American Mythology Setting (Help is welcome!)

[Zap Dynamic]

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Here's what I'm thinking. The x to the east is the location of the capital. The x to the west is the New Orleans equivalent ("Narrowton"?) and the gateway to the west. The x to the north is a grain/timber hub, and is a Chicago equivalent.

[Omeganaut]

I feel like you need to re-evaluate all the things that have gone into the American mythos. I will try and list all of them, but I probably will forget at least one. Also, are you including anything on Middle or Southern America?

Mexican (Evil beings in the Night, Holy beings to protect us)
English (witch trials, Dealing with the Devil)
Urban Legends (sewer crocodile, Headless Horseman, Rip Van Winkle)
Based on Fact (inventors, generals, other celebs)
Cowboy (Some superstition, gunslingers, outlaws)
African (Slave beliefs, superstition, song)
Carribean (voodoo, mind control, diseases)

Native American
Pueblo (Coyote, Raven)
Northern tribes (Brother Bear-esque)
Plains ( vision quest, Wendigo)
East Coast (competing tribes, clan patrons)
Central American (Mayan Calendar, Aztec anthromorphicism)

If you choose to include southern America, include some of the myths of the native rainforest tribes, the Inca, and the Spanish and Portuguese settlers. I confess to not knowing much about their beliefs.

Also, a big part of the myths and legends that sprung up around the west was the sheer size and emptiness of them. Indians could be hiding behind the next hill, or days away. You swore you could see anything coming for miles, but something you don't recognize just spooked your cattle. Those distances made the wild west what it was. Reducing that element as much as you are will cause issues. I'd extend the gulf from the Chesapeake instead of the Gulf of Mexico if I were making the map. Also make sure you have plenty of deep forest in the eastern half, it feed the first colonial fantasies as well as much of the Eastern tribes' beliefs.

[Ninjadeadbeard]

Here's what I'm thinking. The x to the east is the location of the capital. The x to the west is the New Orleans equivalent ("Narrowton"?) and the gateway to the west. The x to the north is a grain/timber hub, and is a Chicago equivalent.

How about Coterois for the Big Easy? I put Cote (coast) and the word for narrow together. And "Chicago" could be Planton (as in "Plains Town").

Also, a big part of the myths and legends that sprung up around the west was the sheer size and emptiness of them. Indians could be hiding behind the next hill, or days away. You swore you could see anything coming for miles, but something you don't recognize just spooked your cattle. Those distances made the wild west what it was. Reducing that element as much as you are will cause issues. I'd extend the gulf from the Chesapeake instead of the Gulf of Mexico if I were making the map. Also make sure you have plenty of deep forest in the eastern half, it feed the first colonial fantasies as well as much of the Eastern tribes' beliefs.

Can't speak for Zap, but as for the map, I'm pretty sure size won't be an issue. If I had to make a judgment call, I'd say that from the East Coast to those western mountains is roughly the size of RL America. Pseudo-America is quite a bit bigger, cause that's the kinda space you need for Tall Tales.

That joke sounded better in my head.

[Zap Dynamic]

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I feel like you need to re-evaluate all the things that have gone into the American mythos. I will try and list all of them, but I probably will forget at least one. Also, are you including anything on Middle or Southern America?

Mexican (Evil beings in the Night, Holy beings to protect us)
English (witch trials, Dealing with the Devil)
Urban Legends (sewer crocodile, Headless Horseman, Rip Van Winkle)
Based on Fact (inventors, generals, other celebs)
Cowboy (Some superstition, gunslingers, outlaws)
African (Slave beliefs, superstition, song)
Carribean (voodoo, mind control, diseases)

Native American
Pueblo (Coyote, Raven)
Northern tribes (Brother Bear-esque)
Plains ( vision quest, Wendigo)
East Coast (competing tribes, clan patrons)
Central American (Mayan Calendar, Aztec anthromorphicism)

If you choose to include southern America, include some of the myths of the native rainforest tribes, the Inca, and the Spanish and Portuguese settlers. I confess to not knowing much about their beliefs.

This is great info, thanks! I always prefer to have short, distilled examples of the various cultures at work, so this will help us out a lot. Honestly, I had been wanting to work on this pretty early in the process, but we got swept up into the map, and I put this on the back burner. Any chance you'd want to stick around and help flesh out the cultures a bit?

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Also, a big part of the myths and legends that sprung up around the west was the sheer size and emptiness of them. Indians could be hiding behind the next hill, or days away. You swore you could see anything coming for miles, but something you don't recognize just spooked your cattle. Those distances made the wild west what it was. Reducing that element as much as you are will cause issues. I'd extend the gulf from the Chesapeake instead of the Gulf of Mexico if I were making the map. Also make sure you have plenty of deep forest in the eastern half, it feed the first colonial fantasies as well as much of the Eastern tribes' beliefs.

I'm not so much worried about this. I had been assuming that this landmass was about as big as the US from coast-to-coast, but I like what Ninja is saying.

Still, even if it's only the size of the US, let's crunch some numbers. The whole continent is about 2,500 miles wide. In the west (where most of those "wide open emptiness" stories take place), that southern desert is about 1000 miles wide and about as tall, meaning that it would take a solid month of travel on horseback to make it from any one side to another. Even that northern neck would be about 450 miles wide, which is almost 15 days of nothing but travel on horseback. Both of those travel times would basically double when you're talking about carriages and wagons.

So the neck is actually narrower than in the RL US, but that southern desert is a good deal bigger. In my mind, all we've really done is take Mexico, flip it upside down, and call it good. Because of that (and especially because Americans love big things), we've created a situation where the US has a reason to prolong its war against Mexico, which I figure makes for more Gaming fodder anyway.

[Zap Dynamic]

How about Coterois for the Big Easy? I put Cote (coast) and the word for narrow together. And "Chicago" could be Planton (as in "Plains Town").

I'm digging Coterois big time. However, "Planton" sounds a little weird to me. This city is going to be a gateway to the north, it will be a railroad hub, a meeting place between the plains and the sea... what else can we come up with? I'm even okay with something as straight forward as Grass City, but that sounds a little too "small town" for me.

[Ninjadeadbeard]

I'm digging Coterois big time. However, "Planton" sounds a little weird to me. This city is going to be a gateway to the north, it will be a railroad hub, a meeting place between the plains and the sea... what else can we come up with? I'm even okay with something as straight forward as Grass City, but that sounds a little too "small town" for me.

Railtown. Bigtime. Venteux (windy). Zweibel (onion, as in The Big Onion).

Or, Neugotham. As in, New Gotham. I guess The Dark Knight was filmed there a lot, so they use that as a nickname. Maybe a variation? Dunno.

[TheMeMan]

This is great info, thanks! I always prefer to have short, distilled examples of the various cultures at work, so this will help us out a lot. Honestly, I had been wanting to work on this pretty early in the process, but we got swept up into the map, and I put this on the back burner. Any chance you'd want to stick around and help flesh out the cultures a bit?

Although I didn't post that message, let me help flesh out some Mexican Gods from colonial periods for a bit of background, and a short description of each:

Xipe-Totec: Our Lord the Flayed One, God of Old Corn(Dried Corn), Fertility, Warfare, Rebirth/Renewal, Gold & Silver Smiths, warrior sacrifice; Depicted as a Golden Skinned God (Literally and Figuratively, depending on context) who wore the flayed skins of sacrificed warriors. Both revered highly and feared to an extent(Due to being an aspect Tetzcatlipoca-more on that later).

Tlaloc: God of storms, rain, and Lightning. Any who were struck by lightning were said to have been "chosen" by Tlaloc, and became "mini-Tlalocs" so-to-speak. Each of these Little Tlalocs would cast thunderbolts in a Storm, and cause the rain to fall. Extremely Old God predating Aztecs and Mayan(I forget which period he first appears in Mayan). Depicting as a man with a reptilian face and crocodile like features wearing jade "goggles" over his eyes. Once again, both feared and revered(Brought life through rain, but also destruction through thunderstorms).

Huitzilopochtli: Hummingbird on the Left, the patron god of the Aztecs. He was the left handed God of War who sprang from his mother's womb fully armed and armored in war attire. He slew his brothers and sisters(Who had entrapped his mother) who later became the stars. His name refers to the fact that his voice was said to be like that of a hummingbird's wingflaps: Fleeting, quick, and very quiet. Led the Aztecs to lake Texcoco from their mythical homeland of Azatlan. Depicted as a normal-ish Man.

Tetzcatlipoca: Smoking Mirror, Brother & Rival to Quetzalcoatl. He was a vengeful God that was feared and revered extremely heavily. The original rivalry with his brother began over means of Sacrifice: Tetzcatlipoca demanded human sacrifices, whereas Quetzalcoatl demanded animal and plant sacrifices. In some stories is one of the four main creators of the current world(There are several versions). He is a tutelary god, and capable of traversing the Heavens, Earth, and the Underwold unheeded. Associated with Obsidian, which when highly polished was used in rituals to "see" into the various supernatural realms. Called the Invisible One at times, was always watching every action of individuals. Has Four Aspects, each associated with a different cardinal direction. Each Aspect is effectively Tetzcatlipoca, although still being a distinct being of their own. The most well-known and heavily worshipped was Xipe Totec, also known as Red Tetzcatlipoca. Depicted as a dark-skinned person with a yellow painted stripe on his face. Missing one of his feet, and in it's place has an Obsidian Mirror.

Quetzalcoatl: The Feathered Serpent. Quetzal has many different roles: At times he is a culture Hero, at other a mythical person of great wisdom and ability, at others a God and brother to Tetzcatlipoca, and still at others a primordial being beyond the power of the Gods themselves. He is all of these things at once, and each is different and separate from the other. The Primordial Quetzalcoatl is truly as the name suggests: A feathered serpent of great power and magnitude. Controller of the Sun, the Winds, and bringer of all life(At defender against darkness), the Primordial Form is perhaps the most heavily worshipped deity in Mesoamerica(Next to Tlaloc, another Primordial deity). The Second, that of the God, is the next most powerful incarnation. Quetzal the God was the "boundary maker" between the Earth and Sky. Some creation myths place him(With Tetzcatlipoca) as a main figure. As the Culture Hero & Mythical Figure, he was true flesh and blood. His argument over sacrifice with Tetzcatlipoca was an important impetus for the different forms of sacrifice practiced. This argument led to the departure of Quetzal the culture hero from the area to a place "in the west". Quetzal differs in depiction based on which version you are talking about. He also had the Aspect of Ehacatl, the Wind God and God of Movement(Movement being incredibly important in Aztec belief systems). In this form, he appears as an anthropomorphic figure with a "Bill", similar to that on a duck. In other forms, he his pale-skinned and Bearded.

If any of this piques your interest, I'd be more than willing to continue the list of Mesoamerican(Mainly Aztec) Deities.

I also know a few Ojibwe, Sioux, and other Northern tribe myths.

[Zap Dynamic]

Although I didn't post that message, let me help flesh out some Mexican Gods from colonial periods for a bit of background, and a short description of each:

*cue awesome information*

Thanks!! This is some really good stuff... and why does a lot of it remind me of House Bolton from A Song of Ice and Fire??

Here's what I'm thinking. I've been looking for a way to work in this potentially-ancient alien thing, and in another setting of mine I had this idea where the gods of the present civilization are--unbeknown to the present folk--ascended mortals from a previous era.

What if the Boradoans worshipped a council of aliens that ruled them thousands of years ago? The aliens left a long time ago, leaving their technology behind, but the Boradoans lived in such fear of their new gods that they refuse to go near it. They live in the northern portion of the desert and refuse to let anyone go further south, which gives the Empire a reason to go to war with them. Thoughts?

If any of this piques your interest, I'd be more than willing to continue the list of Mesoamerican(Mainly Aztec) Deities.

I also know a few Ojibwe, Sioux, and other Northern tribe myths.

It certainly does, but I don't know how much I want to flesh out the southern folk. Any info you have on northern American myths would be greatly appreciated, though. I'm thinking that the conflict between the tribes and the Empire is going to be a big deal.

[Omeganaut]

I will confess to not having memorized much of the myths I mentioned, so I don't know that I would be a great source. However, your thoughts regarding aliens sparked some historical knowledge.

The Anasazi were ancient pueblo dwellers that had more advanced buildings and crop use than the pueblo Indians that were found by the Europeans. They created extremely elaborate cities, and possessed trade goods from everywhere else in the Americas. They hauled lumber along paths nearly as impressive as was required for Stonehenge. All of the pueblo ancestor myths identify their tribe with these "ancients". Then, in about a generation, all of their cities were abandoned. There is limited evidence of droughts, pestilence, and crop failure, but nothing more than those people had weathered before. And that still wouldn't explain the sudden move away from Every city they had established and the dispersal of their peoples. With a little renaming, you could use a similar myth and tie in your aliens. Perhaps all of the natives were once part of that civilization.

Also, most of the North American natives have creation myths involving humanity emerging from a hole in the ground along with most of the animals. Also important to natives is their land, especially the further west you go. The natives believe their land is sacred, and will not allow themselves to be completely removed from their land except by overpowering force.

[TheMeMan]

Thanks!! This is some really good stuff... and why does a lot of it remind me of House Bolton from A Song of Ice and Fire??

Here's what I'm thinking. I've been looking for a way to work in this potentially-ancient alien thing, and in another setting of mine I had this idea where the gods of the present civilization are--unbeknown to the present folk--ascended mortals from a previous era.

What if the Boradoans worshipped a council of aliens that ruled them thousands of years ago? The aliens left a long time ago, leaving their technology behind, but the Boradoans lived in such fear of their new gods that they refuse to go near it. They live in the northern portion of the desert and refuse to let anyone go further south, which gives the Empire a reason to go to war with them. Thoughts?

I don't know much about Song of F&I, so I haven't the slightest. The major thing to remember about Mesoamerican Pantheons is that there was a God for EVERYTHING. Gambling, prostitutes, merchants, guides throw the underworld, various underworld deities, Old Corn, New Corn, Corn Planting, Gold, Silver, several Water deities, Jade, Priests, War, Sacrifice... the list goes on and on. If you can think of it, there was a separate God for it. That said, I won't go into detail, as you're not going to focus on it, but it is something to keep in mind. Also, the concept of "Different but the same" is very important: Certain gods had different aspects of themselves that were separate entities but still the same as the original god.

As for the Aliens concept, it's a fairly tried-and-true concept for fiction involving the various mythos. Nothing wrong with that, mind you. The Deities and such were strange beings of actual flesh, capable of miraculous endeavors.

It certainly does, but I don't know how much I want to flesh out the southern folk. Any info you have on northern American myths would be greatly appreciated, though. I'm thinking that the conflict between the tribes and the Empire is going to be a big deal.

Alright, perhaps to start with we should go with creation myths, and one the best known, and most common, is the story of Lone Man. Now remember, there are various versions and myths involving him, and I'm going to relate a couple. One thing to keep in mind is that almost all Native American myths relate towards behavior: Either explaining why the group does something, or why a person should act in a certain way over another.

Various Algonkian(Northern Tribe) Creation Myths: Long ago, there was no land, only water, upon the earth. Otter decided to create Land, and dove deep into the water to find mud to create land. Down he dove, but he could not reach the bottom. Turtle tried as well, but could not reach the bottom. Finally, Duck attempted to reach the bottom. Down he went, deep below surface, deeper than Otter, deeper than Turtle. He wasn't sure if he could make it, and was about to return to the surface. However, just as he was about to turn around, he saw the bottom of the Lake. With every bit of energy he had, he went to the bottom, and barely was able to touch it with his bill. He was able to get a small bit of mud onto his bill, and swam to the surface. When he surfaced, this mud became land. Note: Some versions tell that this occurs after the flood myth related later.

Mandan Creation: The First involves the creation of the village(concept) and the earth(place). I'm paraphrasing, so keep this in mind. Basically, long ago Lone Man and First Creator created the Earth. The Northern Lands were created by Lone Man, and the Southern lands created by First Creator. Lone Man created domesticated crops, the villages(the concept of them, so to speak), the various goods needed for life within the "village", etc. The Southern lands had everything wild: The hills, the trees, the wild animals, and unknown expanses. At this time there were no people in the world above: Instead they all lived deep underground. A few found their way to the surface, and settled in the Northern Lands, becoming the first people. Others remained below, and depending on the given myth became Bears(Sometimes referred to Old Men), or spirits of the earth, or what have you(There are dozens of different versions). The people that came to the surface, however, became the original people.

Flood Myth: It was after some time that a great flood came to the lands, threatening the villages that people resided in. It was at this time that villages were found everywhere within the land, from the valley bottoms to the middle of the plains. In fear of his life, Lone Man climbed the tallest hill to escape from the coming waters. Depending on the exact version, Lone Man was the only person left(Once again, we enter into the different but same territory of a culture-hero who happens to also be a God, but is not really). It is for this reason the the villages are built on the tops of bluffs and hills.

Wendigo: Essentially, Wendigo refers to cannibals. It's a tad different depending on the exact nature of the story, but essentially once an individual devours human flesh, they crave nothing else. They go mad and will do anything to eat human flesh again. Further, they are always hungry, and never satiated. Some myths state that the person transforms into a horrid beast, others that the person remains mostly "human". Note that the depiction of the Wendigo is that of a humanoid he is emaciated, skin pulled tightly over their bones, and a rather horrifying remnant of what was once human. That said, it really depends on which groups your talking about. The Wendigo represents everything that is opposite of "human" and "village": They are greedy, gluttonous, destructive beasts who have no semblance of recognition for society.

Note: I have many, many more, and will post more later. I'd go with Lone Man at the very least as a major entity. Myths involving him are widespread, and he is about as close to a "Deity" as you get within the mythos. He essentially represents what people should be, and strive to be. He is an example for man-kind, in essence. The Wendigo would make a great monster concept, also.

Note #2: Another important figure, which I will touch on later, is Coyote. Thing to remember about him is that he is an incorrigible trickster, although extremely dimwitted. He often has bouts with Raven, with Raven often times besting him with superior wit.

[Zap Dynamic]

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The Anasazi were ancient pueblo dwellers that had more advanced buildings and crop use than the pueblo Indians that were found by the Europeans. They created extremely elaborate cities, and possessed trade goods from everywhere else in the Americas. They hauled lumber along paths nearly as impressive as was required for Stonehenge. All of the pueblo ancestor myths identify their tribe with these "ancients". Then, in about a generation, all of their cities were abandoned. There is limited evidence of droughts, pestilence, and crop failure, but nothing more than those people had weathered before. And that still wouldn't explain the sudden move away from Every city they had established and the dispersal of their peoples. With a little renaming, you could use a similar myth and tie in your aliens. Perhaps all of the natives were once part of that civilization.

I like it! So we've got these southern alien gods with their advanced technology, and we've got these Boradoans who live in the north of the desert, preventing anyone from coming closer to the Place of the Gods. Maybe a faction of the Boradoans sought to use the Gods' Gifts, and were expelled further north by their brethren, turning into these Anasazi. The Anasazi grew into a huge kingdom with the boon of their technology, and could serve as another major threat to the expanding Empire. Thoughts?

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Also, most of the North American natives have creation myths involving humanity emerging from a hole in the ground along with most of the animals. Also important to natives is their land, especially the further west you go. The natives believe their land is sacred, and will not allow themselves to be completely removed from their land except by overpowering force.

Coming out of the ground... what if the Rocky Mountains were one of their most sacred places? They consider it the birthplace of all life, and guard it fiercely? The rocky mountains become a sort of bastion of native power?

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Alright, perhaps to start with we should go with creation myths, and one the best known, and most common, is the story of Lone Man. Now remember, there are various versions and myths involving him, and I'm going to relate a couple. One thing to keep in mind is that almost all Native American myths relate towards behavior: Either explaining why the group does something, or why a person should act in a certain way over another.

*cue info*

I dig it. Creation of the world, creation of society, and the destruction and salvation of society. We can use all of that. Especially the hilltop thing, which enforces the Rockies idea above.

For wendigos, I think I like the idea of monsters being created via transformation. Any person can become a monster if they're not careful. It could also be the fragment myths from a zombie onslaught hundreds of years ago.

I picture some forbidden place (a huge canyon, maybe?) where it is said that these Wendigo still live. Maybe sometimes people go to this place, but never return?

As far as native cultures, here's what it looks like we've got (Green=we've got it; Red=I want it):

• Boradoans: Guardians of the desert. I'm getting strong Proud Warrior Race Guy vibes from this.
• Anasazi (needs a new name): Advanced kingdom that lives in the neck of the desert. Poses a threat to the Empire.
• Mountain Tribes: Guard the mountain from incursions, possible alliance with subterranean race. I'm imagining these guys as primitive, but still effective because they're stealthy. Also, because of modern-day Colorado, I imagine them being rock climbers, athletes, and stoners.
• Northeast Coast Tribes: I like the idea of fisher folk in the Northeast. These guy may be pretty peaceful, and may actually form an alliance with the Empire.
• Plains tribe: Wanderers and warriors. Teepees and Buffalo. Fighting a losing battle against the Empire.
• Eastern tribes: Either extinct due to the Empire, very nearly extinct, or fled to the north or west.

I think it's worth mentioning that while these cultures are based off of Native Americans, I don't think these races necessarily need to be. We can make them look however we'd like, and it may be nice to use standard fantasy races. Thoughts?

[TheMeMan]

As far as native cultures, here's what it looks like we've got (Green=we've got it; Red=I want it):

• Boradoans: Guardians of the desert. I'm getting strong Proud Warrior Race Guy vibes from this.
• Anasazi (needs a new name): Advanced kingdom that lives in the neck of the desert. Poses a threat to the Empire.
• Mountain Tribes: Guard the mountain from incursions, possible alliance with subterranean race. I'm imagining these guys as primitive, but still effective because they're stealthy. Also, because of modern-day Colorado, I imagine them being rock climbers, athletes, and stoners.
• Northeast Coast Tribes: I like the idea of fisher folk in the Northeast. These guy may be pretty peaceful, and may actually form an alliance with the Empire.
• Plains tribe: Wanderers and warriors. Teepees and Buffalo. Fighting a losing battle against the Empire.
• Eastern tribes: Either extinct due to the Empire, very nearly extinct, or fled to the north or west.

I think it's worth mentioning that while these cultures are based off of Native Americans, I don't think these races necessarily need to be. We can make them look however we'd like, and it may be nice to use standard fantasy races. Thoughts?

I can comment to fully right now, gotta get going. That said, I would reconsider the Northwest Coast people as being "peaceful". They were extremely war-like, with almost constant inter-tribal fighting occurring(Due to a very small amount of land available and dense populations). They were not exactly a friendly bunch of folk, with an extremely stratified society (With very clear Chiefs who held almost complete control over the village-something that was actually very rare for a single figure to have in most of the American tribes).

That said, looks decent so far. I'll give some history on the Real-Life regions when I get back to help you out even more. That said, don't assume that all Plains folk were nomadic. The Mandans had massive earth-lodge villages(Numbering, in some cases, in the thousands for population). They were centerred right smack-dab in the middle of the Northern Plains on the Missouri River in North Dakota. However, it still works. It might be an interesting note that the Village complex was predominant in Pre-Contact periods, and highly Nomadic folk were largely the result of the inter-Tribal conflicts, warfare, and competition for resources that was a direct result of the European incursion into areas east of the plains.

[Zap Dynamic]

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I can comment to fully right now, gotta get going. That said, I would reconsider the Northwest Coast people as being "peaceful". They were extremely war-like, with almost constant inter-tribal fighting occurring(Due to a very small amount of land available and dense populations). They were not exactly a friendly bunch of folk, with an extremely stratified society (With very clear Chiefs who held almost complete control over the village-something that was actually very rare for a single figure to have in most of the American tribes).

First off, I don't think I want this to be a 100% translation of American history and culture. I like the idea of taking inspiration from history, but I want to make it our own.

That said, I like the idea of at least one of the regions of natives being friendly toward the Empire. My first thought was the mountain people, but then I fell in love with the idea of those mountains being sacred to all the natives, which kind of removed that option from the table. I just threw out the Northeasterners as an idea because fishing is a pretty peaceful activity, but I'm not married to that notion just now. That said, the power being focused in just one individual is common ground between those Northeasterners and the Empire.

What about the plains people? Maybe they took to being nomadic because they've turned into teamsters for the Empire?

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That said, looks decent so far. I'll give some history on the Real-Life regions when I get back to help you out even more. That said, don't assume that all Plains folk were nomadic. The Mandans had massive earth-lodge villages(Numbering, in some cases, in the thousands for population). They were centerred right smack-dab in the middle of the Northern Plains on the Missouri River in North Dakota. However, it still works. It might be an interesting note that the Village complex was predominant in Pre-Contact periods, and highly Nomadic folk were largely the result of the inter-Tribal conflicts, warfare, and competition for resources that was a direct result of the European incursion into areas east of the plains.

That would provide dungeon fodder too! We could exaggerate and say that the plains people built huge underground cities (inspired by their legends about coming from holes in the earth), and then abandoned them when the Empire started meddling.

[TheMeMan]

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First off, I don't think I want this to be a 100% translation of American history and culture. I like the idea of taking inspiration from history, but I want to make it our own.

That said, I like the idea of at least one of the regions of natives being friendly toward the Empire. My first thought was the mountain people, but then I fell in love with the idea of those mountains being sacred to all the natives, which kind of removed that option from the table. I just threw out the Northeasterners as an idea because fishing is a pretty peaceful activity, but I'm not married to that notion just now. That said, the power being focused in just one individual is common ground between those Northeasterners and the Empire.

What about the plains people? Maybe they took to being nomadic because they've turned into teamsters for the Empire?



That would provide dungeon fodder too! We could exaggerate and say that the plains people built huge underground cities (inspired by their legends about coming from holes in the earth), and then abandoned them when the Empire started meddling.

Oh, no doubt on the subject of it being loosely based on American Indian tribes. That said, I'm a firm believer in have as much background info as possible.

As for the Plains folk being friendly to the Empire, that makes a bit of sense actually if you view the historical context that you basing it off of. The Plains Indians were relatively friendly to the Europeans for a great deal of time, and contributed a great deal of trade. Much of the buffalo hides up until the railroads were made came pretty much solely from trade with Plains Indians, as well as other animal furs and goods. It really wasn't until massive settlement expansion in the area that you start to see massive conflict between the groups.

An interesting tidbit to note, also, is that during this period various tribes coalesced into extremely large settlements in South Dakota(For the most part), and in other areas along the Missouri. It wasn't uncommon to have the Sioux, Arikara, and Cheyenne tribes all living in a single village.

Another interesting thing to keep in mind is the interaction between the Plains Indians and the Algonquian Indians(Northern Woodland area-Minnesota, much of Southern Canada, Ohio, etc). The short version is they despised one another. And this was not a product of European interaction, either, as there is a great deal of evidence that they two groups more or less were at constant conflict in Pre-Contact periods. Feuds between various folk were as old as the oral histories went back, basically. Of note is that many of the Algonquian Tribes would paint themselves from head to toe in red before they went to war.

To give you an idea of how much they disliked each other, the word "Sioux" is an insulting term in the Ojibwa language! It's not a Dakota term at all, and the name comes from the fact that the Ojibwa were in more contact with Europeans and earlier(Being from a bit further East, and more accessible), and couldn't help but insult their neighbors when asked about them. It is essentially calling them "Little Snakes". Close meaning in English would be "Little Bastards".

That all said, what would be even better than a friendly Plains folk would be a friendly Algonquian folk between the Plains and the Empire proper, with said group being in constant conflict of some sort or another with the Plains people. They were almost entirely left to their own devices, and did not have the history of major conflict with Europeans.

As for the underground complexes, I think that's a great idea actually. Would fit the bill perfectly.

[Zap Dynamic]

All of that sounds good, but I'm completely lost about what you're trying to say here:

That all said, what would be even better than a friendly Plains folk would be a friendly Algonquian folk between the Plains and the Empire proper, with said group being in constant conflict of some sort or another with the Plains people. They were almost entirely left to their own devices, and did not have the history of major conflict with Europeans.

Are you saying that the Algonquin should be physically between the Plains Folk and the Empire? And that they should be something like guerilla terrorists against the Plains Folk? That could be awesome.

I made this just now. Bear in mind, I made it based on this morning's info, so of course it's already not up to date.

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I imagine this to be a map representing the general spread of races/cultures/whatever across the continent. It's definitely not a map of actual nations/states. Here's the breakdown:

Purple represents Imperials. Manifest destiny and all that.

Yellow in the north represents the plains people. Considering the "let's push out the natives" attitude that we've established for the Empire, it would be reasonable to say that the Algonquin (name pending) folk got pushed out onto the plains too, and are currently fighting the normal plains folk.

Grey is the mountain men, fiercely guarding their homeland.

White is the Frost Peoples, chillin like they do. Could be hostile or friendly, I don't have any basis or opinion right now.

Red on the Western side is for the Northwesterners (I've been calling them Northeasterners this whole time! Whoops!). Fishers and such. Probably hostile.

Blue is for the Anasazi (again, name pending). Advanced culture (maybe magic instead of steampunk?) and at war with the Empire.

Green is for the Boradoans. Sweating in the desert while they guard their sacred spot.

Dark Red in the desert is for the Place of the Gods. I imagine it being a Steampunk Area 51.

Black is for a race of swamp people. I think it'd be cool if that whole region was basically worthless. The Empire officially claims it, but it's totally unsettled.

These are pretty lumpy categories. I imagine them showing the various races, and each race could (probably will) have several different cultures therein. Thoughts?

[Ninjadeadbeard]

Just adding my two cents to things:

Purple represents Imperials. Manifest destiny and all that.

I assume that any Natives living in the purple would have already been absorbed and/or exterminated long ago.

Yellow in the north represents the plains people. Considering the "let's push out the natives" attitude that we've established for the Empire, it would be reasonable to say that the Algonquin (name pending) folk got pushed out onto the plains too, and are currently fighting the normal plains folk.

Personally, I would move the purple border further west, at least so that the Imperials have that next northern gulf. Increases contact with the Frosties (or, Kannuks).

Grey is the mountain men, fiercely guarding their homeland.

A lot of Windigo's could hide in those mountains.

White is the Frost Peoples, chillin like they do. Could be hostile or friendly, I don't have any basis or opinion right now.

Definitely Canada. Friendly, eh?

As far as native cultures, here's what it looks like we've got (Green=we've got it; Red=I want it):

• Boradoans: Guardians of the desert. I'm getting strong Proud Warrior Race Guy vibes from this.
• Anasazi (needs a new name): Advanced kingdom that lives in the neck of the desert. Poses a threat to the Empire.
• Mountain Tribes: Guard the mountain from incursions, possible alliance with subterranean race. I'm imagining these guys as primitive, but still effective because they're stealthy. Also, because of modern-day Colorado, I imagine them being rock climbers, athletes, and stoners.
• Northeast Coast Tribes: I like the idea of fisher folk in the Northeast. These guy may be pretty peaceful, and may actually form an alliance with the Empire.
• Plains tribe: Wanderers and warriors. Teepees and Buffalo. Fighting a losing battle against the Empire.
• Eastern tribes: Either extinct due to the Empire, very nearly extinct, or fled to the north or west.

Personally, I would have the Northwestern tribes be peaceful. They just seem like California-Indians. I would also advise you to move the Anasazi farther south and stretch the Boradoan border to take its current place. I might be missing something, but it seems to me that since the Anasazi were Boradoans who chose to use their “Gods'” old supertech, they shouldn't be able to replicate it. While very Magitek, they should be severely limited in resources due to living in a desert and not having invented the tech themselves. The Boradoans, unless I miss my guess, are supposed to be like Mexico. That said, I think it should be mentioned that they are not full-blooded Natives, but rather a mix between the Natives and whatever this setting has for Europeans.

Actually, that's a great reason for them not using their Gods' old tech. The tech requires a full-blooded native. It's a gene-sensitive tech.

[TheMeMan]

All of that sounds good, but I'm completely lost about what you're trying to say here:


Are you saying that the Algonquin should be physically between the Plains Folk and the Empire? And that they should be something like guerilla terrorists against the Plains Folk? That could be awesome.

That's exactly what I meant.
I can see two distinct possibilities here:

1. The Algonquian types have their own distinct territory, and are settled in between the eastern portion of the empire and Plains Groups. They act as sort of an antonymous territory that are allies of some sort with the Empire. The Empire allows the territory to exist and not incorporate it as a form of "buffer" against the hostile Plains groups. They are constantly at war with said groups, with guerrilla style raids across the border into Plains territory, and vice-versa. This sort of fits with the Ojibwa and how the Europeans acted towards them pre-settlement period.

2. The Algonquian types have been fully incorporated into the Empire, and have no territory of their own. They may have a province of sorts within the territory of the Empire, but are under direct control by the Imperials. Once again, they are mainly settled close to the Plains territory. They have fully incorporated themselves into Imperial Society, and have very little of the "old ways" left within their society. The Empire uses them essentially as guerrilla fighters against the Plains, conducting covert strategic operations and the like. This would be more like the Southeast Indians, in particular the Cherokee (Who had completely adopted a European lifestyle and were a feared fighting force for both sides in the Civil War).

Edit:

Just saw the "Frost People". A very easy thing for a basis: Inuit. Widespread hunting folk whos technology is absolutely brilliant in it's complexity, and perfectly manufactured for a harsh environment. Not much for war or raids due to being very widespread. On the extremely rare occasion that they do make an attack, it is brief, fierce, and extremely violent. Yet they disappear almost as quickly as they attack, leaving very little trace. Attempting to track them in the frozen wilderness is next to impossible, largely due to the vast and hostile expanse they live in, but also due to their absolute and total knowledge of the area. Incursions into the region by the Empire have yielded only the briefest of glimpses of the people themselves, and more commonly the ghostly remnants of abandoned settlements. Few know much about them at all, and they keep largely out of the grander schemes of those in the South. If contact is somehow made, you find that they are neither Enemy nor Ally any group. Pleas or bargains for such and alliance fall on deaf ears. They will help you, give you food if they have it rather freely, as the food they eat is often plentiful when they have or non-existent if they do not. However, visitors would find the food unpalatable to say the least, as all manner of food is eaten raw.

Whooooo. How's that for a start? I imagine they would be "The Highest of the Low tech", probably incorporating ancient and primordial magics into their way of life.

[Zap Dynamic]

I assume that any Natives living in the purple would have already been absorbed and/or exterminated long ago.

Exactly.

Personally, I would move the purple border further west, at least so that the Imperials have that next northern gulf. Increases contact with the Frosties (or, Kannuks).

All of the Yellow is Imperial territory, too. This map is more of a "Dominant Ethnicity Map" than a true political map. I imagine the Empire claims every inch of land beneath the Frost peoples and above the Anasazi and Boradoans, it's just that sometimes there are very few Imperials in a given region. I'm actually thinking that the Northwest needs to be something other than purple in this map.

A lot of Windigo's could hide in those mountains.

Totes.

Personally, I would have the Northwestern tribes be peaceful. They just seem like California-Indians.

In my somewhat limited, midwestern experience, there are three kinds of people that live in Cali: Hippies, Dickwads, and homeless people.

Like I mentioned earlier, I pictured the mountain people to be the peaceful ones before I fell in love with the idea of them being fierce guardians of their peoples' "Eden." Colorado's full of hippies and stoners... but maybe there's still room for that here. Very territorial hippies.

I would also advise you to move the Anasazi farther south and stretch the Boradoan border to take its current place. I might be missing something, but it seems to me that since the Anasazi were Boradoans who chose to use their “Gods'” old supertech, they shouldn't be able to replicate it. While very Magitek, they should be severely limited in resources due to living in a desert and not having invented the tech themselves. The Boradoans, unless I miss my guess, are supposed to be like Mexico.

Having had time to think about it, I almost think the Anasazi should be more like the Mexicans. When I think about Mexicans in the wild west, my mind always jumps to Zorro, and the Anasazi area is exactly the place where I could imagine those sorts of adventures happening.

That said, I think it should be mentioned that they are not full-blooded Natives, but rather a mix between the Natives and whatever this setting has for Europeans.

Actually, that's a great reason for them not using their Gods' old tech. The tech requires a full-blooded native. It's a gene-sensitive tech.

I like this idea, but I don't know that I like the idea of the Boradoans not being able to use the tech. I'd prefer the Boradoans to be fearful of the tech (regardless whether or not they can use it), but maybe the Anasazi have all this stuff that they haven't been able to use because of diluted blood. Instead, they've made a lot of progress by studying the stuff.

[Ninjadeadbeard]

In my somewhat limited, midwestern experience, there are three kinds of people that live in Cali: Hippies, Dickwads, and homeless people.

Speaking as a Californian, you're not far off . Cali's really about as diverse as the rest of the US. Lots of Mexican/Latino influence in the South, Hippie/Oregon types in the North, Midwest and Southern types in the middle and desert regions. A friend of my sister's went to Alabama for college and once brought some of his mates down there back home for a tour. According to them the mountains region I'm from is virtually identical to Alabama. But this isn't a thread about just Cali or Alabama, so whatever.

I like this idea, but I don't know that I like the idea of the Boradoans not being able to use the tech. I'd prefer the Boradoans to be fearful of the tech (regardless whether or not they can use it), but maybe the Anasazi have all this stuff that they haven't been able to use because of diluted blood. Instead, they've made a lot of progress by studying the stuff.

Like Giant Stone Jaguar Guardians (tm). There's only a few and they can't make any more of them, but through study the Anasazi can make smaller stone golems and the like.

[Zap Dynamic]

Speaking as a Californian, you're not far off .

Like Giant Stone Jaguar Guardians (tm). There's only a few and they can't make any more of them, but through study the Anasazi can make smaller stone golems and the like.

We could work with this. There could even be a tie-in with the Ironmen.

[TheMeMan]

More native American Myths involving Bear's Lodge:

A quick note on Bear's Lodge: Bear's Lodge is the core of a long-since dead volcano. Essentially what happened is that the inner part that was hardened lava is all the remains intact, as the out "shell" crumbled away over time. It's an amazing sight, as it is pretty much a massive stone structure standing by itself.

Bear Lodge(Also called Devil's Tower these days), Kiowa: Long ago, there was group of the Kiowa people that camped in the prairie along a stream. Seven young girls went to pick berries far away from their encampment. The Bear People smelled them from far away, and as they were hungry they left their village to find the young girls and eat them. The girls saw the Bear People coming, and ran. It was then that they came up on a great rock standing above the landscape. They climbed the rock, trying to get to safety. The bears followed the girls, and started to climb the rock themselves! They girls prayed to the rock to help them.

Never having been revered before, the great rock took kindness to them. The rock grew taller and steeper, and the bears could no longer climb it. Frustrated, the bears prayed to the bear gods, and the gods grew the bears! But as the bears grew in size, the rock grew doubly. The bears clawing at the side of the rock tore of huge chunks form the side, leaving deep gashes in its side. But the bears could not reach the girls. Finally, after a great time the bears left the rock to return to their village.

It was at this time that the young girl's village packed their camp and left. Seeing this, the girls prayed to the Stars. Taking pity on the abandoned girls, the Stars took them and allowed the girls to join them in the sky. These girls became stars themselves, and are the Seven Sisters who can be seen rising above Bears lodge.

Alternatively, Cheyenne Legend of Bear's Lodge(Abridged):
A young cheyenne man was suspicious that he wife was being courted by another man. She often disappeared, rousing his suspicions. He watched to see when his wife disappeared and to see if at these times any of the men in the village had left as well. After a few days and not seeing any man being gone when his wife was, he confronted her. She was afraid, and told him she was charmed by a great bear. The man gathered several warriors from the village, and had his wife lead them to the bear.

She brought them to the bear's cave, where he was asleep. The warriors could not get to the bear, as his feet were massive and hanging out of the cave blocking their way. To awaken the bear, they shot arrows into his feet. This enraged the bear who awoke, and attack the warriors.

The warriors, terrified now of the enraged bear, climbed to the top of the rock that was the bear's cave. The Great bear began to climb up after them. The young warriors began to pray to the Great Spirit to help them. Hearing them, the Great Spirit grew the rock larger and larger. The Bear mad a great leap to the top, and found a firm grip at the ledge. The men, now with renewed courage, shot the Bear and killed it. As the bear fell, it pushed against the rock, causing it to lean.

Of course, there are different variations as well. There's a Sioux story about a Warrior who made a sort of quest to the top(And hence why Sioux make a pilgrimage there), an Arapaho story about 7 siblings(Different than the Kiowa one, as the "bear" is one of the siblings), a Crow story about two sisters, and many more. It's one of the most well-known mythical sites.

A picture of Bears lodge:

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And a rendition I was able to find online of the Cheyenne story:

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[Recherché]

You know with a local origin for the Iron men, we'be kind of gotten rid of a source for a lot of African culture in this setting including Voodoun. In an attempt to fix this Is like to reintroduce them, by combining them with the French.
Note: all of this is just a suggestion for people to accept, reject, or modify as they will.

History

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The imperials were not the first easterners across the ocean to find the new world. That honor goes to the Afro-French, but where the imperials came to conquer the Afro-French came to trade. More interestingly for our purposes they sent men as traders, not families to settle. After a few years these men began to grow lonely and did what men in such situations often do. They took the native women as brides (both officially and in less official capacities.) Here lies the origin of the Gente Mis (depending on how you translate it means "my people" or "mixed people".)
Eventually the Imperials came and in their wars they not only destroyed the Eastern natives but also forced out the Gente Mis. The mixed people were driven from their original homes further and further west and into the most inhospitable places. Eventually all that was left to them were the frozen wastes of the north (Quebec equivalent) and the marshy islands of the far south (Cajuns.) The Gente Mis of the south were resourceful people though, they were able to turn the swamp into a source of wealth. They learned that they could sell some of the exotic spices that grew in the swamp for exorbitant prices. And for a long time things were good; the Gente Mis thrived on trade in vanilla, chocolate, cinnamon, chiles and other exotic exports.
The Imperials were still expanding though and soon their expansion brought them to the Gente Mis once again. Unlike in the last war, this time the Gente Mis were well funded and highly determined. Through their knowledge of the native swamp and great wealth they were able to hold off the much larger Empire for years. The mpire and its iron men soldiers were able to hold the dry land, but the Gente Mis ruled the swamps with the zombie armies raised by their priests. In the end the money of the Gente Mis ran out before the Empire ran out of bodies to throw at the war. The Gente Mis officially surrendered to the empire 19 years ago. The Empire gained a broken land of destroyed cities, a generation of youths dead in the war and a highly resentful populace. To rule this land they appointed corrupt and incompetent officials and because of this corruption is the only thing flourishing in Coterois today. In the south, some groups never acknowledged the treaty ending the war and continue a guerilla campaign against the empire. Savas town in particular never surrendered to the empire. At the time the empire ignored Savas town as a non-threat and not worth the ef
fort to destroy. However in recent years the town has swelled into a city of rebels recruited from all over Gente Mis territory and a new generation of soldiers is
approaching adulthood.

Gente Mis Religion

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The beliefs of the Gente Mis are incredibly diverse and may include elements of any and all cultures they came in contact with. The basic cosmology is that the original creator goddess wished to know herself better and therefore to shattered herself and became the universe. Everything in the world is a fragment of the original divine and therefore contains a small god, there are also some larger fragments remaining (AKA the gods), some humans have managed to awaken the divine spirit within themselves and became saints. One of the other defining features of Gente Mis religion is the practice of drawing down the gods and having them possess a priest.

[Zap Dynamic]

You know with a local origin for the Iron men, we'be kind of gotten rid of a source for a lot of African culture in this setting including Voodoun. In an attempt to fix this Is like to reintroduce them, by combining them with the French.
Note: all of this is just a suggestion for people to accept, reject, or modify as they will.

Thanks for the contribution!

Stuff I like:

• A "mixed people" from the two separate continents. On a side note, it's interesting to me that the culture was basically started by bastardry. What would an "ideal family" look like for these people?
• The Gente Mis as defeated but still rebellious swamp people.
• "Northern" and "Southern" Gente Mis.
• The threat of weirdness and violence so close to Coterois.

Stuff I'd like to tweak:

• The level of corruption in Coterois. I'm sure there are corrupt politicians in the city, but in general I'd like it to have a reputation as a gateway to the west. It will have a seedy underbelly, but it's a shining, happy city at face value.
• The "armies of zombies" thing. I like the idea of the Gente Mis priests using zombies as soldiers, but I picture it being some kind of subversive, terrifying guerrilla assult instead of open war. I want zombies to be hinted at in myth and history, but still a fairly rare occurence.
• The sainthood thing. What's the precedent in Vodoun? I like the shattered goddess idea a whole lot, but anointing mortals seems more like Catholicism to me. That said, I love that the priests invite themselve to be possessed!

Proposed fixes:

• There's a "daytime" government and a "nighttime" government in Coterois? During the day, elected politicians do their part to accomplish the desires of the populace, but under the surface there's a complex organization of puppet strings and dark creatures that REALLY have all the control.
• Maybe only one priest managed to start the zombie plague, and maybe that's what caused the truce in the war? Which may or may not have been the priest's intention?
• My thorough five-minute browsing of Voodoo on Wikipedia sets up the basic hierarchy of divinity as follows: there's one big, leader god, and there are intermediate spirits that people pray to to get help from the head god. Among those spirits is Baron Samedi, and I think he obviously needs to be a part of this. Maybe he (as a spirit of the dead) is the deified (er, "spirified") priest who started the zombie plague?

I'd like to change the name. If I remember my French correctly, Gente Mis is pronounced something like "Zhahnt Mee,"... what about Jahmy?

I'd like to thank everyone for all the ideas they've submitted. This is all really awesome stuff, and I'm extremely grateful that you've taken an interest in the project. Here's what we've got hammered out so far:

• Map
• Races
  Imperials
  Boradoans
  Boradoan Splinter Kingdom
  Plains Folk
  Mountaineers
  Remnants of the Eastern Natives
  Northwestern Fisherfolk
  Northern Peoples
  Ironmen
  Swamp Folk (Name Still) Pending
• Cultures
  Boradoans
  Boradoan Splinter Kingdom
  Northwesterners
  Plains Folk
  Mountaineers
  Swamp People
• Monsters
  Zombies
  Wendigo (Zombies)

If people have more to contribute in any of these areas: awesome. But let's start to consider some more stuff, too. Specifically, I think we need to start fleshing out:

• Imperial religion
• Eastern region (basically the Empire)
• Mythic Heroes (equivalents of Paul Bunyan, Pecos Bill, etc.)
• More monsters! Bigfoot, Chupacabra, Jackalope, whatever.

I'll start. Nikola Tesla is now...
Sergei Tokarev, or "Dr. Steam," is the most innovative mind in the Empire. Churning out hundreds of inventions each year, Dr. Steam is responsible for nearly every technological advancement the Empire has made in the past decade, including harnessing the powers of steam to the benefit of each of the Empire's citizens. Dr. Steam works closely with the Imperial Government, developing everything from more sophisticated labor devices to--it is rumored--more powerful weapons for the Imperial Military.

[Ninjadeadbeard]

The sainthood thing. What's the precedent in Vodoun? I like the shattered goddess idea a whole lot, but anointing mortals seems more like Catholicism to me. That said, I love that the priests invite themselve to be possessed!

From what I know of Voodoo and Hoodoo (folk magic), and it isn't much, American Louisiana Voodoo is basically Western Africa traditions plus Christianity. Saints are used a lot, from what I understand. Moses, in fact, is considered to be the finest Voodoo Doctor ever for his plagues and spliting the Red Sea.

[*]My thorough five-minute browsing of Voodoo on Wikipedia sets up the basic hierarchy of divinity as follows: there's one big, leader god, and there are intermediate spirits that people pray to to get help from the head god. Among those spirits is Baron Samedi, and I think he obviously needs to be a part of this. Maybe he (as a spirit of the dead) is the deified (er, "spirified") priest who started the zombie plague?

Gotta have the Baron. Love that guy!

I'd like to change the name. If I remember my French correctly, Gente Mis is pronounced something like "Zhahnt Mee,"... what about Jahmy?

Good name. Probably spelled Jahmi (or Je'ami) by practitioners though.

If people have more to contribute in any of these areas: awesome. But let's start to consider some more stuff, too. Specifically, I think we need to start fleshing out:

• Imperial religion
• Eastern region (basically the Empire)
• Mythic Heroes (equivalents of Paul Bunyan, Pecos Bill, etc.)
• More monsters! Bigfoot, Chupacabra, Jackalope, whatever.

I'll start. Nikola Tesla is now...
Sergei Tokarev, or "Dr. Steam," is the most innovative mind in the Empire. Churning out hundreds of inventions each year, Dr. Steam is responsible for nearly every technological advancement the Empire has made in the past decade, including harnessing the powers of steam to the benefit of each of the Empire's citizens. Dr. Steam works closely with the Imperial Government, developing everything from more sophisticated labor devices to--it is rumored--more powerful weapons for the Imperial Military.

Sounds good so far. As for the Imperial Religion, let's go similar to the founding fathers' rhetoric. Liberty and Freedom and the like aren't just ideas. They're deities to the Empire. If the Empire itself is run like a Republic you could even make the state religion Catonianism (a belief in the Divinity of the State). Named for Cato, a Roman Senator at the time of the First Triumvirate and Julius Caesar, Catonianism is the belief that the very institution of the government is divine, that it is a God-like entity. It's like saying that any law passed has the weight of religious commandment because it is supported by the Republic.

It also makes the political rhetoric much harsher when accusing your opponent of being harmful to the nation is like saying they're a devil (early 19th century politics were savage!). Any mortal who proves to have an extraordinary impact is added post-mortem to the National Pantheon. It's like having Ben Franklin as a Lightning God of Progress, and George Washington as the indefatigable War God and Spirit of Humility.

[TheMeMan]

If people have more to contribute in any of these areas: awesome. But let's start to consider some more stuff, too. Specifically, I think we need to start fleshing out:

• Imperial religion
• Eastern region (basically the Empire)
• Mythic Heroes (equivalents of Paul Bunyan, Pecos Bill, etc.)
• More monsters! Bigfoot, Chupacabra, Jackalope, whatever.

As for Monsters... well...

There is the Hînqûmemen. Essentially just a lake in appearance(It's actually the name of a Lake in B.C.), however when people drink from the waters it angers the lake which then hunts said person down and devours them. To put it more simply, it's a living lake that can travel across land and eats people, returning to it's spot after doing so.

Then there is the Mishipzhiw. It's an Algonquian myth of a water-monster that is cat-like in appearance. It captures people with it's tail and devours them. Also it creates storms by thrashing it's tail in the water.

The Nunyenunc, which is an absolutely massive bird that hunts people. This was actually one of the more terrifying creatures of legend.

Flying Heads, and Iroquios myth. They were literally flying human heads with long hair and sharp knife-like teeth. Instead of ears they had bat wings. And I think I actually recall now an actually D&D monster that is identical to this(I'm thinking it's based off of it). They latch onto you and once attached never come off.

Be Chasti, or "Metal Old Man"(Although I'm willing to bet it's a misnomer or mistranslation). A Giant who was covered in black obsidian plates, with only a single weakspot(The armpits), which is where the warriors struck to kill him.

And I almost forgot the Thunderbird. They create lightning and thunder, and have the power to destroy entire villages with their abilities. They are extremely powerful eagles that are often depicted as massive in size. Able to control the weather, particularly thunderstorms.

Also, look into the Ghost Dance. Essentially it was a revitalization movement that was throughout much to the Plains area, that involved a ritual dance. What was hoped to happen, depending, is that the ghosts of ancestors would return and drive the Europeans out. Or that the Europeans would just leave, leaving the Americas back in the hands of the various tribes.

[Zap Dynamic]

From what I know of Voodoo and Hoodoo (folk magic), and it isn't much, American Louisiana Voodoo is basically Western Africa traditions plus Christianity. Saints are used a lot, from what I understand. Moses, in fact, is considered to be the finest Voodoo Doctor ever for his plagues and spliting the Red Sea.

Sweet. Let's keep it, then!

Good name. Probably spelled Jahmi (or Je'ami) by practitioners though.

My usual habit when I'm coming up with names etc. is to take a real-world language, find an appropriate word, then twist it until it's just beyond the point of recognition. For example: the hungarian word for wolf is "Farkas." In a private project I'm working on right now, I have a forest called "Arka" because it has a lot of wolves in it. I'd like to do something similar here.

That said, I like the idea of using "i" instead of "y," but I'm pretty sure "Je'ami" means something like "I friend," in French.

What about this:
Je ("I" French)+Amalgame ("mixed"French)+Watu ("Person" Swahili)=J'awaltu
???

Imperial Religion Stuff

I'm hesitant to make the Empire deify its historical figures for the same reason that I'm hesitant to give it a state religion. Religious freedom is in the Bill of Rights, and I think that a setting that distills American culture should include that. Maybe there are monuments to the various important political figures, and maybe they are contemplated and sworn before by the populace, but I hesitate to make it a tried-and-true religion.

Maybe this is a place where we can include something I've been thinking about for another project. Instead of giving domains and portfolios only to religions, I'd like to try giving them to all organizations. The "cleric" becomes a "champion," and draws power from their belief in any cause (this is RAW, but I think extending domains to organizations actually makes it feasible). For example, you've got Colonel "Bear" Redfelt and his Tough Riders, and at the penultimate moment when they're storming up the hill, maybe he shouts something like "Remember Emperor Rinseington!," effectively casting some sort of Heroism spell on his allies.

This allows for the government, its history, and its important figures to become "gods" in deed but not in name, and it leaves the door open for lots of other organizations and religions to have a tangible influence on the world.

Native American Monster Stuff

I'm liking this info! I don't know why I didn't think of it before, but I think the struggle between Natives and the Empire simply has to be the focus of this thing. There's really no other way.

I definitely want to keep the Lake Monster (holy **** TERRIFYING), the Obsidian Giant, and the Thunderbird. The giant bird dude might be worth holding onto as well, but I'm really not crazy about the grabby cat and the flying heads.

I'm editing the first post to include those monsters. Got any more? Anyone?

[TheMeMan]

I definitely want to keep the Lake Monster (holy **** TERRIFYING), the Obsidian Giant, and the Thunderbird. The giant bird dude might be worth holding onto as well, but I'm really not crazy about the grabby cat and the flying heads.

I'm editing the first post to include those monsters. Got any more? Anyone?

I figured you'd like the Lake Monster. It is probably the most literal interpretation of "Lake Monster" that there is.

Do I have anymore... of course I do.

Let's go with a few from American Folklore right now.

There's "Raw-Head And Bloody Bones." A story imported from England, it comes in to variants. The first(Original story) was the English version. Raw Head and Bloody Bones would track down children and devour him. You may be wondering where he got his name. Well, it has to do with the fact that he was skinless on his head. The Bloody Bones part came from the fact that he collected massive pile of children's bones that he would live on(Or sit on). He was roughly human in this depiction, more or less.

The American story is a bit weirder. He was a boar that a witch created that could take the form of a human, and could talk as well. He was killed by a hunter, and the witch brought his bones back to life. Angered, Raw-Head decided to hunt and kill the Hunter who killed him. To help him, he took the teeth of a panther, the claws of a bear, and the tail of a... rabbit(Don't ask, I don't know why). He was bloody and horrifying in appearance, with raw flesh throughout his body. He found the hunter and killed him.

Then there is the Jersey Devil, which you can look into if you want(I don't know much about it really).

The Headless Horseman of Sleepy Hollow comes to mind. I'm sure you know the story, but if you don't I'll iterate it.

Ogo-Pogo, which is essentially the Loch Ness Monster of Canada(See also "Champ" in New York).

The Joint Snake, which is a snake that when cut up will reassemble itself(And any items that may have it's blood on it will be incorporated into it).

The Shunka Warakin, which is an Ioway legend about a massive wolf-like creature. In more recent folklore, it takes the appearance of a cross between a hyena and a wolf. It's incredibly vicious and deadly, slinking into villages under the cover of night to carry it's prey to it's lair. It is rarely ever seen, and often leaves little or no trace of it's presence.

Edit: Looking closer into a few of my books, I've found some interesting tidbits.

The Bemola. Similar to the Thunderbird(Which was predominantly a plains legend, though not exclusively by any means), there is the Bemola. Like the Thunderbird, it is a massive bird of prey that can control storms. Unlike the the Thunderbird, however, it resides at the peaks of mountains and controls Snowstorms and can create extremely cold winds. It was large enough to carry off a Moose if it cared to.

And the Wuchoswen, a giant and immortal bird-spirit. It is massive, to say the least. Large enough that it's wings flapping creates all of the winds of the world. It's technically a deity like figure, and is not a "monster" in the strictest sense, however with a bit of reworking it could easily fit. Myths about it say that it can creates deadly winds, especially when angered.

[Zap Dynamic]

Another "Hero" figure:
Based on: John Henry

Iron John is an Ironman who is fed up with all this new-fangled steam technology. A bit of history first:

CE 1790: Times are tough in the New Empire. Without a strong workforce, it's hard to create the volume of foodstuffs and other goods to make the Empire a contender on the world stage.

CE 1800: Enter Desmond Merryweather, a southern landholder and renaissance man. Using the mysteries of alchemy as his foundation, he manages to imbue inert wood, rope, and metal with life. He calls his creations "Ironmen," and sees them as an end to the labor woes of his people.

CE 1860: The Ironmen are discovered to be sentient, feeling beings, and a war is fought to free them from bondage. Their freedom is won at great cost.

CE 1870: A young Sergei Tokarev distinguishes himself as an inventor, and pioneers the use of steam technology. Huge advances are made on every technological front. Steam is heralded as a new hope for the landowners of the south.

CE 1880 (the present): The Ironmen have have learned that the taste of their freedom is bitter. They need sustenance just as any other creature, and with the advent of steam, many are out of work.

Enter Iron John. A larger-than-usual Ironman dedicated to laying the rail that will travel from Rinseington, through the north all the way to the war with the Boradoans, he encounters adversity at every step. For all his stamina and strength, the new steam-powered construction machines are faster, cheaper, and more precise than his brethren.

Iron John contests with one of these rail machines, working so furiously that he breaks apart at the seams and destroys himself. His comrades, heartened by the valor of their fallen brother, form up and flee into the wilderness, to live or die by their own ingenuity. Freedom is no longer enough: they require independence.

[Ninjadeadbeard]

Another "Hero" figure:
Based on: John Henry

Iron John is an Ironman who is fed up with all this new-fangled steam technology. A bit of history first:

Iron John contests with one of these rail machines, winning by a narrow margin. Within days, he is the target of mysterious assassination attempts. Gathering a host of his Iron brethren, Iron John flees into the wilderness, to live or die by the ingenuity of his people. Freedom is no longer enough: they require independence.

Hmm. Sad to see the ending change. The original story was a tale about the tragic consequence of Man v Machine, in that Machine won. I would have Iron John die from exhaustion (sheered his own metal joints with the effort of beating the steam drill), and become a Hero that way, inspiring the Ironmen to push harder for true equality. Also, I'm sorry, but I have to share this. Best version of John Henry I know of.

On Voodoo...

How about Jefais (I make in French) or Jecreis (close to "I create" in French). Or, taking your suggestion and mixing it, how about J'amatu?

Imperial Religion

I get it. I like what you've got in regards to the Organizations and Domains. I might change Organizations to Ideas (Freedom or Independence...or Sobriety for Prohibitionist Cleric ) or perhaps just straight semi-worship of individuals. Like, your "Bear" Redfelt (Bully!) wouldn't be a cleric of the Knights of Copper (Isaiah Copper = Abraham Lincoln), but of Saint-Emperor Copper directly.

I only say this because, well, Americans Do deify our historical characters. Still, your idea is probably for the best.

[Inglenook]

As far as monsters, there are a few fairly famous local ones that I can think of.

Wampus Cat — Sort of a gigantic, dusky cougar that eats livestock … and people, if it can get them. According to Wiki there's a a Native American myth about it being a woman cursed by a medicine man? I was always told that its cry sounds like the scream of a woman being murdered (pretty much like an actual cougar's cry), and that it lurks in the trees above roads/paths in the forest, pouncing when prey wanders underneath.

Tailypo — Not sure if this is the proper name for the monster, but that's the only thing I've ever heard it called. Always heard it described as a dog-sized tarsier with large ears and long, sharp claws/teeth. According to the legend, a starving hunter shot off its tail, cooked it and ate it. That night the thing showed up at his cabin window, whispering "Tailypo, tailypo, give me back my tailypo." The hunter sent his three dogs to chase it off, but it killed one of the dogs. Each night it would come back and scuttle around the outside of the cabin while asking for its "tailypo" to be returned, and each night the hunter would send his dogs out only for another one of them to be killed. On the last night, with no dogs for protection, tailypo broke into the cabin and tore the man to shreds, extracting its tail from the hunter's stomach. Presumably it can reattach limbs?

I'm sure stuff like skinwalkers, Bigfoot, the Thunderbird, wendigos and the Jersey Devil have already been mentioned.

Ooh, another thing that could be fun: turn the snipe into a source for some extremely rare and valuable spell component or something, make it extremely fast and dangerous, and have the players go on a "snipe hunt".

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Some NPC ideas:

Johnny Appleseed — Perhaps the last remaining druid of long-forgotten nature god, cursed to wander the earth planting trees? Technically he was a real guy, but to most Americans I think he's sort of faded into a legendary figure.

Evelyn Eileen Headhunter — Okay, I think this is an extremely local mythological figure, but Evelyn Headhunter is supposedly this cannibalistic witch who lives in the forest here, and she always carries a long axe with her. At night she'll use her magic to cause cars driving through the forest to break down, and she proceeds to kill the occupants and take them back to her cabin to eat. She keeps the heads of all her victims nailed to the wall.

Bloody Mary — The one that pops out of the mirror if you say her name three times.

Cropsey — Staten Island's version of the boogeyman. There's a pretty neat documentary out about this myth.

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Mammoth Cave should totally be the entrance to some sort of Underdark, by the way.