Pokémon XII: Truth of the Ideal Thread

[Prime32]

I mean, theoretically TMs can be created and sold. Assuming you could create one of any move, it then becomes a matter of figuring out how to use your TM on any Pokemon. Though I do still express confusion as to how you teach a Pokemon a move by applying a CD to their head until a special sound plays...

I always assumed that they were demonstration videos or something.

[OracleofWuffing]

This is the first I've heard of that rule. It might not be recommended for competent deckbuilding, but I've never heard of that rule.

Bingo.

I mean, I don't know what all this "draw power" stuff is, we decked ourselves just fine with four Bills and four Oaks back in the day, I don't know how you can draw better than decking yourself, but keep in mind I speak of an older generation, and well, sure, you could run more than two basic energy card types, but it'd be like playing a Monk at a Tome of Battle table, or playing a Truenamer next to an Incantrix.

Also, having no money for CCGs at this point, I've been playing a bit of Pokémon TCG Online...

[...]

And that's not even getting into their "luck" with the coin flips.

Case in point, the first rule of competent deck building was "Only Electabuzz may flip coins. And maybe Articuno."
That said, the idea is that you're supposed to go out and buy physical card decks, and those have a code you can put in to unlock those decks in the game. I don't think that'll provide much advantage, though, 'cause nobody plays preconstructed decks out of the box, so they're just as simple as the other decks only with different types.

But yeah, when you are (were?) forced to play with low-op decks, you can expect the game to change based on coin flips.

[Mando Knight]

I mean, I don't know what all this "draw power" stuff is, we decked ourselves just fine with four Bills and four Oaks back in the day

Emcee's Chatter is a Super-Bill. Fail? It's Bill. Succeed? It's better. There's probably lots I don't know about, but that's one that's been cheesing me off, as the computers get it but I don't in TCG online.

That said, the idea is that you're supposed to go out and buy physical card decks, and those have a code you can put in to unlock those decks in the game. I don't think that'll provide much advantage, though, 'cause nobody plays preconstructed decks out of the box, so they're just as simple as the other decks only with different types.

Well, yes. I figured that. Still, the online system as a whole is technically in beta, so I think allowing deckbuilding is something they'll focus on later.

But yeah, when you are (were?) forced to play with low-op decks, you can expect the game to change based on coin flips.

They're good to learn on: the online Basic Fire deck is built to blast away your opponent with high-power, high-energy (and often energy-burning) attacks.

[tgva8889]

There are so many cards that are straight up better than Bill these days. Cheren is a card that actually reads "Draw 3 cards." That's it. No frills, nothing special, just do it. There are others, like one that's "Discard an energy, then draw 4 cards" and one that's "look at the top 8 cards of your deck, reveal all the energy, then put those into your hand and shuffle the rest away," and one that's "Look at the top 5 cards, choose 2 to your hand and discard the rest." There's also a card that lets you search for any 3 Basic Pokemon and put them into your hand. Bill is just old hat. Also, they "balanced" the card drawing by making it so that you can only play 1 such trainer per turn.

There's also Magnezone, whose Pokemon Power actually says "Draw until you have 6 in your hand," and there's Cleffa, whose attack for 0 Energy says "Shuffle your hand into your deck and draw 6 cards" and then it becomes almost invulnerable. There's also Ninetails, which turns all your Fire Energy into Cherens.

[Mando Knight]

There's also Ninetails, which turns all your Fire Energy into Cherens.

There's another Ninetails that grabs three Fire Energy from the discards and attaches them to any of your Pokémon. It's an attack (but only one Energy), though, but one of the "wait, this deck has the potential to work" moments I had with the TCG Online's fire deck was realizing just how easy it is for it to pull Energy out of your discards between Fisherman (four directly to your hand), Burning Tower (Stadium that gives each player a chance to pull one energy to the hand on their turn), and that Ninetails.

(And there's another Ninetails with a null-energy attack that pulls a random amount of Fire Energy from the deck onto your Pokémon, but that's not included in the basic Online decks...)

[tgva8889]

A "random" amount". Which 50% of the time is 0. Yeah, somehow that doesn't seem worth the slot when I could play a Ninetails that turns my Fire Energys into Cherens.

The fact that it's an attack makes it a bit weaker. From what I've played, the TCG is about who can set up fastest and stay set up longest.

[OracleofWuffing]

Emcee's Chatter is a Super-Bill. Fail? It's Bill. Succeed? It's better.

Well, pre-errata, I wouldn't be too certain. Most old decks would prefer to draw eight cards in one turn than twelve cards over four turns.

(And there's another Ninetails with a null-energy attack that pulls a random amount of Fire Energy from the deck onto your Pokémon, but that's not included in the basic Online decks...)

What did I just tell you about flipping coins?

No, seriously, that's the Zeitgeist from back when. You shouldn't use a Poke Ball, for example, because Computer Search will grab you the card you want without a fifty percent chance of doing nothing.

That said, I'm one to talk about this, 'cause one of my real-life decks started out as, "FLIP SO MANY COINS THAT I HAVE TO HIT A LUCKY STREAK SOMETIME."

[Mando Knight]

Shh. The point isn't the particulars, it's that the game has moved on.

Darth Vader Riding Charizard: Argument is invalid.

Spoiler

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[OracleofWuffing]

Wouldn't that be an 8x weakness to Stealth Rock? I wouldn't play it.

[tgva8889]

What do you mean? Darth Vader is Steel/Dark type. He resists Stealth Rocks.

[OracleofWuffing]

He's Flying/Dark in the Digitally Remastered 3D version.

[The-Mage-King]

Hm... I'm considering doing a runthrough of one of my Gen4 games. Magicarp with everstone as my "starter", with only a mercy Pidgey/Pidove to help.


Should I?

[tgva8889]

He's Flying/Dark in the Digitally Remastered 3D version.

Wait, what? How is he not Steel/Dark?

[OracleofWuffing]

Well, George Lucas was involved.

[Mando Knight]

Well, George Lucas was involved.

No, see, Vader is like Scizor. As Anakin, he was such a wizard with fighters while (still being moody) that he was Dark/Flying. Then he got thrown into a lava pit while Obi-Wan traded him to Palpatine, which evolved him into the Dark/Steel Vader.

[tgva8889]

I still don't get the Flying-type. I'd more likely consider him Dark/Psychic or Dark/Fighting. Or even Fighting/Psychic, slowly transforming to Dark as he "evolved" into a Sith.

[AtlanteanTroll]

I still don't get the Flying-type. I'd more likely consider him Dark/Psychic or Dark/Fighting. Or even Fighting/Psychic, slowly transforming to Dark as he "evolved" into a Sith.

But after the whole lava incident, he needs the Steel typing...

[tgva8889]

I'm talking about Anakin Skywalker there. Darth Vader is quite obviously Steel/Dark type.

[AtlanteanTroll]

I'm talking about Anakin Skywalker there. Darth Vader is quite obviously Steel/Dark type.

Oh... Derpin'

[OracleofWuffing]

So, what you're saying is, you expect George Lucas to do something that makes logical sense and benefits the entire nerddom, as opposed to making a bad decision involving a rereleaseremake that's still good business sense because it'll profit anyways?

...

Oh my gosh it worked! I've finally reached a parallel dimension!

[Mando Knight]

I still don't get the Flying-type. I'd more likely consider him Dark/Psychic or Dark/Fighting. Or even Fighting/Psychic, slowly transforming to Dark as he "evolved" into a Sith.

The one thing he's good at other than swinging laser swords around and complaining about how The Man is keeping him down is flying things.

[tgva8889]

Yes, but there are only 3 Pokemon in all 5 generations that are Flying-type that don't have wings, and that's because they're all sitting on weather events. He doesn't have wings. He's very clearly a Humanshape Pokemon, and none of those are Flying-type. He can learn Fly if necessary, though honestly I think the best he can do is Jump Kick. As a Jedi, he's probably Fighting/Psychic type. As a Sith, he's either Fighting/Dark or Psychic/Dark, most likely. I'd go with Fighting/Dark, as his training gives him Fighting status and his switch from Light Side to Dark Side makes him Dark-type. You could also argue Normal instead of Fighting for Jedi, but I think Flying makes no sense on what is clearly a human being.

Now Darth Vader's TIE Fighter, that'd be Flying-type.

Edit: I don't really care what Lucas did or did not do. Based on Pokemon precedent and my understanding of what Anakin Skywalker is, he cannot possibly be Flying-type.

[OracleofWuffing]

Yes, but there are only 3 Pokemon in all 5 generations that are Flying-type that don't have wings, and that's because they're all sitting on weather events.

Drifloon and Drifblim maybe have wings if you use your imagination, but... What about Doduo and Dodrio!?

E: And Gyarados. Maybe Jumpluff, too.

[tgva8889]

It's arguable that Gyarados has wings, but okay, so I didn't actually go research all of them. But Anakin is very rarely floating in the air of his own accord, unlike several of those guys. And Doduo and Dodrio are quite clearly birds and have feathers. I'd give them way more of a pass than a human with supernatural abilities to move objects and manipulate minds. Though it still eludes me as to how Dodrio could use Fly in any game ever.

[OracleofWuffing]

Same way Doduo does it, but with 25 more base speed.

[Qwertystop]

Though it still eludes me as to how Dodrio could use Fly in any game ever.

Helicopternecks.

EDIT: Ninjaed, plus you found the link...

[boj0]

Guess who has an upgraded laptop with functioning internet?

[tgva8889]

Black Lanturn Gengar?

[Terry576]

Finally got a Pokemon of the Ground/Dragon variety.

Now to try and grind him in the Battle Subway even though that IS PROBABLY IMPOSSIBLE

(I hate grinding Gabite. So much. His stats are just so terrible )

[OracleofWuffing]

Um, yeah. You can't gain any experience points in the Battle Subway, so...