If the Emperor Fully healed would it matter? [WH40k]

[Cheesegear]

Originally Posted by The Succubus

WH40K is so unrealistic. =/

NO WAI!!!

But, I've thought about DVT heaps too. I do Path&Phys lab work. But the assumption is that the Emperor is 'fully healed'.

[bluntpencil]

So, Blood Angels get Librarian Dreadnoughts now, right...?

I'll let you lot finish that thought with regards to the Emperor.

[HandofShadows]

Originally Posted by The Succubus

Hmmm, if the Emperor finally got off his throne, IMO as a medical expert:

1) He'd need rather a lot of physiotherapy to rebuild his leg muscles from where he'd been seated so long, probably using a wheel-throne to begin with and gradually working up to crutches.

2) The first thing he'd probably ask was "Where's the nearest toilet?"

3) To be perfectly honest, I'm surprised he hasn't died from DVT yet.


WH40K is so unrealistic. =/

I recall a pic of the Emperor seated on the Golden Thrown and he looked more like a heavily rotted zombie or a Lich. He is already clinicaly dead. It is just that there are some cells still alive that keep his spirit still going. http://images.wikia.com/warhammer40k...pon_Throne.jpg

[Borgh]

I wonder about the not-dedicated chaos legions. Empy probably woudn't want them back (and given his track record with the Thunder Warriors will probably start an extermination campaign) but what would they do? stay doing what they do now and run from the Neolegions or would they go on some sort of pentinence crusade.
The Alpha Legion:
would probably try to get back into the Empire one way or another. Omegon (I like to believe the killed Alpharius was a decoy) might turn up on terra to go "sorry dad, that didn't really turn out as expected." they will probably face a culling in the best case scenario and get wiped out in the worst.

The Night Lords
Will be splintered. Some might want to seek forgiveness, most will probably be too far gone for that. They will most likely be exterminated and rebuilt as a Neolegion for their crimes.

The fallen who?
The Lion and Empy are goin to have A Talk. (assuming the Emperor can home in on his general location like he did with most of the other primarchs)
Either the DA or their shadowy brothers are going to get an extermination order.

[GolemsVoice]

Well, he might also psychically restore his body, it might be possible for an Alpha +++ psyker like him.

[Cheesegear]

Originally Posted by Borgh

I like to believe the killed Alpharius was a decoy

DOOMBOTS! *fist shake*

[comicshorse]

Originally Posted by The Succubus

Hmmm, if the Emperor finally got off his throne, IMO as a medical expert:

1) He'd need rather a lot of physiotherapy to rebuild his leg muscles from where he'd been seated so long, probably using a wheel-throne to begin with and gradually working up to crutches.

2) The first thing he'd probably ask was "Where's the nearest toilet?"

3) To be perfectly honest, I'm surprised he hasn't died from DVT yet.


WH40K is so unrealistic. =/

The bed sores (throne sores ?) don't bear thinking about

[Forum Explorer]

Originally Posted by The Succubus

2) The first thing he'd probably ask was "Where's the nearest toilet?"

What do you think the Golden Throne is?

Spoiler

[J-H]

My contribution to this discussion:

http://www.fanfiction.net/s/5354511/...al-Declaration

Yes, it's Dr. Who & 40k. It works.

[Tavar]

In before shouts of Hersey over Female Space Marine.

[The Glyphstone]

Adeptus Custodes aren't Space Marines. Technically. So the HERESY doesn't apply here.

Also, that story is funnier every time I run across it.

[lord_khaine]

1) He'd need rather a lot of physiotherapy to rebuild his leg muscles from where he'd been seated so long, probably using a wheel-throne to begin with and gradually working up to crutches.

2) The first thing he'd probably ask was "Where's the nearest toilet?"

3) To be perfectly honest, I'm surprised he hasn't died from DVT yet.

lol that made my morning

[Borgh]

Funny story but all the inaccuracies just made me cringe. Female custodians being the least of them.

[Cikomyr]

Originally Posted by Borgh

Funny story but all the inaccuracies just made me cringe. Female custodians being the least of them.

I never understood why people have a problem with female Custodians. After all, it is said they are a hereditary forces. Therefore, they have children.

[Borgh]

Originally Posted by Cikomyr

I never understood why people have a problem with female Custodians. After all, it is said they are a hereditary forces. Therefore, they have children.

Because Custodians use a version of the Space Marine process which just doesn't work on women. Since it it "a variation of" I don't think it impossible for there to be female custodians (especially as it is a job that involves a lot of intrigue which women are generally good at) but I think its highly unlikely given the canon we have so far.

[Cikomyr]

Originally Posted by Borgh

Because Custodians use a version of the Space Marine process which just doesn't work on women. Since it it "a variation of" I don't think it impossible for there to be female custodians (especially as it is a job that involves a lot of intrigue which women are generally good at) but I think its highly unlikely given the canon we have so far.

But the Space Marine creation process renders the subjet sterile.

Which clearly isn't the case with the Adeptus Custodes. Since they are a hereditary organisation.

[bluntpencil]

Originally Posted by Cikomyr

But the Space Marine creation process renders the subjet sterile.

Which clearly isn't the case with the Adeptus Custodes. Since they are a hereditary organisation.

Untrue.

They could have children before becoming Custodians. Likewise, you could have Space Marines, whose fathers were Space Marines, providing that they got their mothers pregnant before they became Marines. It's unlikely, due to most potential Marines being young, but it's certainly possible.

Also:

Can't we just put the Big E in a dreadnought?

[Borgh]

Also, can I have a source on the heriditary custodians thing? I can't find anything on it.

And we can't put the Emperor in a dread because those things are way too crude for what it would have to do. A dread woudn't be able to keep the Astronomical lit or for that matter keep the emperor alive.

[Tiki Snakes]

Originally Posted by Borgh

Funny story but all the inaccuracies just made me cringe. Female custodians being the least of them.

Originally Posted by Borgh

Because Custodians use a version of the Space Marine process which just doesn't work on women. Since it it "a variation of" I don't think it impossible for there to be female custodians (especially as it is a job that involves a lot of intrigue which women are generally good at) but I think its highly unlikely given the canon we have so far.

Well, thing is there isn't much in the way of logical reasons why the Space Marine process wouldn't work on women. I'm sure I've heard it's because it's keyed to the male chromosome, but really the answer boils down, in and out of universe to "It doesn't work on Women because they don't want it to work on Women".

Which is to say I choose to interpret it as "Everybody knows the process doesn't work on women" and the Codex never considers the potential of female recruits at all and that individual chapters may or may not simply ignore that and recruit female marines anyway.

Originally Posted by Cikomyr

But the Space Marine creation process renders the subjet sterile.

Which clearly isn't the case with the Adeptus Custodes. Since they are a hereditary organisation.

Likewise the the sterility thing. I choose to believe it's merely a commonly held belief that may or may not have any basis in fact. It's not like the vast majority of marines have any opportunity to find out.

[Morph Bark]

If female Space Marines aren't considered a possibility because they don't want it and Jack Harkness is the God-Emperor of Mankind, he'd make it possible, goshdarnit!

[Tiki Snakes]

Oh. I really should have read the fic when it was posted. Or perhaps not at all.

Jack Harkness as the God Emperor of Mankind?
As crack fic's go, that makes far too much sense and I'm going to have trouble getting that mental image out of my mind now.

I mean, still kind of not un-alive despite the throne killing other people in minutes, and sometime in his future is reduced to a tentacled head. Clearly, being hooked into a psionic death machine for so long had it's side effects...

I must not, cannot, shall not use this as canon when I run my Deathwatch game.

[comicshorse]

Originally Posted by Tiki Snakes

Oh. I really should have read the fic when it was posted. Or perhaps not at all.

Jack Harkness as the God Emperor of Mankind?
As crack fic's go, that makes far too much sense and I'm going to have trouble getting that mental image out of my mind now.

I mean, still kind of not un-alive despite the throne killing other people in minutes, and sometime in his future is reduced to a tentacled head. Clearly, being hooked into a psionic death machine for so long had it's side effects...

I must not, cannot, shall not use this as canon when I run my Deathwatch game.

DO IT ! You know you want to
( This message brought to you by Slaanesh.com)

[Cheesegear]

I prefer the theory that the Pandorica is the Throne. Y'know...How it lets everyone in the galaxy at all places at all times lets everything know that I. Am. Here. And that The Master (who has upgraded his title to simply 'The Emperor') is in it...He created 20 clones of himself and tried to take over the Galaxy using his intellect.

Cypher is the Doctor. He shows up, disappears and re-appears at will. He's practically indestructible (the HH Heresy implies that Cypher is a title and can be passed on...The Phantom style) and you can kill him and he'll just come back. And, whether his goal is to shank or save The Master Emperor, nobody knows.

As of Know No Fear, Ollanius Pius has acquired the role of Jack Harkness. Although I've read another that Harkness is actually John 'Jack' Grammaticus.

Anyway, that's not the point. Just something I thought was hilarious now that we've brought up WhoHammer.

[GloatingSwine]

Originally Posted by Tiki Snakes

Well, thing is there isn't much in the way of logical reasons why the Space Marine process wouldn't work on women. I'm sure I've heard it's because it's keyed to the male chromosome, but really the answer boils down, in and out of universe to "It doesn't work on Women because they don't want it to work on Women".

Given that like much of the technology of the IoM the details of how and why the conversion process to make a Space Marine are lost, they probably don't know in universe why it doesn't work on women.

They have a set of rites which, if performed correctly, produce a Space Marine candidate from an ordinary human. They may not know how all of them work.

[Cheesegear]

Originally Posted by GloatingSwine

Given that like much of the technology of the IoM the details of how and why the conversion process to make a Space Marine are lost, they probably don't know in universe why it doesn't work on women.

Except that they do. Space Marines are made in their formative years when hormones are going crazy. They accelerate that process. During this time, the massive testosterone output usually kills a woman by Phase 3 (of 19). Theoretically you can give a woman two hearts, and the height and the cement bones and chestplate but none of the strength or the other redundant organs that makes a Space Marine take any wound that isn't a headshot.

This process is similar to a massive dose of steroids and shrivels a man's junk making him sterile - as we saw in Space Wolf.

[Tiki Snakes]

Originally Posted by Cheesegear

Except that they do. Space Marines are made in their formative years when hormones are going crazy. They accelerate that process. During this time, the massive testosterone output usually kills a woman by Phase 3 (of 19). Theoretically you can give a woman two hearts, and the height and the cement bones and chestplate but none of the strength or the other redundant organs that makes a Space Marine take any wound that isn't a headshot.

This process is similar to a massive dose of steroids and shrivels a man's junk making him sterile - as we saw in Space Wolf.

But the thing is, female biology simply isn't that different.

You know what happens when you give a female massive amounts of testosterone? Almost exactly what happens when you give a man massive amounts of testosterone. I'm just not sure I believe that space testosterone would be that different.

[Soras Teva Gee]

Jack Harkness GEoM.... yep, its now become hypercanon. So true that even out canon impossiblity cannot disprove it.

Originally Posted by Cheesegear

Except that they do. Space Marines are made in their formative years when hormones are going crazy. They accelerate that process. During this time, the massive testosterone output usually kills a woman by Phase 3 (of 19). Theoretically you can give a woman two hearts, and the height and the cement bones and chestplate but none of the strength or the other redundant organs that makes a Space Marine take any wound that isn't a headshot.

This process is similar to a massive dose of steroids and shrivels a man's junk making him sterile - as we saw in Space Wolf.

Literal testosterone poisoning. Fascinating, where you get that from if I may ask?

Anyways its really not a terrible surprise that a process as radical as a making a Space Marine can't be applied blindly applied to both genders. Though there should be some outside chance of success I think, but would probably result in the same, ahem, body type except in one regard.

However there's not much reason a differently tuned process would not work on females. Since those sort of balances can be (and are) altered IRL. Course "realistically" the results would be pretty similar to the males. Not that realism has ever stopped 40k from doing anything.

I think I can encapsulate the real reason there are no female marines though:

Spoiler

This picture has absolutely nothing to do with 40 but I think explains succinctly (and better then I can put into words) why GW will never create towering amazon warriors of awesome.

[The Glyphstone]

Better reason - they'd have to make new plastic molds without increasing their models sold. Right now, 'Female marine' is Space Marine plus some modeling putty - creating a line of Female Marines would end up siphoning away Male Marine sales.

[Tiki Snakes]

Originally Posted by The Glyphstone

Better reason - they'd have to make new plastic molds without increasing their models sold. Right now, 'Female marine' is Space Marine plus some modeling putty - creating a line of Female Marines would end up siphoning away Male Marine sales.

My take on the matter is that this is not the case. It's the Samus dilemma, for me. Inside any of those suits of power armour there may be a dude or a surprisingly feminine super soldieress. Post process, she'd be as tall, as strong, as fast and a female space marine isn't going to put up with all that power-stilleto nonsense the Sisters of Battle totter around in. Ain't going to be no lumps to indicate a difference in armour occupant.

(I use this as a facet of a custom marine chapter I wrote up for our local deathwatch campaigns. They have a long running hatred for and feud with the Sisters of Battle partially for this reason and partially out of disgust at the weasel-word origin of the Sisters.)

Of course chances are if GW decided it was canon, they'd put them in power stilletos and impractically designed chestplates anyway, regardless of how wrong it would be.

[Soras Teva Gee]

I'd point out its hard to avoid the idea that the Sisters of Battle are/were at same level meant to be the "female marines" only curiously they are probably the least supported IoM force, demoted from even having their own codex for awhile yes, and are from the begining also comfortably weaker then the Space Marines and not held in as high regard.

And its not like 40k is overflowing with options for someone wanting to field an amazon army. If GW can provide a single chapter with sue-per special awesome chapter only models like this monstrosity¹ I think they can draw up some canon support for female marines.

¹Yo dawg I herd u lik powah armur, so I put powah armur in ya powah amur so u can go ta war while ya go to war!