afroakuma's Planar Questions Thread IV

[afroakuma]

Oh. Oh. Do the Athar know about Ao/other overdeities?

Nope.

The thing is, as a (teleportation) spell, plane shift requires the ability to reach the Astral. So can plane shift, dimension door and the like be used on, say, Cania as Answerer says, or is this just bunk?

As I was saying to whoever else not long ago, WotC/TSR are utter idiots when it comes to the Astral Plane. Completely, farcically incompetent. Those effects do work on deeper layers of various planes, as the Astral is ruled to be coexistent with all layers of a plane unless otherwise noted.

[Brookshw]

As I was saying to whoever else not long ago, WotC/TSR are utter idiots when it comes to the Astral Plane. Completely, farcically incompetent. Those effects do work on deeper layers of various planes, as the Astral is ruled to be coexistent with all layers of a plane unless otherwise noted.

Which really begs the question in my mind why 2e ruled the inner planes counted against planar distance when it comes to prime to outer (for magic item bonuses). Wouldn't astral to outer make more sense?

Also, and again, voting for new planar thread titles? I'm still game for "The Planes! Afro explains it all".

[enderlord99]

How skilled at pun-making is Chourst? I mean, I know of one he came up with, but it's fairly obvious (to the point that a random mortal came up with it independently.)

[Larkas]

Which really begs the question in my mind why 2e ruled the inner planes counted against planar distance when it comes to prime to outer (for magic item bonuses). Wouldn't astral to outer make more sense?

I'm not sure I understood the question, but weren't the Inner Planes only coterminous/coexistent with the Ethereal?

[JusticeZero]

How would you construct and populate the Astral and Outer Planes for a P6/E6 campaign, were the characters in it to decide to go there? Most of the things statted assume that you won't be going there without a certain number of levels under your belt, in excess of the limits of an E6 game.

[afroakuma]

How would you construct and populate the Astral and Outer Planes for a P6/E6 campaign, were the characters in it to decide to go there? Most of the things statted assume that you won't be going there without a certain number of levels under your belt, in excess of the limits of an E6 game.

Well I wouldn't populate the Astral, most of it is unpopulated and that's the way it should be.

E6 I'm familiar with, but what is P6?

[Fable Wright]

Well I wouldn't populate the Astral, most of it is unpopulated and that's the way it should be.

E6 I'm familiar with, but what is P6?

P6 is just E6 ported to Pathfinder.

[afroakuma]

Figured.

Well, I don't know Pathfinder, but I don't see why the standard planar encounters wouldn't function in E6. You'd have to avoid the big heavies, since their higher-end abilities will rapidly and brutally outclass the party. In general, CR's your friend on this one.

Let's look at a few sample planes:

Baator

Ah, the Nine Hells. Always fun to be down there when you're a low-level adventurer. It's actually perfectly livable, barring Phlegethos and Cania. And the inhabitants.

No special precautions needed to travel in Hell, but the locals are going to be up your backside in a good hurry. The third layer is lousy with kytons, who are in the sweet spot CR-wise. Other inhabitants to see are lemures, imps of multiple types, nupperibos, hell hounds, and the deadly armies of the baatezu. You've actually got a fair bit to play around with here; merregons, barbazu, spinagons, abishai (visit Tiamat, perhaps!), advespas, buerozas, kochrachons; orthons make for menacing above-the-curve encounters, while amnizu and falxugons make excellent villains. Narzugons are usually mounted and are thus a bit trickier to work in. An osyluth might make for an excellent climactic encounter.

The Abyss

What are we doing here? Running the flip away is what we're doing here. Nonetheless, for some reason we've decided to be here. What are we contending with? Once again, there's a fair chance the layer itself is not immediately lethal. The denizens, on the other hand...

Remember when I said Hell's inhabitants would get up your backside? The Abyss's natives will get in your face. While their talons get into your guts. There are a ton of low-level creatures usable here, ranging from the lowly manes and dretches to uridezu, babaus, bar-lgura and maurezhi. The jovoc is a suitable accompaniment to a babau, while palrethees make for nice slightly above-curve opponents whose main schtick is easily defended against. Demonhives are solid in E6, and animalistic creatures such as abyssal maws and nashrous can help fill in the encounter curve. Gadacros are a good opponent for opening up some options, and if you want a suitable heavy encounter you can send in a vrock (dangerous, watch the screech), chasme or solamith.

Elemental and Energy Planes

These ones are pesky to travel. Attune form is available to help with the deleterious effects of these planes, but you'll need a lot of magic support in either spell or item form to traverse them safely. Elemental creatures tend to be available at low levels, so that much isn't a problem. Make sure foes don't have access to dispel magic or you could be looking at a rather quick and dirty TPK.

Ethereal Plane

The closest plane to the Material has enough low-level creatures in it that your party should always find themselves with something to do. The Ethereal is not really a threat per se, not like the others.

Anything more you need from me?

[unseenmage]

Do Mephits have names? Societies? Any sort of social structure at all? Particularly Mirror Mephits but how any Mephit gets it's name pre-becoming-an-Improved-Familiar is of interest.

[Mr Adventurer]

Is there a reason we know that Larva are unique amongst petitioners in being able to leave their spawning plane? If so, what is it?

(Alternatively, maybe they aren't unique in this way, in which case what other petitioners can do this and do we know why?)

Apologies if this has been asked before!

[CRtwenty]

Been awhile since I posted here but I just started replaying Planescape Torment and I wanted to know.

What are Mimirs specifically?

[Brookshw]

Do Mephits have names? Societies? Any sort of social structure at all? Particularly Mirror Mephits but how any Mephit gets it's name pre-becoming-an-Improved-Familiar is of interest.

Uncaged had a dust mephit known as Seamusxanthuszenus who ran a shop. Couldn't comment on the rest.

[afroakuma]

Do Mephits have names? Societies? Any sort of social structure at all? Particularly Mirror Mephits but how any Mephit gets it's name pre-becoming-an-Improved-Familiar is of interest.

They do, yes. Mephits don't have nations or civilization per se, but they definitely have society.

Is there a reason we know that Larva are unique amongst petitioners in being able to leave their spawning plane? If so, what is it?

We do not have such a reason, no.

Been awhile since I posted here but I just started replaying Planescape Torment and I wanted to know.

What are Mimirs specifically?

They're magical constructs; items, really, more than anything, handy little jabbering skulls that give their owners info on the Planes.

[Yael]

How do intelligent aberrations interact outside of the Material Plane (such as Illithids, and Aboleths)?

Is there a settlement of any aberration outside of the Material Plane (outside of Kythons, and Ken'zai)?

Is there any event that involved aberrations trying to take on a full society of another plane?

Also, I always asked myself if outside of the Material Plane, is there clean oxygen to breath? I mean, like inside the Abyss, or the Nine Hells, is Oxygen present? Even while there is not stated as a necesary requirement in the PHB to have oxygen, I don't remember to have read anything about how to sustain in such environments.

[Brookshw]

Why does Shemeska intervene on Kylie's behalf with the bellringer? Conjecture welcome. Is Kylie just a useful resource to leave out there should push ever come to shove and Shemesha's looking for something? Uncaged made reference that it's unlikely the Loth would have waited so long to take over if she just wanted the spy network so I have to wonder if I'm missing some cross source connection.

[Todd Stewart]

Why does Shemeska intervene on Kylie's behalf with the bellringer? Conjecture welcome. Is Kylie just a useful resource to leave out there should push ever come to shove and Shemesha's looking for something? Uncaged made reference that it's unlikely the Loth would have waited so long to take over if she just wanted the spy network so I have to wonder if I'm missing some cross source connection.

I think it's a combination of things: having a diversity of resources out there which you have influence over (to one degree or another), just something to do to watch the bellringer squirm because he won't cross the Marauder and his suffering amuses her, and the last one - Kylie has been suggested to be Shemeshka's daughter both in 2e sources and in the 4e article on the Marauder (I wrote the latter one).

Given the fiend's immortality, it's quite possible that making seemingly contradictory moves in the short term is just elements of a ensuring that she has a game to continue playing. If you lock everything down, if there are no challenges, and if there isn't a risk of losing, it's no longer fun. And in a big way I think that's how the Marauder operates - she amuses herself with others' suffering, and it's much more fun if you can create a field of play that makes it more interesting to play.

I wouldn't want to strictly define the question of if Kylie is actually related to the Marauder however, or if she just reminds her of herself in some way. Shemeshka might see something there and protects her just on account of self-absorbed vanity.

[Brookshw]

I think it's a combination of things: having a diversity of resources out there which you have influence over (to one degree or another), just something to do to watch the bellringer squirm because he won't cross the Marauder and his suffering amuses her, and the last one - Kylie has been suggested to be Shemeshka's daughter both in 2e sources and in the 4e article on the Marauder (I wrote the latter one).

Given the fiend's immortality, it's quite possible that making seemingly contradictory moves in the short term is just elements of a ensuring that she has a game to continue playing. If you lock everything down, if there are no challenges, and if there isn't a risk of losing, it's no longer fun. And in a big way I think that's how the Marauder operates - she amuses herself with others' suffering, and it's much more fun if you can create a field of play that makes it more interesting to play.

I wouldn't want to strictly define the question of if Kylie is actually related to the Marauder however, or if she just reminds her of herself in some way. Shemeshka might see something there and protects her just on account of self-absorbed vanity.

That does sound like everyone's favorite loth. Is your article posted anywhere? If so any chance of a link?

[Todd Stewart]

That does sound like everyone's favorite loth. Is your article posted anywhere? If so any chance of a link?

Dungeon 205, behind a paywall. I'd link to it, but the bookmark I had is broken since WotC redid their website.

[afroakuma]

How do intelligent aberrations interact outside of the Material Plane (such as Illithids, and Aboleths)?

I'm not sure I understand the question... both of those races reside on the Material Plane.

Is there a settlement of any aberration outside of the Material Plane (outside of Kythons, and Ken'zai)?

I feel like you're trying to ask something that you didn't ask. Try again.

Is there any event that involved aberrations trying to take on a full society of another plane?

Technically.. when the illithids appeared, they posed enough of a threat that the Blood War stopped and the combined forces of Hell and the Abyss slaughtered them. They didn't deliberately provoke that one, though.

Also, I always asked myself if outside of the Material Plane, is there clean oxygen to breath? I mean, like inside the Abyss, or the Nine Hells, is Oxygen present? Even while there is not stated as a necesary requirement in the PHB to have oxygen, I don't remember to have read anything about how to sustain in such environments.

Air that exists in other planes is, as a general rule, breathable, excluding any vapors and gases adulterating it.

[Xuldarinar]

How do intelligent aberrations interact outside of the Material Plane (such as Illithids, and Aboleths)?

Is there a settlement of any aberration outside of the Material Plane (outside of Kythons, and Ken'zai)?

Is there any event that involved aberrations trying to take on a full society of another plane?

Away from book, I can only present this. I recall there is a type of Aboleth that resides in Stygia I believe.

[Dalmosh]

Lords of Madness mentions there is a Beholder City in Gehenna called Uldinath.

[Brookshw]

Who has access to the words of creation?

[Bronk]

Who has access to the words of creation?

Well, the seven martyrs of the Hebdomad, Queen Morwel, the Queen's consort Faerinaal, and all the rest of the Tulani are the ones specifically mentioned in the BoED... Along with members of some of the Hebdomad's prestige classes.

[Fable Wright]

Dungeon 205, behind a paywall. I'd link to it, but the bookmark I had is broken since WotC redid their website.

Fixing the bookmark should be as simple as changing the www.wizards.com to archive.wizards.com. Or was that article just nuked entirely?

[afroakuma]

Who has access to the words of creation?

Anyone with the Words of Creation feat. See the Book of Exalted Deeds. I'm betting you meant something else though

[Brookshw]

Anyone with the Words of Creation feat. See the Book of Exalted Deeds. I'm betting you meant something else though

Yeah, I meant more Canon/lore rather than crunch, such as the lady using the words to rewrite reality, or the serpents. I assume something overgod level as well would definitely have access. Quite possibly I'm not asking the question in the right manner.

[afroakuma]

Yeah, I meant more Canon/lore rather than crunch, such as the lady using the words to rewrite reality, or the serpents. I assume something overgod level as well would definitely have access. Quite possibly I'm not asking the question in the right manner.

You're getting two things mixed up. As I noted in the whitetext.

"Words of Creation" is a feat and a language of sorts that predates the Celestial language. What you're thinking of are the words of Creation Once Spoken, powerful and deep magic from the most ancient era of the multiverse. Vecna, who knows the Language Primeval via his link to the Serpent, was once taught three words of Creation Once Spoken. They didn't help him much, in the end, but he did learn them. The Lady of Pain knows them all, of course. Gods don't really need them to do what they do.

[Brookshw]

You're getting two things mixed up. As I noted in the whitetext.

"Words of Creation" is a feat and a language of sorts that predates the Celestial language. What you're thinking of are the words of Creation Once Spoken, powerful and deep magic from the most ancient era of the multiverse. Vecna, who knows the Language Primeval via his link to the Serpent, was once taught three words of Creation Once Spoken. They didn't help him much, in the end, but he did learn them. The Lady of Pain knows them all, of course. Gods don't really need them to do what they do.

So is it safe to say gods don't have access to them?

[afroakuma]

So is it safe to say gods don't have access to them?

They do not.

The problem here is that originally, the words of Creation Once Spoken were literally three words, a specific deep magic spell that would let Vecna go ruin Kas's day. Then, Bad Authoring kicked in, and they took that concept from Vecna Reborn, along with a misreading of the Ancient Brethren (originally just the ancient mages from whom Vecna was descended) and did... you know. That thing they did.

[pwykersotz]

In working on 5th Edition, Mike Mearls has had a few tweets with some planar info.

https://twitter.com/mikemearls/statu...05114382249984

Do these ideas, particularly the one about worlds/kingdoms existing as halfway points between the material and the relevant elemental plane have any opposition in afro-canon? I know we don't know full details yet, I'm just curious if the basic concept fits.