High School Harem Comedy (Game System, PEACH)

[steelsmiter]

At the moment I'm using a rule called VP for Everyone that I presented earlier which amounts to similar things, but no secret. I'm coming to find that having codified "stages" of romance has both ups and downs. I'm not sure how to handle it at the moment.

[Angelalex242]

By Stages, he means:

1-10 just friends. Getting phone number/first kiss happens at this stage.
11-20 dating. Some groping happens at this stage, first time having sex happens at 20.
21-30 sexual relationship. At 30, the protag goes ring shopping, which is the ultimate goal (engagement)

[Mutazoia]

Ok....let's see if THIS LINK works for downloading the PDF...

(some one try it and let me know if it works)

[Amechra]

By Stages, he means:

1-10 just friends. Getting phone number/first kiss happens at this stage.
11-20 dating. Some groping happens at this stage, first time having sex happens at 20.
21-30 sexual relationship. At 30, the protag goes ring shopping, which is the ultimate goal (engagement)

You know what might be neat? If you went with something like this as a default, and then Archetypes you pick modify it. Like how a Pervert is likely to add sex to stuff a lot earlier in the relationship than, say, a Shrinking Violet.

So, instead of having it at set Stages, make it Thresholds; to take your example:

10 RP: Dating opens up.
20 RP: Sex opens up.
30 RP: Engagement (great success!)

Then, for example, Pervert would drop that second threshold by 5.

If you went for a system like that, you'd need a bunch of thresholds; I mean, Pervert might mean that you get to Third Base much earlier, but the Protagonist is not likely to take you home to meet the parents until much later than he would normally (they might not approve, you know.)

Actually, that's something that's missing: Protagonist Family Members! Remember how people were discussing giving the Protagonist traits? How about giving him Family Members as an explicit thing? They wouldn't be introduced until later on in the game, but hitting ~15 RP and then suddenly coming face to face with the the Protagonist's Annoying Kid Sister trying to keep you apart...

Drama!

[Angelalex242]

That's true.

I can conceive of some archetypes where the Protag goes ring shopping BEFORE the sex. Ya know, traditional family values marriage style.

No nookie for that PC, but their number to win outright with shiny bling on their finger may be far lower.

[BWR]

The link works for me.
Thanks.

[steelsmiter]

You know what might be neat? If you went with something like this as a default, and then Archetypes you pick modify it. Like how a Pervert is likely to add sex to stuff a lot earlier in the relationship than, say, a Shrinking Violet.

So, instead of having it at set Stages, make it Thresholds; to take your example:

10 RP: Dating opens up.
20 RP: Sex opens up.
30 RP: Engagement (great success!)

Then, for example, Pervert would drop that second threshold by 5.

If you went for a system like that, you'd need a bunch of thresholds; I mean, Pervert might mean that you get to Third Base much earlier, but the Protagonist is not likely to take you home to meet the parents until much later than he would normally (they might not approve, you know.)

I am actually toying with the idea of 100 VP in total (due to my VP for Everyone rule working out where players give out VP to each other like candy) with only the first and last thresholds being set. If you try to kiss or get someone's phone number before 10 points it could be awkward, likewise with the "engagement" hitting at around 90 or better.

Actually, that's something that's missing: Protagonist Family Members!

it isn't in my game. I call them subtypes. I require a set number of traits from certain archetypes to be in the character's initial picks. I had a male, a mother, and a sister subtype. One guy did play a male for a while but he quit or something...

Oh and I have multiple protagonists, one of which is getting a sister :D.

Remember how people were discussing giving the Protagonist traits?

I do and I use them.

How about giving him Family Members as an explicit thing? They wouldn't be introduced until later on in the game, but hitting ~15 RP and then suddenly coming face to face with the the Protagonist's Annoying Kid Sister trying to keep you apart...

That's an interesting idea for additional relative NPCs. Would it actually provide any statistical modifiers (like the protagonist traits did)?

[Angelalex242]

I'd say that depends entirely on the relative's reaction to the individual girls after their son/brother/whatever. Odds are, the relative will pick a 'favorite', and help that favorite and hinder the others.

They might favor archetypes like class rep and oujo (their +2 to dealing with NPCs do influence the NPCs in this case...), and disfavor archetypes like Yandere, Sukeban, and Pervert.

[Durazno]

That would turn meeting the family into an exciting crapshoot, perhaps.

Wait... crapshoot. Oh god.

Random family member generation as an optional rule!

[Amechra]

I think, with Family Members, it would be best if you played them as resources to go after.

After all, getting Protag-kun to go out with you is a lot easier if his parent's approve; his younger sister might be able to share embarassing stories (the ROOT of all healthy relationships!) about him, etc, etc.

[Durazno]

Right, but who they're helpful to and how might change in different circumstances. It could be as simple as a given family member having a few archetypes they like or don't like, with the reasoning coming down to roleplay.

[Angelalex242]

Right. A religious family will of course warm up to the miko, while a secular family might put them down.

Some people might see the oujo as a possibility of social advancement for their son (marry the money!), but others might be haters of the top 1% and work against her.

Yandere, Sukeban, and Pervert almost always win the dislike of family members.

[Amechra]

"My son's not dating any of them wishy-washy girly-girl types! How about that nice Mika girl?"

"Dad, she's been suspended for breaking Keichi's hands after he wouldn't give her his lunch money."

"Damn straight, son! She's an assertive go-getter with a drive to succeed and the willingness to do whatever it takes to get what she wants!"

[Durazno]

I laugh, but I wouldn't put it past some protagonist families.

Also, some yanderes are probably able to charm people around their targets.

[Angelalex242]

Define "Charm"

Yandere/Sukeban:

"And if you ever get in the way of my date with your brother ever again, I'll pop your tiny little head off your twiggy little neck and mount it on my trophy wall." (I roll Conflict, stacking armed and dangerous with bruiser, I'm at +5 to my roll...)

[Ionbound]

I think it's more the thing about the Yandere that nobody ever seems to notice how crazy she actually is except for the Protagonist and her victims...And sometime, not Protag-kun sees it.

[Mutazoia]

I think it's more the thing about the Yandere that nobody ever seems to notice how crazy she actually is except for the Protagonist and her victims...And sometime, not Protag-kun sees it.

Basically....a female version of Eddie Haskell

[steelsmiter]

Compassion: You believe in peace, not conflict, and seeing others find happiness warms your heart greatly. Twice per episode, you may give +2 on another girl’s roll. If she receives VP as a result, you receive a VP bonus equal to half of what your target received, rounding up.

Ok, a question has been brought to my attention: A player wanting to play a Celestial asked me why the Celestial wouldn't just give her own roll up in order to gain this bonus. I couldn't figure out why but I thought it might be a decent trade off in return for not limiting it to twice daily. What are your thoughts on this?

[Qwertystop]

Ok, a question has been brought to my attention: A player wanting to play a Celestial asked me why the Celestial wouldn't just give her own roll up in order to gain this bonus. I couldn't figure out why but I thought it might be a decent trade off in return for not limiting it to twice daily. What are your thoughts on this?

Because then you're giving up the roll you would get the bonus to. I see two interpretations: One is saying "okay, so you have +2 on top of your other bonuses but no die roll," effectively letting you declare that you roll a 2 instead of actually rolling. This is worse than average.

The other is saying "okay, you get +2 to the roll you're not making, so it doesn't actually do anything at all and you just forfeited your chance at it".

[A Rainy Knight]

Ok, a question has been brought to my attention: A player wanting to play a Celestial asked me why the Celestial wouldn't just give her own roll up in order to gain this bonus. I couldn't figure out why but I thought it might be a decent trade off in return for not limiting it to twice daily. What are your thoughts on this?

Sure, you could impose that tradeoff on it and remove the times per day restriction if you wanted. As it's written now, it's similar in spirit to Just As Planned - you're making the roll yourself, while also betting on who you think is going to win. In this case, the payoff for betting on the right person is less since you're skewing the odds in favor of the person you're 'betting' on.

[Angelalex242]

That misses the point of 'compassion.'

What that ability's supposed to do:

Girl A:I'm going to roll allure against the protagonist. Oh, look, I got a good roll.
Celestial:Okay, I'll add +2 to the roll and make it even better!

GM:Girl A gets 3 VP. Celestial gets 2 VP, since it's half rounded up.

[steelsmiter]

That misses the point of 'compassion.'

What that ability's supposed to do:

Girl A:I'm going to roll allure against the protagonist. Oh, look, I got a good roll.
Celestial:Okay, I'll add +2 to the roll and make it even better!

GM:Girl A gets 3 VP. Celestial gets 2 VP, since it's half rounded up.

Not particularly, The original writing of the ability is

The celestial adds +2 to a roll twice an episode and gains half VP. She's still able to make her own roll.

My proposition is

The celestial still adds +2 to a roll and gains half VP, but rather than sticking it on a roll twice a day, she forfeits her own roll, and in doing so, she can't possibly gain any VP beyond half the award the other player got.

[Angelalex242]

For a twice a day ability, letting the Celestial make her own roll too isn't out of place.

Considering the Celestial Archetype is essentially a Belldandy knockoff (with Keiichi as the protag), it makes sense they'd be able to improve somebody else's roll, make their own, and capitalize on all of it.

[steelsmiter]

For a twice a day ability, letting the Celestial make her own roll too isn't out of place.

It is if the celestial wants to trade something in exchange for not being limited to twice a day. But I've seen Rainy's approval, and since I was inclined to allow it anyway, EDIT: I'm looking to specify that the ability can only be used on the target's "next roll" to add further uncertainty to the prospect.

[steelsmiter]

So... I saw what effect Dazzling Display has on flavor text. What effect does it have on actual wealth?

[Esprit15]

I'd assume she's at the "Money is not an object" point. Short of funding space travel (unless your GM wants to go for that wacky a game), she should likely be able to get it with a little begging of daddy.

[Hiro Protagonest]

That's true.

I can conceive of some archetypes where the Protag goes ring shopping BEFORE the sex. Ya know, traditional family values marriage style.

No nookie for that PC, but their number to win outright with shiny bling on their finger may be far lower.

Mmm... no, just a flavor flaw for a very real advantage to winning wouldn't work.

You could make it work by creating mechanics for getting to sex, but it would require very careful balancing and rules for different protagonists.

[steelsmiter]

You could make it work by creating mechanics for getting to sex, but it would require very careful balancing and rules for different protagonists.

I'm doing something like that. Along with extending VP to 100, I've now set it up where one protagonist pretty much automatically grants VP based on the 'protagonist traits' (from an earlier post) I've chosen for him. I'm not sure yet what I'm going to do for the other two though, but it hasn't come up. I've got ideas for one, but I'm iffy on the other.

So... I saw what effect Dazzling Display has on flavor text. What effect does it have on actual wealth?

I've still got this question though, and I've seen this reply:

I'd assume she's at the "Money is not an object" point. Short of funding space travel (unless your GM wants to go for that wacky a game), she should likely be able to get it with a little begging of daddy.

Which to me kind of implies an Allure Roll, which would work for my system because I'm using purchase rolls staggered at 3 (hundreds of yen)/6 (thousands of yen)/9 (tens of thousands of yen). I could reasonably see adding 12, or even 15 for hundreds of thousands of yen and millions of yen respectively. In any case, I'm still stuck with what kind of bonus it should add if it isn't intended as just flavor text.

[Angelalex242]

Well...

If one assumes the point of the oujo is 'really wealthy heiress', she's essentially Paris Hilton. Probably with more class, but Paris Hilton nonetheless. The kind of people who can yawn and buy a Ferrari. Who can buy their friends houses with cash just because they feel like it. "Oh, you want a $300,000 house? Let me write you a check."

Anyways, since 1 yen is one penny, more or less, the wealth limit might be something like 100 million yen before they need to bother rolling (1 Million dollars), and then a billion yen with a decent roll. (10 million dollars)

[steelsmiter]

Well, I've been chatting with others on the subject and through chatting I've come this opinion (conclusion isn't quite the right word yet):

Dazzling Display is a twice/episode ability, so if "ignoring purchase rolls" is the way to go, they can do it twice per episode. A lot of episodes coincide with day passages so being able to pretty much buy anything you want twice in a given day is pretty hardcore anyway. That leads to this interesting situation where you have a third thing you really want, and you can't get it because you've burned your uses. This hasn't really come to the forefront because I don't think the original system was intended to have purchase rolls.

The second possibility is simply a large bonus on any purchase roll. With that method, you are somewhat dependent on randomness and can't always outright buy anything you want, but the bonus should still be large enough that anyone else has to be very lucky indeed to purchase such a thing. This method has the advantage that you can't outright buy certain items that break my game.

The final issue to discuss is how Contingency Plan affects this. That's my reason for thinking anything more than flavor text wasn't anticipated. Would Contingency Plan negate the purchase power? Would it simply reduce it?