Nethack/Slash'em

[zarakstan]

I play both semi-regularly! So discuss!

I like SLASH'EM and am working on my own version "SLASH'ADDER"!

[RS14]

I haven't played either in a while. I most recently played SporkHack, which I'm trying to remain unspoiled with respect to.

[zarakstan]

I haven't played either in a while. I most recently played SporkHack, which I'm trying to remain unspoiled with respect to.

Sporkhack is cool I looked at a changes list for it and it has some good stuff!

[RS14]

What are you changing for SLASH'ADDER?

[zarakstan]

I'm going to compile most of the special level branches like the Lost Tomb and the Sunless Sea into the main dungeon, I'm adding a couple new big branches the biggest one being an underground forest full of drow, making new monsters and items as well as changing existing ones etc. etc. for a tutorial on making changes in the nethack source code go here: http://members.shaw.ca/rob.ellwood/sources.txt

[Darwin]

I started playing Nethack for windows (with tiles, yeah I'm a wuss, now scram ). I've made it to Dlevel 22 at my best attempt, where I suffered a horrible death due to quaffing a potion I had mis-identified, turnned out it was paralysis

I've enjoyed the game so far, and I hope I'll pull of an ascencion before I grow tired of it.

[zarakstan]

Yeah I don't use tiles or colors I hope you ascend soon! I've ascended twice once as a tourist I can give you a tip about identifying potions if you want.

[pendell]

I have ascended every class and race combo in Vanilla. Don't play it very much anymore, because I'm just too busy with other things.

The way I identify potions is to simply wield them as weapons and bash goblins over the head with 'em, then take notes. If it doesn't have any obvious effect such as healing or
sickness or screaming in pain or suddenly polymorphing into a blue jelly, I'll go ahead and drink it -- provided I'm reasonably sure it's uncursed.

This is not wholly without risk. A potion of polymorph could conceivably change a goblin into a lich or a black dragon (which breathes disintegration beams in nethack).

However, the odds of finding a potion of polymorph are very slim indeed. Once found, the odds that it will convert the creature into something I can't fight or run away from are even slimmer. I'll accept the risk of a potentially fatal polymorph because IMO I used to lose far more characters who were carrying around unidentified healing potions.

Spoiler

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sticking a unicorn horn into a potion will convert potion of sickness to fruit juice, and blindness/confusion/hallucination to water. So having a unicorn horn allows you to identify
a number of harmful potions, potion of sickness , and potion of fruit juice.

IMO, identifying objects is the single toughest challenge in NH.

Respectfully,

Brian P.

[zarakstan]

I have ascended every class and race combo in Vanilla. Don't play it very much anymore, because I'm just too busy with other things.

The way I identify potions is to simply wield them as weapons and bash goblins over the head with 'em, then take notes. If it doesn't have any obvious effect such as healing or
sickness or screaming in pain or suddenly polymorphing into a blue jelly, I'll go ahead and drink it -- provided I'm reasonably sure it's uncursed.

This is not wholly without risk. A potion of polymorph could conceivably change a goblin into a lich or a black dragon (which breathes disintegration beams in nethack).

However, the odds of finding a potion of polymorph are very slim indeed. Once found, the odds that it will convert the creature into something I can't fight or run away from are even slimmer. I'll accept the risk of a potentially fatal polymorph because IMO I used to lose far more characters who were carrying around unidentified healing potions.

Spoiler

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sticking a unicorn horn into a potion will convert potion of sickness to fruit juice, and blindness/confusion/hallucination to water. So having a unicorn horn allows you to identify
a number of harmful potions, potion of sickness , and potion of fruit juice.

IMO, identifying objects is the single toughest challenge in NH.

Respectfully,

Brian P.

What you said in your spoiler is the method I'm referring to it allows you to safely quaff any potions

[pendell]

What you said in your spoiler is the method I'm referring to it allows you to safely quaff any potions

It doesn't work for all potions.

Spoiler

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The unicorn horn does absolutely nothing to the polymorph potion. Instantly busting
out of your armor as you turn into a hill giant has it's disadvantages. So does turning into a killer bee and being completely overburdened by a pile of equipment you can't carry in this form. So does turning into a quantum mechanic and causing anything you hit to teleport ...

Of course, there is a fairly easy solution to the problem of being trapped in a polymorphed form, but it won't replace your shattered armor, and if you were unfortunate enough to encounter a stream of soldier ants before you were able to undo the effects, it probably
won't save your life.

IIRC, it also doesn't work on acid potions either. Acid causes temporary HP damage only, so it's fairly easy to recover, but if you're low on HP or under attack you may *need* those hit points.

Respectfully,

Brian P.

[zarakstan]

It doesn't work for all potions.

Spoiler

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The unicorn horn does absolutely nothing to the polymorph potion. Instantly busting
out of your armor as you turn into a hill giant has it's disadvantages. So does turning into a killer bee and being completely overburdened by a pile of equipment you can't carry in this form. So does turning into a quantum mechanic and causing anything you hit to teleport ...

Of course, there is a fairly easy solution to the problem of being trapped in a polymorphed form, but it won't replace your shattered armor, and if you were unfortunate enough to encounter a stream of soldier ants before you were able to undo the effects, it probably
won't save your life.

IIRC, it also doesn't work on acid potions either. Acid causes temporary HP damage only, so it's fairly easy to recover, but if you're low on HP or under attack you may *need* those hit points.

Respectfully,

Brian P.

Indeed, I always dip an arrow or a dart into a potion first, if it polymorphs I've identified to potion if it doesn't I use the method we've been discussing.

[RS14]

Spoiler

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It notably doesn't find paralysis or sleep, so it's best if you lock yourself in a closet or temple or stay with your pet while sampling potions. I also choose to dip a piece of junk in potions first, so that when I inevitably find a potion of polymorph, it doesn't affect my only unicorn horn.

Ninja'd.

[Zeful]

The furthest I've managed to get was Dlevel 13 before I started running out of food and had to climb back up.

I've tried to get the color mod so I can better manage my inventory, but the wiki's directions make no sense/I can't get the programs to run.

[pendell]

The furthest I've managed to get was Dlevel 13 before I started running out of food and had to climb back up.

Food can be solved by

Spoiler

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The #pray command.

If you
A) Are in good graces with your god
B) Have food status 'weak' or worse
C) Have no other critical troubles.
D) Has been at least 800 turns since the last time you used the #pray command.

Using 'pray' will fill your stomach right up.

Of course, you will get hungry again before 800 turns is up, so you'd better be looking for
some way to supplement your diet.

If you pray before 800 turns is up, your god will be angry and you will not be fed. Further, once a god is angry, that anger must be appeased or they will never give you anything again.

Another thought, non-spoilery: I've found that it's better to go *down* rather than up to get more food. Reason: Monsters are bigger, the further down you go, ergo make bigger meals. I can't survive on level 1 or 2 when all I can find to eat are jackals. But killing just one mumak or dragon on the lower levels will keep me fed for a VERY long time.

Spoiler

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And don't forget the Ring of Slow Digestion.

Respectfully,

Brian P.

[zarakstan]

Food can be solved by

Spoiler

Show

The #pray command.

If you
A) Are in good graces with your god
B) Have food status 'weak' or worse
C) Have no other critical troubles.
D) Has been at least 800 turns since the last time you used the #pray command.

Using 'pray' will fill your stomach right up.

Of course, you will get hungry again before 800 turns is up, so you'd better be looking for
some way to supplement your diet.

If you pray before 800 turns is up, your god will be angry and you will not be fed. Further, once a god is angry, that anger must be appeased or they will never give you anything again.

Another thought, non-spoilery: I've found that it's better to go *down* rather than up to get more food. Reason: Monsters are bigger, the further down you go, ergo make bigger meals. I can't survive on level 1 or 2 when all I can find to eat are jackals. But killing just one mumak or dragon on the lower levels will keep me fed for a VERY long time.

Spoiler

Show

And don't forget the Ring of Slow Digestion.

Respectfully,

Brian P.

Quoted for Truth

[Zeful]

Food can be solved by

Spoiler

Show

The #pray command.

If you
A) Are in good graces with your god
B) Have food status 'weak' or worse
C) Have no other critical troubles.
D) Has been at least 800 turns since the last time you used the #pray command.

Using 'pray' will fill your stomach right up.

Of course, you will get hungry again before 800 turns is up, so you'd better be looking for
some way to supplement your diet.

If you pray before 800 turns is up, your god will be angry and you will not be fed. Further, once a god is angry, that anger must be appeased or they will never give you anything again.

Another thought, non-spoilery: I've found that it's better to go *down* rather than up to get more food. Reason: Monsters are bigger, the further down you go, ergo make bigger meals. I can't survive on level 1 or 2 when all I can find to eat are jackals. But killing just one mumak or dragon on the lower levels will keep me fed for a VERY long time.

Spoiler

Show

And don't forget the Ring of Slow Digestion.

Respectfully,

Brian P.

Except the reason I was going up was to get back to my stash by sokoban so I could get more of the food I had stored up. The enemies weren't dropping edible corpses (no poison resistance for me in that game) or food.

[Nano]

I just downloaded this yesterday, actually! Now I'm running around as a level 5 monk with a cloak of invisibility. For a brief period I was blind and hallucinating, and I found a magic trap that would spawn monsters if I stepped on it - I used that to go from level 2 to 4, I think. It's kind of fun.

Edit: Welp, she died. Went up against a bunch of water demons, then died to a fire ant. Turns out I was wearing a ring of free action, a ring of invisibility, and had a ring of 'Aggravate Monster.' Good thing I couldn't figure out how to take off my jewelry.

Final list of attributes:

You were devoutly aligned.
You were sleep resistant.
You were poison resistant.
You saw invisible.
You were telepathic.
You were warned.
You were invisible to others.
You were stealthy.
You were protected.
You were fast.
You had free action.
YOU ARE DEAD. Woah.

[zarakstan]

I just downloaded this yesterday, actually! Now I'm running around as a level 5 monk with a cloak of invisibility. For a brief period I was blind and hallucinating, and I found a magic trap that would spawn monsters if I stepped on it - I used that to go from level 2 to 4, I think. It's kind of fun.

Edit: Welp, she died. Went up against a bunch of water demons, then died to a fire ant. Turns out I was wearing a ring of free action, a ring of invisibility, and had a ring of 'Aggravate Monster.' Good thing I couldn't figure out how to take off my jewelry.

Final list of attributes:

You were devoutly aligned.
You were sleep resistant.
You were poison resistant.
You saw invisible.
You were telepathic.
You were warned.
You were invisible to others.
You were stealthy.
You were protected.
You were fast.
You had free action.
YOU ARE DEAD. Woah.

Awesome! Nethack is a great game how did the water demons show up were you quaffing from a fountain I don't quaff from fountains . . . too dangerous.

[valadil]

I played a hell of a lot of Angband back in the day. Does that count for anything? One of these days I'll give NH a try.

[SinisterPenguin]

I downloaded Nethack a few weeks ago, and yep, it's a pretty cool game. I'm pretty sure I'm destined to suck at roguelikes forever, though, and Nethack is no different; I think the farthest I've gotten is level 6.

I just downloaded this yesterday, actually! Now I'm running around as a level 5 monk with a cloak of invisibility. For a brief period I was blind and hallucinating, and I found a magic trap that would spawn monsters if I stepped on it - I used that to go from level 2 to 4, I think. It's kind of fun.

Edit: Welp, she died. Went up against a bunch of water demons, then died to a fire ant. Turns out I was wearing a ring of free action, a ring of invisibility, and had a ring of 'Aggravate Monster.' Good thing I couldn't figure out how to take off my jewelry.

Just so you know, use the "R" (for remove) key to take off jewelry.

[Darwin]

Could someone give me a few tips regarding the magic marker? I've been making progress and I'm currently sitting on Dlvl 23 with a bunch of blank scrolls and a magic marker that I want to make use of before I suffer a gruesome death (yet again )

[zarakstan]

Could someone give me a few tips regarding the magic marker? I've been making progress and I'm currently sitting on Dlvl 23 with a bunch of blank scrolls and a magic marker that I want to make use of before I suffer a gruesome death (yet again )

Magic Marker Advice Below: Note I did spoiler it for a reason!

Spoiler

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Okay if you have a magic marker you should identify the Blessed/Cursed/Uncursed Status of both scrolls and markers. Then it depends on the class. If you are a wizard and you don't know charging or you are any other class and know charging I would write a scroll of 'Charging' (don't do this if the scrolls/marker are cursed) then I would write scrolls of genocide (assuming you know them or are a wizard) until it says the marker is too dry to write that then charge the marker. Now the Marker will have a guaranteed 50 charges. I would save these until you get blessed scrolls and or bless the marker. If you have questions about this just ask.

[Darwin]

Magic Marker Advice Below: Note I did spoiler it for a reason!

Spoiler

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Okay if you have a magic marker you should identify the Blessed/Cursed/Uncursed Status of both scrolls and markers. Then it depends on the class. If you are a wizard and you don't know charging or you are any other class and know charging I would write a scroll of 'Charging' (don't do this if the scrolls/marker are cursed) then I would write scrolls of genocide (assuming you know them or are a wizard) until it says the marker is too dry to write that then charge the marker. Now the Marker will have a guaranteed 50 charges. I would save these until you get blessed scrolls and or bless the marker. If you have questions about this just ask.

Which scrolls would I want when the blessed marker has been recharged?

[zarakstan]

Which scrolls would I want when the blessed marker has been recharged?

More genocide and some enchant armor to bring your AC down.

By the end of the game you want at least -30 AC

EDIT: Be careful with enchant armor if you enchant something that is over +3 it will probably evaporate and you'll lose it forever.
EDIT 2: and you want 1 more scroll of charging, but don't use it on the magic marker you'll save it for something (make sure it is blessed)

[Nano]

Heheh, awesome. My new Barbarian just found herself some -2 Boots of Levitation. I'm not sure what the advantages are, but they kick ass. (Only if I have something to brace myself against, though.)

Edit: Wait. Waaaait. I can't take them off. I can't pick things up. I can't dip into fountains. They are not awesome! Boots of levitation are no longer awesome!

[Darwin]

More genocide and some enchant armor to bring your AC down.

By the end of the game you want at least -30 AC

EDIT: Be careful with enchant armor if you enchant something that is over +3 it will probably evaporate and you'll lose it forever.
EDIT 2: and you want 1 more scroll of charging, but don't use it on the magic marker you'll save it for something (make sure it is blessed)

Thanks for the tip

[pendell]

More genocide and some enchant armor to bring your AC down.

Also:
-- blessed scroll of enchant weapon. This allows you to build (say) a stack of blessed rustproof +5 daggers. Say, 12 of them. And with some classes you can throw four of them around.

-- blessed scroll of charging. recharges any wand (including the wand of death) to maximum capacity. It's nice to have a couple 'reloads', especially when facing off with some later creatures.

-- scroll of gold detection. You want a couple of these for the end game.

Spoiler

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When read while confused, it will detect traps and magic portals. In the end game planes, finding the magic portal -- the only exit from the level -- is of critical importance. Scrolls of gold detection allow you to do this quickly. But that's end game.

EDIT: Be careful with enchant armor if you enchant something that is over +3 it will probably evaporate and you'll lose it forever.

I believe that is only about 80% true.

Spoiler

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Weapons can be charged to a maximum of +5 without danger.
Elvish armor has a safe threshold of +5.
All other armor has a safe threshold of +3.

Once enchantment is *above* this threshold, there is a probability that the armor in question will simply evaporate if enchanted further. The probability is proportional to the strength of the enchantment. The higher the enchantment, the higher the chance of evaporation.

So you can safely make +4 armor / +6 elvish. But if you enchant further,
there's a chance (which gets better as magic goes higher) that your uber-awesome armor will just disappear forever. Disappointing.

Respectfully,

Brian P.

[Nano]

This is a problem. I can't go down stairs! All I can do is float around here on the top level, killing things and waiting for my food stores to run out. It's guaranteed death.

Floating is not cool.

[pendell]

This is a problem. I can't go down stairs! All I can do is float around here on the top level, killing things and waiting for my food stores to run out. It's guaranteed death.

Floating is not cool.

Boots of levitation, eh?

Spoiler

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#pray may remove the curse on the boots, allowing you to take them off.
a scroll of remove curse, or a potion of holy water, will allow you to remove the boots.

Allow a nymph to steal the boots. If there is no nymph on the level, quaff at fountains in the hopes of attracting a water nymph.

A wand of cancellation zapped at yourself will remove the curse on your boots. It will also remove all bless/curse of all your items, turn all your potions to water, blank all scrolls, and set the enchantment of all inventory to +0. But it's still better than death.

Quaff at sinks in the hopes of undergoing a 'freakish metamorphosis'. If you're lucky, you'll change into something that can't wear boots, and it will come off. Of course, that leaves you with a whole 'nother set of problems...

If there's one lesson I've learned from this game, it's to Never. Give. Up. Use your imagination. The dev team has thought of a lot of things.

LATER in the game you will find that boots of levitation still have their uses.

Spoiler

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Most traps do not set off if you float over them. And you can't fall through trap doors.

There are some flooded areas of the dungeon. Levitation will allow you to cross open areas of water safely -- as long as a nymph doesn't steal your boots, leaving you to a horrible death of drowning.

Respectfully,

Brian P.

[RS14]

Spoiler

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#pray may remove the curse on the ring, allowing you to take it off.
a scroll of remove curse, or a potion of holy water, will allow you to remove the ring.

Allow a nymph to steal the ring. If there is no nymph on the level, quaff at fountains in the hopes of attracting a water nymph.

Quaff at sinks in the hopes of undergoing a 'freakish metamorphosis'. If you're lucky, you'll change into something that can't wear a ring, and it will come off. Of course, that leaves you with a whole 'nother set of problems...

You'll probably have better luck...

Spoiler

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if you dip it in a fountain. The odds are good that it will be uncursed.

Also, if you float over a sink, you will... sink.

Also:
-- blessed scroll of enchant weapon. This allows you to build (say) a stack of blessed rustproof +5 daggers. Say, 12 of them. And with some classes you can throw four of them around.

My most powerful character ever was a ranger. He stashed nearly 1000 arrows at one point. I enchanted them all to +7, blessed them, rustproofed them, and poisoned them. Then I burned up about half of my stack with enchant weapon and wound up with a few hundred +7 arrows and about 100 +8 arrows. I didn't even bother enchanting Stormbringer, which I used against mundane foes, beyond +3 or so.