rank 5 for Arbitrators (funnily enough): the name of Rank 1 is "Trooper". I'm not disagreeing with you hugely - just saying that maybe you need to calibrate your expectations to what the rules are trying to represent, rather than vice versa. The DH careers are broad, they don't always match up to the iconic archetypes right from the start.

Looking over your new character sheet, I did spot one more thing - I don't think you can apply the Mono upgrade to non-Primitive weapons. Could be misremembering, though.

EDIT: I've just been re-reading the rules for the Servo-claw, and realised I can use it to make all my attacks, not just one. I'm pretty sure that makes the chainsword strictly inferior; gonna make some changes to my gear, if that's alright.
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Old 10-02-2012, 10:00 AM   Top  -  End  -  #46
bluntpencil
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"Enginseer" is the name of Rank 4 for tech-priests; my character is Rank 5. "Arbitrator" is the name of Rank 5 for Arbitrators (funnily enough): the name of Rank 1 is "Trooper". I'm not disagreeing with you hugely - just saying that maybe you need to calibrate your expectations to what the rules are trying to represent, rather than vice versa. The DH careers are broad, they don't always match up to the iconic archetypes right from the start.

Looking over your new character sheet, I did spot one more thing - I don't think you can apply the Mono upgrade to non-Primitive weapons. Could be misremembering, though.
Ah, right, yes, the Errata says that, hmm. Still, it allows for upgrading a Power Weapon... so, hopefully the GM will allow it on a Shock weapon too. All it does is add +2 Penetration.

And, yeah, the rules should probably be clearer on what a Rank 1 character actually is, and shouldn't contradict themselves in the various books. As it currently is, he's a character at the beginning of Arbitrator school... someone an Inquisitor (or one of his catspaws) should certainly never have recruited. And hell, even the rookies get the full gear.

When you're an Inquisitor, you can recruit full Arbitrators, Guardsmen that aren't still trying to work out which end of the gun is dangerous, and all the rest. Why bother with rookies, unless they are prodigally talented?

Rank 4 or 5 sounds about right for a proper Arbitrator, yeah.

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Old 10-02-2012, 10:01 AM   Top  -  End  -  #47
bluntpencil
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EDIT: I've just been re-reading the rules for the Servo-claw, and realised I can use it to make all my attacks, not just one. I'm pretty sure that makes the chainsword strictly inferior; gonna make some changes to my gear, if that's alright.
Chainswords are good for parrying, I guess. Can Parry with your off-hand...
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Old 10-02-2012, 10:35 AM   Top  -  End  -  #48
LCP
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Can do that with a regular sword or staff. Have traded out the chainsword for some explosive goodness.
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Old 10-02-2012, 10:37 AM   Top  -  End  -  #49
bluntpencil
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Can do that with a regular sword or staff. Have traded out the chainsword for some explosive goodness.
Or a shield!

Yeah, I've screwed around with my gear a bit, going for re-fluffed Magistratum carapace from Inquisitor's Handbook. Effectively the same, except it covers all locations.

Edit: I'm wondering why the Acuitor Tech-Assassin doesn't have 'Whisper of Samadhi' yet? It's pretty awesome.

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Old 10-02-2012, 10:54 AM   Top  -  End  -  #50
LCP
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Good point, actually - with Chain training and Blademaster gone I have some spare XP sloshing about. Bought!
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Old 10-02-2012, 11:05 AM   Top  -  End  -  #51
bluntpencil
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Good point, actually - with Chain training and Blademaster gone I have some spare XP sloshing about. Bought!
Acuitor Mech-Assassins always make me think of the typical porno's plot gone horribly wrong.

"I have come to fix zee boiler, ja?"

"Uh... okay... it's right... in here..."

<Cue dismembered limbs and explosions.>

Last edited by bluntpencil : 10-02-2012 at 11:15 AM.
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Old 10-02-2012, 12:30 PM   Top  -  End  -  #52
Destro_Yersul
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Default Re: The War of the Shadow (Dark Heresy)

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Originally Posted by bluntpencil View Post
When you're an Inquisitor, you can recruit full Arbitrators, Guardsmen that aren't still trying to work out which end of the gun is dangerous, and all the rest. Why bother with rookies, unless they are prodigally talented?

Rank 4 or 5 sounds about right for a proper Arbitrator, yeah.
Because Inquisitors need expendable people to send into dangerous but low-priority situations. After surviving a few of those, you become competent enough to send into the dangerous and high-priority situations. Plus, this way, it doesn't unduly de-stabilise the Imperium by removing competent individuals from higher offices.

As for 'standard issue' stuff, I believe Arbitrator standard issue is a pistol, a shotgun, carapace, riot shield and shock maul. This will run you 3740, if you use the expensive versions from Book of Judgement. If you use core-book armoury stuff to simulate it, it's 1765, though you end up with slightly less armour.
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Old 10-02-2012, 12:31 PM   Top  -  End  -  #53
LeSwordfish
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Quote:
<Cue dismembered limbs and explosions.>
Wait, that's not how all your porn ends?
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Old 10-02-2012, 12:34 PM   Top  -  End  -  #54
bluntpencil
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Because Inquisitors need expendable people to send into dangerous but low-priority situations. After surviving a few of those, you become competent enough to send into the dangerous and high-priority situations. Plus, this way, it doesn't unduly de-stabilise the Imperium by removing competent individuals from higher offices.

As for 'standard issue' stuff, I believe Arbitrator standard issue is a pistol, a shotgun, carapace, riot shield and shock maul. This will run you 3740, if you use the expensive versions from Book of Judgement. If you use core-book armoury stuff to simulate it, it's 1765, though you end up with slightly less armour.
If it's low-priority, the Inquisition probably won't be handling it. It's someone else's job, like the Imperial Guard or planetary Enforcers, and if it turns out to be high-priority, they can always report it.

Also, why would the Inquisition take lowly recruits from the Arbites? How would they determine which ones they took? It's unlikely they, the Adeptus Arbites, recruit just anyone. Such a recruit likely has a potential value to the Arbites that make him something other than expendable.

If you survive those low priority, dangerous jobs though, for the Guard, or whoever, the Inquisition might pick you up.

And yeah, managed to fit the gear in already, using a combination of Book of Judgement, Core Book and Inquisitor's Handbook. Had to toss the power maul (which I can't even use anyway, in spite of it being the standard) for a shock maul.

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Wait, that's not how all your porn ends?
Inquisitors do love torture porn.

Last edited by bluntpencil : 10-02-2012 at 12:43 PM.
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Old 10-02-2012, 12:43 PM   Top  -  End  -  #55
LeSwordfish
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My understanding was:

1)Firstly, you aren't average. Average for stats is thirty, for an average person is twenty. This point's been made with regards to the tabletop before: an imperial guardsman may be WS, BS, S, and T 3, but he could kick your ass. Also, Fate.
2) Sure the inquisition has low-priority stuff. And, more importantly, a need for cannon fodder.
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Old 10-02-2012, 12:49 PM   Top  -  End  -  #56
bluntpencil
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My understanding was:

1)Firstly, you aren't average. Average for stats is thirty, for an average person is twenty. This point's been made with regards to the tabletop before: an imperial guardsman may be WS, BS, S, and T 3, but he could kick your ass. Also, Fate.
2) Sure the inquisition has low-priority stuff. And, more importantly, a need for cannon fodder.
I understand the need for cannon fodder, but I can't see that always being low-priority. Stalingrad was high-priority, but used cannon fodder.

You don't empty the Arbites training school for cannon fodder, you grab Guard conscripts and farmers. Emptying the Scholastica Psykana of untested psykers is even worse! Psykers that are strong enough not to become Emperor-food are not cannon fodder. Ever. They're a very valuable resource.

Basically, my point is that the starting level for Dark Heresy should be about Rank 3 or 4, if you're working for the Inquisition. You shouldn't have attracted Inquisitorial notice with only 400 XP.

However, the system could be used, at Rank 1 for Heroic Citizens of the Imperium!

Basically, regular dudes, or guys in training or whatever, who happen to have Fate points. They're the sorts who are farmhands, scribes, conscripts and other schmucks, but they're lucky, maybe. If they survive to Rank x, bang, they might get promoted to full Arbitrator, or get a job for some guy that apparently works for an Inquisitor.

The in-training guys would... shock horror... be using their own initiative, not working for the Inquisition. That would make them worthy of notice and becoming Acolytes.

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Old 10-02-2012, 12:51 PM   Top  -  End  -  #57
Strainseir
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I have two questions. First do you have any more room? Second, if room is available would a Templar fit in with this group?
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Old 10-02-2012, 12:55 PM   Top  -  End  -  #58
Riddick
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Thanks for redoing your gear, Bluntpencil. It was necessary.

As for the Mono-shockmaul. A club is d10 primitive and a shockmaul is d10 shocking (non-primitive). While I understand your reasoning on why this should be doable. Looking over the compiled list of shocking weapons, all but one of them have 0 pen. I believe this is to make them lean towards the nice to have rather than "get one and win."

So for now, let's keep it at no pen:2 while in shocking mode but you can take the mono-upgrade to effect it while in 'off' mode. The pneumatic device disables the shocking and vice versa.

Oh, and here's a neat pdf to all you who haven't seen it already:

Neat

It's a complilation from DH and RT books I believe. Some of the rules listed in each description are up for approval however. The author seemed to add a few things. Unless one really can use a snub-shotgun in melee now and I missed that errata (please tell me if so). Otherwise, it's a handy list of weapons and armor by type.

EDIT: You are free to turn in a character sheet, but as the initial post said, I won't be choosing the players to get in until this weekend. So keep that in mind please. I'm only taking a handful to keep the game moving and to prevent a slow death by non-posters/slow-posters. If you post regularly, by all means get a Templar in!

Last edited by Riddick : 10-02-2012 at 12:57 PM.
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Old 10-02-2012, 12:57 PM   Top  -  End  -  #59
bluntpencil
Ogre in the Playground
 
PaladinGuy
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: 
Scotland
Gender: Male
Default Re: The War of the Shadow (Dark Heresy)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Riddick View Post
Thanks for redoing your gear, Bluntpencil. It was necessary.

As for the Mono-shockmaul. A club is d10 primitive and a shockmaul is d10 shocking (non-primitive). While I understand your reasoning on why this should be doable. Looking over the compiled list of shocking weapons, all but one of them have 0 pen. I believe this is to make them lean towards the nice to have rather than "get one and win."

So for now, let's keep it at no pen:2 while in shocking mode but you can take the mono-upgrade to effect it while in 'off' mode. The pneumatic device disables the shocking and vice versa.

Oh, and here's a neat pdf to all you who haven't seen it already:

Neat

It's a complilation from DH and RT books I believe. Some of the rules listed in each description are up for approval however. The author seemed to add a few things. Unless one really can use a snub-shotgun in melee now and I missed that errata (please tell me if so). Otherwise, it's a handy list of weapons and armor by type.
Works for me. Armoured guys tend to resist Shock anyway, so it's almost a non-issue. I can remove the Mono enhancement entirely, in fact.

Basically, I now at least look like a proper Arbitrator, without going overboard.

Last edited by bluntpencil : 10-02-2012 at 01:00 PM.
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Old 10-02-2012, 01:10 PM   Top  -  End  -  #60
Strainseir
Bugbear in the Playground
 
RedWizardGuy
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Default Re: The War of the Shadow (Dark Heresy)

I read about you not choosing people yet. I just wanted to make sure that you were still accepting applications. Being polite has been force-ably ingrained in me.
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