BleachITP Reborn: Discussion & Setup Thread 6

[Sucrose]

I was not bothering with the fighting until FF jumped on KD. I do not intend to speak up except as necessary to defend my viewpoint, until such time as Boo has 'finalized' his intended backstory.

Your proposed homosexual angle is tolerable to me, if it would work for the others concerned.

In any case, Vael, with the PMs clearly demonstrated not to be an option, there really is no alternative to hashing things out in the thread. Before you suggest it outright, I will not abandon my point altogether, largely because to do that, I would need to abandon the game, and I would like to avoid that.

[KnightDisciple]

I was not bothering with the fighting until FF jumped on KD. I do not intend to speak up except as necessary to defend my viewpoint, until such time as Boo has 'finalized' his intended backstory.

Your proposed homosexual angle is tolerable to me, if it would work for the others concerned.

In any case, Vael, with the PMs clearly demonstrated not to be an option, there really is no alternative to hashing things out in the thread. Before you suggest it outright, I will not abandon my point altogether, largely because to do that, I would need to abandon the game, and I would like to avoid that.

I have to admit, I'm starting to approach this point.

My main frustration lies in the fact that Sucrose and I have a very specific objection to the story, not to every single element. I've proposed a compromise that I feel retains the majority of the essence of the story, while removing something so fundamentally distasteful.

I feel like I'm essentially being told that since this is "purely backstory", I can't object at all. Even though this is a collective effort. I worry that the implication is that we can include almost anything, so long as we're vague, and maybe just shove it into "backstory".

I feel like people are patting me on the head, saying "that's nice, dear", and proceeding to keep going on, totally ignoring my objection. Which is frustrating. Not to mention the fact I'm having trouble interpreting the tone of Boo's posts; what I read as sarcasm apparently isn't, or something.

Then, when I try to be as neutral as possible in my objections, I am the villain here, even as Boo sits back and snipes at me. Maybe that's an overblown perception, but it's the message I'm getting.

Frankly, it's getting a bit upsetting.

[AmberVael]

In any case, Vael, with the PMs clearly demonstrated not to be an option, there really is no alternative to hashing things out in the thread. Before you suggest it outright, I will not abandon my point altogether, largely because to do that, I would need to abandon the game, and I would like to avoid that.

You preemptively brought up a point I was not going to suggest.

No, I think it is a terrible idea not to resolve it at this point, I just want to point out that I think the way it is currently being handled feels very uneasy for a lot of us.

I don't necessarily have a suggestion (wish I did), but I think it would be very much preferable to slow down and find some alternate method of dealing with the problem than what is currently being used- because it is apparently breeding a lot of bad feelings on both sides.

And I do want to say that this isn't pointed towards either side of the argument. It's towards the argument in general.

[Terry576]

I've got a question.

Why does she need to be kicked out because of Forbidden Love exactly? Boo's just saying "Freedom of Speech" and stuff like that.

[Sucrose]

I've got a question.

Why does she need to be kicked out because of Forbidden Love exactly? Boo's just saying "Freedom of Speech" and stuff like that.

Because it is the angle that he wishes to pursue for his character. KD and I generally support the idea of players getting to do what they wish with their characters. However, there are limits, dictated by what the members of the game can stomach. That is why we are trying to remove the unnecessary 'adoptive incest' nature of the forbidden love, because it is beyond what we can stomach.

[Draken]

For the record. Nothing bothers me. I am just trying to conciliate the different point of views.

There could be outright vicious things made explicit in the text and I wouldn't be bothered. A mod might, however, and that would be sorta bad.

[tgva8889]

I'm not trying to incite argument of any kind. I just want to clarify stuff. Please ignore this if you don't want to be involved.

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Here's what I'm reading. Please correct me if I'm wrong.

Boo: Here's my backstory! It has incest in it, please don't take this the wrong way, I'm including it because I find it interesting, not because I want to incite problems. I have the right to include whatever I want in my character's story, and I chose this. Since it has no affect on the character in-game, I refuse to change it.
KD: I have a problem with you including incest in this story. It does not add anything that having the relationship not be incestuous would not retain. The relationship could be this, this, this, this, or this and the story would be the same. As a part of the community, I would like to say that I have problems with this (of some kind, I myself am not clear what the best descriptive word would be to use).
Boo: I want to write about incest because I find it interesting. Why is incest worse than [bad thing] or [bad thing]?
KD: It's not. I don't want you to write about incest because there are other alternatives that could replace it and still maintain the story, the character, etc. Currently I see no reason why it couldn't be another way.

My real question is, Boo, is why this is so important to you. You can write about incest wherever you want, whenever you want. We're not telling you you can't. What we are telling you is that there is no reason for it to be this way. There are alternatives, and you have yet to explain why those alternative won't work beyond "I don't feel like it." If you don't think they fit with the story you've written, maybe you should explain to us exactly why the relationship needs to be brother/sister so that we can better understand your view.

Thus far, the only reason you've said you don't want to change it is some equivalent of "You can't tell me what to do, I have the right to do whatever I want." This is true. However, this is not a defense of why you need to include something that appears to offend other people. If you could defend it in a way that would prove that no other subject would be acceptable, then I'm sure that KD and Sucrose would at least consider leaving you be.

This is not intended to be an offense to anyone or anything. I just don't want to see the game destroyed because of an argument about something this trivial.

[KnightDisciple]

I'm not trying to incite argument of any kind. I just want to clarify stuff. Please ignore this if you don't want to be involved.

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Here's what I'm reading. Please correct me if I'm wrong.

Boo: Here's my backstory! It has incest in it, please don't take this the wrong way, I'm including it because I find it interesting, not because I want to incite problems. I have the right to include whatever I want in my character's story, and I chose this. Since it has no affect on the character in-game, I refuse to change it.
KD: I have a problem with you including incest in this story. It does not add anything that having the relationship not be incestuous would not retain. The relationship could be this, this, this, this, or this and the story would be the same. As a part of the community, I would like to say that I have problems with this (of some kind, I myself am not clear what the best descriptive word would be to use).
Boo: I want to write about incest because I find it interesting. Why is incest worse than [bad thing] or [bad thing]?
KD: It's not. I don't want you to write about incest because there are other alternatives that could replace it and still maintain the story, the character, etc. Currently I see no reason why it couldn't be another way.

My real question is, Boo, is why this is so important to you. You can write about incest wherever you want, whenever you want. We're not telling you you can't. What we are telling you is that there is no reason for it to be this way. There are alternatives, and you have yet to explain why those alternative won't work beyond "I don't feel like it." If you don't think they fit with the story you've written, maybe you should explain to us exactly why the relationship needs to be brother/sister so that we can better understand your view.

Thus far, the only reason you've said you don't want to change it is some equivalent of "You can't tell me what to do, I have the right to do whatever I want." This is true. However, this is not a defense of why you need to include something that appears to offend other people. If you could defend it in a way that would prove that no other subject would be acceptable, then I'm sure that KD and Sucrose would at least consider leaving you be.

This is not intended to be an offense to anyone or anything. I just don't want to see the game destroyed because of an argument about something this trivial.

This pretty much sums it up in a nutshell. Except it should rightly be "KD and Sucrose".

[Boo]

Question: Would not including words such as "adopt" and "brother" make this story passable? If it were just "Himura is taken in by a noblehouse, but never considered a true member of it, and is often unincluded in many lists/events/etc and treated poorly when not in public".

If not, then whatever. I give up. Not because of Sucrose and KD. Frankly, Vael is right.

TGVA: I've just lost all interest in whether or not that's right.

[KnightDisciple]

Isn't that basically what we've been suggesting, Boo?

Essentially, if you entirely remove the facet where these individuals are considered siblings in any way (socially, legally, emotionally, etc.), then yes, that eliminates the core of my protest.

[Boo]

Wait, so... wow, this was such a pointless argument between you and I. I don't know about Sucrose's opinion.

Just to be clear, I was always willing to change my wording. The family wasn't intended to treat her well in the revision--abusive even because she wasn't a true member. There's a bit more, but I have to run really fast to class.

[KnightDisciple]

Wait, so... wow, this was such a pointless argument between you and I. I don't know about Sucrose's opinion.

...Did you seriously not pick up that it specifically being a sibling incest story was what we objected to? What with all the suggestions where the story stayed almost the same, just with her not being considered related in any way?

[tgva8889]

Well I'm glad that's over with.

[Steilos]

Alright, here's a fraccion if you happen to need more.

Sargeant Apolinar Rodriguez, Fraccion

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Age: 452 years old, counting mortal life (422 afterwards)
Height: 6'1"
Aspect of Death: Pride/Honour
Weight: 189
Reiatsu: A dark blue, tinged with dark red and smelling faintly of the ocean
Speech colour: Navy
Appearance:

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Tall and somewhat imposing, Apolinar is never found without his armour and helmet, or without his 16th century Spanish soldier's uniform. A fairly lean man who looks to be in his thirties, he sports black hair, a beard and moustache of middling length and his Hollow Mask, which is a steel plate adorned with a depiction of crashing waves strapped over his left eye. His 400 years without an eye seem to have given him plenty of time to accomodate for this lack of depth perception, and he shows no signs of being hindered by the missing eye. Incidentally, the Hollow Hole is his left eye, in case anyone was wondering why he has to wear an eyepatch. The main standout feature is most definitely how haggard he looks. His skin is ghostly pale, and there is a definite... dampness about him. He looks slightly pruned, almost as if he had spent some time at the bottom of the sea...

Personality:

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The sargeant's temperament has always been reserved, polite and gentlemanly. When riled, however, he becomes a regular old dog of war, abandoning tact, social graces, but never obedience, in favour of uncompromising brutality. He owes everything to Las Noches, as his fealty to them gives him that all important reason to live, and would obey any orders except the ridiculous without question.

History:

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Apolinar was born in 1558. His father, Roderigo, was an artist with a great love for Greek mythology. Despite his father's protests, Apolinar joined the Spanish Army, and became renowned for his strict sense of honour and discipline. However, on that fateful day in 1588, when the fire ships burned into the harbour at Gravelines, Apolinar found himself and the ship he was on in the heat of battle as the Armada was pushed into the Channel. There, his ship was shot to pieces and the men dived off like rats. Surrounded and basically alone on a sinking wreck, Apolinar cursed the evacuating sailors, and spat in the face of the captain as he climbed aboard one of the boats. He started to load the cannons himself, but a chain shot hit the mast and it toppled down on top of him. The ship soon folded up and sank to the bottom, and that was the last anyone saw of Sargeant Apolinar Rodriguez.

Unfortunately, no one thought to check that last statement with Rodriguez himself. After several days wandering on the seabed, he came up, expecting to see the glorious Armada back on course. Instead what he saw was devastation. The glorious, invincible Armada... a spot on which Rodriguez had been preparing for his whole life... was in full rout. Helpless, he watched and raged helplessly as the ships dashed against the rocks, and thousands of his comrades died, not fighting gloriously, but begging for mercy. It hit him, starkly, in that moment, the sheer weakness of humanity, how easily it hid itself, no matter the punishment. It did not take long for him to Hollowify after that.

Maybe the Fae were on holiday. Maybe he just didn't do that much. But after slaughtering his parents in a blind rage, Apolinar toured Britain, terrorising children as a malevolent Hollow spirit, even killing some, in a state of total anger. How dare they mock Spain!? How DARE they mock ME!? Eventually this slowly passed, and a new, yet at the same time old, feeling came back to haunt him: Guilt. He was a child murderer. Fratricidal. Matricidal. What had happened to the honour and chivalry that had guided him so far? Being a soldier, and not one to give in at that, Apolinar came to realise just how little these meant on their own. It is about this time that Apolinar became an Arrancar, somewhere around 50 years after his death. The souls he had consumed up to this point made him strong enough to survive, but only just. Making his way to Hueco Mundo, Rodriguez became a Numeros after pledging fealty to the King of Hollows. The next 400 years involved him getting strong enough to work up to fraccion status, which was difficult given he did not take the usual Menos path most took.

Abilities:
Standard Arrancar Powers:

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Bala- Apolinar does not really go in for Bala, and when he does, he usually uses it as a decoy before an actual strike. It isn't really that harmful, due to his lack of practice, but it is quite flashy.
Cero- Comes out of his mouth, and is essentially blood-tainted seawater, which may have once been coughed up from his lungs, in an energy form. It's strong and quite quick moving, but he spends a few seconds inhaling beforehand, and he has to drop some hierro away from his facial area while he performs it.
Hierro- Outstanding. Easily one of the best, if not the best, among fraccion. It even sometimes matches an Espada's level. And that is not even counting the armour. He also has exceptional control of this ability.
Garganta- Portal to other dimensions. Nothing more to say really, as Apolinar has an average skill in this.
Sonido- Poor. Although Apolinar can (barely) stand on air, he prefers the ground, and his movement speed is barely-above-mortal slow, although he is fairly quick and skilled with his weapon.
Pesquisa- Fast (about 1 second), and far reaching, but quite indistinct, not giving anything other than direction. It's basically a sonar ping, in that respect. If he wants more detail, Apolinar can focus upon one person above all others, but only within about 50m.

Zanpakutō: Precio del Deber

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Appearance: A battle-worn halberd, with an elongated tip which makes the weapon look more like a pike.

Resureccion

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"Romper, las olas de vosotros, contra el acero del Honor..."
("Break, ye waves, against Honour's steel...")

A fairly accurate description of what this entails. Scales form over Apolinar's skin, although this is hard to notice against the sudden thickening of his armour: suddenly a full suit of plate, as worn by feudal knights. It's heavy, but it feels significantly lighter to Apolinar; about the weight of his regular uniform in fact. Although this helps somewhat against attacks, the main defense increase comes from the fusing of his hierro with this armour, allowing him to treat it like his own flesh and blood for channeling his hierro, which is now strengthened significantly, making him nigh-invulnerable to anyone below VC level, and reasonably close to that on anyone below Captain. He's still slow as all heck though.
Glorious Fusilade: His strikes, although no faster, can, at the price of some fatigue, gain the force of a ship cannon's broadside. When this happens, the blade of his weapon glows white-hot, and the crashing of waves can be heard. He can alternately, provided he stands stock still and lowers his defenses, channel this energy into a heavy cannon bombardment. Think his cero, on fire, shot 20 times at once, wide to narrowish spread, depending on Apolinar's wish.
Sea Control: Apolinar can do such things as raise up a wave to shield against incoming attacks, and cause eddies and currents to catch those in the water off balance, but really this is not anything more than the occasional fancy trick.

Thoughts?

Oh, and about this little discussion we're having: I'm not really a big fan of it either, and really I'd rather see Boo's story edited, but it's not like it's gonna kill me if it isn't, so lo- oh. Well, I guess that's perfectly acceptable. Kinda wish we could have done without the semi-pointless arguing cloggin' up tha thread.

[strawberryman]

...Steilos, I would just like to say that your avatar creeps me out, and I am not usually a person who can be swayed in such a manner. Kudos.

[Sucrose]

Boo, KD and I are of the same mind on this matter. Since you removed the 'if I were a worse man' line, the extent of my complaint has always been the incest. If they were never considered relatives in any sense, then that removes the incest, and makes them essentially just childhood friends. I can tolerate that.

[KnightDisciple]

Boo, KD and I are of the same mind on this matter. Since you removed the 'if I were a worse man' line, the extent of my complaint has always been the incest. If they were never considered relatives in any sense, then that removes the incest, and makes them essentially just childhood friends. I can tolerate that.

Exactly this.

[tgva8889]

And this is why we should always ask questions and attempt to better understand the other side.

I'm going to go back to sitting in my corner now.

[Steilos]

Sooo we're agreed? Remove the incestous parts, and it's all good? Ok. Glad to see its over. What now? Apologies if this seems abrupt, but all of this posting has slowed down actual planning and discussion somewhat. It's taken nearly the entirety of this thread so far.

@strawberryman: Thanks, I try my best.

[Moon Wolf]

Just a question: if we were going to do a 'Turn Back The Pendulum' episode, could we perhaps make it 100 years ago instead of 200? That's what they did in the canon...plus we could fit in more characters that way.

(I'm a little late because I had 8 pages to catch up on)

[tgva8889]

Sooo we're agreed? Remove the incestous parts, and it's all good? Ok. Glad to see its over. What now? Apologies if this seems abrupt, but all of this posting has slowed down actual planning and discussion somewhat. It's taken nearly the entirety of this thread so far.

I didn't honestly know we were doing actual planning and discussion while that argument was going on. The only thing that I noticed was discussion of a Turn Back the Pendulum-type series, which I thought was sort of discussed and handled already.

[riccaru]

Is there only one bount or am I missing something?

[Frozen_Feet]

Is there only one bount or am I missing something?

Yes. The four other bounts. (Let's see... Sören, Donovan, Ava, Viatrix, Eirine; am I missing someone?)

I didn't honestly know we were doing actual planning and discussion while that argument was going on. The only thing that I noticed was discussion of a Turn Back the Pendulum-type series, which I thought was sort of discussed and handled already.

The biggest question is when will we kick them up.

[riccaru]

Are the others members of sword?

[Frozen_Feet]

No. I've listed all bount character under 'Loose Cannons' in the registry.

[riccaru]

Oh, only one of them are labeled as bounts... Sorry

[Frozen_Feet]

Oh, only one of them are labeled as bounts... Sorry

False! Eirine was labeled as Bount too!

Honestly, if I could think of good enough descriptors, species of each and every loose cannon would fade behind an obscure designation, just to confuse people.

[The Librarian]

Bonjourno I'm a newbie and I've made my first character and I would like comments and what not. Please and thanks.
CMOTDibbler and you know that guy...>.> oh yeah Righty convinced me to join and so i did :D!

Name: Rya Tamasine
Position: 10th 3rd Seat
Reiatsu: Slate Grey
Age: 7
Height: 3'8
Weight: 69

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Appearance: Rya is a humanoid (dragon/human). Rya has silver hair and onyx black eyes. He has wings that spread three feet. Rya looks like a seven year old little child, but he is actually around four hundred years old. His body is covered with white (greenish tented) scales. He wears a standard black hakama and black haori with the white sash, but he doesn't wear any shoes and prefers to run around bare footed.

Personality: Rya is actually has a twin brother named Ryu whose soul was trapped inside of his body. There is no given time in which one is in control they're always acting as one. Rya and Ryu are very playful and they like to play pranks on the other shinigami on a regular basis. However when in battle or an important issue arises they become very serious.

Zanpakuto: Ryū-ryoku
Ryū-ryoku is a duel Kodachi


Shikai: Kasai burēdo (Fire Blades) while in shikai form the blades of Ryū-ryoku turn dark red and engulf in flames. Ryū-ryoku is enchanted in with fire and enchances the damage of its attacks.

Bankai: Tamashī o sakujo suru (Remove Soul) while in bankai form Ryu's soul is stripped from Rya's body and it takes the form of a body identical to Rya's. Ryu is then enabled to fight outside of Rya's body and he uses one of the blades of Ryū-ryoku.

Abilities: All of Rya's senses are enhanced. He has exceptional vision, hearing, and sense of smell.

Other: While Ryu's and Rya's mother was giving birth she devoured Ryu's body and his soul sort of wandered into Rya's body some how o_O.

Reposting my friends character submission because arguing and other stuff kind of overpowered it.

CheapAT, I like your character. I'm not sure about the half-dragon thing, but the rest sounds pretty solid.

[strawberryman]

@CheapAfterTaste: Uhhh... *cough*

Talon Gunvhald.

That said. He seems more like an Arrancar. And as a 3rd seat, should really not have Bankai, unless you're just noting it for future use. Which is fine. But you should make a note of that, if you do.

...Also, 7 years old? He'd be a toddler.

57 is a more appropriate age, and even then, he'd have to be some kind of genius to be a 3rd seat already.

@Bounts: KD recently suggested an idea for a product in Vi's shop, to help out the Bount customers. That being, she'd bottle reishi from the garganta world (seeing as no one has had issue with her possessing an artificial garganta yet ) and sell them to Bount so they didn't need to subside on eating the occasional soul, and thus get in hot water with the Shinigami. It would, naturally, take the innocuous shape of:

[Frozen_Feet]

@CheapAfterTaste:

I though about saying something about Bankais and power level, but if manifesting Ryu is all it does, I'm willing to let it slide. If neither Ryu or Rya are overwhermingly powerful initially, it can be worked with. However, expect to be demanded to give a good explanation why he has it.

Also, Ryu's and Rya's connection could do with some expanding and explaining. The vibe I'm getting is Ryu was a twin whose soul somehow became a zanpakuto spirit. Also, why is he a dragon? Was he perhaps a newt or a real dragon in life?

You could also detail Rya's expertise in four Shinigami arts: Kido (Magic), Hoho (Agility), Zanjutsu (Swordmanship) and Hakuda (Unarmed combat).