The Pub: Off-topic chat for forum gamers

[Ramsus]

I think part of the reason that so many games are recruiting at the same time has to do with what seemed like a previous upswing in players. We had/have some rather large games going on currently and it for me at least wasn't inconceivable to draw some of those people into a smaller, shorter game.

[BourgeoisJerry]

Of the various still active and recruiting games, the percentage of the active player based is engaged as follows:

26%
10%
5%
60%
22%
40%
20%
18%
6%
18%

Are you counting players that are dead in the active games, or just the living ones? At first I did the math and came away thinking that the average player is active in 2.25 games, which seems like a fairly high average, but then I realized you might be counting games in which the player is dead, and thus really isn't very active.

Maybe after Typical is over I should try making a spreadsheet to help us keep track of these things, though that might be a bit complicated.

[Askthepizzaguy]

Typically, my native forums tended to limit large games to 1 at once, and smaller games to 2 at once, depending on the player base.

Larger games could run 2 at once when the first game had achieved a sufficient death toll.

[Lenlo]

We used to have someone who kept track of who was in what game and how many people were in said game and abunch of other useful info. Was very nice while it existed, but eventually it became to much to keep up with.

[Zack]

Typically, my native forums tended to limit large games to 1 at once, and smaller games to 2 at once, depending on the player base.

Larger games could run 2 at once when the first game had achieved a sufficient death toll.

It should also be noted that some of these games were extremely large, sometimes upwards of 50 or 60 players, and very often 40+.

[Legato Endless]

Are you counting players that are dead in the active games, or just the living ones? At first I did the math and came away thinking that the average player is active in 2.25 games, which seems like a fairly high average, but then I realized you might be counting games in which the player is dead, and thus really isn't very active.

Maybe after Typical is over I should try making a spreadsheet to help us keep track of these things, though that might be a bit complicated.

No, I considered doing this, but things become murky either way. First, some players still follow games even after they aren't playing them, which still represents something in terms of engagement. Second, some games such as LOTR and Careless have mechanics which keep some players involved even after their first elimination. Pizza died on the first day of LOTR, but being a wolf, he was till allowed to participate in the wolf quick topic and aid the general effort, such as disentangling the town network.

[Askthepizzaguy]

It really should be based on "what % of the active player base is engaged in a game and unwilling to sign up for another one" plus "what % of the player base isn't willing to sign up to any game", where a lower total number indicates another game can open.

But those numbers aren't convenient to get. So, 2 at a time at most is my recommendation. Right now there are over half a dozen games in sign ups with quite a few in progress or delayed.

[Lenlo]

Aye. I looked at all the games up when I got here and instantly thought "Which... which one do I join? Which one is going to start anytime soon?". It was very daunting to say the least.

[Legato Endless]

It really should be based on "what % of the active player base is engaged in a game and unwilling to sign up for another one" plus "what % of the player base isn't willing to sign up to any game", where a lower total number indicates another game can open.

But those numbers aren't convenient to get. So, 2 at a time at most is my recommendation. Right now there are over half a dozen games in sign ups with quite a few in progress or delayed.

We could poll the general player base though to get a rough idea of the averages.

[Duck999]

I will likely need autolynch replacements soon for WW Classified. If you want to join, or have died without gathering info, contact me to be a replacement..

[Penguinator]

I think it's because you guys always have a ridiculous number of games in sign-ups.

Well, to be fair, we didn't always. A bunch of people came back for Fears IV. That kind of kicked it off. Then we got Askthepizzaguy, and all you lovely new folks. So, business is booming.

And we have a lot more people who are returning narrators or new narrators. Lot of people have ideas for games. I know I've got my next three games ready, and that might be the next year and a half of actual playtime. It's also becoming increasingly difficult to get a timeslot. It used to be that you could peg "sometime in (month)" and that left open pretty much every time that month. Now, the next available slot might be months away. In addition, it's not a bad thing, but I think we ought to consider setting a limit on the number of small games running. There are a ton of small games popping up because people want to run something but also circumvent the schedule.

Another thing ive noticed is its difficult, atleast for me, to notice which games are still in signups and which have just started. Im sure ill get better at noticing that, but where im from we have a separate thread for a game labeled SIGNUPS for [blank] and then start a new thread for the actual game itself. It helps us keep track.

Take a look in Werewolf Central. A lot of people seem to have either missed or forgotten its existence. It's usually up to date, and has a list of which games are recruiting and which are running.

[Visor]

1. You guys have a lot of largish games open at the one time.
2. Your games are very similar.

[Zweisteine]

I'm posting to gauge interest in two werewolf games, both of which I plan to run eventually (though I already have another 3 I have plans for, so...).

1. Star Trek Werewolf
This would be a relatively simple, small game. No big tricks, and mostly standard roles.

2. Steins;Gate Werewolf
This would also be relatively small, but would have some less standard roles, and possibly fewer standard roles.

Aaand now I've been struck by about 10 more WW Game ideas, all based on various anime.

[TFT]

Well, considering my game was the scheduled one for this week and there are not only 3 competing games with small amounts of people but a bunch of people trying to host small games still. We really do need to bring back the restriction on the number of games for a bit on small ones. Just my opinion.

[Askthepizzaguy]

Note to all- been quite busy, will catch up and do some narrations which have been delayed after my work shift today, an unusual morning shift. I typically work nights.

[BasketOfPuppies]

I don't know about y'all, but for me it seems like there's been a lull in activity.

[Legato Endless]

It's not just you.

[reaverb]

Does anybody have access to the full rules of this version of witch-hunt? It seems like an interesting rule-set/game (as shown by the fact both Internet Flea and Ramsus have their signature quotes from it) but I can't tell what's going on because all the role descriptions were stored off-site (and have since been deleted, except for one image showing around 1/5 the roles)

[Saposhiente]

Does anybody have access to the full rules of this version of witch-hunt? It seems like an interesting rule-set/game (as shown by the fact both Internet Flea and Ramsus have their signature quotes from it) but I can't tell what's going on because all the role descriptions were stored off-site (and have since been deleted, except for one image showing around 1/5 the roles)

Witchhunt has actually been in continuous development for several years now. Unfortunately, its designer's webhost lost both his data and the backup, so much of the information has been lost, however you can see the history of roles used here, in the second spoiler. That version is version 4.0. (The third spoiler is the current version of Witchhunt.)

Spoiler: Role descriptions from memory

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Werewolf: Neutral. Can't be lynched. During Day, may guess someone's role to Devour them, killing them and becoming protected that night.
Spy: Villager in the coven, replaces one of the Witch roles (knows which), and except for Junior Witch, doesn't have that role's power.
Warlock: Protected from first lynch, I think?
Demon: Learns whom the Priest targeted each night
Assassin: When the witches Sacrifice someone, they may make an additional, non-protection-bypassing, kill
Junior Witch: Doesn't join the coven until they choose to. Don't remember the exact timing of the choice.
Necromancer: Learns role of NK'd players
Enchantress: Start of game, may choose lovers. (Village-only, I think) Is protected as long as the Lovers live.

Priest: Seer
Acolyte: Knows Priest at start of game
Nun: During day, may confirm himself Innocent
DOB: Town Beast
Survivalist: Starts with 1 extra life
VH: Vanilla
Leeroy: Kill self to decide lynch
Medium: Learns role of lynched players
Martyr: If someone would die, may kill self instead.
Spiritualist: Observes Angels
Wizard: If last villager standing, wins
BOD: On death, grants an extra life to someone
Judge: On no lynch, chooses the lynch. Bypasses Enchantress.
Traveller: Protected from nightkills

[Internet Flea]

Does anybody have access to the full rules of this version of witch-hunt? It seems like an interesting rule-set/game (as shown by the fact both Internet Flea and Ramsus have their signature quotes from it) but I can't tell what's going on because all the role descriptions were stored off-site (and have since been deleted, except for one image showing around 1/5 the roles)

Um... I'll give it a shot. But keep in mind, the main reason that particular game was such fun was because nobody really understood what they were doing.

Spoiler: long

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There are three teams; Assuming 21 players (it was designed to scale at four-player intervals but I don't remember the role orders apart from the last four), there will be 15 Town, 5 Witches and the Werewolf. The goal of each team is to eliminate all members of the other two teams. There is no communication outside of thread except for the Lovers (if any) and the Coven. There is no talking in thread during the night. Roles are not revealed upon death. A lynch takes a 50% majority, and day immediately ends when 50% majority is reached.

Spoiler: Werewolf Team

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The Werewolf cannot be killed by the lynch. The Werewolf has the power to publicly guess a player's role once per day (called Devouring), and if correct, that player is killed and the Werewolf becomes invincible until the next day cycle. However, the Spy is immune to Devouring. A correct Devour Any Devour attempt reveals who the Werewolf is. The Werewolf can choose to "fake" a devour, in which case the Werewolf will not be officially revealed and the targeted player will not die even if the Werewolf is correct about their role (this is to prevent Day 1 Nun-claim/mass-devour shenanigans.)

If the Werewolf is chosen to be a Lover, the Werewolf's Lover joins the Werewolf's team. Otherwise, the Werewolf is the only member of their team.

Spoiler: Witches

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There are six witch roles, five of which start connected (Coven members). The Coven and the Lovers are the only (living) players who can talk to each other outside of thread. The connected witches do not start knowing who has which role, or which role is the Spy.

The Necromancer learns the role of any player killed in the night.

The Demon learns the target of the Priest scry. If the Priest does not scry anyone, the Demon does not learn why.

The Assassin allows the witches to gain an additional unblockable kill if they make a sacrifice (even if they sacrifice the Assassin).

The Warlock survives being lynched one time, though they will die if lynched a second time, or if killed by any other means.

The Enchantress chooses two other players at the start of the game. These players become Lovers (die together if one is lynched, but separately if one is nightkilled), and the Enchantress is immune to lynching while both Lovers are alive, which she loses if one or both Lovers are killed by any means (this was modified in 3 so that the Judge could judge-lynch the Enchantress despite protection.)

The Junior Witch starts unconnected from the Coven, but scries as Good until she joins, which she can choose to do at the beginning of any night phase.

The witches have a standard nightkill decided by simple majority of the Coven. They can choose to nightkill a Coven member, but only if that member agrees, i.e. votes for themselves. They also have the ability to sacrifice a witch, which is decided by plurality (if there are four Coven members and two elect to sacrifice the same member, that member is sacrificed). On top of killing the sacrificed witch, the nightkill becomes unblockable, and if the Assassin is alive, the Coven gains a second nightkill for the night which is also unblockable. If two witches both have plurality votes for sacrifice, both are sacrificed. If there are only two members of the Coven, Spy loses in a tie. In case of a sacrifice, it is not revealed who was sacrificed and who died from other causes.

One of the witches, chosen at random before the game starts, is the town role, the Spy. The Spy takes the place of one of the six witch roles (the Spy knows which one), but scries as Good and does not have the standard Witch power, unless they are the Junior Witch.

Spoiler: Town

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There are fifteen Town roles, none of which start connected unless the Enchantress chooses them to be Lovers. They had an order so you could tier the power levels to how many players you got, but I don't remember the order.

One of the witches, chosen at random before the game starts, is the town role, the Spy. The Spy takes the place of one of the six witch roles (the Spy knows which one), but scries as Good and does not have the standard power of the role they are replacing, unless they are the Junior Witch.

The Benevolent Old Dame, or BOD, provides protection from nightkills to all players the night after they are lynched. If the BOD dies by means other than lynch, nothing happens.

The Priest scries one player during the night and learns their alignment, though not their role. Spy scries as Good. Junior Witch scries as Good until she joins the Coven. The Demon learns the Priest's scry target if they are not the Spy. Guardian Angels know who the Priest is and who he scries.

The Acolyte starts knowing who the Priest is.

The Judge decides the lynch if no majority is reached during the day. They can choose any living player. A lynch by the Judge can kill the Enchantress, but the Medium will not gain any information from a judgelynch.

The Medium learns the role of any player killed by lynch during the day. This applies only to lynches. If Leeroy Jenkins lynches someone, the Medium learns the role, but if the Judge decides the lynch the Medium does not learn anything.

Leeroy Jenkins can sacrifice himself to control the lynch for the day. Upon power activation, Leeroy is publicly revealed and dies, Leeroy's target is lynched and Day ends. If the lynch kills the player, The Medium learns the lynched player's role.

The Martyr can sacrifice themselves to bring a dying player back to life. The Martyr is revealed upon death, and the targeted player is revived. This power only activates if the Martyr targets a player who is dying in the current phase, otherwise the Martyr stays alive and nothing happens. If the necromancer is not the Spy, they still learn the role of the saved player.

The Survivalist survives the first kill attempt from any source.

The Dirty Old Bastard, or DOB, can kill a targeted player upon death. This kill ignores protection, and is revealed to be caused by the DOB.

The Nun can publicly reveal themselves as the Nun at any time.

The Wizard wins the game for Town if he is the last Town player left alive.

The Vampire Hunter has no in-game powers.

The Spiritualist sees who the Guardian Angels protect during the night, if anyone.

...I think I'm forgetting one. No, Sapo got it. The Traveller has automatic protection against nightkills, which lasts until they die. Traveller Protection does not work against sacrifice-powered nightkills, DOB kills, Werewolf Devours or any form of lynch.

Spoiler: Dead players

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Dead players become the Guardian Angels, or GA. Every night, the GA votes to protect one player from the witch nightkill. Protection does not work against sacrifice or DOB kills. Protection is decided by simple majority. If no majority is reached, no one is protected in the night. Dead players can talk to each other, start knowing the Priest, and know who the Priest scries, but do not gain special information about the roles of any other players, living or dead.

Once there are fewer than five living players, the GA loses the ability to protect anyone.

[reaverb]

Thanks Saposhiente and Internet Flea, I think I can follow that thread now. (Although there are some contradictions in your explanations . I'm sure I can puzzle it out)

[Count Dingdong]

If you want the most recent game, you can find it here. As with the other games, the image links don't all work. However, there is a list of all role PMs for the game that you can use. Most of the images are gone, as mentioned, but the flavor text is there in italics, as well as a description of what the role does. The Werewolf, Junior Witch, and Enchantress flavor text is "illegible", but I could decipher most of the first two. The Enchantress is missing an image, so I was never able to decipher its flavor text.

Werewolf: "You are surrounded by fools. Tasty, delicious fools."
Junior Witch: "Favorite Movies include Hannah Montana, Finding Nemo, and the entire [???] series."

These are mostly deciphered, as "delicious" is an educated guess, though it does fit the shape and length of the missing word on the second line of the flavor text. Likewise, the [???] is an illegible 3-letter word, starting with a capital letter. I believe the capital letter is an S, but I'm not certain, and I'm not sure what the rest of the word would be. The images are still there, so if anyone else wants to try and decipher them, be my guest.

In addition, you could try PMing Gray Mage to see if he has any of the images stored elsewhere?

[Internet Flea]

??? was Saw. The entire Saw series.

[reaverb]

However, there is a list of all role PMs for the game that you can use.

Thanks for finding a almost complete source. I don't really mind the images being gone, but seeing all the role PMs is great.

[Count Dingdong]

??? was Saw. The entire Saw series.

That would explain it. I was looking for something that would fit with the other two examples, but I had neglected to think of something meant to clash. So we have the role descriptions, a smattering of cards, and the title text for all but the Enchantress. The role descriptions alone should be enough to run the game, but now you have more for fluff purposes.

[Ramsus]

Just me or has it been awfully quiet the last few days?

[Legato Endless]

Just me or has it been awfully quiet the last few days?

No, a lot of games have stalled out, and a fair number of people are awol.

[Askthepizzaguy]

Re: My game

Back is still injured, and we just lost yet another manager, so my hours at work didn't decrease, they increased, much to my extreme displeasure.

However, back is on the mend and I will be fine to lay down and do extended hosting and narration duties in short order, and will PM everyone involved in the game to give them fair notice the game has resumed, and extend the first Day and Night phase as we return.

Re: AWOL players

These things happen, all too often everywhere, and especially here. We'll just suffer through it and remember not to count on everyone playing their assigned role all the way to the end, as per usual.

Gotta design games that factor that into it. Recommend against power-heavy games which go unbalanced real quick if not everyone plays, and against games which have "critical" roles such as a main investigator/seer/detective which the game would be broken without, or roles which are absolutely critical to the narration or perceived importance to the story.

[Saposhiente]

I'm also going to go change my settings so my online status is no longer hidden. If people are actually using that information, it seems kind of cheaty to keep mine hidden.

My opinion is that is is not cheaty; it is simply anti-town. You are removing information from the game; this makes the villagers' job more difficult. Because this is the sort of thing that players would decide on and then use the same setting for all their games, I wouldn't lynch you for it. Personal preference; on the one hand, this information won't be used to convict you; on the other hand, it can't be used to defend you either.

[Shadow]

That wasn't the first time I've caught a wolf that way, either. I think this is the first time I've had to use it for my explanation though, so it's the first time I've ever publicized that I've done it.

I've been Invisible ever since I first used online times to catch someone, which was probably five to seven years ago.