EMPIRE! A Community World-Building Tale of People & Discovery

[Morph Bark]

If there's a big difference between 1 and 3, or 2 and 4, it's a problem with the game because some people just had much luckier/unluckier rolls than others.

If the difference is serious it'd be better to tell people 'You have a 5, a 4, a 3, a 2 and a 1; assign one of each to diplomacy/military/curiosity/faith/luck as you choose.'

So I'm assuming that there is not a big difference between a 3 and a 1 or a 4 and a 2.

I disagree. Curiosity also happens to be the stat for economic matters, such as farming and building things, so it remains useful even without a five in it.

That's the idea, yes. I wanted to have it have a scaling benefit, with a 5 simply giving an extra option that makes it special (which is why player's can't start with more than one 5).

By making it a random roll I'm keeping in a bit of chance, otherwise it would be too easy to make it into a numbers game and game the system.

The main reason I would say Curiosity is a little strong is because it will always be useful. As described the benefit of Faith 5 might only be useful once to establish your religion. Diplomacy 5 is only good for uniting multiple regions you control. Right now these two are situationally useful, nobody can make use of Diplomacy 5 this turn, and for those worshiping the Lord of Fire Faith 5 does nothing.

Meanwhile the ability to add something new to the game will be useful every single turn without exception. Really it doesn't need a nerf. The more situational stats need a boost.

The usefulness of the stats will change over time. No one cares about the diplomacy 5 special right now; faith 5 also looks like a long-term game; military 5 is declaring yourself a wannabe Napoleon (& so top on your neighbours' enemy list); luck 5 would probably be great but I'd prefer to see how it works via others. Curiosity 5 on the other hand lets me plan on having deep water ships first.

I guess the issue is mostly that the benefits of Curiosity are more immediately clear than the rest. What avr says is interesting, and true. Those who put a 4 into a stat could be planning more long term and banking on the chance that it'll increase or that their heir will roll a 4 into that stat and get it upgraded to a 5.

I will think of ways to put in more immediate benefits for the other scores. Military is pretty clear, considering it's a contest between players by rolling and adding up. Diplomacy and Faith effectively showcase the stability of the region (Diplomacy helps in easier times, Faith in times of trouble). Luck will be made VERY clear later in play.

:( Poor Bloodfang only has 2 curiosity. He won't be able to craft his own crazy gear like everyone else. Here's hoping their are plenty of NPC nations to take over to make up for it.

So what I'm getting here is that:
1= Piss Poor
2= Average, mediocre
3= Good
4= Great!
5= Flash Gordon tier

Or is 2/3 worse then I think it is?

That's a pretty good estimate of it, with 2 being more mediocre than average.

Also is too late to change my resources?

Not at all, though I do need to change it myself then. ARE YOU MAKING ME WORK TO DEATH?

[Percy]

But... that is a sign of death, you have marked the GM... * hands axe * Do your dwarven duty..

*Takes axe* I shall not fail out traditions brother.

Not at all, though I do need to change it myself then. ARE YOU MAKING ME WORK TO DEATH?

There there, I have a solution. *points to axe in hand* Now do not make any sudden movements lassie, tradition needs ta be satisfied.

Also I changed them: Nation Post. Thank you!!!

[Rain Dragon]

This is why I need friends. I did not pick that +1 in Curiosity for fun, I lack imagination so hard I need people to give me pointers at time. Comes with the territory.

Gonna do just that Blade, thanks. I was so fixated on "you can get another" resource that I kinda forgot about the technological leap ^^. I knew I was forgetting something, now I just feel silly again >.>...

As an unlucky roller I support this post.

Also is too late to change my resources?

I don't mind tossing pointers your way, as long as it ultimately benefits me.

I do realize I am a terrible, terrible person...

Also, as each leader has to roll scores it is very likely that unlucky rolls and lucky rolls will even out over time. I suppose it's what you do with each situation that is more important than 'I was unlucky this one time.'

Good luck!

There there, I have a solution. *points to axe in hand* Now do not make any sudden movements lassie, tradition needs ta be satisfied.

Woah, woah, woah. Does tradition demand an immediate death? Death at your hand?

[Percy]

I don't mind tossing pointers your way, as long as it ultimately benefits me.

I do realize I am a terrible, terrible person...

Also, as each leader has to roll scores it is very likely that unlucky rolls and lucky rolls will even out over time. I suppose it's what you do with each situation that is more important than 'I was unlucky this one time.'

Good luck!



Woah, woah, woah. Does tradition demand an immediate death? Death at your hand?

Woah woah woah?! THIS IS DWARVEN TRADITION!!! *Swings Axe Leonidas Style*

[Elemental]

How about we put tradition aside for a moment and focus on this conveniently prepared distraction in the form of a plate of delicious party pies?


That aside... My leader has seven unmarried children, two of which he is likely to keep around for succession, but five I'm interested in marrying off to foreign royalty. Hmm... I shall have to check to see who'll be of marriageable age when Hazael's children are old enough...

[Lady Serpentine]

Kynvessa and Katara most likely would be; they're a bit older than most of Hazael's children (19 and 25, respectively) but even assuming Korath to Katara, that's hardly an impossible age gap.

[Elemental]

It's only a gap of ten years! It'll be fine, and hardly unprecedented in the realm of royalty.

[TheWombatOfDoom]

I really think exploring new regions isn't really a thing that should be limited to curiousity.

Faith - A crusade or missions to other regions,
Military - Invasion and patrolling,
Diplomacy - Go on a diplomatic mission to areas unknown, in search of support,
Luck - I seem to have tripped into this pool of water, which actually leads to a nation of merfolk.

That could help spread out Curiousity's power out.

The main problem I believe, is that Curiousity houses technology, and therefore civilization, AND it encompasses resources, one of the main purposes of the game.

[Elemental]

Hmm... I agree Mr. OfDoom. It makes sense in a way, as many expeditions were sent out for military or trade purposes, rather than "to see what is there". In fact, that was the major drive for almost all exploratory expeditions.

[Lord_Burch]

Well, Elemental, Lord David's sister in law is nineteen and un married. A good match, for Korath, being neighbors and all.

[Elemental]

Hmm... Hopefully all these offers don't signify that I'm going to have trouble with Hazael's daughters... Though to be fair, most of them are young so don't need to be worried about just yet.
Let me see... He's got seven children. I really don't want to send Hazael Junior and Idrisa abroad as they're the first two in line to the throne. But Salline and Korath, who are both underage but won't be by the end of the first turn, I have no problems with sending to other countries. The other three are two turns underage.

But still... Three, or four if you count it as two offer from C'nor, offers for Korath's hand in marriage... It appears he's the most eligible royal bachelor! I'll have to think this over.

[Morph Bark]

I really think exploring new regions isn't really a thing that should be limited to curiousity.

Faith - A crusade or missions to other regions,
Military - Invasion and patrolling,
Diplomacy - Go on a diplomatic mission to areas unknown, in search of support,
Luck - I seem to have tripped into this pool of water, which actually leads to a nation of merfolk.

That could help spread out Curiousity's power out.

The main problem I believe, is that Curiousity houses technology, and therefore civilization, AND it encompasses resources, one of the main purposes of the game.

A good point. I've altered the bit on exploration in the OP. Also, tonight I'll be discussing some of the rules behind Diplomacy, Military and Faith with some friends and ask their opinion on it, adjusting accordingly to try and balance the attributes.

[Silverbit]

For all those speaking of marriage, there are three Razdissi princes left unclaimed. They're dwarves, but interbreeding is possible…

[Lord_Burch]

Well, Silver, right now, I only have one person eligible for marriage, although my family tree could use some expansion. I'd like to see Elemental's response to marriage first, though, because he is closer, after all. But if that doesn't work out, I'm all ears.

[Elemental]

I think it can work out. But I'd prefer to keep Korath for more distant marriage in case he proves troublesome. However, I do still have Hazael's eldest son and heir, Hazael (Junior). He might be a good match for Lady Alyssa, though I'd have to stipulate that she move to Ashenia rather than he move to Bordeux so as to keep my heir more directly under my control.

[Rain Dragon]

Hmm... Hopefully all these offers don't signify that I'm going to have trouble with Hazael's daughters... Though to be fair, most of them are young so don't need to be worried about just yet.
Let me see... He's got seven children. I really don't want to send Hazael Junior and Idrisa abroad as they're the first two in line to the throne. But Salline and Korath, who are both underage but won't be by the end of the first turn, I have no problems with sending to other countries. The other three are two turns underage.

But still... Three, or four if you count it as two offer from C'nor, offers for Korath's hand in marriage... It appears he's the most eligible royal bachelor! I'll have to think this over.

Hopefully all of these unmarried ladies doesn't mean Elder Jaten the last of her line is left having to search Tekorva high and low for a suitable partner.

Congratulations! Korath must be rather... Something!

For all those speaking of marriage, there are three Razdissi princes left unclaimed. They're dwarves, but interbreeding is possible…

You know, one of these dwarves and Elder Jaten... Maybe...

[Percy]

For all those speaking of marriage, there are three Razdissi princes left unclaimed. They're dwarves, but interbreeding is possible…

Got any daughters? My heir needs Dwarven wife, just to be sure kids are guaranteed :).

[Silverbit]

@Percy
As of yet no dwarvern daughters are are currently present in the Unbroken Line Clan. Time may produce some. Doesn't Keldagrim have some females in the line? All dwarves must band together in these times.

@Rain Dragon
A marriage alliance with Tekorva would be a great honour. I heartily approve of this notion.

I love how we've suddenly gone from cheese-based nuclear weapons to marriage alliances in a few pages, and the game hasn't even started .

[TheWombatOfDoom]

There are currently 3 Sons all vying for heir of Lyradis. Only one of them is married. I also have a Daughter of marrying age. Though diplomatically, we'd already have to have some terms or alliance, or reason for the alliance for it to be because of that. If we get into this with a lot of people allying with each other, we should have a Grand Ball for all the royals to meet. Heck, we could have one every year in a different region!

--

I'm seeing a lot of people talking about peace, but I want to know -

Who has obvious problems with other countries? Who will be at odds from the get go? I'm just seeing a lot of one side, and am curious on the other side of things.

[Silverbit]

There are currently 3 Sons all vying for heir of Lyradis. Only one of them is married. I also have a Daughter of marrying age. Though diplomatically, we'd already have to have some terms or alliance, or reason for the alliance for it to be because of that. If we get into this with a lot of people allying with each other, we should have a Grand Ball for all the royals to meet. Heck, we could have one every year in a different region!

--

I'm seeing a lot of people talking about peace, but I want to know -

Who has obvious problems with other countries? Who will be at odds from the get go? I'm just seeing a lot of one side, and am curious on the other side of things.

Oooh, grand balls. I can get behind that.

As far as problems go, I think that my Mormaer is going to come down pretty hard on The Lord Of Fire. Faith 1 has got to mean somethings wrong between them. We of the vaults below Dis need not your light; our eyes open wider in the dark. Just warning anyone whose Fire-aligned.

[Lord_Burch]

I haven't read most people's post, but the border of region 2 and Bordeux could be tenuous. The ruling class is pro Lord of Fire, while region 2 is heavy anti Lord of Fire. So. Logic could have problems with alliances with anyone pro lord of Fire.

EDIT: Previous edit is now irrelevant.

[WaylanderX]

I really like the ideas of Grand balls. Although its going to be hard for my firstborn daughter to dance (Full-blood Cloudiz --> Fishtail).
On the topic of that, my second born daughter is only 10 at the start of the game, but she is aviable for marriage in a few turns if somebody want to have a wife with dragonfly wings and an affinity for magic .
Although to manage that you got to get to very very good terms with the Kasumor Royal family, which might prove time consuming.

[Rain Dragon]

@Percy
As of yet no dwarvern daughters are are currently present in the Unbroken Line Clan. Time may produce some. Doesn't Keldagrim have some females in the line? All dwarves must band together in these times.

@Rain Dragon
A marriage alliance with Tekorva would be a great honour. I heartily approve of this notion.

I love how we've suddenly gone from cheese-based nuclear weapons to marriage alliances in a few pages, and the game hasn't even started .

Excellent! I'll message you later for any details if you want.

This seems typical for a medieval-style game, albeit usually pointy sticks rather than cheese-based nuclear weaponry...

I'm seeing a lot of people talking about peace, but I want to know -

Who has obvious problems with other countries? Who will be at odds from the get go? I'm just seeing a lot of one side, and am curious on the other side of things.

Well, a large number of people around Tekorva worship the Lord of Fire. I'm unsure trade for Bloodfire without a middle person would work out unless it turns out the Lord of Fire was in fact behind the death of the previous king. Furthermore, it is extremely likely that if any heresy breaks out within Tekorva there will be a civil war.

Also, Pyronia is right next to Tekorva and would make trade anywhere to the West difficult. Earlier on, there was talk of some people of Pyronia aiming to convert Tekorva through trade which would be a reasonably good cause for war.

EDIT - @Lord_Burch There are three dwarven princes and so far only one offer.

[TheWombatOfDoom]

It seems theres a large group that is Pro Lord of Fire, a large group that doesn't worship Lord of Fire, and small pockets of very Anti Lord of Fire.

Lyradis isn't anti, but their alliance with the dwarves of Rizdis has certainly influenced their ways, and the current ruler is along these same lines. However, with his high diplomacy, he has been able to still remain in favor of the people, and is handling things well. In other words, the country is at a Religous crossroads. I tried to form my stats based on my fluff instead of having fluff that didn't work well with my stats, so that's why things like me focusing on being craftsmen, since I have a 2 military, giving myself a high diplomacy as opposed to creativity to keep the fact that my kings faith is 1, and so on.

[zabbarot]

If we are talking of arranging marriage Zeburi has many great grandchildren under 20.

[Lord_Burch]

@Rain Dragon- No more marriages for me for at least the next 3 turns.

[Malachi Lemont]

If someone wants to take my region, that's fine. I enjoyed filling out the opening post but I'm not really that interested in playing the whole game. Sorry.

[BladeofObliviom]

If someone wants to take my region, that's fine. I enjoyed filling out the opening post but I'm not really that interested in playing the whole game. Sorry.

Well, that's what the Waitlist is for. Seeya somewhere else sometime!

[QuintonBeck]

Some ideas for buffing the other stats special abilities to match up with Curiosity 5's power: Diplomacy 5:It takes two (or more?) actions to have war declared against you and maybe they can 'steal' inventions from others by having an opposed diplomacy roll to get the side with the invention to slip up and explain it?
Military 5: While it's pretty solid as is I think, just based in a system everyone seems to be avoiding at the moment, the only reasonable buff I could think of is maybe it accelerates the training time for raising troops? IE Military 5 can raise 2,000 troops in one action.
Faith and Luck are really too vague for me to have ideas on so we'll just have to see how they work out in play.

Also, if we're tossing about heirs I have a 14 year old boy set to take the throne, an 11 year old boy, and a 9 year old girl who are all part of the Ignato dynasty.

[Chief]

I think nobody will want to send their children to my country (seeing that the culture dictates he or she will be executed after delivering a new child).
So I wont even ask you to... How nice of me!

Furthermore I dont think I'll be going to war soon as long as people show their respects to the Lord!

PS: C'nor clear your inbox (please)