Sid Meyer's Civilization

[Closet_Skeleton]

What about Terra? The one where there's a whole continent nobody starts on that gets filled up with Barbarians and city states.

I quite liked hemispheres last time I used it, usually gives two continents and lots of small islands.

I just find that any map type that limits the amount of Ocean basically removes a third of the game.

[Luzahn]

Come to think of it, Terra solves both the problem with separating the players for ages and the lack of navy. I'd assume that the size wouldn't be a problem either, considering turn speed is rather low as-is for PBEM games.

[Cikomyr]

Is it just me, or is the Ethiopian's special building... kind of OP? If you grab Tradition early on, you end up with quite an amazing early lead in both culture and faith.

[Luzahn]

Eh, unique buildings are good. The Maya get one that gives science and faith.

[Driderman]

Unique buildings are generally pretty awesome. Haven't actually played as the Ethiopians yet, but I very rarely play a Civ that doesn't have a building, or at least a unique terrain improvement. Units just aren't that awesome.

As for map type, so long as there's more than one big continent I pretty much good with whatever.

[OrcusMcP]

Is it just me, or is the Ethiopian's special building... kind of OP? If you grab Tradition early on, you end up with quite an amazing early lead in both culture and faith.

Dude. Wait until you try the Zulu. The bonuses their unique Barracks gives are just..... awesome.

But yes, Ethiopia's Stele is considered on par with the Mayan pyramid as the best unique building.

[Mx.Silver]

I've always had mixed feelings about Terra. On the one hand, it's one of the only maps that encourages 'colonial' play later in the game. I do quite like this since it feels more historically accurate and because it showcases later game city building better than most other map types (and thereby utilises BNW's food and production transport abilities).
On the other hand, the problem Terra often runs into is that the initial continent gets very crowded, very fast. For the first half of the game (unless you're Polynesia) you're effectively playing a Pangaea that's significantly smaller than your selected map size. That's not necessarily a bad thing, but it can lead to problems, especially if your immediate neighbours are highly expansionist, Early rushes can be nasty and difficult to stop, although that's partly due to the AI's difficulty in grasping the concept of banding together against bigger nations before the lead gets too big reasonably close.

Of course, those are only real problems in single-player. Multi-player it's likely to be more flexible, since early competition will probably lead to a more dynamic diplomatic side things.


If it's what people want then I'm fine with it though.

Dude. Wait until you try the Zulu. The bonuses their unique Barracks gives are just..... awesome.

For added effect, follow this simple guide:

1. Play as Russia
2. Build a Krepost
3. Open Civlopedia and look-up any one of the Ikandi's unique promotions.
4. This is now your face:

[Cikomyr]

For added effect, follow this simple guide:

1. Play as Russia
2. Build a Krepost
3. Open Civlopedia and look-up any one of the Ikandi's unique promotions.
4. This is now your face:

Russia get other bonuses that makes it worthwhile, tho. No?

I mean, the point of balance is that some civ's ability are better, while others get their strenght from uber-units. Others are from their special building.

Which is the best special ability, in your opinion? :D

[OrcusMcP]

For added effect, follow this simple guide:

1. Play as Russia
2. Build a Krepost
3. Open Civlopedia and look-up any one of the Ikandi's unique promotions.
4. This is now your face:

Truth. There is no unique building quite so bad as a Krepost.

Maybe the Moai, but do improvements count?

[Closet_Skeleton]

Moai aren't really bad, they just force a different style of play that isn't optimal. Most maps also suck for Polynesia since they actually want a lot of 4-6 tile islands which aren't very common, so usually they end up being best off with non-coastal cities on the main continent since that's the easiest way to get enough coast for a line of Moai. Otherwise in most cases Moai end up being worse than the culture for plantations pantheon since then you're getting plantation yield as well as culture rather than the base tile yield that makes cities with Moai around them worthless for anything but culture.

There's nothing worse than unique improvements combined with annoyingly placed sheep.

[OrcusMcP]

Russia get other bonuses that makes it worthwhile, tho. No?

Absolutely. Extra iron, horses and uranium is nothing to sneeze at. It can mean extra troops or money you wouldn't otherwise get.
Bonus production from strategic resources is even more useful!

Which is the best special ability, in your opinion? :D

It always depends on your goal, to be sure. If I had to give a top 5 of what is always useful, in no particular order:

• Assyria - Bonus techs form conquering? Yes please!
• Babylon - Bonus Great Scientists? Yes please!
• Greece - Cheaper City State maintenance? Yes please!
• Rome - Easier to get new cities up and running? Yes please!
• Spain - Free money and bonus yields? Yes please!

Inca, Aztec and Shoshone get major honourable mentions.

[Luzahn]

I don't know how optimum it is now, especially with that garbage of the Zulu's, but the German ability is one of my favorites.

Basically, Barbarian camps switch from nuisances to goodie huts. That army maintanence bonus is still cool, but the 50% Zulu just blows it out of the water.

But the most powerful by far has to be Austria's. 500 gold for a 12-pop city? Sure, why not.

[Closet_Skeleton]

Austria's power is only 500 gold if you get lucky with quests or wait for spies. By the time I have spies with Austria I usually don't want any more cities and would rather keep the bonus for having a city state ally.

Venice also has the same ability but arguably better.

[Driderman]

Not to mention that Austria can be countered by allying with it's city state allies while Venice is a cheeky bastard that will annex the city state you just spent 1000 gold on becoming allies with the turn before

[Closet_Skeleton]

Not to mention that Austria can be countered by allying with it's city state allies while Venice is a cheeky bastard that will annex the city state you just spent 1000 gold on becoming allies with the turn before

I think Venice is actually worse in that they can annex city state allies of yours when you're at war with them.

Basically, Barbarian camps switch from nuisances to goodie huts.

Askia's ability is a lot more reliable. With Germany you either never have to train another melee infantry unit again for the whole game or get like 1 brute who dies to another brute.

[Driderman]

I think Venice is actually worse in that they can annex city state allies of yours when you're at war with them.

To be honest I've never felt city state allies as much use though, but that is adding an extra layer of cheek to it.

[zabbarot]

I've been told Brazil's UA is really strong. A friend of mine won his first BNW game as them by getting a cultural victory in 1909 ._.

[Cikomyr]

To be honest I've never felt city state allies as much use though, but that is adding an extra layer of cheek to it.

It would be nice if at least, the buy-out option in time of war would be seen as a genuine act of aggression by the collective of City-States. "Aggressive Buyout" is a real term, ya know

Or maybe you make it costly to buy a city-state you are at war with.

Edit: Can you "liberate" bought-up city states?

[factotum]

A lot of the special stuff civs get is situational and very powerful in certain situations. That free Harbour in every city that Carthage gets? Worth its weight in gold and happiness on an archipelago map, believe me!

[Closet_Skeleton]

Edit: Can you "liberate" bought-up city states?

Nope, both Austria and Venice treat their city states as though they were never city states in the first place, so if you take one then you might as well have taken a city that was originally Austrian.

You know, because Prague, Brugge and Buda were never liberated from Austrian control in real life.

[Vitruviansquid]

I've been told Siam's power is actually completely outrageous, considering that you can be friends with a city-state forever by just adopting the Consulates policy in Patronage and pledging to protect it. I haven't actually tried a strategy of sucking up to the city-states, so I wouldn't know.

[Mx.Silver]

You know, because Prague, Brugge and Buda were never liberated from Austrian control in real life.

Be careful with that line of thought. That seems like a perfectly fair point now, but then you'll start wondering about how it's possible for both Constaninople and Istanbul to exist separately from each other in the same game, and before you know it you'll be declaring that America and Brazil shouldn't be in the game and calling for the Mongols and Huns to be replace by a big horde of barbarians and the entire discussion becomes this.

[zabbarot]

I tried a terra map because I never had, and yes it is crazy crowded. I wouldn't want to play Venice here with all that delicious open land on the other side. Also my test game had Kamehameha who pretty much immediately fled to the new world : |

[Studoku]

The entire discussion becomes this.

I miss those guys.

[Cikomyr]

Man. I think my advisors are screwed up..

I am currently fighting a war of liberation of City-States and France (France has been eliminated since Classical period, I don't think anyone beside Assyria ever seen the CS independent) with Battleships, and for the first time the world is seeing Carriers joining the frey.

My Science Advisor say I should build Triplanes
My Economic Advisor say I should build Great War Bombers
My Military Advisor say I should build an Opera House

.... da ****?

[factotum]

Your military advisor clearly thinks the war is going badly and wants you to go for a culture victory.

[Closet_Skeleton]

Be careful with that line of thought. That seems like a perfectly point now, but then you'll start wondering about how it's possible for to have both Constaninople and Istanbul to exist separately from each other in the same game, and before you know it you'll be declaring that America and Brazil shouldn't be in the game and calling for the Mongols and Huns to be replace by a big horde of barbarians and the entire discussion becomes this.

The United States has no less right to be in the game than the Incas, France, India or England since those countries didn't exist in 4000 BC either. Portugal was just a bit of Spain that became independent out of historical chance and then expanded etc. Brazil kind of needs to be in because there isn't enough information about the native states in that area.

Some Civs make no sense and didn't exist as states but they represent cultures that wouldn't be in the game otherwise (Aztec, Mayans, Polynesia etc) and some are short lived or unimportant states that operate as representations of a larger culture (Zulu, Inca, Indonesia, India, Mongols, Huns, Babylon, Arabia). The only Civilisation that didn't actually exist in real life is the Celts, who's name comes from a tribe that lived in central France but all their city names come from the British Isles or British colonies in Brittany (some of which like Nantes were always majority latin speaking). I really wish Celts and England were replaced by a Gauls Civ and a Britain Civ, but really the Celts are only in the game for Americans who hate English people and want Scottish independence despite not wanting Scottish citizenship or having any affinity with the Scottish people beyond some distant ancestors.

Your military advisor clearly thinks the war is going badly and wants you to go for a culture victory.

Opera houses are very important for the military when you've been knocked into unhappiness by enemy tourism and your units are taking massive penalties to their strength.

[Derthric]

The United States has no less right to be in the game than the Incas, France, India or England since those countries didn't exist in 4000 BC either. Portugal was just a bit of Spain that became independent out of historical chance and then expanded etc. Brazil kind of needs to be in because there isn't enough information about the native states in that area.

Some Civs make no sense and didn't exist as states but they represent cultures that wouldn't be in the game otherwise (Aztec, Mayans, Polynesia etc) and some are short lived or unimportant states that operate as representations of a larger culture (Zulu, Inca, Indonesia, India, Mongols, Huns, Babylon, Arabia). The only Civilisation that didn't actually exist in real life is the Celts, who's name comes from a tribe that lived in central France but all their city names come from the British Isles or British colonies in Brittany (some of which like Nantes were always majority latin speaking). I really wish Celts and England were replaced by a Gauls Civ and a Britain Civ, but really the Celts are only in the game for Americans who hate English people and want Scottish independence despite not wanting Scottish citizenship or having any affinity with the Scottish people beyond some distant ancestors.

Plus Boadicea is kinda hot.....what....don't judge me!

I hadn't played Civ V in quite some time but picked up G+K and some other civ dlc in the steam summer sale. Really feel the game has improved overall but I cannot seem to master Espionage at all. I have my spies deployed into my cities to conduct counter intelligence. But it seems my scientists like to leave my state secrets laying about on the streets. Is there a trick to ensuring your spies are effective or is it just a passive crap shoot?

[Driderman]

Plus Boadicea is kinda hot.....what....don't judge me!

I hadn't played Civ V in quite some time but picked up G+K and some other civ dlc in the steam summer sale. Really feel the game has improved overall but I cannot seem to master Espionage at all. I have my spies deployed into my cities to conduct counter intelligence. But it seems my scientists like to leave my state secrets laying about on the streets. Is there a trick to ensuring your spies are effective or is it just a passive crap shoot?

You can't protect against losing tech secrets effectively until the Information Age (ironically).
I actually found that on Prince/King difficulties, the best way to avoid the AI closing the gap by spying is simply to not be in the lead and build other stuff instead. Use your spies to steal their techs instead!
Then when you get to the late renaissance/industrial age and can build Constabularies and Police Stations you use your (hopefully) superior infrastructure to quickly build those and the science buildings you've neglected up until now. Of course, it's a balancing act, but it's worked well for me so far.

With regards to setting up this multiplayer game, where exactly are we in the process? Who will host, and should we get started? I can host it, if nobody else wants.

[Closet_Skeleton]

With regards to setting up this multiplayer game, where exactly are we in the process? Who will host, and should we get started? I can host it, if nobody else wants.

Somebody said we'd start on saturday evening so I was assuming that was accepted.

I don't feel confident in hosting anything so I think it should be the person who's had the most experience.