Harthar's Kingmaker Part One: The Stolen Lands OOC

[Harthar]

ALL:
I chose the party we have for a reason, and you will recall that I had chosen a Paladin as well to be among our number but that person didn’t take the invite for reasons that wouldn’t be made available to me. Do I think we have too many ‘ranged’ and not enough ‘melee’, no I think its perfect as is. There is Gedriwyn as a tank of sorts, and Crimson who is melee also, Dhovanu, whilst being a ranger can be effective at melee if Gedriwyn and Crimson gets put down. You all need to think not only of what these characters excel at, but what they can achieve if needed to as well. Even Elanore could work well as a melee sort with her healing powers to bring her back to health and her other spells to buff her up and make her harder to hurt.

And even if it is a bit tougher in combat without more melee, why see that as a down point when clearly it is just making things more challenging?

Frivolous:
I would say no to changing characters at this stage, the Game is started and I have chosen the character you created; It is up to you to challenge yourself with that character and make it work.

PhilMeyer:
I think you need to re-read what I posted in that plan. Ged suggested that Dhovanu should be ontop of the wagon. And you need to think about where the bandits will be if they are grabbing the trading posts’ goods. From my point of view, even without knowing as a GM, I would have thought them to be around the storehouse, ontop of which is Vasili (fulfilling his ‘closer than the ranger’ model). Dhovanu then has a straight open line of fire down the center of the yard and is unobstructed by the buildings that are on every other side of the trading post. Had Dhovanu been on any other wall she wouldn’t have been able to hit half of the bandits. Dhovanu also has acrobatics which gives her the best chance of leaping from the cart onto the wall and being able to take down anyone who manages to get out of the trading post and make a run for it.

So I bolded suggested because that is what it was. If Dhovanu is supposed to be a more decisive and self-possessed person, then play her as such and get her to tell Gedriwyn where she will be. The only reason he may come across as being intimidating or leadership like is because of the effort I put into roleplaying, not the actual words themselves. It’s the post length and quality not what is actually going on. Re-read those posts and you’ll find I’m correct in that.

You also need to think of these conflicts as hooks for your own role play. Use the disagreement you feel to fuel your posts, to add detail and depth to them. Tell us how your character feels in your posts. If Dhovanu feels conflicted with following Gedriwyn and wanting her own personality to be the strongest amongst the group, or to assume the mantle of leadership, then have her come into conflict with Gedriwyn. We don’t REALLY need to be a co-hesive unit until the Kingdom is founded, and even then it adds more to the story if we aren’t. The little intrigues and plot points make it all worthwhile and memorable.

Also, the reason I post Gedriwyn as a separate post to my own, which you’ll find out during combat, is because I’ll be making exactly the same rolls as you on the forum and it also means he is played separate from the NPCs and the world that is being DMed. It is meant not to stifle, but rather to show division between my playing a PC and my GMing. IF you don’t like this then I can do it all in the same post but you won’t be able to see my rolls as I’m not going roll, post and then edit to GM myself when it is far easier to just post with rolls, and then post as GM to reply to everything that is happening.

So finally, if everyone has a problem with Gedriwyn, then I guess I can remove him entirely and get a PC to replace Kazimir, but you’ll probably find me disgruntled at having to do so since the whole reason I even created the thread to recruit for this game was so that I could play it, not DM it. It’s up to you. I’ll give you all a few days to discuss it before going ahead with the ambush as it seems to be a feeling shared by more than just one member of the group; plus we have to wait for Crimson to post anyway.

Elvish Translator

[PhilMeyer]

I think you need to re-read what I posted in that plan. Ged suggested that Dhovanu should be ontop of the wagon.

I readily admit that my perception of the suggestion is what I was having a difficult time with. Your post that explained that you weren't trying to have your PC be the leader laid a lot of that concern to rest. One suggestion, and which might actually be the source of some of this, is for you to choose a different color for Ged's dialog than you do for your NPC dialog. I think that'd go a long way towards erasing the perception of "this is the word of god". I mean really, having your dialog in bold has psychological significance .

And you need to think about where the bandits will be if they are grabbing the trading posts’ goods. From my point of view, even without knowing as a GM, I would have thought them to be around the storehouse...

Well, its really up to us how far we let them get before we do the ambush, but if that's how you see it going down then that makes sense.

Had Dhovanu been on any other wall she wouldn’t have been able to hit half of the bandits.

That's partly where I got confused. I asked about clear sitelines from the catwalk, and as far as I know I never did get an answer (it's possible I just missed it). If she can't get a good shot from up there, then again that adds to the picture. You've got a crystal clear picture as the DM, while we've kind of got bits and pieces of it .

Taking a step back, I want to say that most of that post was actually unncessary for me (though I do appreciate the effort). Your first response on the topic was good enough for me, and I really was just asking if there was a basis for the suggestion that I wasn't aware of. Your post mentioned acrobatics and similar factors, which is what I was looking for.

Honestly, this has been my favorite start to a PBP campaign so far on the GITP forums yet, and I've joined quite a few. So try to read my posts with that fact in mind. I'm not trying to drive Ged out of the game or anything, and the idea of a disgruntled DM is just plain scary.

As for that Elvish translator, I can't say I am impressed. Neither 'beast' nor 'animal' are giving me a response, and the translations for 'arrow' and 'horse' I don't like very much. Are you asking me to use it or are my own translations okay?

[Harthar]

I kinda started ranting halfway through my post, :P. But the rant may give some people some perspective with regards to their own character development, heh.

I guess I can look into using a colour for Ged, though I don't particularly like colours in general. He would be a slate greycolour maybe? Or a Steely Grey, or royal orange. I'm not really sure.

Anyways. The elvish translator was just a suggestion. Its easier for everyone if we use the same source for words for different languages if possible, just so that others who know that language can draw from the same source as they would be able to translate it/know what is being said. Unless of course after you write your elvish, you have a translation next to it?

EDIT: Slate GRey is too much like normal text, And North has Teal, which I thought to be more steely than teal, so orange it is.

[North_Ranger]

Heh, you know it's a good game when people offer constructive criticism and defend their views on how to make the game even better. And I am in complete agreement with Phil: this is definitely one of if not the best PbP I've played. Granted I've not played so many, but I'm really liking our ragtag band and the entire premise on which this game runs.

Harthar, I'm just gonna say this to reiterate the point: no one here wants Ged gone. Far from it. It's a delicate balancing act, having a DMPC (just look at Dorkness Rising ), but I think you're finding your balance. Don't think us trying to push you off the tightrope; we're just giving you little nudges to help restore your balance.

As for the whole language issue... I think we can just make up single words in other tongues if need be. Heck, they do it in movies and books all the time: Kwisatz Haderach, Kolee-dok-Zumil, Ardat-Yakshi, Dovahkiin, Imzadi...

[PhilMeyer]

Unless of course after you write your elvish, you have a translation next to it?

Absolutely. I think it will always be clear in context what Dhovanu is saying in elvish, and if not I'll make it explicit.

[PhilMeyer]

If Dhovanu feels conflicted with following Gedriwyn and wanting her own personality to be the strongest amongst the group, or to assume the mantle of leadership, then have her come into conflict with Gedriwyn.

I'm actually not interested in Dhovanu being the leader of the group (official or otherwise), she's mostly just a chick with some strong opinions .

I think the main thing is that she's used to being on her own and so expects a fair amount of autonomy over her own actions.

[Harthar]

So, we are still waiting on Crimson to post, if he hasn't posted by this time tomorrow then I'll just be proceeding with the ambush. I would hate to think that at this early stage in the RP that we loose a member for inactivity.

I expect everyone to be able to post daily at the very least. If there are extenuating circumstances than something can be arranged, but if not and things continue then I will either write out characters, or make them into NPCs and find replacements.

[North_Ranger]

Notice received and understood. Daily posting shouldn't be a problem for me. There are times when I may have a hard time posting, but I'll try and let you know as soon as possible. Chronic illness that sometimes needs hospital stays, you know... thank goodness for laptops and wi-fi Not expecting anything to happen, but you never know...

[Mari01]

As far as the DMPC goes, as long as he stays at our power level and doesn't lead us by the nose, you could have 5 of them for all I care.

[ApatheticAbacus]

No problems here with you having Gedriwyn as a PC, Harthar. I think, though, that probably the best way to make sure he doesn't become too much of a leader (and therefore sort of leading everyone through the campaign even as you play in it) is to separate your posting as the DM and your posting on Ged. You already do them in different posts, but since the posts have tended to be right beside each other, you're getting first crack at responding to NPCs and such. My (admittedly speculative) advice would be to sometimes hold back on posting as Ged until after one, two, or three people have responded.

[Frivolous]

I support what ApatheticAbacus wrote.

Harthar's job of playing a DMPC would be easier, I believe, if he were playing an Elan or a Belkar. Someone whose opinion doesn't matter too much. Or even a Durkon, who is very stoic and taciturn.

Gedriwyn is more like a Roy.

[North_Ranger]

We'll just need to stop treating Ged like a paladin when he's essentially a gloryhound I mean, if my memory of the cavalier orders is correct, The Order of the Cockatrice was the one where the brethren are essentially out to gain personal fortune and glory, correct?

I mean, I've been playing Vasili as someone who thinks Ged's got good ideas but sometimes gets too high and mighty just because he's got a horse and a better suit of armor.

EDIT: Ah, scratch that. I just checked, Ged's Order of the Dragon, not Cockatrice. My memory, she has failed me But the point is, if the rest of the party is worried that Ged's being too much of the boss, it's up to them to put the cavalier back in his place.

Also, Harthar, none of this is personal or intended as mean-spirited. I just admit, I'm one of those players who enjoys a bit of tension between PCs. Nothing that will tear the party to pieces, but that healthy kind of headbutting that comes with having a group of ecclectic personalities sharing the same space for any period of time

[Mari01]

I'm a squishy mage. If someone wants to be "leader" be my guest. I'll know who to point to when we get captured

[Harthar]

Heh, I see. I thought my posting last as Gedriwyn was leaving enough time for you guys to respond to the NPCs. :P

Last little post there to provide information, I'd really like to get the ambush started in a few hours when I get back from lunch, so if anyone has any last minute questions/ideas that won't change the setup or stop me from posting up until the start of the ambush, that should be fine.

[North_Ranger]

Well, if it's any help, I'm ready to jump to the morning when everyone else is. Vasili will try and find a moment alone with Oleg at some point, though, to ask if he's seen or heard of the twin of his pistol. And if there's anything interesting to buy in Oleg's wares, we can settle that in OOC, I think.

So let's go over the plan once more, shall we?
1. Locations:
-Dhovanu on the ramparts
-Vasili on the storehouse roof or in the alley between the storehouse and the main house
-Elanore with Oleg near the main house
-Vill in a barrel somewhere
-Ged, Renly and Gregory outside the gates, ready to push the wagon so that it blocks the gateway.
-Where be Winter?
Is this correct?
2. What's the cue for attack? A signal from Oleg? Ged charging? Vasili or Dhov shooting the leader?
3. Do we build any cover from goods or use them to keep the bandits boxed in?

[North_Ranger]

Suggestions based on Oleg and Svetlana's goods:
- Shield potions to those most likely to get attacked, lowest AC first.
- CLWs to those most likely to be out of reach of Ela's channeling.
- Javelins as back-up weapons to the casters.
- Bow and arrows as back-up weapons to Vill or Vasili - or to Renly.

[Harthar]

So let's go over the plan once more, shall we?
1. Locations:
-Dhovanu on the ramparts
-Vasili on the storehouse roof or in the alley between the storehouse and the main house
-Elanore with Oleg near the main house
-Vill in a barrel somewhere
-Ged, Renly and Gregory outside the gates, ready to push the wagon so that it blocks the gateway.
-Where be Winter?
Is this correct?
2. What's the cue for attack? A signal from Oleg? Ged charging? Vasili or Dhov shooting the leader?
3. Do we build any cover from goods or use them to keep the bandits boxed in?

Sorry, is this the way we want it?
Ged will be the only one outside as far as I could see, whilst Renly and Gregory are behind the wagon ready to push it. With sight lines they shouldn't be seen unless the bandits go searching, which is possible considering they have never seen the wagon before and may want to take it also.

I'll do up a quick adjustment to where you are all in Oleg's on the map, so that it can get confirmed before we continue. Future battles shouldn't take this long to get started, unless we make a habit of ambushing people. :P

There, as yet, is no cue for Ged's charge and the wagon being rolled into place, so the PCs should definitely make one up. It could be something as simple as Vasili's first pistol shot? Or yes, Gedriwyn's charge. He can be warned of the bandits having entered the trading post with Dhovanu's bird or the pistol shot.

You can build cover, though whether your characters think the bandits might notice is entirely up to them as to whether they should build anything so obvious.

Suggestions based on Oleg and Svetlana's goods:
- Shield potions to those most likely to get attacked, lowest AC first.
- CLWs to those most likely to be out of reach of Ela's channeling.
- Javelins as back-up weapons to the casters.
- Bow and arrows as back-up weapons to Vill or Vasili - or to Renly.

CLWs and shield potion will probably have to be bought, or some sweet talking happen after the battle to convince Oleg and Svetlana that it was necessary to use them. Javelins and arrow should be fine, they are recoverable.

I'll quickly whip that map up so that everyone is on the same page and we all know our starting positions for when we get moving.

[Harthar]

Alrighty, how is this?



So Crimson is in a barrel, just assume that even if you can't see it.

Vasili is standing on the roof of the storehouse, obviously, and because I can't find anything good to chuck in for the platform allowing easy access to the storehouse, lets just assume that in front of the storehouse and to the right of Vasili as we are looking at it, is a two square platform. One square for the platform itself, one for the ramp up to it. It is a steep ramp :P

Oh and the pictures for Renly and Gregory are the same, but that doesn't really matter. hehe.

[PhilMeyer]

Looks good to me. I think a pistol shot is an excellent signal, personally .

[Frivolous]

I'm very sorry to have to write this, but I wish to pull out of the game.

I feel that it is unfair to Harthar that he feels forced to DM this game even though he would prefer to play.

However, I also feel that trying to both play a PC and DM the game makes succeeding at either less likely.

I should have written this much earlier, but I was very busy with work (10 hour shifts doing medical stuff). Plus I had never been in a game with a DMPC before, and I thought maybe it would work out.

I regret writing this, but I feel it is best that I do so sooner rather than later.


Hope you all can eventually forgive this unseemly lack of persistence. I don't really do this very often.

Take care everyone.

[Harthar]

Hmmm... Well that's disappointing.

[North_Ranger]

Life happens, I suppose. Me, I think Harthar's doing a good job as a DM, and the whole DMPC thing would have cleared up with time and feedback. Sorry to see you go, Frivolous... I really liked what you were doing with your character.

So what now? Go through the battle sans divine caster, and put up a notice for a replacement?

[Harthar]

Pretty much, Elanore will become an NPC until the battle is over and then she'll be written out, I've already got a reason and a good time to do it. I'll post up for a new team member a little later on, having dinner at the moment.

[North_Ranger]

Guys?

Anyone around?

Hello?

[Harthar]

Two new people have been found. When/If they accept they will be joining our party shortly; probably the day following this battle, maybe a bit sooner if I can push it. They will be posting their Characters here and I'll edit the second post with their information, and work on a story for their entry In Character.

Meanwhile, we'll proceed with the ambush, and hopefully it won't get too convoluted. What we really need to work on at the moment is our pace; if we can start to post a little more frequently then we will all be more enthusiastic about posting in the future, guaranteed. I do know that Real Life can get in the way ( :P ), and so obviously I understand delays in posting. Lets just all keep the eye on the prize and before we all know it we'll be founding a new Kingdom.

If anyone wants to, I recently got Yahoo Messanger, and I think have MSN around here somewhere. So if you want to PM me with your accounts I can add you for any discussions that you'd like to keep private, or any concerns that you might not want to put up on the boards. I don't mind either way.

[PhilMeyer]

Meanwhile, we'll proceed with the ambush, and hopefully it won't get too convoluted. What we really need to work on at the moment is our pace;

Well ****, in my subscription folder the IC thread didn't look like it had any new updates. I had no idea that the encounter beginning had been posted. I'm very sorry, I was around last night and definitely would have posted my turn. Weekends are tough during the day, but I try and check all my games at night at least.

My kid just woke up so probably won't have a chance to post right now, but should be able to around 1:30PM when he takes a nap. I'll try to get in an update before then if possible.

[PhilMeyer]

Okay he's playing quietly in his crib, so snuck in a post. I wasn't sure what the situation was, whether the two were going to move the wagon before Dhovanu goes. Feel free to make appropriate adjustments either way.

[North_Ranger]

Phil, if you click the "User CP" link in the upper left-hand corner, the first thing you will see are subscribed threads with new posts. I check that first every time I come online and have a moment to spare :) Hope that helps.

[PhilMeyer]

Thanks, that should help. I think what happened is that I clicked on it on my mobile phone but that the page took too long and so I abandoned it (Sprint sucks). Then next time I looked it didn't show as being new.

[PhilMeyer]

So as not to keep editing my post...

Would the talons on Ouray be secondary attacks? I thought there was a table somewhere that I was referencing when I built the character sheet that said that they were primary, but I'm not sure if having a bite attack makes them secondary or not. (and now I can't find the table)

If they are secondary I think with Multiattack it'd be at -2. Which I'm guessing would mean all missed.

Not the end of the world, I'm worried that the poor bird will draw too much "aggro" if it is effective early on in the combat anyway.