Quote Originally Posted by Soras Teva Gee View Post
I'd argue that putting aside setting as much as possible that the archetypal wizard will loose to the standard Jedi. Because Jedi are going to be broadly speaking faster to act and bring all that to bear.

Now high level wizards (of some settings) reverse that trend and magic users still broadly go up higher on the usefully applied power scale then Jedi do, but they aren't in my mind typical.



As far as playing TK tug o' war yes this is true as most TK can only move so much mass and regardless of how one exerts force one an opposite force will balance it out or exceed it. That's exactly the sort of practical end I'm talking about.

Talking about say a shield or other protection though the manner of TK becomes relevant. Because its not "TK vs TK" anymore its "TK vs Defense" which is a major conceptual difference. The practical endpoint approach is about minimizing interaction to as much as possible, which still demands interaction where nessecary.

To make a different example should a Jedi be able to use Force powers on a 3.5 Golem?

My answer would be "Yes" because its meant to be an immunity to magic, which the Force can be separated from. A Jedi couldn't use mental abilities though since a Golem doesn't broadly speaking have a mind to effect, the effect doesn't match up. Force Push though, not a problem.

The thing is that the force was never really just TK

In the original trillogy it was described and used as if you are using the force to connect to what it is that you want to affect and that you are using your connection to affect that thing in some way. You're not lifting it with tk so much as making the object lift itself up.

Manipulating something in the force is exerting your will on it to do something other than what it is doing, via mind manipulation, or other such things.