V's Gender Debate IV [Official]

[Meg]

Y'know, it seems to me that almost everyone thinks of V as being the same gender as they are.

[Wind d8/d12]

When V and Haley were comparing "Orbs" Look at the expressions! Would I be off the mark in believing that at least Roy and Belkar Believe V is female?
Also, why is it such a big idea? Maybe V is left androgynous to make it easier on the shippers...

[multilis]

IMO http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0123.html works better if V is female, each gender gets separate room, "the boys eavesdropping".

(Edit: Oops, notice comment above this is referring to same strip)

[Wind d8/d12]

I love how Roy's expression was pretty puzzled throughout the strip. Maybe he did think V was male?

[bsparrow]

Interesting confirmation bias in this thread.

It seems that whenever you form an opinion on this, from that moment on, you'll gather evidence to support that opinion, whatever it is. And you're not really open to being persuaded otherwise.

Yep, that's human nature for you.

Personally, I view V as male (original author intention + male body shape), but I'm not going to scoff at people who think V is female. The Giant made V's ambiguous gender a running gag, so he's going to drop teases for both camps, thereby fueling both camps.

Trying to debate something that has no answer is futile.

*joins hands and sings kumbaya*

[icastflare!]

I always though she was female. I do know the exact differences between elven and human fashion, but It seems to appear that V's mate was more on the male side. While she seems to have longer hair and seems slightly more motherly towards her children ( though her companion also shows this trait.) I personally think it is female, but there is a million beliefs out there so i could be wrong.

[Mumei Tensai]

When I first started reading the comic, I saw V as male - didn't even think there was any question. Then I read more of the comic and noticed all the ambiguous-gender related comments and started questioning my assumption.

And really I think it just isn't the same with elves as it is with humans. V doesn't even view hirself as a particular gender, I don't think. S/he's just kinda oblivious about anything relating to that which defines a particular gender. And now, after convincing myself of this I honestly can't even imagine V being either gender.

However, I have noticed that certain characters definitely think of V as one gender or the other. For example, I've noticed this most with Roy - from the oft-mentioned v-man thing to a clear differentiation between Haley and everyone else in the group (in other words he's worried about Haley seeing Elan "invisible", but doesn't seem to care if V does, thus implying that he thinks of V as a guy).

Oh, and one more thing - I've seen a lot of people reference #123 as proof that V is female, but I've always seen that as more implying that V is male - at least until you realize they're referring to gemstones. Then I suppose it is more implying that V's female. I mean seriously, though. V has a smaller set... lower down...

Wow, that post ended up being way longer than I intended.

Oh, and I've decided that we should all refer to V as "ta". Why? 'Cause that's the word for he, she, AND it in Chinese. It covers all the possibilities.

[lio45]

I always though she was female. I do know the exact differences between elven and human fashion, but It seems to appear that V's mate was more on the male side. While she seems to have longer hair and seems slightly more motherly towards her children ( though her companion also shows this trait.) I personally think it is female, but there is a million beliefs out there so i could be wrong.

"Are the kids' injuries immediately life-threatening? No? Then great, on to actually important business" is what you would call motherly behavior??? You must be kidding.

V's mate doesn't tell us anything. Rich apparently made Kyrie as ambiguously-gendered as he could (and it's a success) + he made sure it's stated in the comic that their kids are adopted. Clearly, absolutely no conclusion to be drawn here. They could be a gay couple, or not.

[Rattine]

Personally, I've always thought Vaarsuvius to be a guy. I've tried to picture him/her as a female, but it just doen't seem right. The only confusing thing is why does (s)he always room with Haley?

[PallElendro]

Think of it this way, Vaarsuvius' mate doesn't show much, and she or he bunks with Haley, like most good friends, and usually referred by people as stuff like V-Man, Mr. Elf, an frankly is still shown relatively either V's mate is a guy, or a woman with breast cancer, at least I think that's what it is.

[Math_Mage]

Personally, I've always thought Vaarsuvius to be a guy. I've tried to picture him/her as a female, but it just doen't seem right. The only confusing thing is why does (s)he always room with Haley?

AFAIK, hotels charge more for 5+1 room pairs than 4+2. Occam's Razor dictates not reading too much into it.

[Nimrod's Son]

The only confusing thing is why does (s)he always room with Haley?

Because they're old friends. I really don't get why so many people find this so hard to believe - I'm male, and I've slept in the same bed as several of my female friends (and far many more times than I could ever count, at that), let alone the same room. Not to mention that V was in a committed, monogamous relationship at the time, which would make him the least likely to pose a "threat" to Haley of everyone in the group.

[Gandariel]

i'm sure someone has posted all of these arguments, but...

FEMALE
- V is particularly friends with Haley. Haley tells her almost all her secrets; they sleep in the same room

- a 6-people group with 1 only female? mph...

- V's mate looks like a man, his pants are square, alike all men in the comic (but sure, V could be omosexual, their children are adopted)

- Belkar kissed her/him
ok, he was drunk but...
i'm a male, and i wouldn't kiss a male AT ALL, drunk or no drunk

though...
V is not particularly attached to his/her children (barely wants to know if their wounds are lethal...) while Inkirius is.

[lio45]

i suppose this has already been pointed out, but...

a group of 6 people with 1 only single female? naaah

Actually, it's more like "yaaah", since it's basically certain that the initial OotS party that Rich designed was a group of 5 males + 1 female. Scroll up and read if you want to see compelling arguments.

[Dvandemon]

By the logic of your third argument, i'm assuming that the brown hair/shirt/pants member of Team Peregrine is female (I've always thought that women in this style have rounded bottoms). While posting this I started wondering why Rich didn't show Miko's body before she was revealed to be a woman (I mean you can wear a hood without covering your body) but maybe i'm just overthinking it.

[Math_Mage]

i'm sure someone has posted all of these arguments, but...

FEMALE
- V is particularly friends with Haley. Haley tells her almost all her secrets; they sleep in the same room

Gender-neutral, as V is married, and would prefer NOT to share a room with Belkar and Elan whatever xer gender.

- a 6-people group with 1 only female? mph...

4 men, 1 woman, 1 androgynous elf. This doesn't really change whether V is male or female.

- V's mate looks like a man, his pants are square, alike all men in the comic (but sure, V could be omosexual, their children are adopted)

Well, Rich could hardly draw an androgynous character in female clothing...

- Belkar kissed her/him
ok, he was drunk but...
i'm a male, and i wouldn't kiss a male AT ALL, drunk or no drunk

But Belkar does not know V's gender any more than the others do.

though...
V is not particularly attached to his/her children (barely wants to know if their wounds are lethal...) while Inkirius is.

That is a trait of V, more than a trait of a man or a woman. And we do not know whether the same gender roles apply to elven society.

[Mando Knight]

- Belkar kissed her/him
ok, he was drunk but...
i'm a male, and i wouldn't kiss a male AT ALL, drunk or no drunk

Belkar can't tell the difference while he was sober, and he was drunk drunk when he did it. I don't know who you think you are, but if you're that drunk, your inhibitions are already gone.

[Asta Kask]

Belkar can't tell the difference while he was sober, and he was drunk drunk when he did it. I don't know who you think you are, but if you're that drunk, your inhibitions are already gone.

I'm a straight male and I've kissed a man. I wasn't even drunk - it was part of a truth-or-dare. So, yeah, not a good indicator.

Besides: Belkar has Craft Disturbing Mental Image. He may have used that (successfully, as it turned out) on V.

[drengnikrafe]

I find V to be female. If you ask me for legitimate backup reasons, I will be able to supply none. I came to this conclusion while I was reading V gender debates, back when there wasn't an official one, and got tired of them. I made this conclusion based, not upon logic or reason of any sort, but just because I wanted a definite conclusion in my head.
I also believe every person should reach their own conclusion, and not be swayed by such silly things as logic, or people telling them what to beleieve.

In regards to the "6 person party, only 1 female", there are many groups (or, at least, my group) in which it is a miracle to even get one girl. 2 girls in the same group is unheard of to the people I game with.

[Asta Kask]

I think V is a drone servant of the Queen Elf.

[TriForce]

I think V is a drone servant of the Queen Elf.

LIVE FOR THE SWARM!



sorry, couldnt resist

[Asta Kask]

I think we need to take the theory that elves are like bees or mole rats, with a hive structure, a drone worker caste and an Elven Queen. And V is a drone and as such has no gender.

It has about as much evidence as the other two theories.

[Zxo]

I am in the "no gender at all" camp. In a world where items like Girdle of F/M exist, someone unhappy or uncomfortable with their gender can just get one of these and put them on, and a wizard of V's level could easily afford one. V also isn't a chaotic or unsecure type who would object to being classified just because this may make them subject to stereotypes.

V does not act like someone who is male or female and is working hard to hide it or deny it. V acts like someone to whom the very notion of gender is foreign and hard to understand - there was a strip with V saying something like "I do not think I'm qualified to answer that question" when asked about something gender-related. I think V is part of a bigger group (as the existence of hir equally undefined mate shows) or even subrace of elves who do not have a gender as we understand it. This may be a genetic mutation, such cases exist in real world (remember that South African athlete), of course in real world this is rare, but in V's nation/subrace a particular combination of genes that makes you a hermaphrodite may have become widespread and a norm. Or, like Asta Kask said, a hive structure with one queen bearing children and drone couples adopting and raising them.

It'd be cool to see this society (or at least V explaining it) somewhere at the end of the story. Rich said he wouldn't reveal V's gender, but that would fall under "not revealing it"

[warrl]

In regards to the "6 person party, only 1 female", there are many groups (or, at least, my group) in which it is a miracle to even get one girl. 2 girls in the same group is unheard of to the people I game with.

In the group I play with, for the last year or so of the previous campaign we had three females.

Of course, that was out of twelve people (including DM).

Currently we have nine people, one female.

[Cisturn]

I think V is a girl, i just think it's better story writing if the wife were to leave the family and embark on an epic quest solely because I've seen the reverse x amount of time

[albis]

Hi everyone :)
Personally, I initially thought about V as a male because in one of the very first strips (the one when they found the girdle of femininity-masculinity, I think) Roy referred to him/her as "V-man"... but then, going forward, I saw that it was onlyRoy's guess on Vaarsuuvius gender, and the apparently male body shape doesn't really mean anything...
...I should know, people can't tell what gender I am half the time X°D
And I've started to find it incredibly amusing, so much so that I nowadays let people believe their first guess, whatever it is, is right... Not my fault they can't tell.
Back on topic, having initially though about V as a male, I automatically refer to Vaarsuvius as a "him", but that's just because "it" would be rather offensive, V could very well be a "she"...
I can only hope it will be revealed before the very end. XD You know, a dramatic last-episode revelation Elan would be so proud of... X°D
Until that, I think that -I can't remember who was it that said it- it's natural that, given V's ambiguity, people tend to identify him/her being of their same gender, so there'll never actually be an end to this debate.
It's kind of useless, since only the Giant knows the truth, but this kind of conversation raises interesting points about people's perception of genders and sexuality. =)

[onthetown]

i'm sure someone has posted all of these arguments, but...

FEMALE
- V is particularly friends with Haley. Haley tells her almost all her secrets; they sleep in the same room

...

V is not particularly attached to his/her children (barely wants to know if their wounds are lethal...) while Inkirius is.

-My best friend is male; I tell him all my secrets and when we have sleepovers we sleep in the same room, and (since this may come up) he is not gay or bi.

-I know plenty of fathers that are more attached to their children than their wives or their children's mothers, mine included.

Just thought I'd contribute that. I'm following the debate, I just have nothing to add to it except that without seeming incredibly closed-minded or one-sided.

Personally, though, I just find V to be a girl... simply because that's what I thought s/he was when I first started reading the comic. I didn't clue in to the ambiguous elf jokes until later on.

[AkazilliaDeNaro]

i was once told that v is a hallucination/optical illusion

but in a particularly magial point of view. v is the only one in the party that is elven and also magical so i do belive it to be entirely possible that v is either both neither or is able to switch genders.

okay i got 3 bottles of brain bleach use them wisely

[Petrocorus]

I read this thread and i am really astonished that so many people keep bringing the same arguments about V rooming with Haley.

The other choice is to room with FOUR peoples, including Durkon (a stinky Dwarf, since all Dwarves are stinky, In an Arrogant Elf's Opinion, plus, y'know, Drwarf!); Elan (an utterly moronic moron IAEO) and Belkar (who is, y'know, Belkar). So, rooming with Haley is surely the best choice for V in V's mind.

On Haley's part, the fact that she doesn't feel sexually threaten by V doesn't mean V is a woman or a gay man. Maybe it's because V's married, maybe because An Arrogant Elf like him would not be attracted to a ''lesser being'' like a human (IAEO), or maybe she just trust V on that matter.
And remember the panel 1 of strip #123, this is Haley who decide that V room with her. And in #225, V probably just can't stand to room with Miko.

And the fact that V is married and room with a girl seems no more and no less proper than if V would room with men, according to his own understanding of genders and sexual relationships.

It seems that a lot of people here really cannot understand that a straight man and a straight woman can room together without having a romantic relationship or a very serious reason.

And speaking of #123, the comic of the strip relieves on the misunderstanding by the eavesdroppers, who don't know V's gender. Whether it's funnier if V is a female or male is a matter of taste, so, not relevant for The Question. The funnier argument is also a matter of taste for The Unfortunate Event of the new year's eve.

[Stone Heart]

Oh, and one more thing - I've seen a lot of people reference #123 as proof that V is female, but I've always seen that as more implying that V is male - at least until you realize they're referring to gemstones. Then I suppose it is more implying that V's female. I mean seriously, though. V has a smaller set... lower down...

I don't see how someone could think that V (were s/he referring to a part of hir anatomy as misinterpreted by the boys) was referring to testicles instead of breasts, because the way its worded ("I'm surprised you don't have your own pair") seems to be implying "you should have boobs too, since I view you as a girl" (again from the misinterpretation viewpoint) not to mention I don't see why any guy would say he has his own pair if they were referring to breasts.

But again that comic doesn't actually imply anything either way it just implys that the guys were misinterpreting the conversation.