afroakuma's Planar And Other Oddities Questions Thread 5!

[Brookshw]

Hmmmm... Could it be... The first exemplar to hold Talisid's post?

I debated that one as well, hard to say based on the evidence but an interesting question.

[afroakuma]

May as well finish. I'm here and await your final questions and guess.

[enderlord99]

Are erinyes capable of intercepting summoning/calling spells cast by mortals attempting to get a celestial (specifically an aasimon)? Are any other baatezu (or possibly yugoloths) capable of doing so, and also superficially appearing angelic?

I need the answer to help with speculation in the Fan Comics section.

[afroakuma]

Are erinyes capable of intercepting summoning/calling spells cast by mortals attempting to get a celestial (specifically an aasimon)? Are any other baatezu (or possibly yugoloths) capable of doing so, and also superficially appearing angelic?

Not as a general rule, no. Someone might have figured out a way to jack a summons, but it would be a very individual thing. As a species they have no such power. It's more likely that they're on the prowl and looking for idiots who think they're casting a summoning spell.

[Alleran]

Is there anything we know in particular, or that you have in your headcanon, about the original creator(s) of the Codex of the Infinite Planes?

And what it does or represents beyond the rules? It grants powers to the owner if their minds can handle learning the knowledge without going crazy, so is it a repository of knowledge? What do we know is actually written there? Records of how the planes function, their scope and details, perhaps?

It's been referred to as "Yagrax's Tome" - who was Yagrax?

[Brookshw]

May as well finish. I'm here and await your final questions and guess.

Well, I've been starring at the computer for half an hour puzzling over all the questions and little hints and admit I'm at a loss. Sooo......

Q20 [The Guess]: The Queen of Law?

Yes, a complete throw out wild guess, because.

Sad thing is I think you basically brushed past what it is in a bid to figure out why

Yeah, that's true. Probably because questions like "does it have scales" wouldn't be much help in figuring out which creature in Canon it was when the assumption was it existed in Canon.

Though the "does it have scales" 20 questions guess the monster version sounds like it would be fun as well.

[afroakuma]

Is there anything we know in particular, or that you have in your headcanon, about the original creator(s) of the Codex of the Infinite Planes?

Haven't given it much thought yet for my own headcanon, but canonical sources give no information except to suggest that no mortal could have crafted the thing. Surprise surprise.

And what it does or represents beyond the rules? It grants powers to the owner if their minds can handle learning the knowledge without going crazy, so is it a repository of knowledge? What do we know is actually written there? Records of how the planes function, their scope and details, perhaps?

If this is a topic of sufficient curiosity I may have to devote some time to creating content for it.

It's been referred to as "Yagrax's Tome" - who was Yagrax?

The idiot wizard-priest who sank the Isles of Woe with the tome, and its earliest recorded "owner" from Oerth/general canon.

Well, I've been starring at the computer for half an hour puzzling over all the questions and little hints and admit I'm at a loss. Sooo......

Q20 [The Guess]: The Queen of Law?

Snrk.

Yeah, that's true. Probably because questions like "does it have scales" wouldn't be much help in figuring out which creature in Canon it was when the assumption was it existed in Canon.

Yeah, the problem is that you were looking for an identity rather than just trying to suss out the nature of the thing. You were doomed from the outset.

However, since you (and others) were such a good sport about the game, I'm going to give you the answer regardless. Spoilered for anyone who doesn't want to know:

Spoiler: The Prisoner of Elysium

Show

And once you know, you can't un-know.

Spoiler: Yes I get it take me to the secret

Show

Are you sure?

Spoiler: Yes I'm sure. Kick open the final gate!

Show

The First Fallen

[Brookshw]

BWAHAHAHA

I even considered that a while back and immediately discounted it. Ah well, fun game and I like your headcanon.

[afroakuma]

BWAHAHAHA

I even considered that a while back and immediately discounted it. Ah well, fun game and I like your headcanon.

I know you did. I watched it go zwooom as it passed. Ultimately, I think it's the best answer; it's certainly the most terrifying possibility that could reasonably be confined, and given what it is the embodiment of, it makes a ton of sense for them to keep it hidden. Also explains why Belierin sucks.

[Brookshw]

I know you did. I watched it go zwooom as it passed. Ultimately, I think it's the best answer; it's certainly the most terrifying possibility that could reasonably be confined, and given what it is the embodiment of, it makes a ton of sense for them to keep it hidden.

Yeah, I can certainly see the logic

Also explains why Belierin sucks.

there's a surprising amount of suckage on the plane in odd corners, like that funky graveyard a layer up. You'd think celestials might do something about that (or not, I can get why it is what it is).

Spoiler: things related to game/answer

Show

any headcanon on why it, ya know. Also what was up with InterrogativeXayide, I did a fair amount of poking around on that one but don't see much of a connection though I haven't read the story in quite a while.

[afroakuma]

any headcanon on why

Nope. Of course, I have a fondness for Wrath.

Also what was up with InterrogativeXayide

Oh. I was trying to inveigle you into using up your questions and in doing so destroying yourself (figuratively). Like an interrogative version of Xayide.

[afroakuma]

Anyway, now that that's done with, let's have more questions!

[Urpriest]

What's the most evil thing Iggwilv did?

(Thinking about doing a fanfic in which she's the protagonist, want to figure out just how much needs to be rationalized.)

[Necroticplague]

What creatures are native to the reign of dreams? Is it any sleeping creature, since they exist in the world as they sleep? Do the creatures created as a part of a dream count as natives (I.e., you dream about an iron golem, does that both make your dream self and the iron golem natives, despite the golem not dreaming?).p

[afroakuma]

What's the most evil thing Iggwilv did?

(Thinking about doing a fanfic in which she's the protagonist, want to figure out just how much needs to be rationalized.)

Ehh... honestly, she's not done much. I suppose supplying armies of fiends to Iuz or waging war on Perrenland would both be kind of evil.

[Asrrin]

If Fharlanghn were prevented from accessing the Prime Material Plane, What location(s) would he make his home? I know he sometimes wanders some of the Elemental Planes, but surely there would be some places hospitable to him in the Outer Planes such as the Outlands or limbo.

[*.*.*.*]

Why is the Great Mother CE when her chosen race is LE? Not too mention, the Occular Adept requires NE or LE(which is 2 steps naway from her, thus should be unable to grab divine spells from).

[Brookshw]

Do you know it there's any truth to the rumored character Center-of-All? I don't think I've seen any references outside of Faces of Sigil.

Speaking of that book, what's with the arcane's/mercane's avoidance of Sigil? Something to do with the Planar Consortium? Seems like a great market opportunity (though maybe not so much the spelljammer helm business). I guess later there's union for them and doing business under a certain shadow might be a concern, but still...

[afroakuma]

What creatures are native to the reign of dreams?

None canonically, though you could certainly use dream element creatures (Dragon 287) and steal eidolons, hobs and spellshadows from Dal Quor easily enough (Dragon 324).

If Fharlanghn were prevented from accessing the Prime Material Plane, What location(s) would he make his home? I know he sometimes wanders some of the Elemental Planes, but surely there would be some places hospitable to him in the Outer Planes such as the Outlands or limbo.

I would imagine he could wander just about everywhere, but I feel like the Outlands and Shurrock are both just really good places for him. Ysgard wouldn't be out of sorts either.

Why is the Great Mother CE when her chosen race is LE?

She's an insane primal Abyssal entity and they don't usually worship her. No curing that level of crazy. A lot of her worship comes from beholder cults (i.e. cults based around beholders).

Not too mention, the Occular Adept requires NE or LE(which is 2 steps naway from her, thus should be unable to grab divine spells from).

The ocular adept is venerating the beholder that is serving as a proxy for the Great Mother's powers. The beholder is probably Lawful Evil.

Do you know it there's any truth to the rumored character Center-of-All? I don't think I've seen any references outside of Faces of Sigil.

Can't think of any other references offhand. Do you have the page number in Uncaged?

Speaking of that book, what's with the arcane's/mercane's avoidance of Sigil?

Page citation on that?

[Brookshw]

Can't think of any other references offhand. Do you have the page number in Uncaged?

Sure do, mentioned under Rule of Three (pg. 86) and Unity of Rings (pg. 105).

Page citation on that?

You got it, under Torholt (pg. 100, brief mention on the right column). This ones in a bit of a grey area as I could see it being parsed as to indicate particular arcane's that won't enter but its strange to call out any race at all rather than just "customers" (or whatever) that won't enter Sigil. (Likewise the idea there's a suitable enough number that avoid it as to justify mention I imagine would be pointing to something deeper,.....or is simply wrong).

[afroakuma]

Sure do, mentioned under Rule of Three (pg. 86) and Unity of Rings (pg. 105).

Yeah, no other references.

You got it, under Torholt (pg. 100, brief mention on the right column). This ones in a bit of a grey area as I could see it being parsed as to indicate particular arcane's that won't enter but its strange to call out any race at all rather than just "customers" (or whatever) that won't enter Sigil. (Likewise the idea there's a suitable enough number that avoid it as to justify mention I imagine would be pointing to something deeper,.....or is simply wrong).

No, it's quite correct. The arcane do not want to enter Sigil.

[Brookshw]

Yeah, no other references.

Shame, sounded like a bit of flavorful fun.

No, it's quite correct. The arcane do not want to enter Sigil.

Right, okay, so back to the "what's up with that"?

[afroakuma]

Shame, sounded like a bit of flavorful fun.

Well, it is. It would be unfun to distinctly identify something rather than leaving it as a rumor and option for DMs. That's the Planescape way.

Right, okay, so back to the "what's up with that"?

The arcane don't like setting up permanent shops, trading with exemplars (particularly fiends), being separated from their network, or the possibility of ending up stranded without a way back out. Sigil isn't a good environment for them.

[afroakuma]

Five pages and stagnating already. Sadness.

[123456789blaaa]

Five pages and stagnating already. Sadness.

Been busy recently but I don't want this thread to die!:

The Blood Queen doesn't really seem to lend herself well to being used in-game. She doesn't really do anything. Do you have any ideas for incorporating her into the plot of a game?

From the PM you replied to me with (I'm quoting it):

Quick question: By non-dumb fluff, which creature types have souls?

There's been some talk over on the MinMaxBoards about creating more incarnum classes based on the various creature types. There's already Magical Beast (Totemist), Aberrations (Warpsouls), and Plants (Green Man). While I'd love to see more based on Elementals, Fey, Constructs, and Oozes, I'm not sure if the fluff would fit. Incarnum is soul energy after all.

Fey have souls. Elementals are "souls" = their essence is their body and vice versa. Constructs almost always do not have souls, but it's not impossible to install one. It wouldn't be native to the construct, though. Oozes also very rarely have souls; an ooze with a soul is more likely an aberration (such as a phasm).

Given that nature/lack of souls of these creature types, do you think Totemist-equivalents would be inappropriate from a fluff perspective?

Do all mindless creatures not have souls? If you raise ones intelligence, does it gain a soul?

Do all souls come from from the Positive Energy Plane? Including elemental souls/Obyrith souls/etc?

You've said previously that the Plane of Shadow-similar to the Para-elemental Planes- is a mixture of the Positive and Negative Energy Planes. Now, before it was previously a demi-plane before becoming a full plane. Does this mean the Para/Quasi/etc Elemental Planes used to be demi-planes?

[Brookshw]

Five pages and stagnating already. Sadness.

Phirblas, dabus that know how to spell? How do they fit into things (conjecture is fine).

Also from the same book, scile, how much rainbow bright were the authors watching? Murky and lurky must be so proud. What is life like when you're drained of color?

[Eldan]

Hm. This is more a general sentiment and I don't really know how to put it into questions, but...

There was a thread about law and chaos in D&D that made me think about "weirdness". I sort of feel that all exemplars should be, to a degree, alien, but how even Planescape often does a bad job of showing them that way. Some come close, but in the end, all their motives feel remarkably human, sometimes, just bigger, grander. Which also makes sense, of course, given that they are born from human beliefs, but is also a bit disappointing sometimes.

So, I think a good starting question is: can you think of anything, preferably an exemplar, that is both good and utterly strange and alien in mindset?

[enderlord99]

So, I think a good starting question is: can you think of anything, preferably an exemplar, that is both good and utterly strange and alien

Well, there's the ancient equivalent to the eladrins, whatever they are...

in mindset?

...possibly.

[afroakuma]

Been busy recently but I don't want this thread to die!:

The Blood Queen doesn't really seem to lend herself well to being used in-game. She doesn't really do anything. Do you have any ideas for incorporating her into the plot of a game?

In what capacity? I could see using her in a game.

Given that nature/lack of souls of these creature types, do you think Totemist-equivalents would be inappropriate from a fluff perspective?

Yes.

Do all mindless creatures not have souls?

A creature which is naturally mindless does not have a soul. It has an animus, which is the spiritual equivalent of basic clockwork.

If you raise ones intelligence, does it gain a soul?

If I blast your Intelligence down to zero, your soul doesn't stop existing. A change in Intelligence is simply magic adding extra doodads to the functioning of the animus. Entities such as bacteria, protists, diatoms, microzooa, plankton, algae, hell even trees all have animi rather than souls. If a demon lord could just awaken a snack whenever desired, life would get quite silly. This is why awaken is transmutation rather than necromancy.

Do all souls come from from the Positive Energy Plane? Including elemental souls/Obyrith souls/etc?

Yes and no. In the sense that the Outer Planes are constituted via the Inner Planes, yes - but the soul of an Obyrith forms from the Abyss itself; it is not preincarnate in the Positive Energy Plane. Similarly, while it's likely that the existence of the Positive and Negative Planes had some strange influence on the Inner Planes, an elemental isn't "one part Positive in an element shell."

Does this mean the Para/Quasi/etc Elemental Planes used to be demi-planes?

No.

Phirblas, dabus that know how to spell? How do they fit into things (conjecture is fine).

I really have no headcanon on them yet. In the meantime, they're there to add to the mystery.

Also from the same book, scile, how much rainbow bright were the authors watching? Murky and lurky must be so proud. What is life like when you're drained of color?

Oh come on, how can you not like scile? Scile are awesome. And life sucks when they've had their way with you - you're not gray, you're transparent. Invisible. Light will not strike you. You can't even see yourself. Fortunately, if you have magic friends (you do, you went to the Plane of Radiance) it's fairly easily fixed, but until then you'll be fumbling around a lot.

So, I think a good starting question is: can you think of anything, preferably an exemplar, that is both good and utterly strange and alien in mindset?

Mercurial. Not an exemplar, but definitely an outsider and definitely alien. If we're just going for "good-aligned but alien," silthilar.

But really, I agree with you, I feel like people are too reductivist when it comes to the mindsets of exemplars. Modrons and slaad aren't actually funny at all; devils, demons and yugoloths are all horrific on levels we fail to fathom; archons, guardinals and eladrins are basically putting on a veneer of approachability for the benefit of mortals.

[JohnnyCancer]

The Tome of Magic's version of Dantalion may be the collective ancestral rulers of some cosmic empire that the Gods took down. Any indication of which gods were offended by this empire, and if it fit anywhere in the Spelljammer universe?