General Exalted Discussion Thread X: Playground Cosmic Principle

[Lord Raziere]

If your Storyteller knows what you will be doing next session, you're doing it wrong.

Well I've routinely made my first DM facepalm from merely the antics of Lelk*, so I should do pretty well making any other cry themselves to sleep with someone far more powerful……

*invented the zeppelin in medieval times, accidentally walked in on the god of thieves and survived by saying "HI!" cheerfully, and has a fought a giant worm with a dagger and a net full of stone, jumps over everything, and persuaded a group of paladins and barbarians who hated each other to team up and defeat a hydra, by singing about how awesome paladins are…he is basically a Zenith with Performance and Athletics excellencies, if they were an elf in DnD.

[Hiro Protagonest]

In Loom-Snarling Deception, it says that the disguise is an Illusion that is perfectly immune to mundane scrutiny. Does this mean that anyone looking really hard at you can't detect any disguise, but if they shake your hand, they might notice that it doesn't feel right (like a rough hand when disguised as a lazy noble)? Or is it a transformation, which means that while you keep the same stats, your body is, for all intents and purposes, the disguise?

[aetherialDawn]

In Loom-Snarling Deception, it says that the disguise is an Illusion that is perfectly immune to mundane scrutiny. Does this mean that anyone looking really hard at you can't detect any disguise, but if they shake your hand, they might notice that it doesn't feel right (like a rough hand when disguised as a lazy noble)? Or is it a transformation, which means that while you keep the same stats, your body is, for all intents and purposes, the disguise?

It is an Illusion - it fools perceptions and beliefs.

Even if they were somehow capable of mundanely perceiving your true form, they would be forced to believe that you were as the Illusion presented.

Not only is every sense affected, but the Illusion doesn't even discriminate between senses, and it affects the person possessing the senses!

[TentacleGirl]

In Loom-Snarling Deception, it says that the disguise is an Illusion that is perfectly immune to mundane scrutiny. Does this mean that anyone looking really hard at you can't detect any disguise, but if they shake your hand, they might notice that it doesn't feel right (like a rough hand when disguised as a lazy noble)? Or is it a transformation, which means that while you keep the same stats, your body is, for all intents and purposes, the disguise?

Well, that would still be mundane scrutiny, right? So it's an illusion against normal let's-look-at-things-eyes, but any supernatural scrutiny would pierce it.

[TheCountAlucard]

Unrelated note, I totally misread that as "Loom-Snarling Decepticon" just now.

[tonberrian]

Unrelated note, I totally misread that as "Loom-Snarling Decepticon" just now.

Apostate Champion concept get!

[TheCountAlucard]

Apostate Champion concept get!

Glad I could help.

[Lochar]

You mean "shed tears of joy" because of all the awesome, right?

If your ST has trained you to stay on his rails, then it'll definately be tears of rage.

[HerrTenko]

Actually, I'm the ST most of the time, and even though I do have "rails" prepared in case my players have no idea what to do with their time, I'm always happy to see them leave the railroad.

[golentan]

I love rails in exalted. You can tear them up and tie them into a pretty metal bow to gift wrap your exploding present to the ebon dragon with.

[Kyeudo]

If your ST has trained you to stay on his rails, then it'll definately be tears of rage.

This is why building railroads in Exalted is a bad idea. Exalts are so capable of dramatic direction changes you should not be able to predict how they will approach a problem. If you have a plot to overthrow the government, they could blackmail your key conspirators, they could assassinate them with stealth, they could just decide to take over the goverment themselves, or they could go to the kingdom next door and borrow their army.

[Lix Lorn]

The only way to railroad characters is to ask their players nicely. There's no way to railroad players unless you threaten to end the game.

[Turalisj]

The only way to railroad characters is to ask their players nicely. There's no way to railroad players unless you threaten to end the game.

You can send stronger and stronger opponents after them and refuse to allow timeskips for training.

[golentan]

Guys? What's the attunement cost of a warbird? I can't seem to find it, and it seems redonkulous that it would only require a level 2 hearthstone...

[Drascin]

This is why building railroads in Exalted is a bad idea. Exalts are so capable of dramatic direction changes you should not be able to predict how they will approach a problem. If you have a plot to overthrow the government, they could blackmail your key conspirators, they could assassinate them with stealth, they could just decide to take over the goverment themselves, or they could go to the kingdom next door and borrow their army.

Most young Exalts are also roughly as versatile as a ceiling fan (because the system enormously rewards especialization) and have absolutely no way to improvise any power to do something different on a short notice (such as how in M&M you can repurpose powers in an emergency), so having a rough idea of how they will approach things is really pretty damn easy - it's, in like three quarters of cases, going to be one of the few ways their charms support, because most people like using the bennies that are in their character sheet .

It's a lot harder to predict what, say, your basic M&M PL10 party, since they can basically make up pretty much anything on the fly if they come up with a better idea.

Of course, predicting what your party will want to do most of the time is less about railroading and more about having a couple hours notice on mentally preparing stuff, and a rather important GM skill. So with time you just end up knowing your players and having a pretty good guess of what they will want to do in pretty much any game, anyway.

[Xefas]

Most young Exalts are also roughly as versatile as a ceiling fan (because the system enormously rewards especialization) and have absolutely no way to improvise any power to do something different on a short notice (such as how in M&M you can repurpose powers in an emergency), so having a rough idea of how they will approach things is really pretty damn easy - it's, in like three quarters of cases, going to be one of the few ways their charms support, because most people like using the bennies that are in their character sheet .

I just wanted to throw in that I totally agree, so that you don't get that "Arrgh, I'm all alone and everyone in the thread is just yelling at me" feeling when they all yell at you. (I wish we had a Thank function.)

Also, this is one of the many reasons why Fate is so much better for Exalted. With one Aspect choice, I could manipulate nuclear sunfire. I didn't have to buy one fiddle parcel for punching someone with nuclear sunfire, and then another fiddly parcel to shoot someone with nuclear sunfire, and then another fiddly parcel to give someone cancer with nuclear sunfire, and then another fiddly parcel to give someone cancer in a different way with nuclear sunfire, and so on and so on. I could manipulate nuclear sunfire - and did awesome things with it.

[Lord Raziere]

Hah! Thats exactly what the players want you to think.

Then they pull crazy stunts out of nowhere with impossible creativity or do something incredibly foolishly brave that you'd think they would be too smart to do. And then they succeed anyways.

Edit: Eh, I prefer Strands of Fate, so that I just look up any Advantage and with a few creative twists, turn it into a way of manipulating nuclear sunfire.

or just y'know….purchase Control Nuclear Sunfire.

[Drascin]

I just wanted to throw in that I totally agree, so that you don't get that "Arrgh, I'm all alone and everyone in the thread is just yelling at me" feeling when they all yell at you. (I wish we had a Thank function.)

Oh, don't worry. I'm not really taking things incredibly seriously, just idly commenting until I get bored

Thanks for the support nonetheless.

[Rikandur Azebol]

Drascin, I am also agreeing with You. So Xefas isn't the only one fighting windmills in Your name.

Then they pull crazy stunts out of nowhere with impossible creativity or do something incredibly foolishly brave that you'd think they would be too smart to do. And then they succeed anyways.

And in my opinion it's one of the most delightful things Players can gift their GM with. Of course another important GM skill is smoothly taking such miracles in stride, instantly transforming whole universe that Players are running around within, and continuing with altered plot. After all DM needs his fun moments too. The sneaky tactic is to later, after session, congratulate them for the brilliance and smiling benignly informing them that they raised Your expectations to another level.

And no, it isn't when Players die miserably and sob over their character sheets. GM wins when Players learn to do awesome, cool things and do them. In a way that make him enjoy his thankless toil.

[Kyeudo]

Most young Exalts are also roughly as versatile as a ceiling fan (because the system enormously rewards especialization) and have absolutely no way to improvise any power to do something different on a short notice (such as how in M&M you can repurpose powers in an emergency), so having a rough idea of how they will approach things is really pretty damn easy - it's, in like three quarters of cases, going to be one of the few ways their charms support, because most people like using the bennies that are in their character sheet .

Individually, that may be true. The Dawn Caste hits things, the Night Caste sneaks past things, and the Zenith talks about things. However, put them together, and then you have something completely unpredictable.

Say you have a corrupt Terrestrial king to deal with. You expect the Zenith to rally an army with his speaking power, the Dawn to lead it, and the Night to do recon. Instead, the Zenith starts a riot to distract the guards, the Night sneaks the Dawn into the palace, and together they assassinate the king.

[chaoskristy21]

Guys? What's the attunement cost of a warbird? I can't seem to find it, and it seems redonkulous that it would only require a level 2 hearthstone...

Well, it IS a 4 to 5 Dot Artifact, so a Hearthstone requirement INSTEAD of an Attunement requirement seems reasonable enough. You may want to look into Windblade-Class Personal Transport (Artifact 3) instead if you find the Warbird's independence from committed Essence to be problematic.

[golentan]

Well, it IS a 4 to 5 Dot Artifact, so a Hearthstone requirement INSTEAD of an Attunement requirement seems reasonable enough. You may want to look into Windblade-Class Personal Transport (Artifact 3) instead if you find the Warbird's independence from committed Essence to be problematic.

Not so much, honey. It's for a dragonblooded character in a celestial level game, so that could be a major advantage. I'm just surprised by the implication they can be piloted by mortals.

[Gensh]

I'm just surprised by the implication they can be piloted by mortals.

Or tyrant lizards.

[chaoskristy21]

Not so much, honey. It's for a dragonblooded character in a celestial level game, so that could be a major advantage. I'm just surprised by the implication they can be piloted by mortals.

Well, the thing to keep in mind is that this IS an Aerial Transportation Artifact we're talking about, here. It has built in drawbacks like a Repair score, the lack of subtlety, the need for the Ride Ability in order to use it to it's full potential, and the fact that it's the same Artifact level as several MUCH larger Airships. Also, these things are SUPPOSED to be extremely rare in the Age of Sorrows anyways (see Repair Score), so there we have it. The fact that Mortals can use it doesn't surprise me much either, on account of the Artifact Rating of the thing.
I turn your attention once again to the Windblade-Class Personal Transport in the same book; it might be more to your liking for what you have planned. The Jade version comes equipped with either a lightning weapon OR a built-in Elemental Lens, making the Artifact's presence in a scene potentially a one-sided advantage.

[Tavar]

Note Elemental lenses will be nerfed a bit: they were already amazing pre-2.5. No way they're balanced now.

[tonberrian]

The bunny, the bunny, whoah I love the bunny...

[Xefas]

The bunny, the bunny, whoah I love the bunny...

Bunny-based idolatry pleases me.

[tonberrian]

Bunny-based idolatry pleases me.

*offers Xefas a chocolate bunny*

[Lix Lorn]

What could possibly go wrong?

[MickJay]

Individually, that may be true. The Dawn Caste hits things, the Night Caste sneaks past things, and the Zenith talks about things. However, put them together, and then you have something completely unpredictable.

Say you have a corrupt Terrestrial king to deal with. You expect the Zenith to rally an army with his speaking power, the Dawn to lead it, and the Night to do recon. Instead, the Zenith starts a riot to distract the guards, the Night sneaks the Dawn into the palace, and together they assassinate the king.

If you have 3 solars getting ready to take down any Terrestrial, it doesn't really matter what route they take. The ST occupies himself with what happens after the poor DB is out of the picture ;)

My current ST merely sets the world and events in motion, how we interact with it is up to us. The only thing that could count as rails are events big enough that we have no way of countering them (although we might still affect them somehow). That, and he plays his NPCs very well - they tend to have their own secrets, agendas and tend to be prepared for various unexpected situations and have backup plans of their own.