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Old 08-21-2008, 04:26 PM   Top  -  End  -  #1
Person_Man
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Default Haberdash the Masked: The 3.5 Kitchen Sink

The goal of the build is to have as many options as possible, so that you always have something interesting to do. It relies heavily on exotic weapons, magic items, and Skill Tricks (Complete Scoundrel).

Skill Tricks take 2 Skill points to get. They also have minimum Skill rank requirements. You can have a maximum number of Skill Tricks equal to half your level. And each one can be used once per encounter. By themselves, they’re pretty weak. But when combined with creative thinking and the right weapons, they have a lot of potential.

Much of this is stolen directly from posts I've read here and on the opt boards over the years. I've tried to link everywhere I could, but if I've written down one of your ideas and didn't give you credit, I apologize. Please let me know, and I will do so.


Haberdash the Masked

The build:
Spoiler


The combos:
Spoiler


The Full List of Potentially Useful Exotic Weapons
Spoiler


Tome of Battle Fun:
Spoiler


Incarnum:
Spoiler


I've also been informed that Vestiges are an easy way to gain useful powers. However, I don't own Tome of Magic, so I can't comment on it intelligently. If you do and your DM allows it, the Consolidated Binder Handbook should tell you everything you need to know. Most notably, The Triad vestige (from a WotC Mind's Eye article) grants proficiency in "all simple, martial, and exotic weapons." So Binder 12 (or the equivalent combination using prestige classes and the Improved Binder feat) substitutes for Master of Masks.

Haberdash will not be able to do all of the combos I’ve laid out. You have a limited number of Skill Tricks that you can take, and limited resources for equipment. Furthermore, most DMs won’t allow every possible supplement. And some DMs won’t allow overpowered uses of some rules, even if they’re core. I get this.

Haberdash is basically a buffet style build that allows you to choose whatever elements fit into your campaign. He’s also potentially a great BBEG to throw at your PCs, because he has many potential screw-but-not-kill combos, and the whole Master of Masks/Disguise thing going to drive an interesting plot.

Please post any and all ideas, tweaks, opinions, etc. In particular, I’d like to hear if I missed any useful exotic weapons or low cost combos (ie, not involving more then one or two feats, items, spells, or powers) which might be of help. I also haven't settled on the best race to use, what feats to finish the build with, or found a good pic of a masked gladiator carrying many weapons.

Last edited by Person_Man : 02-23-2011 at 08:24 AM.
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Old 08-21-2008, 04:30 PM   Top  -  End  -  #2
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Default Re: Haberdash the Masked: The 3.5 Kitchen Sink

cast the bard spell improvisation to get 1/2 caster level as bonus to skills
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Old 08-21-2008, 04:33 PM   Top  -  End  -  #3
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Default Re: Haberdash the Masked: The 3.5 Kitchen Sink

Wow. Is there a single 3.5 book that you don't use in that build?

It looks like it could be a lot of fun to play, but your character sheet would be longer than some sourcebooks. :P

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Old 08-21-2008, 06:43 PM   Top  -  End  -  #4
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Default Re: Haberdash the Masked: The 3.5 Kitchen Sink

I love the mental image of this guy, walking around with six or eight exotic reach weapons strapped to him, a gigantic composite bow and whips and god knows what all else, doing the most ludicrous cartwheels and gratuitous gymnastics that clearly defy each and every law of physics in turn, and Quick Drawing a new weapon every six seconds! Very entertaining.
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Old 08-21-2008, 07:28 PM   Top  -  End  -  #5
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Default Re: Haberdash the Masked: The 3.5 Kitchen Sink

Quote:
If you make it up to ECL 11, one level of Exemplar (Complete Adventurer) will give you +4 to one Skill...
Be advised: The Skill Artistry bonus is a competence bonus, which is the most common type of bonus to a skill. So it likely won't stack with any other bonuses you might have. In other words, pick a skill for it that you can't easily get other bonuses for.

Since you have so many uses for Skill Tricks, you might want to consider one of the Trickster PrCs from Complete Scoundrel. The bonus tricks you gain don't count against the half-character-level limit, and +2 levels of an existing class can be useful (I recommend advancing something that doesn't have good skills, since Uncanny Trickster gives you a full 8+Int per level from a broad list).

Overall, I like it. It looks like it'd be very fun to play, and with so many options, even you won't know what you're going to pull off next.
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Old 08-21-2008, 08:13 PM   Top  -  End  -  #6
Occasional Sage
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Default Re: Haberdash the Masked: The 3.5 Kitchen Sink

A small thing: isn't OA 3.0, not 3.5? That's my recollection, which makes Iaijutsu non-compatible.
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Old 08-21-2008, 08:57 PM   Top  -  End  -  #7
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Default Re: Haberdash the Masked: The 3.5 Kitchen Sink

Quote:
Originally Posted by Occasional Sage View Post
A small thing: isn't OA 3.0, not 3.5? That's my recollection, which makes Iaijutsu non-compatible.
I believe you can use 3.0 stuff so long as it wasn't reprinted elsewhere. Whether this is the case for Iaijutsu, I do not know.
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Old 08-21-2008, 09:16 PM   Top  -  End  -  #8
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Default Re: Haberdash the Masked: The 3.5 Kitchen Sink

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kasrkin View Post
I believe you can use 3.0 stuff so long as it wasn't reprinted elsewhere. Whether this is the case for Iaijutsu, I do not know.
Hmm... I thought 3.5 was assumed to be 3.0-compatible, but not the other way around. Maybe I'm backwards?
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Old 08-21-2008, 09:19 PM   Top  -  End  -  #9
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Default Re: Haberdash the Masked: The 3.5 Kitchen Sink

Seems like if you're going to charge on a mount, you might as well try to sneak spirited charge in there somewhere.
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Old 08-21-2008, 09:21 PM   Top  -  End  -  #10
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Default Re: Haberdash the Masked: The 3.5 Kitchen Sink

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Originally Posted by ocato View Post
Seems like if you're going to charge on a mount, you might as well try to sneak spirited charge in there somewhere.
The idea of sneaking up on somebody with a long pointy stick while riding an animal heavy enough that it shakes the ground is, frankly, fabulous.

By the way OP I didn't say this before and I suck for that, but: this build is CRAZY COOL!
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Old 08-21-2008, 09:51 PM   Top  -  End  -  #11
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Default Re: Haberdash the Masked: The 3.5 Kitchen Sink

This build is awesome. I could never use it as a villian because then it'd be destined to lose because I've run too many "ha ha, everybody wins because of my suprisingly unevil plan" villians already.
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Old 08-21-2008, 10:05 PM   Top  -  End  -  #12
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Default Re: Haberdash the Masked: The 3.5 Kitchen Sink

Have you considered the feats from ToM that allow you to gain some powers from Vestiges?

Also, for exotic weapon, don't forget that "broken" greathammer that the Greathorn Minotaur gets in MMIV (19-20/x4 crit, from memory).

Last edited by Thurbane : 08-21-2008 at 10:38 PM.
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Old 08-22-2008, 12:41 AM   Top  -  End  -  #13
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Default Re: Haberdash the Masked: The 3.5 Kitchen Sink

I could never use this build simple cuz I would end up chuckling over and over to myself say "Yes...yes I could do that...or this..." until the group rises up against me.

Plus all my DMs think factotum is broken. Which I really can't argue too much with.

Also I would need flash cards to remind me what I can do.

Last edited by BobVosh : 08-22-2008 at 12:41 AM.
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Old 08-22-2008, 08:19 AM   Top  -  End  -  #14
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Default Re: Haberdash the Masked: The 3.5 Kitchen Sink

Quote:
Originally Posted by Occasional Sage View Post
A small thing: isn't OA 3.0, not 3.5? That's my recollection, which makes Iaijutsu non-compatible.
OA was "updated" in one of the Dragon magazines. (Which is to say, they didn't really fix or change anything). Most 3.0 material is still compatible with 3.x, unless it's been updated by a new sourcebook. It boils down to a judgement call by the DM, but then, so does everything else in the game.

What this build really needs is Drunken Master: absolutely anything you could pick up becomes a weapon, and no improvised or non-proficient penalty. Unfortunately you pretty much have to suffer through two levels of monk to get it.

Add Bloodstorm Blade on top of that, though, and not only does everything in the room suddenly become a weapon, but it becomes a throwing and returning weapon that you can make ranged melee attacks with (here, let me Power Attack with this couch and dinette set).

Weapons you might want to add:

Collapsing Crescent Fan (Sandstorm, p. 96): +4 to attack any flat-footed foe. Combine with Blurstrike or Confound the Big Folk and Alter Self/Reduce Person to render most foes flat-footed. Not quite as effective as Iajutsu Focus + gnome quickrazor, though.

Orc Shotput (Sword & Fist, p. 71): One of the best thrown weapons in the game: 2d6 damage, 19-20 crit, x3 multiplier. Add some Master Thrower for extra fun.

Razor Net (Dragon Compendium, p. 115): all the hassle of a regular net, and it does 1d6 damage.

Oh, and can't forget the infamous Braid Blade (Dungeon 120): 1d3, 18-20, x2. On a full attack, allows you to make an extra attack at -5, or -2 if you have 5 ranks of Tumble. There's also nothing in the description that explicitly forbids multiple Braid Blades (beyond common sense, that is).

Last edited by Darrin : 08-22-2008 at 08:44 AM.
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Old 08-22-2008, 10:02 AM   Top  -  End  -  #15
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Default Re: Haberdash the Masked: The 3.5 Kitchen Sink

RE: Iajutsu Focus being 3.0:
Yes, it is 3.0. When 3.5 came out, WotC made a big deal about saying repeatedly that everything in 3.0 will be updated, and that if its not updated, it could be included in 3.5 games anyway. Oriental Adventures was updated in 2006. Iajutsu Focus wasn't touched. Thus its safe to assume it can be used. As a side note, 1 out of my 3 regular-ish DMs uses 3.0, and I've seen it used at conventions as well as recently as last year. So there are definitely some DMs who use it. But I completely accept that most DMs won't allow it, which is why Haberdash has other options.

RE: Factotum = Overpowered
The thing about this build, and any build really, is that its only overpowered if you abuse it. If other people in your party don't use full casters, then don't use Alter Self and Polymorph. If they don't use Leap Attack, then don't use Iajutsu Focus or the debuff and kill combo. If they don't use attack of opportunity builds, then don't use a Familiar or Hustle. You can have a great time with this build using nothing but Skills and funny weapons. Even the Druid can be played in a very weak fashion - just Wildshape into a rabbit and memorize utility spells. 3.5 is about options. If you want balance, play 4th ed.

Stupendous_Man: What book is Improvisation from? I haven't seen it.

Chronos: Thanks for the heads up on the Exemplar and the Tricksters.

Thurbane: Thanks for the info on the greathammer. However, I have to confess that I know nothing about Tome of Magic or Vestiges. I'd be happy to consider them for this build if you could explain them.

Darrin: Thanks a ton for the additions. The only thing I disagree with is Drunken Master - drinking reduces your Int, which screws your Factotum abilities. And the improvised weapons will be a lot less useful then the exotic weapons you can already use. It would be hilarious to play though.
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Old 08-22-2008, 10:21 AM   Top  -  End  -  #16
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Default Re: Haberdash the Masked: The 3.5 Kitchen Sink

Improvisation was first in complete adventurer, level 5 bard spell. Now it's level 1 bard spell, as of Spell Compendium printing. To cast it, you need bard or chameleon, most likely.
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Old 08-22-2008, 01:17 PM   Top  -  End  -  #17
Chronos
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Default Re: Haberdash the Masked: The 3.5 Kitchen Sink

Quote:
Thurbane: Thanks for the info on the greathammer. However, I have to confess that I know nothing about Tome of Magic or Vestiges. I'd be happy to consider them for this build if you could explain them.
Short version: A binder gets special abilities from entities called vestiges, which are sort of on the edge between existing and not-existing. Each day, a binder makes a pact to bind a vestige, and can choose a different one each day. You're guaranteed to bind a vestige, but have a chance based on level, Charisma, and the difficulty of the vestige that you'll make a bad pact, which means that the vestige causes you to act in particular ways (becoming overly talkative, refusing spells from clerics of particular deities, etc.). Each vestige comes with a package of abilities: While you have a particular vestige bound, you can use the abilities that come with it. Most vestige abilities are either continuous, or can each be used once ever 5 rounds. At higher levels, you gain access to more powerful vestiges, and can have more vestiges bound at once (eventually up to 4).

There's a feat called Bind Vestige that lets characters of other classes get in on the action. By itself, the feat lets you bind a single vestige (chosen when you make the binding, and so can be different every day) as if you were a 1st-level binder (so you only get access to the weakest vestiges), and get a single pre-determined ability from that vestige (there's a table that tells you which ability each vestige grants). A second feat called Improved Bind Vestige lets you count as a fifth-level binder (so you can get slightly more powerful vestiges), and another feat called Practiced Binding lets you get two powers from a vestige, not just one (again, they're predetermined and listed on a table).

Long story short, taking the feat Bind Vestige can give you a variety of abilities, of which you choose one every day.
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Old 08-22-2008, 03:39 PM   Top  -  End  -  #18
Darrin
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Default Re: Haberdash the Masked: The 3.5 Kitchen Sink

Quote:
Originally Posted by Person_Man View Post
The only thing I disagree with is Drunken Master - drinking reduces your Int, which screws your Factotum abilities. And the improvised weapons will be a lot less useful then the exotic weapons you can already use. It would be hilarious to play though.
Then be the designated driver... I wasn't even thinking about the drinking. Never been a big fan of abilities that muck around with your Con score. I was only thinking of using the improvised weapons. But yeah, the damage is a bit sub-par. Although the worst part of Drunken Master has got to be taking at least two levels of monk.

It'd be worth it to smack around a BBEG with his own scenery. What, never killed a man with his own shoe before? Death by bedpan? Hmm... I wonder, what's the funniest equipment/item you could kill someone with? Rod of Resurrection, maybe?

I'm still liking the Drunken Master/Bloodstorm Blade thing... I'll have to see if I can put together a build that works, and spring it on my players as a throw-away bad guy.
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Old 08-22-2008, 03:47 PM   Top  -  End  -  #19
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Default Re: Haberdash the Masked: The 3.5 Kitchen Sink

Quote:
Originally Posted by Darrin View Post
I'm still liking the Drunken Master/Bloodstorm Blade thing... I'll have to see if I can put together a build that works, and spring it on my players as a throw-away bad guy.
That is a fairly popular trend among chicken-infested commoner builds, actually. Grab some bard levels, draconic inspiration, and you are chucking flaming/exploding chickens at high speeds.
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Old 08-22-2008, 04:23 PM   Top  -  End  -  #20
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Default Re: Haberdash the Masked: The 3.5 Kitchen Sink

I'm thinking this build could use a few levels of Chameleon. Not necessarily because it's needed, but stylistically it certainly fits in well.
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Old 08-22-2008, 06:00 PM   Top  -  End  -  #21
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Default Re: Haberdash the Masked: The 3.5 Kitchen Sink

All this talk of everything-is-projectile gives me an idea...

Alternate Character Concept: The butler. High bluff, sense motive, diplomacy, and in combat he wields a tea set.
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Old 08-22-2008, 08:03 PM   Top  -  End  -  #22
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Default Re: Haberdash the Masked: The 3.5 Kitchen Sink

Quote:
Originally Posted by Person_Man View Post
Thurbane: Thanks for the info on the greathammer. However, I have to confess that I know nothing about Tome of Magic or Vestiges. I'd be happy to consider them for this build if you could explain them.
Now I have my books in front of me:

Greathammer 1d12 19-20/x4 30lb. bludgeoning
+2 bonus on sundering a weapon or shield

As for the vestige feats:

Bind Vestige allows you to bind a low level vestige and gain a single power while you have it bound. These include: Darkvision, Ruinous attack, Hide bonus, Naberius's skills and Feather fall.

Improved Bind Vestige allows you to bind higher level vestiges which grant the following powers: Sense trickery, Mad soul, Aura of sadness, Immunity to transformation, Karsus's senses, Poison use, Paimon's skills and Call armor.

Practiced Binder allows you to get a second power from the vestige you have bound. These include: Ram attack, See the unseen, Resistance to fire, Natural armor, Water breathing, Weapon proficiency, Heavy magic, Bird's eye viewing, Silver tongue, uncanny dodge, Sprint and Savnok's armor.

For more info on binders and vestiges, check out the Consolidated Binder Handbook.
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Old 08-22-2008, 08:48 PM   Top  -  End  -  #23
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Default Re: Haberdash the Masked: The 3.5 Kitchen Sink

Quote:
Originally Posted by lordhenry4000 View Post
I'm thinking this build could use a few levels of Chameleon. Not necessarily because it's needed, but stylistically it certainly fits in well.
I was going to say that, but Chameleon doesn't really offer anything that this guy can't already do.
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Old 08-22-2008, 09:06 PM   Top  -  End  -  #24
Thurbane
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Default Re: Haberdash the Masked: The 3.5 Kitchen Sink

Just a question: would the Factotum qualify for the Obtain Familiar feat?

Arcane Dilettante gives spell-like abilities, would it qualify as arcane caster levels?
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Old 08-22-2008, 09:31 PM   Top  -  End  -  #25
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Default Re: Haberdash the Masked: The 3.5 Kitchen Sink

Factotum has an arcane caster level, so yes, he can (and should) get a familiar.

A thought: How about pulling that gladiator mask trick with wizard or monk as the base class? That way, you could have a character who's proficient in all martial and exotic weapons, but not simple ones.
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Old 08-22-2008, 09:36 PM   Top  -  End  -  #26
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Default Re: Haberdash the Masked: The 3.5 Kitchen Sink

Quote:
Originally Posted by Darrin View Post
I'm still liking the Drunken Master/Bloodstorm Blade thing... I'll have to see if I can put together a build that works, and spring it on my players as a throw-away bad guy.
If you come up with that build, please post it here. It sounds like its made of awesome.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Thurbane View Post
Just a question: would the Factotum qualify for the Obtain Familiar feat?

Arcane Dilettante gives spell-like abilities, would it qualify as arcane caster levels?
Obtain Familiar requires "Arcane Caster Level 3rd." Arcane Dilettante gives you an arcane caster level, just as Warlocks have an arcane caster level and can use certain PrC that require an arcane caster level, and not "the ability to cast Xth level spells." Arcane Dilettante also specifically allows you to apply metamagic feats to it.

But I'll admit that its in a questionable realm, and hopefully Lord Silvanos will read this thread and tell me all of the incorrect rules in my build. My DM has allowed a Factotum to use a familiar (they get much less out of it then any other arcane caster) but your mileage may vary.

If your DM disallows the familiar but you really want one as part of your build, you could always go with a Whatever 5/Master of Masks 1/Chameleon X - giving up Iajutsu Focus and Cunning Surge for better spells, and whatever else you could swing from your first five levels.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Thurbane View Post
As for the vestige feats...

For more info on binders and vestiges, check out the Consolidated Binder Handbook.
Thanks for the info. I'll definitely look into it and try to add to the main post once I understand what might be useful.

You could always go Factotum 8/Master of Masks 1/ToB class X/ToM class Y, and have maneuvers, stances, and vestiges mixed in with Alter Self and your Skill Trick and Exotic Weapon craziness. Lots of possibilities.

Again, thanks to everyone for ideas. Please keep them coming.

Last edited by Person_Man : 08-22-2008 at 09:39 PM.
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Old 10-13-2008, 04:04 AM   Top  -  End  -  #27
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Default Re: Haberdash the Masked: The 3.5 Kitchen Sink

As long as you're throwing in everything and the kitchen sink, you should include Incarnum effects to your arsenal. Mechanically it's rather similar to the description you've already been given of binding; it's a class ability that grants you a set of abilities usable at-will or at intervals throughout the day. You gain acces to multiple skill/ability sets as you go up in levels. The abilities are all over the place in function, from attacks to skills to mimicing the powers of some magic items. And, like binding, if you just invest a feat or two in Incarnum use, then you get a limited pick from some pretty random choices.
Of course by now in the build, Haberdash has got to be very feat-starved. What is the best way to get extra bonus feat(s)?
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Old 10-13-2008, 04:40 AM   Top  -  End  -  #28
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Default Re: Haberdash the Masked: The 3.5 Kitchen Sink

Flaws.

Cutting really close to thread necromancy. Why were you like 10 pages in?

He doesn't really have levels to spare.
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Old 10-13-2008, 11:44 AM   Top  -  End  -  #29
Chronos
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Default Re: Haberdash the Masked: The 3.5 Kitchen Sink

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Of course by now in the build, Haberdash has got to be very feat-starved. What is the best way to get extra bonus feat(s)?
The absolute best way to pick up soulmelds, if your DM will allow it (and I won't blame him if he doesn't) is through Chameleon. Pick up Shape Soulmeld with your changeable feat, and shape a soulmeld. Soulmelds stay shaped indefinitely, until you deliberately unshape them (or until someone else forces them to unshape, but that's not too common), so you keep the soulmeld even after you've changed your bonus feat the next day. Repeat until you have a soulmeld shaped on every body slot.

As a further thought, since we're dipping Master of Masks anyway, are there any other masks that would be good to have?
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Old 10-13-2008, 12:31 PM   Top  -  End  -  #30
Flashlight
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Default Re: Haberdash the Masked: The 3.5 Kitchen Sink

The archmage mask adds +2 to your arcane caster level. Nice for buffing.
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