Base Class Challenge Chat Thread II

[God Imperror]

Rest taken and challenge accepted sir!

Obviously as I've gone over a number of aspects of your class before this will be a little bit more brief, or at least I think it will.

anyway I'll shut up, because its PEACHIN' TIME!!

The Anointed Heritor

It sounds like a feminine hygiene product sold by the Vatican, but let’s find out...

I actually struggled for the name, at first I considered anointed knight, but a knight without full bab? And since this class is slightly compensated by medium bab I switched the name.

Title Image and initial fluff...

... well yer actually that does look like the kinda thing the Vatican would put on such a product were they selling them.

Anyway, enough of my tomfoolery, lets move on because everything here looks dandy to me!


Pre game rule information stuff...

I really like the flavour you have built up for this, it’s filled out much better than when I first looked over it all and as such has really helped elevate the class beyond a simple numbers experiment (which many other classes become).

I would like to see alternate explanations for their powers explored within the “Adaptation” section however. This is just personal preference though as I always think this is one of the more interesting elements when analysis these fluff entries. Not all campaign worlds are the same and thus it’s nice to show that you creation can be melded to fit a new theme and form if needed.

I promise to work a bit more on adaptation

Game rule information...


Just as solid as its always been :)

Surprisingly they lost sense motive in this last iteration as it fitted truthseeker pretty well.

Class Table...


More of the same, all looks good here.

I still lack a good capstone ability at the moment I am contemplating having you build your own hero. And giving you a bonus if you choose to channel said hero (that hero would be yourself)

Class features...

Weapon and Armor Proficiencies:

Brief and to the point i guess... maybe worth writing it in the more traditional style. Just a nit pick though.

Yep, forgot to change that from when I started to work on it.

Patron Hero (Ex):

It was good before and still just as good now. I'll take a look at the Ancestral Heroes a bit further down, which will give a better idea of how things look.

It now has an associated save too which makes the class more customizable, though you always get will save. And even if reflex is normally inferior to fortitude it fits a different archetype.

Anointed Guidance (Ex):

So at 17th level when do i pick the skills which i gain my bonus on? is it a one time choice? or each time i replenish my guidance points? or freeform?

I also asume from the wording that you cant choose Listen, Search or Spot and thus cant use the ability to take 10 on those?

You can choose listen, search and spot (if you want) and I am probably going to make it a one time choice, I feel that if I allow people to change it whenever they use ancestral tactics it might be too OTT.

As a side note I also reduced (halved) the guidance points at high levels.

Anointment (Ex or Su):

Wow this class really is a big read...

these abilities all seem pretty good to me to be honest. They certainly add a lot of flexability and customisation to your hero.

I guess my only gripe at this time would be the lack of flavour text for each ability. It might be nice to have a single line just to explain the fluff behind the boon a bit better.

They are going to get flavor text, some might disappear (probably anointed intervention and anointed hero) since they might be a bit over powered and there are certainly enough abilities.

Ancestral Channeling (Su):

Much as i remebmer it, still looking good.

Just clarified that it was once a day and increased the time required, to make it clearly an out of combat thing.

Offerings (Su):

As above, still looking good.

It would be nice if you gave a little more insight into the fluff of your abilities though.

Burning some incense while you start channeling the heroes?

Ancestral Skills (Ex):

The flexability this actually offers makes it rather powerful. Not OTT but powerful.

I try to convince myself that the limits on the class skill list and the fact that the anointed heritors are probably going to need knowledge (history) and whatever hero they are channeling lessens the actual skills available but it is of course strong (I am considering adding a clause to limit this to the class skills gained from your levels in anointed heritors specifically)

Boons (Su):
Stacked with everything else your class is getting over time some of these things are begining to make your class very powerful.

No single ability is broken or OTT but combined together they are very potent indeed. I see this class as a very high Tier 3 at the moment, which if totally fine but i thought you should know my thoughts.

I might try to tone it down a little once I feel that the class is finished, I have to say though that I don't fear having a hight tier 3 and later nerf it a little once we get some playtesting done with it.

Anointed recovery (Su):
Much needed and kicks in at about the right point.

Really glad that you like the point it kicks in I moved it along the class.

Ancestral feat (Ex):
"The ancestral heroes are known for their heroic deeds, you cannot choose a feat with the following descriptors [divine], [item creation], [metamagic], [metapsionic], [psionic item creation feats] or [wild]."[/I] is not really the best flow of fluff into crunch i've seen.

Still the feature itself is pretty good, no complaints from me!

Yep, the fluff on that sucks, I have to improve it.

Ancestral tactics (Su):
If you get this at 9th why is it all the way down here?

Also where is your capstone? is this supposed to be it? I mean its not bad but I was kinda expecting something with more balls to be honest.

I need to work on a cool capstone not been inspired lately

Ancestral Heroes

Ok i'm gunna blast through these pretty quick...

Its great to have all this sorted up front. Good job!

right on to the Ancestral Heroes themselves...

Yep that helped to build the abilities.

Nightthirster: very themeatic plus who does not like a bit of sneak attacking!

Stormcloak: Lightning is always fun and its got some ok abilities. Not super powerful, but i like it.

Dancing Fire: I really like this one, its quite potent as well. Inspire courage is a really nice touch.

Windrider: I always like looking at mounted combat stuff even though i never really get the chance to explore it in game as much as i would like. Its not overly powerful as far as I can tell, but i like it none the less.

Moonwolf: Becoming a kind of werewolf is awesome. I like the way this develops.

Swordmaster: Martial lore as a skill is a nice touch. I love playing "the greatest swordsman who ever lived" role and while this is far away from that kind of power level it does carry the flavor.

Laughing fool: Why the Kukri as its weapon? I would hve though maybe something a bit more trixy like net or whip?

I didn't really know what weapon to give the laughing fool I almost picked the cutlass from stormwrack for a more pirate feeling arrh.

Battlelord: Spell cutter is a cool ability, i like the image of using an attack roll more than using a weapon drill check, but i see why you made that call.

Skill checks are OP but it is a small memento to the broken bardblade.

Godspeaker: I love the image of a bad ass priest with a war hammer. Forbidden knowledge is a nice idea as well Omen of Peril is a cool thing for a class like this to have access to and it works quite well.

Glad you like, I am quite fond of this one it is in fact one anointed heritor that became a hero so it will tie to the capstone (once it gets one).

Swifttalon: Dont know why but i really expected this one to offer you a movement speed boost. none the less its a solid choice, not one of my favs though.

It is a scout role though I just realized that it lacks fluff

Wrath: ...and here is the movement boost. You get to fill that barbarian role if you so wish. Its nice and theme filled, probably not the choice I would make but good none the less.

Yep that's the barbarian.

Truthseeker: Its got that paladin feel, which i asume was the point. Sadly i'm not really that fond of paladins so its not really for me, none the less its a solid choice.

The paladin is a really embedded archetype at least on stories so it seemed necessary to have it filled.

As a sidenote the six other anointed heroes that I want to build are:
-A "dragon" breathing fire, having scaly hide, and something related with gold/greed/hoards
-A "mage" archetype a savy hero opposed slightly to the power of Godspeaker probably using some low level spell like or psi like abilities.
-A "crafter" while probably have some abilities that replicate crafting or create stuff.
-A "tankie" character the hit me kind of guy. A mix of knight and crusaders typical abilities.
-A "poisoner" there is not a love for poisons in D&D and having an ancestral hero capable of pulling it off might fit a niche.
-A "flier" no hero seems to give good mobility (other than mounted) and it can be a good role to fit.

This will up the heroes to 18, that way the anointed heritor is not taking 9 of their available heroes and this combined with the several number of anointments will probably give a lot of options to the prospective anointed heritor.

Summary

Wow, that was one hell of a class to work though.

I will be honest, I really like it and mechanically it hits all the right notes. I cant really point at to many issues beyond a few nitpicks mentioned above.

I guess my biggest single issue would be the lack of flavour on some of the features. You sometimes just kind of give a title for an ability and then state some crunch... obviously this is fine, but I quite enjoy a little bit of fluff to get me in the mood... think of it as class feature foreplay.

Anyway, I think you should be very prouf of what your making here. Its solid and powerful enough to stand shoulder to shoulder with all the cool kids without being broken.

All in all, a strong candidate for winning this entire contest if you flesh out the flavour text.

I wouldn't be able of doing these without everyone's help, PEACHes and other homebrews have been really helpful.

PS. Who want's to see a multiclass feat between this and the Champion?