Magic: The Gathering Thread XIV: Instant Annoying, Just Add Hexproof

[Lord Seth]

I've been talking a bit before about how I was curious about how the shockland reprint would affect their prices, and so far...the price of getting a shockland is less. You can look on eBay and see how Steam Vents and Hallowed Fountains from Return to Ravnica are noticeably cheaper--at least in the Buy It Nows--than their original counterparts. Heck, a Blood Crypt preorder on StarCityGames costs half that of an original.

Makes me wonder what'll happen when it's no longer preorders and they're actually out. Still interesting though. Makes Modern a little more affordable.

[Landis963]

My previous question was completely ignored, so I'll ask it again. Do you think Izzet or Azorius would be better for a constructed deck? the Azorius keyword has "powerful in Limited" written all over it, and that may or may not extend to a deck, but is the Izzet keyword and suite of combo tricks better? I ask because I'd like to know what to do until Gatecrash when House Dimir gets some new toys to play with.

[Fable Wright]

My previous question was completely ignored, so I'll ask it again. Do you think Izzet or Azorius would be better for a constructed deck? the Azorius keyword has "powerful in Limited" written all over it, and that may or may not extend to a deck, but is the Izzet keyword and suite of combo tricks better? I ask because I'd like to know what to do until Gatecrash when House Dimir gets some new toys to play with.

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Well, on the one hand, Azorius has a lot of stall cards and a fairly good lategame. On the other hand, Izzet have Talrand and Guttersnipe. With Flashback cards. And Electromancer. And the ubiquitous Delver of Secrets. I don't know for sure, as the sets aren't out yet, but Instants and Sorceries seem to be getting a lot of love right now...

[Landis963]

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Well, on the one hand, Azorius has a lot of stall cards and a fairly good lategame. On the other hand, Izzet have Talrand and Guttersnipe. With Flashback cards. And Electromancer. And the ubiquitous Delver of Secrets. I don't know for sure, as the sets aren't out yet, but Instants and Sorceries seem to be getting a lot of love right now...

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Hmmmm.... Most of my games tend to extend into lategame, but I recently picked up the makings of a Delver deck, so now I'm even more torn. I guess I could get a better answer from "is there enough data to make a decision based solely on the cards in the set, and if so, which?" (I ask this because RtR is most likely to be the only card material I'll be getting until Gatecrash)

[tgva8889]

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Azorious Charm is so good with Geist of St. Traft, though. And so are Exalted creatures. And so is Lyev Skyknight. So Azorious definitely has some merit. Detain is almost perfect with Geist.

My real question, though, is why don't you just play both? You'll have shocklands, Clifftop Retreat, and Sulfur Falls. Why not try it? I can only imagine the deck that plays Geist with Bonfire or Mizzium Mortars.

[Mr._Blinky]

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A working BUG Self-mill Beatdown deck would be super awesome. I've been working on this some time, but the thing is.. any kind of GY hate shuts you down hard and there will be a LOT of GY hate, if only because of Snapcaster.

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Yeah, that's always been the problem with making the deck work. I think the main thing is to always make sure to have some way of restocking your yard, whether it's Grizzly Salvage, Forbidden Alchemy, Mulch, Tracker's Instincts, etc., of which I will probably be running some combination totaling in 8. It's not perfect, but I think if you keep the curve low enough you should be able to beat up your opponent before they can kill you. Witchbane Orb might be a possible side-board option, but I feel it's probably just a hair too expensive.

*Points to Gender icon*

Pssst. I'm a girl.

What Sith_Happens said. I mostly use sir as a gender-neutral form of address.

[tgva8889]

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One of the cool advantages of Golgari is that you can probably reduce the Self-Mill deck to just GB if you want. Between Bonehoard Wurm, Spliterfright, and Jarad you have enough creatures to deliver the beats. You probably end up playing a totally different deck, though. While you can do these things, it seems like it'll be better to do things involving that new Troll, Jarad, Zombies, and/or Scavenge guys.

[Landis963]

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Azorious Charm is so good with Geist of St. Traft, though. And so are Exalted creatures. And so is Lyev Skyknight. So Azorious definitely has some merit. Detain is almost perfect with Geist.

My real question, though, is why don't you just play both? You'll have shocklands, Clifftop Retreat, and Sulfur Falls. Why not try it? I can only imagine the deck that plays Geist with Bonfire or Mizzium Mortars.

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The main point of the exercise is "Which guild do I attach my temporary allegiance to for RtR, since Dimir isn't available?" Although that WUR deck sounds really fun to play, I don't have the Innistrad/Dark Ascension/Avacyn cards necessary to fill it out (e.g. I have no Geists of Saint Traft), meaning that it'll languish in glitchy imbalance until such time as I can buy the singletons and/or playsets I need. Meh, I'll look at my collection and make a decision then.

[tgva8889]

You know that the way the quiz works, you are still Dimir even though the guild isn't out yet. You play whatever you want (even though I'm Izzet I am probably picking Golgari or Selesnya at the Prerelease) and you still play for your guild. So you don't really have to choose.

On a spoiler note:

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Looks like the prerelease cards are all going to be the Intro Pack rares.

Also, Golgari Planeswalker! Woo! Spoiling responses to it so other people can look at it.

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Well that's one way of defending itself. And I absolutely adore that ultimate. It might not even be particularly good, but it's so cool to me. I am definitely looking forward to jamming Vraska.

[Mystic Muse]

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I now want 2 or 3 Vraskas.

[Landis963]

You know that the way the quiz works, you are still Dimir even though the guild isn't out yet. You play whatever you want (even though I'm Izzet I am probably picking Golgari or Selesnya at the Prerelease) and you still play for your guild. So you don't really have to choose.

On a spoiler note:

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Looks like the prerelease cards are all going to be the Intro Pack rares.

Also, Golgari Planeswalker! Woo! Spoiling responses to it so other people can look at it.

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Well that's one way of defending itself. And I absolutely adore that ultimate. It might not even be particularly good, but it's so cool to me. I am definitely looking forward to jamming Vraska.

I thought you had a choice in the matter, i.e. that the quiz didn't decide what was going on your DCI page.

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Oh, and I've noticed a trend in terms of planeswalker cards each block. You have a few old cameos, this block it'll be Jace and Gideon Jura, you have a "Tamiyo" i.e. a heretofore unknown/uncarded planeswalker who is not native to the plane the block is set on (this spot was filled by Sorin in Zendikar, and of course Tamiyo in Innistrad, and Nicol Bolas in Alara) and you have a heretofore unknown planeswalker who is a native of the plane, the "Tibalt", if you will. (You could just as easily use Nissa Revane of Zendikar, or Tezzeret of Alara). Therefore, I believe that Madam Vraska will be our "Tibalt" "Tezzeret" of Ravnica. (Also, I should make this clear: I'm talking about in terms of flavor and story positions. There was a bit of confusion earlier where I delurked and talked about how Delver was clearly a Simic card - Mechanically it's not, it fits with Izzet best as was pointed out by many but Flavorfully an Izzet scientist wouldn't be caught dead transforming themselves into The Fly, whereas that's much more in-character for the Simic Combine. Yeah I'm a Vorthos. So sue me.)

[tgva8889]

I thought you had a choice in the matter, i.e. that the quiz didn't decide what was going on your DCI page.

It doesn't, but you can't change again after you choose. So if you want to be Dimir, you have to choose Dimir now, even if you can't play with it yet. But it doesn't matter which Guild you choose, you can play with whatever colors you want and still earn glory for your Guild at various events.

[Mr._Blinky]

On a spoiler note:

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Looks like the prerelease cards are all going to be the Intro Pack rares.

Also, Golgari Planeswalker! Woo! Spoiling responses to it so other people can look at it.

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Well that's one way of defending itself. And I absolutely adore that ultimate. It might not even be particularly good, but it's so cool to me. I am definitely looking forward to jamming Vraska.

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I was just coming here to post this. Honestly, without even having played this card it's already probably my favorite Planeswalker ever. I love all three abilities, it's in one of my favorite color combinations, slots perfectly into two of my EDH decks, and...look at the bloody art! Seriously, I love everything about this card, even if she ends up not seeing play, which I think she will.

[tgva8889]

In terms of Return to Ravnica Planeswalkers:

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I think they spoiled that they only planned 3 in this block, and we now know who they all are. We also know that since they like to have a Planeswalker of every color, Gideon is probably WR.

[Androgeus]

In terms of Return to Ravnica Planeswalkers:

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I think they spoiled that they only planned 3 in this block, and we now know who they all are. We also know that since they like to have a Planeswalker of every color, Gideon is probably WR.

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They said at San Diego comic con that it was going to be 2 in Return and 2 in Gatecrash. Sinker is unspecified and so could have any number of planeswalkers (including 0).
Sauce

[Binks]

In terms of Return to Ravnica Planeswalkers:

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I think they spoiled that they only planned 3 in this block, and we now know who they all are. We also know that since they like to have a Planeswalker of every color, Gideon is probably WR.

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Where did they spoil that? Last I heard it was assumed that it would be the average 5 planeswalkers per block, with an assumed 2 in RTR, 2 in Gatecrash, 1 in Sinker based on RTR spoilers.

[tgva8889]

Oh I misremembered. The beginning of the clip has Rosewater saying 3. They do like having at least one Planeswalker of every color, though.

And the number is usually between 4 and 6 Planeswalkers per block, I think. It's not "always 5."

[Androgeus]

Oh I misremembered. The beginning of the clip has Rosewater saying 3. They do like having at least one Planeswalker of every color, though.

And the number is usually between 4 and 6 Planeswalkers per block, I think. It's not "always 5."

I think Scars doesn't have any green Planeswalkers (mono or multi, although I guess all colours can cast Karn), so having each colour represented isn't a rule they always stick to.

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Gideon is wearing Boros insignia, so that makes it very likely he'll be WR in my mind.

[tgva8889]

I did say "they like" not "they certainly will" but I suspect that since they can they will make the effort.

[Landis963]

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So, if my powers of clairvoyance continue to aid me , we have Gideon and someone from another plane in Gatecrash, and then a wildcard planeswalker in Sinker. My guess for that one is someone from Dominaria, assuming of course that the "extraplanar visitor" we get in Gatecrash isn't from there. EDIT: Of course, I'm fairly certain our new Simic guildmaster is a planeswalker (UG, of course), the sinkholes are her work (or her work +Kiora Atua's), as is the introduction of merfolk to Ravnica.

[Lord Seth]

All right, this is kind of annoying me, so if anyone can help...

I feel like somewhere I saw a card that said something like "lands can't use activated abilities that don't produce mana" or something like that. Problem is trying to search for that on Gatherer isn't giving me answers (maybe I'm phrasing it wrong). Of course, it's also possible that that was just a random hypothetical card I saw someone post, and it doesn't actually exist.

Anyone happen to know anything about this?

[IthilanorStPete]

All right, this is kind of annoying me, so if anyone can help...

I feel like somewhere I saw a card that said something like "lands can't use activated abilities that don't produce mana" or something like that. Problem is trying to search for that on Gatherer isn't giving me answers (maybe I'm phrasing it wrong). Of course, it's also possible that that was just a random hypothetical card I saw someone post, and it doesn't actually exist.

Anyone happen to know anything about this?

Hmm. Possibly Tsabo's Web? I searched for "activated abilities" and didn't come up with something that does exactly that.

[Binks]

Interdict does it for 1 turn. As mentioned above Tsabo's Web is pretty close. Other than that I don't know of anything like that effect.

[tgva8889]

I feel like that card doesn't exist (or at least, no card with specifically that card text or one similar enough to it to do the same thing), only because if they'd printed it in the last 5 years I'd have immediately jumped on it and been like "YES THE HOLY RELIC OF AWESOME!"

[Lord Seth]

Hmm. Possibly Tsabo's Web? I searched for "activated abilities" and didn't come up with something that does exactly that.

That's probably what I was thinking of. Thanks!

[Androgeus]

A decent visual spoiler sorted by guild. doesn't include any of the guildless cards mind.

[Duos]

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BG gets a new antidelver tool!
Control gets a new antidelver tool!
Tokens gets an anthem nobody cares about because it costs six!
Zombies gets another great one drop, leaving it's two drop spot completely empty! Again!

STAY TUNED!

[Fable Wright]

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BG gets a new antidelver tool!
Control gets a new antidelver tool!
Tokens gets an anthem nobody cares about because it costs six!
Zombies gets another great one drop, leaving it's two drop spot completely empty! Again!

STAY TUNED!

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...Zombies currently has Lotleth Troll and Blood Artist in the 2-drop slot. Both of them, if I remember correctly, are rather good.

[Androgeus]

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Guild Feud, it is so silly and long winded that I think I'm in love.

[Elagune]

So during the draft today I went up against a really powerful WB Exalted deck. It came down to the wire, with me top-decking a Chandra's Fury to wipe out most of his life, with a single Bladetusk Boar attacking in for the win. Well, that's what should've happened. Turns out that both of us forgot to account for his Rhox Faithmender's lifegain and he scooped right there, when by all accounts he should've won this game.

I ended up giving the win to him voluntarily. Good deed of the day, done!

I ended up pulling a Liliana of the Dark Realms out of the pack I got for taking third place. I believe that was the work of karma.

Aaanyway, random story out of the way. I've been looking at the spoilers, and the idea of Junk Tokens has been very enticing. I've got the beginning of a deck brewed up already, but the hard part is cutting out enough cards to make 60. Anybody got any advice?

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18
4x Champion of the Parish
4x Avacyn's Pilgrim
4x Borderland Ranger
4x Mayor of Avabruck
2x Wayfaring Temple

30
4x Lingering Souls
2x Increasing Devotion
4x Gather the Townsfolk
4x Rancor
2x Collective Blessing
2x Revenge of the Hunted
4x Rootborn Defenses
4x Selesnya Charm
4x Intangible Virtue

4
2x Garruk, Primal Hunter
2x Sorin, Lord of Innistrad

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4x Temple Garden
4x Overgrown Tomb
4x Sunpetal Grove
2x Gavony Township
2x Grove of the Guardian
2x Forest
2x Plains
1x Swamp