[3.5]Improved monster classes: adapting creatures for player use-taking requests!

[Dire Reverend]

So, would anyone be willing to give a monster class to a Slaymate? It is an undead from Libris Mortis. It has 2 CR, and the most important part of it is the Pale Aura.

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Pale Aura (Su):
A slaymate produces an invisible aura in a
10-foot radius around itself. Any creature within the aura that
uses a metamagic feat on a spell from the school of necromancy
can prepare or use the spell as if it took up a spell slot one level
lower than what the metamagic necromancy spell would
normally require.

It also has a poison bite.

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Pale Wasting (Su):
Supernatural disease—
bite, Fortitude DC 14, incubation
period 1 day; damage 1d6 Con and 1d6
Str. The save DC is Charisma-based.

A Slaymate would be great as a Necromancer, or a cohort to a Necromancer.

If anyone would be willing to create such a creature, please do so. I would gladly give you one of my Internets.

[Hyudra]

Was going to write up the Slaymate some time ago, but the issue I see with the creature is that there's so many abuses that come with no(or reduced)-adjustment-metamagic. It makes the class into an ungodly necromancer, or (assuming you leave pale aura to 2nd level and don't give it spellcasting) it nonetheless remains a ridiculously good cohort to necromancers.

Is it ok if I rework the ability somewhat?

[Volthawk]

Oh yeah, I need to do those changes to the lantern archon...

• Need a better picture.
• "proficient with it's light rays." -> you probably mean its.
• I'm guessing that since they don't have hands or bodies, a Lantern Archon probably lacks fine manipulation and the ability to wear gear. I'd specify that.
• Fly speed of 5' per HD? Seriously? Like, they can only move 5' a round at 1st level?
• "they can try to hide it." -> How? How well? Using what skill or stat?
• Re: Lesser Lightbringer & Greater Lightbringer...
  Fun fact! Did you know that the Latin word for Lightbringer is... Lucem Ferre, which has evolved to 'Lucifer'? I might suggest renaming the abilities.
• Under Lesser Lightbringer, you call it a Hound Archon.
• I'd just get rid of the Ruby Dust material component entirely, and let it make permanent continual flame. Hardly game breaking and a little more thematic.
• Under Holy Warding, I'd specify that the magic circle against evil is centered on them.
• "It can also use tongues on herself" -> probably should be 'itself'.
• As tiny size is apparently a huge buff, I'd consider stating that their natural illumination prevents them from getting a bonus to hide, just to help keep the core creature concept together.

It seems to lack oomph. I mean, eldritch blasts are not fantastic firepower at any level, and while its nice that the Archon gets iterative attacks, it's not going to make up for what, presumably, the Lantern Archon loses by being a tiny ball of light without hands, feet or body parts to strap magic items to.

- Googling found me three others, basically. It got unrelated pretty quick.

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Comes from pathfinder:

A maptool token for it:

And the official MM picture, but the lantern archon's sorta on the side, here:

Would one of those be better?

- Somehow, I always forget to put that in.

- Alright, I'll change that. Would 20ft + 5ft

- Well, that was taken from the MM. Put in a disguise check to hide it, is that alright?

- Oh... I was thinking more like 'bringing light to the darkness' type thing, you know, like holy crusades or something.

- A victim of the copy-paste. Changed.

- Yeah, that was copy-pasted over from the hound archon, so I was just following precedent.

- Alright, done.

- Again, from the copy-paste from Succubus.

- Well, it is from a 2-level class, so I was cautious of giving it anything that usual classes have to invest lots of levels for.

Altough he's a lantern archon, transforming whatever place goes to in a permanent christmas tree is something I'm not confortable with. The hound archon has that clause and the lantern archon sould too.

Yeah, that was the precedent I was talking about.

Yeah the lantern archon's is one of those more complicated monsters. Even the vasuhatin at least had hands.

I seem to recently pick the hard classes to do. Added to fact I'm not that good at homebrewing, and...

Anyway it definetely needs some bigger "land" speed that doesn't force the party to carry him as a pet at low levels. The ray damage also should be bigger.

Well, I change the speed.

Making it increase every 3HD would mean the lantern archon ends with 8d6 damage, 1d6 behind the warlock. Would that be alright?

On the other hand it's just two levels long. Being a tiny flying ball that shoots lasers and some SLAs on top is more or less right.

That was why I was being a bit cautious about what to give.

If anything the light archon needs some sinergy with other classes. Right now the best choice it could take would be rogue for sneaking and shooting lasers with sneak attack on top but that goes against the whole "light" theme.

Hmm...maybe I could give it the 'acts like x levels of cleric when you multiclass' thing?

I know it's not part of the class, but would giving the Lantern Archon Mage Hand At-Will be too much? It still cant use equipment, but it can shove a potion down someone's throat if they need it etc.

Yeah, I could see that.

[Kobold-Bard]

Probably already been suggested but can't hurt to check: anyone willing to make the Efreet or Pseudodragon?

[Hyudra]

Probably already been suggested but can't hurt to check: anyone willing to make the Efreet or Pseudodragon?

Speaking of requests, I'll repeat an earlier statement: Instant promotion to 'thread hero' (in my eyes at least) to anyone's willing to go through the thread and make up a list of all the requests.

Pseudodragon seems like my style. No promises on a speedy completion though - I'm painting the interior of my house this week.

[Kobold-Bard]

Speaking of requests, I'll repeat an earlier statement: Instant promotion to 'thread hero' (in my eyes at least) to anyone's willing to go through the thread and make up a list of all the requests.

Pseudodragon seems like my style. No promises on a speedy completion though - I'm painting the interior of my house this week.

Bah, only weirdos let real life come before D&D

Cheers always loved the Pseudodragon (as do lots of others based on the amount who tried to have one as a starter in my D&D pokemon game).

How about Big T, did anyone ever try him?

[Mystic Muse]

Speaking of requests, I'll repeat an earlier statement: Instant promotion to 'thread hero' (in my eyes at least) to anyone's willing to go through the thread and make up a list of all the requests.

Pseudodragon seems like my style. No promises on a speedy completion though - I'm painting the interior of my house this week.

I'll do this.

[mrcarter11]

I may, if I have the time tonight get the requests are done. Although it could take quite a while. In any case, if my night is free, I shall try to.

[Hyudra]

How about Big T, did anyone ever try him?

The OP, Oslecamo, has been working on it, I think.

Tough class to do, since it's fairly low on features for a high CR creature.

[Kobold-Bard]

So for the multi posts but questions keep coming to me as I read through these awesome classes. Re: the Vampire, I know it's part of their deal (and risking Twilight-Syndrome makes me not want to ask it) but isn't being obliterated in 2 rounds of sunlight a bit extreme as a PC race?

[Mystic Muse]

Okay, I made it to post 761 but I have to go now. Here's what I have so far. Apologies if some of these have already been made.

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More Slaad
Platinum dragons
Dragon turtle
Bulette
Pegasus
Deathdrinker
Androsphynx
Drider
one request for somebody to have Oslecamo's children
Concordant killer
bralani
Ghaele
Petal
All Monster manual dragons
boneclaw
deathknight
wraith
Tarrasque
Wight
Leshay
http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showp...94&postcount=9
Tsochari
Aboleths
Rakshasa Nazrathune (MM3)
bodak
movanic deva
clusterfang/deepspawn monsters of faerun
Clawfoot (Ebberon campaign setting)
Joystealer (MM4)
Ruin chanter (MM5)
Glaistig(MM3)
Frostwind virago(MM5)
Arrow demon
Astral stalker
fang dragon
TOB Rakshasa
Need a picture for the murderJack (Post 399)
Gelatinous cube
mimic
beholder
Inevitable
More “Half” templates
more undead
The Werehydra isn't in the OP
devils (bone, chain, barbed, lords of the fourth, ninth, first and eighth in that order
Kolyaruts
Uvuudaum (ELH)
War troll
Curst (template)
Atropal

[Hyudra]

Excellent work, Kyuub.

I laughed at the 'wants Oslecamo to have his/her children.' request.

[Mystic Muse]

Excellent work, Kyuub.

I laughed at the 'wants Oslecamo to have his/her children.' request.

Hey, you never specified you wanted monster requests.

[The Tygre]

Ahhh, my Atropal request went unnoticed? What, nobody wants to play the undead fetus of a god?

[Kobold-Bard]

Ahhh, my Atropal request went unnoticed? What, nobody wants to play the undead fetus of a god?

....Wuh??

What the huh? Undead God fetus? What?

--------------------------
Re: Ghost - Do you have to carry your body with you? Can it go in a portable hole or a bag of holding?

[Oslecamo]

....Wuh??

What the huh? Undead God fetus? What?

An epic undead monster, will be an interesting challenge when I have the time.

Re: Ghost - Do you have to carry your body with you? Can it go in a portable hole or a bag of holding?

Stuffing it in a portable hole means it's in a diferent dimension. If you have 10HD or more you can stuff it while adventuring and then take it out for 8 hours while the party rests and take no penalties.

volthawk:That first image of the lantern archon looks quite cool in my opinion!

Also pseudo-spellcaster would be apropriate.

Light rays being one die behind the warlock it's perfectly fine. The warlock eldrithch blast damage scales quite poorly.

As for mage hand make it so that the lantern archon itself can work as a mage hand. Aka it can somehow grab and manipulate stuff touching it's body. I would also give it the ability of delivering slam attacks dealing ray damage so you can make a melee lantern archon.

Kyuubi:Thanks! Now the ideal would be someone comparing that list to the monsters already done and cut out as necessary. Anybody? Please?

Hyudra:Original slaymate broken indeed and I thank WOTC every other day for not stating an oficial method of spawning them that could be abused. Feel free to turn it into something nonbroken.

On Kytons, yes, the correct would be one base 5 level class(broodling-adult) and then 3 separate "prestige" classes (impaler, slaymaster, slaughterking). They're all specialized roles in Kython society and each a "dead end" on itself. Impalers get sleeker to hunt down stuff, slaymasters regress, and slaughter kings are a new breed of adults who just kept geting bigger and stronger instead of gaining a tail. Make sure there's a reason to take slauymaster over slaughterking tough.

[Kobold-Bard]

Ahhhh, it's 30ft/HD. I misread it as 30ft flat until Level 10. Fair enough.

How about my vampire query? And is there a trial one must endure before making one of these, or it just a try then get your soul consumed if you get it wrong deal? I haz the inspiration, but am notoriously bad at balance without assisstance.

[Oslecamo]

Vampire extreme vulnerability to sunlight is one of it's most defining features and it will stay in.

You must perform a special ritual to become a vampire if you don't want to get bitten and dominated. It can't fail, but once you're a vampire you need a constant supply of fresh blood to fuel your powers or take penalties.

[Draken]

For the record, my current project are all the abominations (Atropal included). I'm giving the anaxim the last touches and then will move on to the stillborn godling.

On the kython. Perhaps make it a 6 level class, with the sixth level being mostly optional and giving you the choice to advance into one of the three specializations (Impaler, Slaymaster,Slaughterking), but those advancements themselves taking place over HD improvements in other class levels.

Kinda like giants keep growing no matter what they advance as.

Edit: I find this specially best because IIRC (AFB), the only differences between the adult and the specialized forms are:

Impaler: stronger natural attacks, pounce.

Slaymaster: large, no legs, constrict (he still has claws).

Slaughterking: large, auras.

[Hyudra]

Impaler: Stronger natural attacks (?), Charge, +20' move

Slaymaster: Extra melee attack (tail slap), large size, constrict, improved grab

Slaughterking: Poison spray, disruption field, large size.

These abilities are good enough to warrant several levels' investment, I'd argue. Plus, it has to be said, Oslecamo has that rule where the number of levels matches the CR (or a rough approximation where such is unclear), and after spending as much time as I have revising the giants, I'm going to suggest sticking to that.

[Crafty Cultist]

I agree with Hyudra. using the basic formats, the kython evolutions should be prestige classes. I'd be willing to do one of the prestige classes once the base kython class is done

[NosferatuZodd]

Could someone make a Tsochar from lords of madness?

Maybe have it grow into medium size or something as well.

[un_known]

I thought I'd take my try at building a Green Dragon, I eventually want to do a campaign where players only use Dragon Races from this thread.

Green Dragon

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Green Dragon

HD 12
{TABLE]Level | BAB | Fort | Ref | Will | Feature
1 | +1 | +2|+0 |+2 | Green Dragon body, Arcane blood
2| +2| +3|+0 |+3 | Keen senses, Acid Breath
3| +3| +3|+1| +3| Blindsense 60 ft. Con+1
4| +4| +4| +1|+4 | Wings, +1 Str
5| +5| +4| +1| +4| Swimming, +1 Cha
6| +6| +5|+2 |+5 | Green Dragon SLAs 1/day, +1 Str
7| +7| +5| +2| +5| Amphibious, +1 Cha, +1 Con
8| +8| +6| +2| +5| Growth, +1 Cha
9| +9| +6|+3 |+6| Dominate Person, Tail slap
10| +10| +7|+3 |+7 | Green Dragon SLAs 2/day, +1 Str, +1 Con
11| +11| +7| +3|+7 | Arcane Skin, +1 Cha
12| +12| +8| +4|+8 | Iron Scales, +1 Str, +1 Con
13| +13| +8| +4| +8| Green Dragon SLAs 3/day, +1 Cha
14| +14| +9| +4| +9| Frightful presence, Tail Sweep
15| +15| +9| +5| +9| Green Dragon SLAs 4/day, +1 Cha
16| +16| +10| +5| +10| Growth, +1 Str, +1 Con
17| +17| +10| +5|+10 | Green Dragon SLAs 5/day, +1 Cha
18| +18| +11|+6 |+11 |, Crush,+1 Str, +1 Con
19 | +19| +11| +6| +11| Green Dragon SLAs 6/day, +1 Cha
20| +20| +12| +6| +12| Command Plants

[/TABLE]



4 Skill points+int per level, quadruple at 1st level. Class skills: Concentration, Climb, Hide, Spot, Listen, Move Silently, Bluff, Intimidate, Knowledge(any), Spellcraft.

Proficiencies: a Green Dragon isn't proficient with any armor or weapons, besides his own natural weapons.


Features:
Green Dragon Body: The Green Dragon loses all other racial bonuses, and gains Dragon traits, Acid subtype, bite 1d8 damage, 2 claws attack for 1d6 damage each and 40 base speed, medium size. The Green Dragon has wings, but they're too weak to do anything for now. His claws are capable of fine manipulation and can be used for somatic components of spellcasting or anything else a human hand could do.

The Green Dragon also gets a natural armor bonus equal to his 1+Con modifier. Whenever the Green Dragon grows one size category, his natural armor increases by a further 1.

The Green Dragon is immune to Acid. It has no particular vulnerability.


Arcane Blood: A Green Dragon receives spells known and spells per day as a bard of same level, but he casts as a sorcerer and takes his spells known from the sorcerer/wizard spell list.


If it multi-classes as a bard it's spell casting increases as a bard.
If it multi-classes as a sorcerer it counts as already having sorcerer casting depending on it's dragon level, as shown on the following table.

{table]Dragon level | Virtual sorceror casting
1|-
2|1
3|2
4|3
5|4
6|5
7|6
8|6
9|7
10|8
11|8
12|9
13|10
14|10
15|11
16|12
17|12
18|13
19|13
20|13
[/table]

So for example a dragon 2 who takes a level of sorcerer would count as already having 1 level of sorcerer and gains the spell slots and spells known that a sorcerer gains when leveling from level 1 to 2, but not the spell slots and spells known from the 1st level of sorcerer. He would get the familiar ability, but dragon levels wouldn't count for it.

A dragon 18 who takes a level of sorcerer would count as having 14 levels of sorcerer(13+1) and gain the spell slots and spells known that a sorcerer gains when leveling from level 13 to 14, but not the spell slots and spells known that a sorcerer gets from level 1 to 13. He would get the familiar ability, but dragon levels wouldn't count for it.

His Caster level remains equal to his full HD when multiclassing to sorcerer.

If a dragon takes a casting Prestige Class, it may choose to advance his casting as that of a sorcerer. So a Dragon 10/Loremaster 10 would cast as a 18th level sorcerer (he would still receive spell slots and spells known from a bard 10 from the first 10 dragon levels and then the spell slots and spells known from a sorcerer 11-18 for the loremaster levels)


Keen senses: The Green Dragon sees four times as well as a human in shadowy illumination and twice as well in normal light. It also has darkvision out to 120 feet.

Acid Breath: line 60 ft dealing 1d6 Acid damage/HD with DC ref of 10+1/2 HD+Con modifier for half every 1d4 turns. Line increases by 10 ft. with each extra HD the player takes from here.

Blindsense: as the normal ability, range 60 ft.

Ability score increase: The Green Dragon ability scores increase by the shown amount.
{table]Level | Total bonus gained
3 | +1 Con
6 | +2 Str, +1 Con, +1 Cha
7 | +2 Str, +2 Con, +2 Cha
8 | +2 Str, +2 Con, +3 Cha
9 | +2 Str, +2 Con, +4 Cha
10 | +3 Str, +3 Con, +4 Cha
11 | +3 Str, +3 Con, +5 Cha
13 | +4 Str, +3 Con, +6 Cha
15 | +4 Str, +3 Con, +7 Cha
16 | +5 Str, +4 Con, +7 Cha
17 | +5 Str, +4 Con, +8 Cha
18 | +6 Str, +5 Con, +8 Cha
19 | +6 Str, +6 Con, +9 Cha


[/table]

NOTE: This table presents the TOTAL bonus gained for ease of keeping count! Don't add the values from different levels!

Wings: The Green Dragon becomes able to fly at the speed of 10 ft. per HD, with poor maneuverability. The maneuverability doesn't increase naturally, but players can take the Savage Species feat that increases it by two steps (stackable). Each wing can also be now used to deliver a natural attack dealing 1d4 damage.

Swimming: The Wings which enable the Green Dragon to now fly can be used to propel the Green Dragon through water giving it a 40 ft. Swim Speed. It can swim on the surface or below it without difficulty. It moves through water at the listed speed without making Swim checks. It has a +8 racial bonus on any Swim check to perform some special action or avoid a hazard. It can always can choose to take 10 on a Swim check, even if distracted or endangered. It can use the run action while swimming, provided it swims in a straight line.

Amphibious (Ex): This dragon can breathe underwater indefinitely and can freely use its breath weapon, spells, and other abilities while submerged.

Growth: At 8th level the Green Dragon grows to large size.
At 16th level the Green Dragon grows to huge size.

His AC, bonus to hit, base damage, grapple and skills change accordingly, but he does not get any ability score bonus or penalties.

Dominate Person (Sp): The Green Dragon can now use Dominate Person as an SLA 2/Day for every 3 HD it has.

Tail slap: The Green dragon can now make a tail slap attack dealing 1d8 damage(already taking in account large size).


Green Dragon SLAs: Plant Growth and Suggestion a number of times per day as indicated in the table. Saves=10+1/2HD+Cha mod.


Arcane skin: The Green Dragon gains SR equal to his HD+11.

Iron Scales: The Green dragon gains DR/magic equal to half his HD.

Crush: The dragon can make a crush attack dealing 2d8 damage base, already taking in account huge size

This special attack allows a flying or jumping dragon of at least Huge size to land on opponents as a standard action, using its whole body to crush them. Crush attacks are effective only against opponents three or more size categories smaller than the dragon (though it can attempt normal overrun or grapple attacks against larger opponents).

A crush attack affects as many creatures as can fit under the dragon’s body. Creatures in the affected area must succeed on a Reflex save (DC equal to that of the dragon’s breath weapon) or be pinned, automatically taking bludgeoning damage during the next round unless the dragon moves off them. If the dragon chooses to maintain the pin, treat it as a normal grapple attack. Pinned opponents take damage from the crush each round if they don’t escape.

A crush attack deals the indicated damage plus 1½ times the dragon’s Strength bonus (round down).



Frightful Presence: The ability takes effect automatically whenever the dragon attacks, charges, or flies overhead. Creatures within a radius of 30 feet × half the dragon's level are subject to the effect if they have fewer HD than the dragon. A potentially affected creature that succeeds on a Will save (DC 10 + ½ dragon’s HD + dragon’s Cha modifier) remains immune to that dragon’s frightful presence for 24 hours. On a failure, creatures with 4 or less HD become panicked for 4d6 rounds and those with 5 or more HD become shaken for 4d6 rounds. Dragons ignore the frightful presence of other dragons.


Command Plants (Sp): The Green dragon can now use Command Plants as a SLA 1/day for every 5 HD it has. Save=10+1/2HD+Cha modifier

[Oslecamo]

Yes it is based on Oslescamo's other Dragon classes but I thought that if we were doing multiple dragon's we'd want them to all be similair in base.

How does it look?

Well I must say you've caught the spirit of this quite quickly.


However one point I've been enforcing vigorously it's that each dragon is unique and has it's own quircks otherwise I would've done a "generic" dragon class that then allowed you to pick an element and a bunch of SLAs.

The green dragon in this case, the original MM monster grows slower than the red dragon on wich you based this. So the class should give the growths at levels 8 and 13 (and 21 if an epic progression was made).

Similarly the green dragon is suposed to be physically weaker than the red dragon so less Str and Con and Cha but it's also suposed to be very manipulative so more skill points (you've done the later already). It also has no elemental vulnerability wich is another advantage so I would lower it's Nat armor to just Con modifier. It also needs a swim speed.

Dominate person doesn't have a number of uses and could come out earlier, probably at lv9 wich is kinda of an empty level right now.

[un_known]

Thank you for those edits Oslecamo.

I'll change the edits to what you say. The problem about growth was that I couldn't find where it stated the age a green dragon lives to. I was searching Draconomicon up and down and couldn't find it for some reason.

Edit: Edited the Green Dragon up now!

Edit #2: If/When this gets approved I'll move onto White Dragons. And after that Tarterian, & Shadow. After that I think I'll start on the Metallic ones and if I get that far I don't see any reason as to not just do the Gem ones as well.

[Hyudra]

Kudos, Un Known. Dragons are hard to do, and it's good to see someone tackling 'em.

Could I suggest that you have the image not be spoilered, and for it to have "Green Dragon" in bold, a size or two bigger? As a thread trend, it helps if the image is visible & the title easily apparent, so people skimming through can quickly spot the monster entries.

Green is my favorite dragon, I think. I was rather disappointed when Dragon Magazine's version of the monster class wound up being rather subpar.

[Kobold-Bard]

Questions about the Ethergaunt (since I'm now building one):

- What is the crit threat & damage type for both Ether Blade attacks (if there is one) and the range for the Ether Blade blast?
- I assume you need to spend charges to fire it, do you need to spend one to summon the blade or do you just have to have a charge left?
- Is the Ether Blade considered Masterwork by default, or do I have to pay for a new one if I want to upgrade it later on.

- Does Total Vision count as Blindsight or Blindsense?

------
Once I get to a computer rather than a phone I plan to make an attempt at something here, perhaps the Ghaele. but definitely NOT the Ghaele!!!

[Gorgondantess]

Once I get to a computer rather than a phone I plan to make an attempt at something here, perhaps the Ghaele.

Emm... I'm working on the Ghaele right now. >.>

[un_known]

Updated the Green Dragon slightly with simple asthetic changes. Some word changes to make it more coherent in areas and what not.

[Kobold-Bard]

Emm... I'm working on the Ghaele right now. >.>

Well then.....maybe I'll do something else....

In the plus side this means the Ghaele will be up sooner, and I love the Ghaele so this works out well