Changing the "Caster beats Mundane" paradigm

[Cazero]

Which implies that the limits of bone and muscle and sinew and metabolism are different in that world. Follow through in worldbuilding, or shrug and accept that the world is internally incoherent and inconsistent.




Unless it's not -- a fictional world where that's within the range of normal human capacity is conceivable. The question is, if that is possible, how else does that change the fictional world?




Choices:
1) "Non-magical" beast is magical (in the broad sense) and tapping into the same forces that spellcasters tap into.
2) "Non-magical" beast is non-magical.

a) The "laws' of that fictional reality are different such that they allow for this -- follow through in worldbuilding.
b) "They just can do it", there's nothing deeper that actually explains it, and the fictional setting is incoherent.

Dragons are magic.

Mad wizards are magic.

People who can leap over cities or punch mountains down are magic -- or if they're not, you've said something about your fictional world that you need to follow through with, unless you just want "rule of kewl" nonsense.




Nope -- I'm saying you can't have your cake and eat it too. It's not the limits that break verisimilitude, it's the contradictions and incoherences. If human limits with no magic are x in our world, and 10x in the fictional world, then you've said something about your fictional world, or you've accepted that your world just makes no sense and you're fine with that.

Note that I've never said "human limits must be real-world realistic in YOUR setting to maintain verisimilitude". I've said "If you change the limits, and don't want to sacrifice verisimilitude, here are your possible solutions".




First, you're assuming a level-based game. This isn't just about D&D-like games.

Second, this isn't about what I want, it's about laying out the inherent contradiction and the mutually exclusive nature of all these things people seem to want.

Let's go with "metabolisms work differently" because we already need it for flying megafauna such as dragons, and no, dragons aren't magical as far as their physical capabilities are concerned.

You are asserting that this change (removing limits as we know them in the real world) will create contradictions and incoherences. To wich I answer that fantasy society at large won't be changed by that one superstrong human just existing, pretty much like I can't decide to get fit and break a world record or five.
Even ignoring natural talent (wich applies to physical traits as much as magical ones and can definitely disqualify most people from topping the charts from the get go), going beyond the norm takes time and effort. Going far beyond the norm require more time and more effort. There are many reasons why the vast majority of people aren't able to pull it off. Those who do pull it off are called "adventurers" and wether their exceptional power come from magic or training is pretty much irrelevant to the world at large. Considering the difference between trained and untrained is already huge in the real world, I conclude that the world-shattering consequences you expect simply won't happen.


There are effectively no difference between "Fighter pulling magic power from chi" and "Fighter who's just that strong" except for the core concept. In both cases, only a very few individual have the combination of natural talent, dedication and training to be truly beyond the norm. My beef is that core concept is a dealbreaker and you appear to be breaking the "just that strong" deal for no reason.



And that entire argument is beside the point anyway. When trying to reverse a "Magic vs Non-magic" paradigm, removing the non-magic side from existence doesn't really answer the question asked.