High School Harem Comedy (Game System, PEACH)

[Anubis Dread]

Blessed Comfort is EXTREMELY terrible, personally. Until I spun it as 'any white magic use', it came up NEVER in all the episodes we did with Illven.

I'd say it's Tier 3 myself, because Blessed Comfort is terribad without manipulation of the GM and verbage pretty badly.

But in the proper, strict interpretation of the rules, unless somebody is physically injured, it doesn't come up. It doesn't even technically apply to emotional healing by default, so somebody crying is not sufficient excuse for it.

Eh, between Serenity and Compassion it has the requisite +8 equivalent modifier for Tier 2 just with those abilities and nothing else. It actually surpasses it a bit. It's real weakness is a complete lack of flats, but since Tier 2 is either/or they still qualify.

Whoa, that's an amazing write-up! Thank you for doing it!

I... haven't really being keeping up with this system for a while now, so I'm glad people are still enjoying it as it is. That said, after reading how things are turning out in practice, it seems like there are a few kinks that could easily be ironed out:
-Removal or strengthening of 'Find the Plot' advantages
-Addition of advantages to the low-tier archetypes
-Strengthening of obviously crappy advantages like Multiple Personalities

Now, I just have to get around to actually doing these things sometime! And of course adding some new stuff would be nice.

Sorry for missing any questions in the meantime!

Thank you

Like I said the system is pretty well balanced it is aside from a few stinkers. Most of Tier 3 is still very playable in certain builds, the only absolute exception being Chuunibyou. Pretty much every Tier 3 class only needs one reliable ability flat to push it to Tier 2, and since Tier 1+ isn't exactly desirable that's definitely more than sufficient. I mean it's not like there's anything WRONG with Tier 1 existing, but Tier 2s are good enough a target.

That all sounds like good ideas to say the least . The shame is I kind of like Find the Plot advantages in concept, they just never trigger. It might be a good idea to make them a two in one advantage and have the 'Find The Plot' part of the them be a nice little extra than their whole thing.

Remove the penalty from Hypercharged.

I'd like if Serenity were in fact the flat Anubis thought it was. :)

The rest of those suggestions are good, but these two... Hypercharged is awful UNLESS you build for it. But if you do build for it it's actually kind of nuts. I didn't mention it in the list because you need to be the hyper suicide build to pull it off (like getting +11 bonuses from failing your previous roll) but it's a good way to cash in on the excess of your scientifically notationally large boost. Serenity is probably fine as is - it's already Personality Flip without having to charge but slightly more conditional, and Personality Flip is pretty much ideal power level wise.

[Arutha]

There's also the gimmick build I came up with using overclock , hypercharged and Doujinshi Enthusiast, where you basically get two rolls with no penalty at once. I haven't tested it in actual play, but that may change soon.

[Angelalex242]

Second Wind should probably be altered to match down and dirty.

Quiet Patience needs a buff. Maybe have it function like Old Friends, where you get a flat VP amount automatically on the two failed VP gains.

Upgrade Panty Thief to any stealth, perhaps.

Likewise upgrade upgrade Scaredy Cat to apply whenever a conflict roll is available.

Upgrade Wandering Hands to the more standard +2.

Upgrade Stand Out and Culture Enthusiast to +2.

Practiced Kata goes the wrong way for the Archetype. It should substitute Conflict for Skill, not Skill for Conflict.

[Esprit15]

Practiced Kata goes the wrong way for the Archetype. It should substitute Conflict for Skill, not Skill for Conflict.

*substitutes Conflict for everything forever*

[Anubis Dread]

Second Wind should probably be altered to match down and dirty.

Quiet Patience needs a buff. Maybe have it function like Old Friends, where you get a flat VP amount automatically on the two failed VP gains.

Upgrade Panty Thief to any stealth, perhaps.

Likewise upgrade upgrade Scaredy Cat to apply whenever a conflict roll is available.

Upgrade Wandering Hands to the more standard +2.

Upgrade Stand Out and Culture Enthusiast to +2.

Practiced Kata goes the wrong way for the Archetype. It should substitute Conflict for Skill, not Skill for Conflict.

Yeah that seems like a good change.

The Quiet Patience change seems like a good idea, or it could give +1 for one failed roll then +2 if you fail that one as well.

Panty Thief is actually one of the more reliable Skill flats, it doesn't seem to need a boost.

Scaredy Cat would probably be fine as is if instead of 'scary situations' it was 'when you would reasonably be scared'. Maybe a little bit too easy to trigger, but it would be fun to RP.

Wandering Hands is the standard for boosts to opposed rolls. See Star Quality and Stand Out. That said the standard is somewhat weak as is...

Culture Enthusiast to +2 is very powerful, but honestly since the Half-Foreign archetype doesn't have any limited use abilities it seems fine.

Absolutely not. Or at least not unless the Yandere's Murderous Love ability is changed. So far the only way to break that tier 0 barrier for specialists is to go Cuckoolander, but if this change happened it would be possible for a Yandere/Martial Artist as well. That said Skill to Conflict with no skill boosters is odd, but having more than a single 'this to this' ability of each type in the game is problematic.

[Angelalex242]

Ah! I know.

Add Discipline to Martial Artist. "You eliminate distractions from all you do. +2 to opposed skill rolls."

Alternatively, Concentration. "You excel when undisturbed. +2 to unopposed skill rolls."

Add also 'Meditation.' "Skip a roll entirely. +2 to the modifier you would've used on the roll you skipped."

[Illven]

I would like a buff to the Chuunibyou. It is my favorite class, besides maybe pervert.

[Angelalex242]

Let's see. Only 3 abilities there, so it can stand more.

First, Upgrade Sealed Power to activate on a 1 or a 2.

Then...

Dementia: Once per episode, substitute any roll for any other roll.

Cacophany: Twice per episode, -2 to all skill rolls. (like Misfortune)

Unnerving: All skill rolls you participate in take a -1. (Like Warding Talisman)

Insight of Madness: Once per ep, auto succeed on unopposed rolls. (As Heir to the Dojo)

Grand Obscenity: +4 to any roll, but -2 to the next roll.

Incite Madness: 1 per episode, if conflict is a possibility, force everyone to use conflict.

[Esprit15]

Rainey, is Graceful intended to be declared after a roll is made, or before?

[A Rainy Knight]

Graceful is used before rolling the die; it's like taking 10 on a skill check. It also doesn't work with Big Gamble, if that ever comes up.

[Angelalex242]

You should probably reword it to make that explicit, then, as it's always been used AFTER a roll is made in every game I've seen it used so far.

The current wording makes it 'after the roll.' I think it's better off after the roll anyway, as it then becomes a 'waiting game' power, where you roll the dice and see if you need it. Acting as an insurance policy against bad dice.

Then again, most of your recent rulings in this thread have not been updated on the actual abilities list yet. You talked a couple pages ago about Just as Planned being reduced to 1/Ep, for example, but so long as it says twice in the powers list, twice it remains.

Remember, we're gamers. Everything you say or don't say can be used against a GM in a court of Rules Lawyers. Particularly if you fail to update the actual powers listing.

[Anubis Dread]

I actually like Graceful as before rather than after. It's still extremely powerful this way, so using it after is just over kill. That said the wording definitely needs updated a bit if it's supposed to be before. Well... possibly not, declaring mods before the roll is the default after all. Using it after may have just been wishful reading.

I am kind of torn on Just as Planned being only once an episode. On the one hand, it's really strong. On the other hand, it rewards clever play from both the user AND the other girls, which should be promoted... hm.

[Illven]

I actually like Graceful as before rather than after. It's still extremely powerful this way, so using it after is just over kill. That said the wording definitely needs updated a bit if it's supposed to be before. Well... possibly not, declaring mods before the roll is the default after all. Using it after may have just been wishful reading.

I am kind of torn on Just as Planned being only once an episode. On the one hand, it's really strong. On the other hand, it rewards clever play from both the user AND the other girls, which should be promoted... hm.

Oh no trust me, it needs to be once a day, or Angelalex will intentionally hold up the game, trying to do his snipe methods at the last minute, so he can't be just as planned.

[Anubis Dread]

Oh no trust me, it needs to be once a day, or Angelalex will intentionally hold up the game, trying to do his snipe methods at the last minute, so he can't be just as planned.

Yeah you're right, even with just being once per day it's the equivalent of one of the auto-win advantages. Except that it isn't 100% reliable, but also makes someone else lose. So once per episode seems about right.

[Angelalex242]

Maybe we should recreate the archetype list with our balances added. Then Rainy can just paste them. By the way, I need comments on my Chuun upgrades. Keep which, toss which?

[Illven]

I'm not sure I like the changes.

In my mind a Chuun should depend on how much magic is in the world.

In a no magic. Sure they are insane/ a dreamer.
In a maybe magic, maybe mundane, just as a priestess rituals may be just chance or the deity's work, maybe the Chuun really did marry the protag in a past life.
In a full magic world. No reason that can't be proved.

I think you should at least rename them.

[Angelalex242]

Well, to be honest, I kinda had 'Malkavian' in the back of my head when I came up with these. So they're psuedo supernatural, like the Miko.

[Illven]

Well, to be honest, I kinda had 'Malkavian' in the back of my head when I came up with these. So they're psuedo supernatural, like the Miko.

I'll admit I'm totally biased as my first character was one.

But I kinda want it to be argueable that maybe just maybe, they do retain memories of a past life.

(I mean unless the setting is no magic at all, like Technognomes in which case, yeah.)

[Angelalex242]

Right. But the kinda powers I gave them, particularly the skill reducers, are meant to be that eerie, unnerving sensation people would get when standing next to the Joker (who is the mundane version of the Chuun.)

Joker is essentially a male Chuun/Yandere after all :P

[Illven]

Right. But the kinda powers I gave them, particularly the skill reducers, are meant to be that eerie, unnerving sensation people would get when standing next to the Joker (who is the mundane version of the Chuun.)

Joker is essentially a male Chuun/Yandere after all :P

I don't read/watch Batman actually.

I'd like Dementia, Insight of madness, and Incite madness to be name changed at least.

[Angelalex242]

You didn't even watch Heath Ledger?

Burn the heretic!

Dementia becomes: Lost in your own mind
Insight of Madness becomes simply 'Unsual Insight'
Incite Madness becomes 'Everybody Fight!'

[Illven]

You didn't even watch Heath Ledger?

Burn the heretic!

Dementia becomes: Lost in your own mind
Insight of Madness becomes simply 'Unsual Insight'
Incite Madness becomes 'Everybody Fight!'

Fair enough.

[Angelalex242]

Oh, a couple extra Pervert bonuses:

Dominant: Your closet is full of leather and whips. +2 on rolls where you ask or order the protagonist to do something, or when you are in a position of authority. -2 when asked or ordered to do something, or when you must submit to authority, including teachers. Mutually exclusive with Submissive.

Submissive: Your closet is full of blindfolds and handcuffs. +2 on rolls where you are asked or ordered to do something, or when you must submit to authority, including teachers. -2 on rolls where you ask or order the protagonist to do something, or are in a position of authority. Mutually exclusive with Dominant.

[Esprit15]

Oh, a couple extra Pervert bonuses:

Dominant: Your closet is full of leather and whips. +2 on rolls where you ask or order the protagonist to do something, or when you are in a position of authority. -2 when asked or ordered to do something, or when you must submit to authority, including teachers. Mutually exclusive with Submissive.

Submissive: Your closet is full of blindfolds and handcuffs. +2 on rolls where you are asked or ordered to do something, or when you must submit to authority, including teachers. -2 on rolls where you ask or order the protagonist to do something, or are in a position of authority. Mutually exclusive with Dominant.

Kinky. Could almost see these as universal. Certainly dominant seems to mesh with Yandere fluff wise and mechanically, while submissive with a few other archetypes.

[steelsmiter]

Kinky. Could almost see these as universal. Certainly dominant seems to mesh with Yandere fluff wise and mechanically, while submissive with a few other archetypes.

I like the idea of turning them on their heads and allowing Shrinking Violets to take Dominant and Yandere Submissive. Maybe that's an argument for universal, maybe not, I don't know. Either way, they're pretty neat.

[Esprit15]

I like the idea of turning them on their heads and allowing Shrinking Violets to take Dominant and Yandere Submissive. Maybe that's an argument for universal, maybe not, I don't know. Either way, they're pretty neat.

Indeed. Perhaps I wasn't clear. I was also arguing for universality of the advantage.

[Angelalex242]

The main reason I threw them in the Pervert archetype is to strengthen the archetype itself by giving them such bonus/penalties as that. It's currently Tier 3, after all. These should be powerful enough to fix it.

Besides, even if they remain in the Pervert Archetype, it's easy to quirk one or the other if you really want to.

Over in Tenchi Muyo, Ayeka is an Oujo who quirked Dominant.

[Esprit15]

But they're common enough in many characters that they seem universal.

[Angelalex242]

Well...how many harem anime girls (outside of Hentai) do you see actually showing that stuff? Ayeka's the obvious example, but...

Well, I suppose Belldandy (not my character Verthandi, the original Belldandy) might qualify as submissive.

[Anubis Dread]

I kind of like them as Universal as well honestly. In my mind if there are at least three different archetypes you could make the argument for an advantage being a part of it should probably be a universal, and with just dominant Yandere, Sukeban, Kuudere and Pervert could all make arguments for having it. Plus they're too awesome to strict

As a side note, I plan to go through all the archetypes and do a quick 'if you just did this this and this and made no other changes everything would be pretty much spot on balance wise' sort of run through. It seemed kind of silly of me to do a tier list to show how there are some spotty areas and not do an equally in depth look at the simplest solutions to it. Not necessarily the best mind, but the simplest patch I can come up with off the top of my head.