GitP PrC Contest Chat Thread IV

[sirpercival]

...OH!!! 13d6! I thought you meant a maximum roll of 13! Duh!

No, a maximum roll of 13. 3d6 (max 13), then that increases as per the table, up to 7d6 (max 40) at level 10.

[MoleMage]

I have a question.
I just started an archive dive on our local OOTS, and got the the doily comic. Why, in the gods' names, did we not make a doily themed class during Items of Power?!

[malonkey1]

No, a maximum roll of 13. 3d6 (max 13), then that increases as per the table, up to 7d6 (max 40) at level 10.

That isn't on the table...

[sirpercival]

That isn't on the table...

It's the Surge column, between the Will save and the Special column.

[malonkey1]

...Oh. My bad.

[sirpercival]

...Oh. My bad.

No worries. :)

[Zelkon]

I'm about 25% done with the class: Done with chassis, table, and ideas, as well as a bit of fluff. My personal favorite ability is "Nope," sort of like a catch all counterspell, followed by at-will self targeted explosive runes. I still gotta write the three entry feats though.

[ErrantX]

Not much time left guys and gals, please try to finish up. I always hate DQ'ing an entry.

-X

[Techwarrior]

PEACHes

Tarsten Corvus
The Wandering Thief

Spoiler

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Ooooh shiny, and that brings me off on a Firefly tangetn immediately.

Entry Requirements
It's strange that its actually easier for a character that's only dipped an agile thieving class to get in than a straight thief. Rogue 2/(Full BAB) 4 is the easiest entry, though Rogue 7 is probably the preferred? Also requires 2 really bad feats for entry.

Basics
The save tables are odd, to say the least. From my knowledge, you've got the PrC good save tables for Fort and Will, and then straight up Good progression for Reflex? That's a little mixed, but it makes them a little better at resisting the two saves Rogues are weak against. Skills got slightly expanded, but slightly less per level. Probably all balances out across the table here.

Features
Go go Rogue class features! ... aw.. Losing 2 dice of sneak attack? The rest of these features better be good... As a side note, it would be nice to go over the wording with a fine comb to try and iron out the wrinkles in wording and grammar.

Urban Terrain...
Looks about like a Talent to me, gained twice. Feels like filler, but it's the first feature.

Eye for something Shiny
Again, a Talent. This one feels more useful to me though, like its an actual feature as opposed to the metaphorical Assassin bonus to poison saves.

Calling Card
This should be a major part of the class, and it's not. Its more powerful than both of the above two features because it scales better, and its drawback probably won't come up often. I know if my Thief got something stolen from him that he had rightfully lifted from someone's purse no less, (Do you know how tedious that is?) Diplomacy would not be my modus operandi for dealing with that insufferable petty amateur kleptomaniac.

Bold Instincts
I like this. Its nice and simple, and not dying is a thief's best skill!

Time to Run
I'd consider making this something other than an Enhancement bonus. At this level, if you're jonesing for speedy quckster-ness you've already got Boots of Striding and Springing or similar. Maybe Competence, Insight, or Luck? (I like the thought of Luck myself, just from a fluff standpoint) The acrobatics bonus is yummy.

Slow Fall
Yes it makes sense from a fluff standpoint. I have about as much venom for it as any other playgrounder though. The only time I've seen slow fall work, it was in the DM's hands. If you want to put the ability in, and have only so little, please please please make it not need a wall.

Master Thief
So you've gotten 10 levels into the class, and you get Nondetection and the inability to be tracked by scent. That's a little bit of a letdown. I'd much rather see going all-out and nabbing Mind Blank with Nondetection and Pass Without Trace worked in earlier (4th maybe?). You also need to denote what caster level the spell effects are, in case somebody tries to resist them.

Overall
The class has some neat ideas, and looks to be solid. However, it feels way too focused on numeric bonuses to skills and not enough on things that would help steal. I also would like to see a couple of boosts to certain abilities and more active sneakiness. I'd certainly be willing to look into going into it from a Rogue. The prerequisites should probably less feat intensive to the poor Rogue, and actually favor a Rogue-ish entry more though.

Shadowsaint of the Bladesworn
oh... right that's mine.

inuyasha
Abyssal Apprentice

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Pretty much figured there'd be at least one of these, and I was not disappointed. Let's see if the class keeps up with my anticipations. Hopefully you managed to get a bit more Chaos than Evil, but hey its the thought that counts.

Entry
(Whistles) Those prereqs are all over the place. Seducers can get in one level earlier (9) without shenanigans as is, though I'm sure if you try you can get in at 7. Seducers do get absolutely shafted with feats though, as those are two thrown-away feats as opposed to Power Attack and Cleave. I'd suggest if you're actually looking to make this a 10th level entry you up the skill prerequisites for each side to 13 ranks. Some feats more useful to Seducers would be nice as well, skillmonkeys can't afford to throw two away.

Chassis
That's a really good meaty chassis, though there's quite a few dead levels. Might want to look into filling those with something

Features
First, please order these so that they're actually given some more description. Many of these have no fluff at all alongside them, and even worse, make barely any sense from the little fluff in the class description. I'd love to see those lonely dead levels filled with some interesting demonic stuff. You can literally go anywhere with this at this point, so I really don't want to start directing you, but do something with your idea here.

Overall
Your class is top-heavy currently. Almost the entire class is the mechanical aspects in the chassis. This could go anywhere at this point, but it needs to go somewhere.

sirpercival
Executor of Bedlam

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Well, this will certainly be interesting. Nice to see what I'm up against. On the one hand, its sirpercival and will be awesome, on the other hand I'd love to win so not too much awesome. I'm stalling, on with the PEACH

Image, and setup fluff are all good, solid, and more importantly spot on for the contest.

Prereqs
Hm... stealthy, chaotic, and Martial Lore? This shall be interesting. Overall, they're short, sweet, and direct. I approve. Although, you're Sublime Rogue seems like it should be able to fulfill the prereq with 3rd level maneuvers? Seems a little strange, as that gets you 3d6 Sneak Attack dice.

Chassis
Ha, might be easier to say what skills they don't have, but none jump out at me and scream that they don't belong, so it works. Standard rogue chassis throughout.

Features
Maneuvers and Stances
Half of the Swordsage's maneuvers, similar to Sublime Rogue. Seems to be almost a straight continuation of whatever you had before once you factor in the dips necessary for the Swordsage to qualify. As always, no maneuvers of any kind at 10 makes me sad. Hopefully the capstone makes up for it. 5 disciplines is a lot.

Surging Strike
Our main feature, and boy is it a feature. A feature of wonder. I'd note in the description that the dice and maximum increase according to the table shown, as currently it doesn't say that. Everything looks good here the effects are all generally beneficial, but completely Chaotic.

Wild Adept
There's several things I like here. First, its random Chaotic. Two, it generally balances positively, which since you're in the PrC it should give an overall benefit. However, what stops me from just going into a stance until I get the max +2 bonus for the day. It would also be nice to be given ranges for the dice rolls instead of a splattering on the table, but that's preference.

Sneak Attack
Good good, gotta continue our dice progression. The 3 and not 5 dice makes me sad, but it's actually balanced.

Wreak Havoc
This is everything that the Wild Mage PrC wanted to have their ability be. I approve.

Random Flash
Hm... the damage should probably be typed. I'd suggets Luck.

Cause Clamor
Well, things just got really hard to hit you, now didn't they. Might be starting to worry me a little. At least this one still targets you if your alone in the darkened corridor. Getting a save with your best save in addition to anything else makes everything look like Phantasmal Killer with saves. Cute, but not quite good enough anymore.

Entropy Flash
Yup, I'm worried. This one should definitely be typed, if only so it doesn't stack with everything. Again, I'd suggest Luck. Not sure if you've realized, but as written, you can do Entropy and Random Flashes in the same turn as a full-round.

Bring Bedlam
Yay, now I can dodge attacks and spells. Thats good. The secondary portion might make it a bit too cool though, but that's probably more due to my preferred power level.

Anarchy Flash
I'd suggest that this be [Mind-Affecting] but don't want to get shot by the people who whine about everything and it's mother being immune to that. Currently though, with the activation cost its fine as is. It does make me not want to tear up at the no maneuvers of tenth level.

Overall
It feels more powerful than my preferred comfort level, but its balanced in the level it falls into. It starts off with Rogue/Assassin feel, but then shifts into Anime Bard/Swiftblade/Rogue weirdness that I simultaneously want to hug and punch in the face. In the most loving of ways. Good job.

[Kazyan]

Bah, I'm retracting. I could get the entry done, but it's a bit far off the mark of the "Chaos" theme, so I'll wait until the next contest with another idea I like.

[Zelkon]

Well, the basis of mine is up, and I've made more even since posting it. Hope I can get it done in time for a PEACH! It's already a lot better than my first work, which was some horrible, horrible piece of work relating to Necromancy. What a mess. I like this much better, and I have a good grasp of the mechanics. Lots of dice rolls involved unfortunately. I'm trying to keep it on the low side. My favorite ability isn't even very chaotic though: at will explosive runes as long as you're wearing the target. It's totally badass and completely suicidal.

[Morph Bark]

Partway done with the Shifter of Elements. Shame I couldn't find a good picture of someone shifting from one element to another.

[sirpercival]

Partway done with the Shifter of Elements. Shame I couldn't find a good picture of someone shifting from one element to another.

How's this one?

[Morph Bark]

Hmmm, close enough I guess. I'm moreso looking for a picture of someone seemingly changing their body from one element to another, rather than casting two spells of different elements.

[inuyasha]

PEACHes

inuyasha
Abyssal Apprentice

Spoiler

Show

Pretty much figured there'd be at least one of these, and I was not disappointed. Let's see if the class keeps up with my anticipations. Hopefully you managed to get a bit more Chaos than Evil, but hey its the thought that counts.

Entry
(Whistles) Those prereqs are all over the place. Seducers can get in one level earlier (9) without shenanigans as is, though I'm sure if you try you can get in at 7. Seducers do get absolutely shafted with feats though, as those are two thrown-away feats as opposed to Power Attack and Cleave. I'd suggest if you're actually looking to make this a 10th level entry you up the skill prerequisites for each side to 13 ranks. Some feats more useful to Seducers would be nice as well, skillmonkeys can't afford to throw two away.

Chassis
That's a really good meaty chassis, though there's quite a few dead levels. Might want to look into filling those with something

Features
First, please order these so that they're actually given some more description. Many of these have no fluff at all alongside them, and even worse, make barely any sense from the little fluff in the class description. I'd love to see those lonely dead levels filled with some interesting demonic stuff. You can literally go anywhere with this at this point, so I really don't want to start directing you, but do something with your idea here.

Overall
Your class is top-heavy currently. Almost the entire class is the mechanical aspects in the chassis. This could go anywhere at this point, but it needs to go somewhere.

so do ye have any suggestions on what to fill the levels with or is this you cant help only peach kinda deal, I do appreciate it though thanks

[Zelkon]

I've tackled the abilities, now I just have to flesh out the alterations. It's a nice class, if a bit overpowered. I mean, 9th level spells and full BAB might not have been a great idea... Though its not till 20th level anyway.

[Dark.Revenant]

Due to an extremely busy week with multiple upcoming tests and triple-scheduled D&D to still worry about in the immediate future, I'm withdrawing the Stylemaster due to lack of time. The theme wasn't really synced right, either. In actual gameplay you have to be rather deliberate with your actions (this even holds for the source material; try button-mashing in DMC3 and you'll die in seconds).

[Morph Bark]

Hey Zelkon, it looks like you forgot to end your tables with a [/table] tag. Also, in the class table, the level 10 abilities are in the wrong area due to a missed |, and after BECOMING A FARCHAOS REALMSHAPER there should be a [ before the /color] to fix it.

Overall, I like your class. Love how you used Escher in it.

[Zelkon]

Hey Zelkon, it looks like you forgot to end your tables with a [/table] tag. Also, in the class table, the level 10 abilities are in the wrong area due to a missed |, and after BECOMING A FARCHAOS REALMSHAPER there should be a [ before the /color] to fix it.

Overall, I like your class. Love how you used Escher in it.

Heh, thanks. I fixed it but then ported over old formatting with the new abilities. Will fix. Almost done with fluff, then I need to do some work on the chaos roll and alterations. Escher was better in concept then execution, but his work was sort of the chassis for the class. I looked up a few paintings for ideas.

[Zelkon]

Gah! No way I can do this before midnight! So many tables...So many random effects...So much not in the SRD... Gotta actually get out my books...ZOMBIE!

[Morph Bark]

Aaaaaaand in true Moripphic fashion, it's done just in time! No picture, because obviously a PrC that involves shapeshifting can never be truly represented properly by any one single image.

[Zelkon]

This royally sucks. I'm not going to be able to get done after all this work. SO CLOSE! It's a really great fun class. Just finished the spell list; I wanna play this thing.

[Felyndiira]

I mostly tried to write my chaos theory class off-line, although I ran into a solid prismatic wall when trying to figure out how to codify the mechanics.

Best of luck to everyone that entered, though :).

[Spate]

Sorry if that was ****ty. Had to finish it from my iPhone!

[Morph Bark]

I was made aware that there are a few small wording issues with my PrC's abilities with regards to spellshaping (mostly referring to formula as "spells", like "shaping spells" instead of "shaping formula", an easy mistake since it's called spellshaping after all). Since the PrC's deadline has already passed though, I will refrain from correcting this in the entry itself and will instead update it to be correct in a thread of its own.

[sirpercival]

I was made aware that there are a few small wording issues with my PrC's abilities with regards to spellshaping (mostly referring to formula as "spells", like "shaping spells" instead of "shaping formula", an easy mistake since it's called spellshaping after all). Since the PrC's deadline has already passed though, I will refrain from correcting this in the entry itself and will instead update it to be correct in a thread of its own.

Hey Morph, how would the SoE interact with the Sage?

[Zelkon]

1. Is it alright to submit something partially incomplete?
2. Is it alright to edit my post with the changes I made last night?
3. Is it alright to finish what I have?
I assume No, Yes, and No, but thought I should ask.

[Morph Bark]

Hey Morph, how would the SoE interact with the Sage?

I hadn't looked at the Sage yet, to be honest. After a quick skim of the class, I presume you mean the interaction with Awaken Element? I think it would interact the same way other PrCs would that advance spellshaping in the same manner most spellshaping PrCs do (which is the same as ToB PrCs), so he'd just simply get all the formula of his chosen circle at once. As for the SoE's side of things, he'd be very limited in his choices, since he only has access to one circle, you'd think. However, the Reshape Formula feat requires knowledge of at least one formula from five different circles, so the Sage sadly couldn't enter at all without getting formulae from other circles somehow. I'll put that explicitly and seperately into the entry requirements. It was one of the things I remembered I should change, but I only remembered after the deadline.

Or was there something else you meant?

1. Is it alright to submit something partially incomplete?
2. Is it alright to edit my post with the changes I made last night?
3. Is it alright to finish what I have?
I assume No, Yes, and No, but thought I should ask.

It is generally alright to edit and finish up when the voting thread isn't up yet (as long as ErrantX hasn't called the deadline in the entry thread or the chat thread, at least), IIRC. I may be confusing the PrC Contest for the Base Class Challenge. At any rate, finishing up like that at least would give you a small chance, in case ErrantX allows it, which is better than nothing, and if he doesn't allow it, you still have a kickass PrC you can post outside of the contest and get comments on.

[Zelkon]

I'll get to work and see what happens.

[sirpercival]

Think I could get away with fixing 2 typos I found in the Executor?