Quote Originally Posted by Sir Giacomo View Post
Well, Solo, I must admit I hardly ever saw such a strange way of admitting that you were proven wrong. "Even if you win, you still fail" - just wow.
yes, using massive amounts of resources to squeak past a low powered class can generally be considered failing.

Where's my apology?

What kind of resources does the monk sacrifice?
Skill points into UMD, money into UMD, feats into UMD....

"unoptimized fighter" ? Yes, because he used the full 4 weapon spc feats to increase his melee damage.
I have always heard that weapon specialization feats were a waste of time.

And of course even a 2 skill pt/lvl monk could raise UMD ,take the two relevant feats at higher levels to get +5, and do quite well with his wbl.
And how does this monk of yours scout and fulfil the other roles you said a monk was good at?

[quote[The above levl 15 monk used up around 25% of his wbl to do that great damage output and 1 buff round. Yes, that's truly "a lot of time and resources".[/quote]
And the fighter only has a +4 weapon.

And, btw, looking at the current level 15 joker monk build, you'll see that his damage output is not that far behind that of the level 15 half-orc STR-focused monk build.
Neither is the fighter.

Good job, after all your work, you are about at good as a run of the mill fighter.

And where's my apology?