Kymme Goes To France

[Kymme]

Hello, Playground! Yes, you heard it right, Kymme (yes, the Kymme) is going to France!

I'm going with my high school's French class. This trip has been a long time in the making (planning started my freshman year, and I'm a senior now) and everybody involved has put a lot of effort into going. I took on a full-time job last summer to raise the money that I needed to pay my way, and I'm going to go out and say that the work was worth it.

Now, my class and I will be leaving on the 27th of March, which is 32 days away. We'll be staying in Paris (PARIS) for a few days before heading south to Bordeaux (très beau, this city of Bordeaux). The rest of the trip will be spent in Bordeaux with host families before we head back to Paris and then fly back to the US. I'm absolutely psyched to go, and am pretty much counting the days as they come at this point.

I'm well aware of the fact that not many people probably care about the miscellaneous misadventures of Kymme, but I felt like sharing this all the same.

Thanks for listening, people of the Playground. Good night, and have a pleasant tomorrow!

[GolemsVoice]

Have fun, I bet it will be great. As far as I know, though, Paris is actually a very rude city, because of the overwhelming amount of tourists they have to deal with, so be prepared for that. Although I've never been to Paris, so that might just be rumour.

I wish I could give you some advice, but I've only ever seen Strasbourg (which is worth it as well), because I live more or less 30 minutes away from there on the German side of the Rhine.

[Bulldog Psion]

Charles de Gaulle (sp.) airport is about the worst one I've ever been in. Horribly overheated, astoundingly overcrowded, stinks to high heaven, and the people allegedly announcing destinations and flights in English are worse at speaking English than many an individual I've heard on an airport loudspeaker in remote Central Asian republics. I'm not joking, either. It was a horrible experience, so be prepared. Though I had the misfortune of going through in the summer, so that might have been part of it.

I have no idea what the city is like, though. Hope you have fun!

[Kymme]

Thank you!

It's somewhat odd, about Paris. My French teacher lived in Paris for 3 years or so, and she has vastly different things to say about it. It's somewhat confusing, actually. But Bordeux is a smaller city, anyways, so hopefully they'll be great.

Charles de Gaulle (sp.) airport is about the worst one I've ever been in. Horribly overheated, astoundingly overcrowded, stinks to high heaven, and the people allegedly announcing destinations and flights in English are worse at speaking English than many an individual I've heard on an airport loudspeaker in remote Central Asian republics. I'm not joking, either. It was a horrible experience, so be prepared. Though I had the misfortune of going through in the summer, so that might have been part of it.

I have no idea what the city is like, though. Hope you have fun!

I'll have the misfortune of going through it during spring break, but here's to hoping it'll be nice this time around?

[veti]

It's somewhat odd, about Paris. My French teacher lived in Paris for 3 years or so, and she has vastly different things to say about it. It's somewhat confusing, actually. But Bordeux is a smaller city, anyways, so hopefully they'll be great.

Living in Paris for three years is quite a different experience from visiting it for a day or so. I can well imagine it's very pleasant once you get to know and understand it, enough to confidently deviate from the well-worn tourist trail. But that takes time, which you're unlikely to have.

Never been to Bordeaux, so I can't really comment about that except to mention that they are very jealous of their wine. Probably best not to mention the fact that there exist (red) wines that are made outside the Bordeaux region. Especially "claret".

I'll have the misfortune of going through it during spring break, but here's to hoping it'll be nice this time around?

"Spring break" isn't a thing in Europe, so unless it's packed to the rafters with American students that shouldn't make much of a difference. "Easter" is a thing, but it's only really one (extended) weekend (which this year happens to fall on 3-6 April).

CdG should be approximately "normal", whatever that means...

[TheThan]

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Totally posted this in the wrong thread, please ignore.

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[GolemsVoice]

I also would imagine that the French are cool with you when you actually speak French. Again, a popular stereotype here in Germany is that the French absolutely REFUSE to speak anything but French with you, despite knowing English. But I suppose that's just a stereotype.

[TheThan]

I also would imagine that the French are cool with you when you actually speak French. Again, a popular stereotype here in Germany is that the French absolutely REFUSE to speak anything but French with you, despite knowing English. But I suppose that's just a stereotype.

Another stereotype is that they have a tendency to insult and make fun of non-french speakers in french. I mean beyond the point of just being rude.

I know someone that visited Paris and this actually happened to her. She speaks french and was appalled by what the tour guide was saying (apparently it was pretty foul). So she complained to the owner of the tour service in french... it was quite an amusing story.

[Scarlet Knight]

My niece went to Paris, and enjoyed it so much she went back to teach English for a bit.

[Aedilred]

Have fun, I bet it will be great. As far as I know, though, Paris is actually a very rude city, because of the overwhelming amount of tourists they have to deal with, so be prepared for that. Although I've never been to Paris, so that might just be rumour.

This matches my experience.

Charles de Gaulle (sp.) airport is about the worst one I've ever been in. Horribly overheated, astoundingly overcrowded, stinks to high heaven, and the people allegedly announcing destinations and flights in English are worse at speaking English than many an individual I've heard on an airport loudspeaker in remote Central Asian republics. I'm not joking, either. It was a horrible experience, so be prepared. Though I had the misfortune of going through in the summer, so that might have been part of it.

So does this.

Living in Paris for three years is quite a different experience from visiting it for a day or so. I can well imagine it's very pleasant once you get to know and understand it, enough to confidently deviate from the well-worn tourist trail. But that takes time, which you're unlikely to have.

This I can believe.

I also would imagine that the French are cool with you when you actually speak French. Again, a popular stereotype here in Germany is that the French absolutely REFUSE to speak anything but French with you, despite knowing English. But I suppose that's just a stereotype.

Yes and no, I think, again, at least in my experience. Whenever I've been to France my reception has been much warmer when I've made an effort to speak in French; however, once it has been established that I'm making the effort, if I appear to be struggling people are usually happy to speak English (or franglais, at least) so that mutual comprehension can be restored. And to be honest the same principle has gone for almost everywhere in the world I've visited, albeit you stand a better chance of encountering an English-speaker in France than in many countries.

I don't believe the problems encountered by tourists in Paris are any worse than in any other capital city with a lot of tourists and a global appeal - as a visitor I used to find London very rude - and I also don't think France is really any worse than anywhere else. It's just that many tourists don't set foot outside Paris and assume the whole country is like that (I gather that the rude Parisian is just as much a stereotype in France as it is anywhere else, apart from anything else).

Something also worth bearing in mind, though, is that as a tourist most of the people you encounter will be in the service industry and in a city like Paris a lot of those people will be migrant workers who may not even speak French as a first language. So if you're having difficulty communicating in English, it might not be that your correspondent is deliberately ignoring you or being rude - they just might well not speak it. (The same really goes for anyone in a country where English isn't the regular first language, but in western countries where English is on the standard curriculum, it's going to be a particular issue with immigrants, I think). If you're there with your school French class I shouldn't imagine you're likely to encounter too many of these sort of difficulties though as speaking enough French to get by kind of comes with the territory.

[Amidus Drexel]

Hello, Playground! Yes, you heard it right, Kymme (yes, the Kymme) is going to France!

-snip-

Have fun! I've never been to France, but by all accounts it's a very pretty place once you get out of the big cities (notably Paris, though I'm sure you'll enjoy being there).

[Kymme]

Yes and no, I think, again, at least in my experience. Whenever I've been to France my reception has been much warmer when I've made an effort to speak in French; however, once it has been established that I'm making the effort, if I appear to be struggling people are usually happy to speak English (or franglais, at least) so that mutual comprehension can be restored. And to be honest the same principle has gone for almost everywhere in the world I've visited, albeit you stand a better chance of encountering an English-speaker in France than in many countries.

This jives with most of the things that I have heard about France, and Paris especially. You endear yourself to people in any case.

I don't believe the problems encountered by tourists in Paris are any worse than in any other capital city with a lot of tourists and a global appeal - as a visitor I used to find London very rude - and I also don't think France is really any worse than anywhere else. It's just that many tourists don't set foot outside Paris and assume the whole country is like that (I gather that the rude Parisian is just as much a stereotype in France as it is anywhere else, apart from anything else).

This also makes sense. Thank you muchly for your advice!

Have fun! I've never been to France, but by all accounts it's a very pretty place once you get out of the big cities (notably Paris, though I'm sure you'll enjoy being there).

Thank you! I'll be sure to make the most of it, and report back here on my experiences.

[GolemsVoice]

It just appeared to me that I was spreading a lot of negativity about France here, so I just wanted to say that I have been to Strasbourg several times, and I encountered a lot of nice people every time. So that's that.

[thorgrim29]

I used to live in France, and I know we have a couple of people here who are from Paris, so I'm sure they'll be more relevant then my memories of a decade ago, and since I'm a native french speaker my experience is different. However, I will say that there is some truth about French people being rude, they tend to be much more blunt then americans. It's not personal, they are like that to other french people too. Though you might meet an unbelievably rude parisien from time to time, some of them get fed up with tourists. Expect to wait in line a lot for museums and such, and being taller then the average Japanese tourist helps once you're inside. If you have some free time I would suggest finding a small bistro or brasserie with 4 or 5 friends and spending some time there eating and people watching rather then going for a bigger restaurant. I have very fond memories of wandering around Montmartre for an evening with friends on a school trip when I was 14. Keep in mind that the minimum age to purchase alcohol in france is 18 and there's no minimum for consumption. at the same time, don't get drunk in an unknown town where you don't speak the language.

For Bordeaux, engage with your host family, people are usually proud to show guests around their city.

[Seto]

Hey ! Tuning in. I live in Paris, always have. I hope you'll enjoy your stay in France.
Honestly, as a French person I don't really experience Paris (or the rest of France) the same way tourists might experience it, so I can't tell you how polite and helpful people will be on average. I know I generally am (besides, I love English and I'm pleased when I have to speak it), but it is true that some of us have kind of a jackass mentality.

So, do you know where you'll be going ? (Eiffel Tower, I guess ?) If you need any advice or info, or you just have something to share, feel free to ask me :)

P.S. And congrats on working so hard to make this trip possible, that's kind of awesome :)

[Gwynfrid]

Frenchman here, now living in Canada, but used to be a Parisian for many years.

Charles de Gaulle (sp.) airport is about the worst one I've ever been in. Horribly overheated, astoundingly overcrowded, stinks to high heaven, and the people allegedly announcing destinations and flights in English are worse at speaking English than many an individual I've heard on an airport loudspeaker in remote Central Asian republics. I'm not joking, either. It was a horrible experience, so be prepared. Though I had the misfortune of going through in the summer, so that might have been part of it.

This, unfortunately, is true. CDG is presently the worst airport I know by far, at least in the developed world.

Never been to Bordeaux, so I can't really comment about that except to mention that they are very jealous of their wine. Probably best not to mention the fact that there exist (red) wines that are made outside the Bordeaux region. Especially "claret".

Note if you use the word "claret" (or "clairet" in French), the vast majority of French people won't know what you mean. That term was used for Bordeaux wines exported to England in the Middle Ages; apparently, in recent years the marketing guys in Bordeaux have been trying to resurrect the word as a brand - strictly for export to English-speaking countries

"Spring break" isn't a thing in Europe, so unless it's packed to the rafters with American students that shouldn't make much of a difference. "Easter" is a thing, but it's only really one (extended) weekend (which this year happens to fall on 3-6 April).

Parisian schoolchildren won't be on vacation until mid-April. March is not peak season in France, so you ought to be OK-ish from a crowding perspective. That said, "off-peak" in Paris still means a lot of tourists, especially if you go on the mainstream path ie. Tour Eiffel, Montmartre, Louvre, Notre-Dame, etc.

I also would imagine that the French are cool with you when you actually speak French. Again, a popular stereotype here in Germany is that the French absolutely REFUSE to speak anything but French with you, despite knowing English. But I suppose that's just a stereotype.

That's really a stereotype. If somebody refuses to speak anything but French with you, it means they don't know a word of anything other than French! Yes, such people exist, many of them in fact, especially in the older population. If you need to find somebody who understands English, I recommend you go for the younger generations. The teaching of English in France still isn't great, but it's considerably improved compared to, say, 20 years ago.

Another stereotype is that they have a tendency to insult and make fun of non-french speakers in french. I mean beyond the point of just being rude.

That may happen, but that's not the norm by any means. Shame on anybody doing that... It's not only disgusting, but also idiotic.

One thing that hasn't been mentioned on the thread yet: Be equipped for rain. This is spring, you aren't guaranteed good weather. It shouldn't be cold, it may well be great... but really, late March - early April is rather unpredictable.

[Kymme]

It just appeared to me that I was spreading a lot of negativity about France here, so I just wanted to say that I have been to Strasbourg several times, and I encountered a lot of nice people every time. So that's that.

Oh, it's fine. I just want as many people's opinions as I can possibly get. Thank you for sharing your experiences with me!

I used to live in France, and I know we have a couple of people here who are from Paris, so I'm sure they'll be more relevant then my memories of a decade ago, and since I'm a native french speaker my experience is different. However, I will say that there is some truth about French people being rude, they tend to be much more blunt then americans. It's not personal, they are like that to other french people too. Though you might meet an unbelievably rude parisien from time to time, some of them get fed up with tourists. Expect to wait in line a lot for museums and such, and being taller then the average Japanese tourist helps once you're inside. If you have some free time I would suggest finding a small bistro or brasserie with 4 or 5 friends and spending some time there eating and people watching rather then going for a bigger restaurant. I have very fond memories of wandering around Montmartre for an evening with friends on a school trip when I was 14. Keep in mind that the minimum age to purchase alcohol in france is 18 and there's no minimum for consumption. at the same time, don't get drunk in an unknown town where you don't speak the language.

I assure you, I will not partake of any shady stuff like that. This trip has some pretty stringent rules set up in regards to drinking and stuff. Thank you for your concern, though.

For Bordeaux, engage with your host family, people are usually proud to show guests around their city.

I definitely will! We'll be there for 5 days, so I'll have ample time to explore the city (with my host family as a guide).

Hey ! Tuning in. I live in Paris, always have. I hope you'll enjoy your stay in France.
Honestly, as a French person I don't really experience Paris (or the rest of France) the same way tourists might experience it, so I can't tell you how polite and helpful people will be on average. I know I generally am (besides, I love English and I'm pleased when I have to speak it), but it is true that some of us have kind of a jackass mentality.

I hope so, too! My teacher has warned me about occasional rudeness.

So, do you know where you'll be going ? (Eiffel Tower, I guess ?) If you need any advice or info, or you just have something to share, feel free to ask me :)

I don't have my class' plans on me at the moment, but I'll report back with a bit of our travel itinerary.

P.S. And congrats on working so hard to make this trip possible, that's kind of awesome :)

Thank you! I kinda didn't get a summer, but it'll all be worth it, I think.

One thing that hasn't been mentioned on the thread yet: Be equipped for rain. This is spring, you aren't guaranteed good weather. It shouldn't be cold, it may well be great... but really, late March - early April is rather unpredictable.

I'll make sure to pack rainy-weather gear. My teacher has stressed the importance of being prepared for bad conditions, and I've got some big raincoats and scarves and stuff. Thank you for the advice!

[Kymme]

Please excuse the double post.

Welp, today is the day! I'm getting on a plane in a couple hours to fly across country, and from there to France! I'll be away from my computer for about 11 days, so chances are I won't be able to update this thread until around... early April? Anyways, see you guys later!

[Bulldog Psion]

Safe journey. Remember to sleep when you can and stay hydrated, that jet lag can be a pain in the neck otherwise.

[Seto]

So, how was it ? What did you like and dislike ? Any good stories ? :)

[Kymme]

Safe journey. Remember to sleep when you can and stay hydrated, that jet lag can be a pain in the neck otherwise.

Thank you! And, as luck would have it, it was a safe journey! Jet lag wasn't fun, though.

So, how was it ? What did you like and dislike ? Any good stories ? :)

Well, Paris was absolutely gorgeous. I've spent pretty much my entire life in what amounts to the wilderness, and now I've seen pretty much the opposite. And I really like the city, as it turns out.

It was kinda smelly indoors in places (the Louvre especially), but we spent a great deal of our time outdoors. Also, the weather was really good for all the days we spent in Paris.

I've got a lot of stories. There was a pidgeon-tamer at Notre Dame; an epic windstorm at Versailles, a evening elevator ride up the Eiffel Tower, seeing the Musée d'Orsay, getting lost in the Louvre, dodging traffic on the Champs-Élysées, the whole thing was quite the adventure.

And then we took a bullet train to Bordeaux, in the south of France.

As it turns out, I'm something of a hit with the youth of that city.