Normandy SR2 (Mass Effect) vs. Deep Space Nine

[Leliel]

After completing Mass Effect 1, I've grown sufficiently enamored of 2 that I want to show my affection for the series on this board the only way I know how-making a Versus Thread.

Now, I've seen The Next Generation and the Original Series, and know enough to understand that the crew of the Normandy fighting the Enterprise would only result in either ship limping back home if Shepard has enough Charm/Intimidate to convince them to surrender after turning the engineering section into a work of abstract sculpture (maybe before then, in TNG-a Paragon could simply convince Picard of their noble intentions despite a crew that all desperately needs psychiatric treatment, or a Renegade could threaten to torture Troi via having said crew think very hard about their lives-Jack's general vicinity alone could send her hyperventilating). Completely different power levels, and Shepard's team are considered badasses by the rest of the setting (and this is the place where the peaceful Blue-Skinned Space Babes are capable of killing you with their minds).

Deep Space Nine, on the other hand, has Sisko.

Okay, they have a shapeshifiter on staff, they lord over a space station and associated fleet, but mostly Sisko.

So, if Q decides to have a little fun and pit the crew of the Normandy SR2 against DS9 for the sake of "understanding how different humans could be", who would come out victorious?

[Axolotl]

I don't really see how the normandy could possibly hope to compete. DS 9 is a space station that has successfully repeled attacks by a whole armada of warlike aliens. The Normandy on the other hand is a light ship designed for inserting a special forces group without being detected. In a straight-up fight it's screwed even before you account for the Federation massive tech advantage.

[Leliel]

I don't really see how the normandy could possibly hope to compete. DS 9 is a space station that has successfully repeled attacks by a whole armada of warlike aliens. The Normandy on the other hand is a light ship designed for inserting a special forces group without being detected. In a straight-up fight it's screwed even before you account for the Federation massive tech advantage.

...I wasn't just talking about the ship. It's also a battle of crews.

And really, the Normandy SR2 is the ship that took down a base built by Reapers, and came out fine...even if you don't upgrade it.

That's why I pit it against DS9, to give Starfleet a fighting chance.

[Grif]

...I wasn't just talking about the ship. It's also a battle of crews.

And really, the Normandy SR2 is the ship that took down a base built by Reapers, and came out fine...even if you don't upgrade it.

That's why I pit it against DS9, to give Starfleet a fighting chance.

Mate, you need to play the game again. They took down a Collector's Ship... barely if you didn't upgrade. (I don't consider having a gaping hole in your ship to be fine.) A little easier if you did take the upgrades. But in the end,they still crashed onto the base rather unceremoniously. Commander Shepard was the one who blew the base up, not the Normandy.

Also, DS9 has two different versions if I recall. One with pre-Dominion War armaments, basically obsolete Cardassian weaponry and post-Dominion War weaponry, after the Federation heavily fortified it. Which is it going to be?

[Axolotl]

...I wasn't just talking about the ship. It's also a battle of crews.

And really, the Normandy SR2 is the ship that took down a base built by Reapers, and came out fine...even if you don't upgrade it.

That's why I pit it against DS9, to give Starfleet a fighting chance.

If they aren't in their ships then what enviroment are they in?

[Leliel]

If they aren't in their ships then what enviroment are they in?

Deep Space Nine.

That way both crews can get their full advantage.

How Shep and Co. got on DS9 is where the space combat bit comes in.

[Axolotl]

Deep Space Nine.

That way both crews can get their full advantage.

How Shep and Co. got on DS9 is where the space combat bit comes in.

If you mean they start inside DS9 then Shepard has a fighting chance. The tech difference isn't as big (but the Federation still has the advantage) and Shep's team is on average better soldiers. Assuming the Prophets don't help Sisko then it just depends on if they can disable DS9 before anyone can raise an alarm, which they could probably do, the only peson who would pose serious problems would be Odo since there isn't much they could do to huirt him but they could possibly take him out using biotics.

If you mean they start outside DS9 on the Normandy then no they don't stand a snowball in hell's chance. Yes the crew is badass but the tech dissparity is just too large, it doesn't matter who's crewing it they can't overcome the difference.

[Tavar]

Okay, this really isn't a contest if outside the ship. The Federation uses anti-matter torpedoes, and ship-to-ship capable phasers(essentially, improved version of a Laser). In addition, if the opponent lacks shields, they can do utterly nasty things with the transporter. The idea that the Normandy(either version) could take on a Galaxy class ship and win...

Inside, well, there are again very nasty things doable with transporters. Plus, it's not clear how effective their armor is going to be against phasers, though I don't think their shields would work at all.

[Fan]

Okay, this really isn't a contest if outside the ship. The Federation uses anti-matter torpedoes, and ship-to-ship capable phasers(essentially, improved version of a Laser). In addition, if the opponent lacks shields, they can do utterly nasty things with the transporter. The idea that the Normandy(either version) could take on a Galaxy class ship and win...

Inside, well, there are again very nasty things doable with transporters. Plus, it's not clear how effective their armor is going to be against phasers, though I don't think their shields would work at all.

Not to be.. weird or anything.

The Normandy does have shields in the form of a Biotic Barrier, and a Kinetic Barrier.. essentially have 2 shields on top of armor.

Also, all of the ammo in Mass Effect is fired using a small mass effect field which propels the bullets towards it's target at faster than light speeds.

Not saying it helps, just that the tech isn't that far apart aside from transporter deals.

[chiasaur11]

If you mean they start inside DS9 then Shepard has a fighting chance. The tech difference isn't as big (but the Federation still has the advantage) and Shep's team is on average better soldiers. Assuming the Prophets don't help Sisko then it just depends on if they can disable DS9 before anyone can raise an alarm, which they could probably do, the only peson who would pose serious problems would be Odo since there isn't much they could do to huirt him but they could possibly take him out using biotics.

If you mean they start outside DS9 on the Normandy then no they don't stand a snowball in hell's chance. Yes the crew is badass but the tech dissparity is just too large, it doesn't matter who's crewing it they can't overcome the difference.

Gonna disagree. Immensely.

Sure, straight up slugfest isn't the Normandy's skillset. But it's got stealth systems, heavy armor (which has been shown to be massively useful against Trek ships, as much as you might pretend Voyager never happened), and, importantly, range advantages. All of that lets it stand a chance in a slugfest.

But the most important bit? EDI. Remote shutdown of all defense systems for long enough to get Shepard and her team in? Yeah, she could swing that.

And then Shepard's team is on DS9. And then Shepard wins.

Because, here's the thing. Starfleet has incredibly few dedicated military units in its history. MACOs (which is something you never want Shepard near in general) and the Hazard teams, which were introduced years after DS9. The second group proved man portable shields work against phasers, meaning anyone who shoots Shep doesn't get a one shot kill. Meanwhile, that idiot doesn't have armor or shields, so Shepard explodes his or her head in one of a thousand ways.

And that's assuming it comes down to a gunfight. It won't.

Because Shepard has just the crew to shut down any problems before that.

The galaxy's best thief. A living supercomputer with the galaxy's best multitasking skills. The top engineer from a species where you can fix a fuel regulator issue years before going to first base. The top assassin alive, who can disappear into the shadows without a trace.

Any one of those would be an episode's worth of "there's nothing we can do!"

All together, and Shepard controls the station without firing a shot.

And, again, if it comes to a fight, Shepard has guns that can kill the federation guys much better than they can kill her, and a crew of trained soldiers, natural born killers, and a couple killing machines.

Oh, and if her side has prep time, it's all over. Dr. Mordin Solus, galaxy's foremost bioweapon expert. Humans, a species he knows fairly well, and a lot of species that are genetically oh-so-close.

It wouldn't be pretty.

(And even if Odo is immune to incendiary rounds, as is likely, biotics work on a molecular level. Warp bombs would do him in like anyone else.)

[Tavar]

Not to be.. weird or anything.

The Normandy does have shields in the form of a Biotic Barrier, and a Kinetic Barrier.. essentially have 2 shields on top of armor.

Also, all of the ammo in Mass Effect is fired using a small mass effect field which propels the bullets towards it's target at faster than light speeds.

Not saying it helps, just that the tech isn't that far apart aside from transporter deals.

Okay, this is wrong on many levels. Mass Effect's bullets are not Faster than light. They're C-fractional at best, and those seemed to be reserved for the stronger, ship board weapons.

Secondly, Mass Effects Shields =/= Star Fleet's Shields. Mass Effect's shields are Kinetic Barriers, which explicitly provide almost no protection against light based attacks. Hence, you know, Lasers going right through them. Star Trek's shields protect against both direct kinetic energy and Electromagnetic radiation. Yes, they are both called shields, but they aren't the same, nor do they provide the same amount or type of protection.

Also, source that they have 2 types of shields? Everything I can find suggests that they only have one: the Kinetic Barrier.

[Tiki Snakes]

This may help discussions

Generally, I'm undecided overall. Though it seems simple enough to say that in a straight up station vs ship shootout, the normandy won't have the advantage, the trick is whether there will be one.

Likewise, the Station Security might be able to slow Sheperd and co's team down if they get on-board, but it won't be pretty or likely to succeed. Biotics and tech skills, along with some pretty nasty toys mean that it would be a very bad day for DS9.

But the only likely outcome is Sisko and Sheperd, teams in tow, kicking seven shades out of Q. You know it makes sense.

[Axolotl]

Gonna disagree. Immensely.

Sure, straight up slugfest isn't the Normandy's skillset. But it's got stealth systems,

Ones that are vastly worse than the stealth systems that are on the ship that the DS9 crew have.

heavy armor (which has been shown to be massively useful against Trek ships, as much as you might pretend Voyager never happened),

They don't even have heavy armour for their setting, and yes one type of armour that was made by a society vastly more advanced than the one Mass Effect is set in.

and, importantly, range advantages. All of that lets it stand a chance in a slugfest.

What range advantages?

But the most important bit? EDI. Remote shutdown of all defense systems for long enough to get Shepard and her team in? Yeah, she could swing that.

What? EDI is just an AI, it's not some sort of god that can just magically defeat any enemy tech.

The galaxy's best thief. A living supercomputer with the galaxy's best multitasking skills. The top engineer from a species where you can fix a fuel regulator issue years before going to first base. The top assassin alive, who can disappear into the shadows without a trace.

All badass to be sure, but they aren't going to be able to disable DS9's defences in a timescale less than "weeks" unless they have outside help. The only way they can win is a firefight hoping the alarms system doesn't kick in a seal them off. Now if they're on the station they have a fair chance of doing this. But it isn't an instawin.

Any one of those would be an episode's worth of "there's nothing we can do!"

No. Any one fitting those descriptions from the Star Trek setting would be a episode of problems (problems which the DS9 crew never had to save scum to get past I'd note, although admittedly that's a bit meta) but there's a big difference between one raised with Federation tech and one raised with Citadel tech.

And, again, if it comes to a fight, Shepard has guns that can kill the federation guys much better than they can kill her, and a crew of trained soldiers, natural born killers, and a couple killing machines.

While the Federation only has several war heros, a genetically enigneered supermanand a messiah on their side. Yes Shepard would probably win in the end but it wouldn't be a cakewalk.

Oh, and if her side has prep time, it's all over. Dr. Mordin Solus, galaxy's foremost bioweapon expert. Humans, a species he knows fairly well, and a lot of species that are genetically oh-so-close.

It wouldn't be pretty.

If only there was someone on DS9 who was a genius with large ammounts of experience with engineered viruses.


This is like pitting a trireme against an aircraft carrier. Even if the trireme has Alexander, Archimedes and all the heroes of Troy the gap in just too big for it to pose a threat.

[SoC175]

And really, the Normandy SR2 is the ship that took down a base built by Reapers, and came out fine...even if you don't upgrade it.

The sad truth is that ME2 made the collectors look totally not threatening.

They sacked some undefended minor colonies, that were created in a region that was specifically declared to be outside of alliance navy protection. And they were driven off by the very first of these fleeting colonies that had a small defense system operating.

Their greatest military victory was destroying a frigate (the smallest class of warships) in a surprise attack. Later the same collector warship got it's ***kick by a frigate that was prepared for a fight.

Really? What are these clowns supposed to do if they encounter a force of several frigates? And what about the more powerful classes of warships like cruisers (a single cruiser is said to be capable of destroying multiple frigates), carriers or dreadnoughts?

Given their pitiful track record in the game, I could only shake the head whenever the characters talked as if Earth was doomed if I didn't stop them.

Would have made a great end sequence: The entire collectors fleet jumping into Sol-System only to be totally demolished by a couple of cruiser while the dreadnought don't even bother to leave the docks.

[mangosta71]

Ones that are vastly worse than the stealth systems that are on the ship that the DS9 crew have.

How exactly is cloaking in the ST universe superior to the Normandy's stealth system? Because it turns the ship invisible to visual scans, too? Guess what - none of the targeting computations rely on visual scans. Distances and speeds are both too great for visual data to be useful.

What range advantages?

Against an immobile target? Weapons in ME keep going until they hit something. The Normandy can sit a light year away and unload all of its weaponry, then just hide until it hits. It's not like the space station can move out of the way. Any return fire would be easily evaded because the Normandy isn't immobile.

What? EDI is just an AI, it's not some sort of god that can just magically defeat any enemy tech.

There is no AI in the ST universe. EDI is something that nobody has ever dealt with. She's smart enough to play along with the systems on DS9, allowing commands to go through while she learns the pathways, and then shut everything down hard when the time comes. Or, probably more devastating, reroute orders so that the security teams walk into ambushes.

All badass to be sure, but they aren't going to be able to disable DS9's defences in a timescale less than "weeks" unless they have outside help. The only way they can win is a firefight hoping the alarms system doesn't kick in a seal them off. Now if they're on the station they have a fair chance of doing this. But it isn't an instawin.

Or EDI just leaves the food and water distribution systems locked down until everyone onboard is dead. So, 3 days. At most.

If only there was someone on DS9 who was a genius with large ammounts of experience with engineered viruses.

Again, nothing in the ST universe even compares to the complexity of the genophage. And even if Bashir could figure it out and synthesize a cure, he would need time to do so. If Mordin comes in with a genetic plague ready to go, and he just releases it into the air cycling system, by the time the symptoms start to show up (they'll have no idea that anything is wrong before that point) it will be too late to save the majority of the crew.

[Trixie]

Okay, this really isn't a contest if outside the ship. The Federation uses anti-matter torpedoes, and ship-to-ship capable phasers(essentially, improved version of a Laser). In addition, if the opponent lacks shields, they can do utterly nasty things with the transporter. The idea that the Normandy(either version) could take on a Galaxy class ship and win...

Normandy took on Sovereign. They won, and Normandy II is vastly more powerful. One torpedo to unarmored bridge (conveniently located on top of the saucer) from ambush and there's no one left alive to direct the fight.

As for anti-matter torpedoes, that doesn't make them better. At all. This only changes way of magazining the energy. Only yield counts. Aren't Fed Torps megaton-grade, making them little better than nukes of 1960?

If you mean they start inside DS9 then Shepard has a fighting chance. The tech difference isn't as big (but the Federation still has the advantage) and Shep's team is on average better soldiers.

Um... Pardon? What better tech?

ST has pajamas and hard to aim shaver-like phasers, ME has actual armor with force fields and weapons firing razor-sharp blades at c-fractional speed. Not to mention actual soldiers between rifle butt and trigger guard

[Eldritch Knight]

There is no AI in the ST universe. EDI is something that nobody has ever dealt with. She's smart enough to play along with the systems on DS9, allowing commands to go through while she learns the pathways, and then shut everything down hard when the time comes. Or, probably more devastating, reroute orders so that the security teams walk into ambushes.

No AI? What does that make Data, Lore, The EMH, and Moriarty?

I am sure many other examples could be given, as well.

[Liffguard]

Ship-to-ship? Normandy gets toasted. Kinetic barriers only work against solid projectiles, so no protection there. Normandy has to worry about heat build-up, which Trek ships apparently don't. I assume phasers travel at light speed? If so, then Trek has the range and targeting advantage since even the upgraded Normandy's thanix cannons are only a small fraction of C. Most importantly however, the Normandy has some fairly explicit capabilities and limitations whereas all Trek ships are effectively magic. No matter what the Normandy does, all the Trek engineer has to do is reverse the neutron flow polarity through the secondary fusion deflection binary pulse array to generate a subspace flux anti-electromatter field and everything will be ok again.

Man-to-man? The Normandy's suicide squad definitely take this one. Heavy ablative armour (which would be very useful against phasers). A wide variety of accurate, rapid-firing weapons (with sights even!). Training and experience in FIBUA squad tactics. Biotics and disruptive tech abilities. No Trek ship or station has ever shown any soldiers with anything close to the same armour, weapons, training or abilities.

[Ekul]

No AI? What does that make Data, Lore, The EMH, and Moriarty?

I am sure many other examples could be given, as well.

I think he meant the shipboard AIs are nowhere near as complex and "smart" as EDI. Compare the Doctor with EDI and Data with Legion, the Mass Effect versions generally are technologically superior. (Although let me say that I love all four characters, and the Doctor's probably in my top 3 favorite Star Trek characters.)

In a fight between EDI and Moriarty, there'd be no question. EDI would win. Moriarty and Data have nowhere near the hacking capability of either.

[Trixie]

No AI? What does that make Data, Lore

Singular pieces of tech no one was able to understand, not even Borg. EMH was held in such contempt by actual doctors (ST VIII) that they kept him turned off, permanently, the only good/comparable example was upgraded with XXIX century tech. And, when Data locked systems of Enterprise with cipher (ST VIII), not even Borg were able to unlock it. EDI is far smarter than Data (no problems with emotions, for example), and dedicated hacking AI to boot, he can lock anything he can touch even tighter, making Flagship of the Starfleet tin box floating helplessly

[Reverent-One]

I don't know if we can say self-awareness automatically translates into better at hacking and the like, they're really seperate things. Otherwise we can say that modern day earth in the Tron universe has more advanced programs than the star trek universe, since the programs are at least self-aware.

[Joran]

How exactly is cloaking in the ST universe superior to the Normandy's stealth system? Because it turns the ship invisible to visual scans, too? Guess what - none of the targeting computations rely on visual scans. Distances and speeds are both too great for visual data to be useful.

Well, in Trek, visible = detectable. Blame the medium. There's also a cloaking device in Star Trek that lets you go THROUGH material objects... But anyway, the Collectors didn't seem to have much difficulty in detecting Normandy I.

Against an immobile target? Weapons in ME keep going until they hit something. The Normandy can sit a light year away and unload all of its weaponry, then just hide until it hits. It's not like the space station can move out of the way. Any return fire would be easily evaded because the Normandy isn't immobile.

Err... First off, it'll take more than a year for the projectile to get to DS9, since all ME weapons are sub-light. Second, a dumb projectile firing over a light year away is going to miss, unless you're the luckiest son of a gun in the Universe. Minor gravitational effects add up to a HUGE miss. You're aiming for a really small target from a very long distance.

The Normandy II can't even travel at FTL "cloaked". Their sensors are inhibited by the speed of light. Their weapons, more importantly, are limited by the speed of light. Star Trek ships can travel FTL at will, detect ships at FTL, and can fire their weapons at FTL.

Normandy took on Sovereign. They won, and Normandy II is vastly more powerful. One torpedo to unarmored bridge (conveniently located on top of the saucer) from ambush and there's no one left alive to direct the fight.

As for anti-matter torpedoes, that doesn't make them better. At all. This only changes way of magazining the energy. Only yield counts. Aren't Fed Torps megaton-grade, making them little better than nukes of 1960?

Star Trek torpedo yields are measured in "isotons". Yes, I know, translated it means one-ton, but they gave up on using real world units because they didn't want to get their math wrong.

Err... Normandy had the entire Fifth Fleet behind it. It's not like the Normandy I took on Sovereign all by itself. This was also after Sovereign took a beating from the Citadel defense fleet and the largest freakin' ship in the entire galaxy.

Once Shepard and company board DS9, it's a fairer fight. However, transporter use gives the defense a huge mobility advantage, along with the security forcefields that DS9 can put up to impede movement. Also, internal sensors will allow the DS9 crew to track the exact location and movement of the boarding party, so it's not as cut and dry as it seems.

Unless of course the Mass Effect people slap some omni-gel on the doors and open them up.

P.S. As stated before by Liffguard, Mass Effect is generally good about making its physics work or believeable. Star Trek operates on magic and a ton of hand-waving.

[chiasaur11]

Also, in reference to Bashir being genetically modified:

So is Miranda. And Shepard. And Kaiden. And Ash. And Jack. And Jacob. Probably Zaeed and Kasumi too, but that's less certain.

Maybe not to the same extent in some cases, but a package of soldier boosts is standard. All alliance marines are made faster, stronger, and smarter as a signing bonus.

[Joran]

Again, nothing in the ST universe even compares to the complexity of the genophage. And even if Bashir could figure it out and synthesize a cure, he would need time to do so. If Mordin comes in with a genetic plague ready to go, and he just releases it into the air cycling system, by the time the symptoms start to show up (they'll have no idea that anything is wrong before that point) it will be too late to save the majority of the crew.

Ooh... There's been a couple really terrible diseases in Star Trek. The one that strikes me is The Quickening.

http://memory-alpha.org/wiki/The_Quickening

Basically, genetically engineered disease that doesn't kill its victims quickly, but instead causes very painful death and infects down through to the next generation. The really, evil thing the Dominion did was make it worse when exposed to EM radiation... So kiss that technology good-bye.

[Axolotl]

How exactly is cloaking in the ST universe superior to the Normandy's stealth system? Because it turns the ship invisible to visual scans, too? Guess what - none of the targeting computations rely on visual scans. Distances and speeds are both too great for visual data to be useful.

ST detection methods (and therefore their cloaking that protects from said measures) does not work on visual identification. Hell the only stealth the Normandy has is not venting heat, now that's good stuff against the ME universe especially when inside a solar system. ST however has pseudoscience scanners working on principles that ME guys do't even know about nevermind can try and counteract.

Against an immobile target? Weapons in ME keep going until they hit something. The Normandy can sit a light year away and unload all of its weaponry, then just hide until it hits.

And how do they accurately target at that distance? Also the weapons the Normandy has don't travel at light speed so they'd have to wait over a year for anything to happen. Which would give the DS9 crew plenty of time to use any of their FTL ships to deal with the problem. Also it can't hide in deep space and since it can't travel FTL the Normandy would be a sitting duck.

It's not like the space station can move out of the way. Any return fire would be easily evaded because the Normandy isn't immobile.

But it is immobile in comparison. It can't go FTL unlike everything DS9 is built to deal with and has access to.

There is no AI in the ST universe. EDI is something that nobody has ever dealt with.

You've never seen Star Trek have you? Evil AI is one of the most regular plots ever. Hell an AI was one of the main characters in TNG and another one was a main character in Voyager.

She's smart enough to play along with the systems on DS9, allowing commands to go through while she learns the pathways, and then shut everything down hard when the time comes. Or, probably more devastating, reroute orders so that the security teams walk into ambushes.

What? First how is EDI even going to access these systems? Also AI takes over DS9 security is a plot they used, it was a minor anoyance that they stopped quickly.

Or EDI just leaves the food and water distribution systems locked down until everyone onboard is dead. So, 3 days. At most.

But it can't access those systems, or any systems. for that matter. They've been able to repel hackers who actually have used ST computers before.

Again, nothing in the ST universe even compares to the complexity of the genophage.

The anti-changeling one springs to mind. Or the one the Dominion used to crush a race that resisted them.

[QUPTE]And even if Bashir could figure it out and synthesize a cure, he would need time to do so. If Mordin comes in with a genetic plague ready to go, and he just releases it into the air cycling system, by the time the symptoms start to show up[/QUOTE]And they deploy it how?

(they'll have no idea that anything is wrong before that point)

What about the medical scanners that are designed to counter viral infections?

it will be too late to save the majority of the crew.

Well the human crew that is, welll the ones that aren't augmented, well the ones that don't have magic. So you've killed an engineer basically, well done.

Normandy took on Sovereign. They won, and Normandy II is vastly more powerful. One torpedo to unarmored bridge (conveniently located on top of the saucer) from ambush and there's no one left alive to direct the fight.

The alliance fleet took on Sovereign and won. Besides which, the Reapers are distinctly worse than the Federation when it comes down to tech we've actually seen. Yes they claim to be too advanced to need a motivation but against the Federation they'd be a fairly minor threat overall.

Um... Pardon? What better tech?

You know the teleporters, Faster than Light systems, the Force Fields, the Matter Replicators, Universal Translators and that's not counting the things they have access to but don't use for one reason or another.

ST has pajamas and hard to aim shaver-like phasers, ME has actual armor with force fields and weapons firing razor-sharp blades at c-fractional speed. Not to mention actual soldiers between rifle butt and trigger guard

Yes the Mass Effect people have more military styled aesthetics than the Federation. This is not because they're more advanced.

[Joran]

What? First how is EDI even going to access these systems? Also AI takes over DS9 security is a plot they used, it was a minor anoyance that they stopped quickly.

But it can't access those systems, or any systems. for that matter. They've been able to repel hackers who actually have used ST computers before.

This is a good point. Starfleet communications operate on subspace transmissions. I doubt EDI will suddenly be able to transmit information on a device that don't exist using science she doesn't understand.

Now, if they can get onboard, the Federation ship consoles seem built to allow hacking... Just slap some omni-gel on it, and you're golden.

Also it can't hide in deep space and since it can't travel FTL the Normandy would be a sitting duck.

Well, to be fair, Normandy can go FTL. The problem is that it can't be stealthed when going FTL and it can't fire weapons... which is a problem if you're fighting a foe that CAN go FTL and CAN fire weapons.

[Tiki Snakes]

This is a good point. Starfleet communications operate on subspace transmissions. I doubt EDI will suddenly be able to transmit information on a device that don't exist using science she doesn't understand.

She seemed to have little trouble hacking the systems of the practically mythical collectors, to be fair, which has to be a pretty analogous situation.

[Axolotl]

Well, to be fair, Normandy can go FTL. The problem is that it can't be stealthed when going FTL and it can't fire weapons... which is a problem if you're fighting a foe that CAN go FTL and CAN fire weapons.

I thought they neede one of those mass relays to go FTL?

[Hawriel]

skipped ahead a little.

Another poster made a good point about the how the shield systems are different.

Normandy's 'stealth' system is not a cloaking devise. Normandy traps its own eat and energy emissions so IR scanners do not pick it up. It might have a raidar absorbent skin similar to the B2. This would work with its curved hull to nullify raidar waves. If you look out a window you still see it. I know space is big bla bla. However the ship still needs to get close enough to DS9 to board. It will be spotted.

In order for Normandy to fire its weapons it has to have a sencor lock. That is active sencors need to be activly sending out a signal for the weapons firing computer to creat a firing solution. Federation sensors with detect this immediatly. Federation sencorse will be able to count how many crew are on Normandy, different species, and biotic energy waves.

EDI gets boned.

Sure EDI might be able to do somthing. It's not like the Federation ever came across a species of aliens who are mostly computers with the express goal of assimalating every thing.

Last but not least.

Worf declokes with Defiant with in transporter and weapons range of Normandy.

[Joran]

She seemed to have little trouble hacking the systems of the practically mythical collectors, to be fair, which has to be a pretty analogous situation.

She was built using the same technology, so it's not quite analogous. She's Reaper tech.

I thought they neede one of those mass relays to go FTL?

Well, mass relays to go someplace really, really far; for normal system to system travel, they have normal FTL.

However, traveling at FTL makes you light up like a Christmas tree apparently.