LGBTAI+ #58 Infinity 2.0: The Darth Arminius Apology Thread

[Florian]

Decided to modify my coming out letter a bit to make it more child-friendly and sent it to my nephew (he's 12, and currently visiting my parents, and I'll be seeing him on Thursday). Let's hope this goes as well as it did with my godfather!

Oi, you´re living in a major metropolitan area, heavy influence by the very liberal university towns and it´s ´17, the time we actually have open discussions about updating sexual education in schools.

So, prey tell, what do you actually fear?

[Lycunadari]

I live in rural Bavaria*. I don't know how liberal Berlin is, but I'm pretty sure it's not as backwards as Bavaria. I went to a Catholic cloister school until only a few years ago, and we didn't have even a hint of discussion about non-hetero orientations, let alone trans stuff. Gay is still very heavily used as a slur here. I don't know my nephew good enough to know if he's one of the kids who do so. He's just starting puberty, a time in which many kids think it's cool to be as offensive as possible. His mom is a radfem, and I wouldn't be surprised if she was a TERF.
So, you know, I think as a trans person I'm justified in being cautious. I'd rather be positively surprised than get hurt.

*my parents do, at least, I've actually moved to a semi big town a few years ago. But the point still stands.

[Florian]

I live in rural Bavaria*. I don't know how liberal Berlin is, but I'm pretty sure it's not as backwards as Bavaria. I went to a Catholic cloister school until only a few years ago, and we didn't have even a hint of discussion about non-hetero orientations, let alone trans stuff. Gay is still very heavily used as a slur here. I don't know my nephew good enough to know if he's one of the kids who do so. He's just starting puberty, a time in which many kids think it's cool to be as offensive as possible. His mom is a radfem, and I wouldn't be surprised if she was a TERF.
So, you know, I think as a trans person I'm justified in being cautious. I'd rather be positively surprised than get hurt.

*my parents do, at least, I've actually moved to a semi big town a few years ago. But the point still stands.

I was born and raised in the Dingolfing/Landau area of Lower Bavaria. Can´t get any more rural, conservative or arch-Catholic in our country. Went to Catholic Cloister school in Pullach to finish it.

I´m at least two decades your senior and I know about that stuff.

So please do not try to use that "poor oppressed stuff" on me. Kt was my generation that took up the fight and was met by nightsticks, therefore I´m not really sympathetic to mimimi.

[Shamash]

I was born and raised in the Dingolfing/Landau area of Lower Bavaria. Can´t get any more rural, conservative or arch-Catholic in our country. Went to Catholic Cloister school in Pullach to finish it.

I´m at least two decades your senior and I know about that stuff.

So please do not try to use that "poor oppressed stuff" on me. Kt was my generation that took up the fight and was met by nightsticks, therefore I´m not really sympathetic to mimimi.

That's kind of rude and not suportive at all.

Your fight does not invalidate anyone's suffering. It's like going "At my time we used to have both or legs cut off, you only got an eye and a hand? Pfff... Stop crying!".

[Siosilvar]

Hey, calm down friends. One person's struggle doesn't invalidate another's caution.

[Shamash]

[Florian]

That's kind of rude and not suportive at all.

Your fight does not invalidate anyone's suffering. It's like going "At my time we used to have both or legs cut off, you only got an eye and a hand? Pfff... Stop crying!".

Sometimes it is necessary to be rude.

Today we see people using "gay!" as a swear word and then going by a gay couple making out in public without flinching.

That should tell us that people might be stupid, bad not necessarily homophobe.

It´s not the 50s anymore and heck, even if angst and anxiety stayed the same, it also doesn´t help support that stance.

[Xihirli]

Trans women are being murdered, Florian. That's not just in rural areas.
Trans women are being murdered for existing.
People set trans women's cars on fire, terrorize them, and kill them.

We do not have to justify our fear to you for it to be real.

[Rain Dragon]

Decided to modify my coming out letter a bit to make it more child-friendly and sent it to my nephew (he's 12, and currently visiting my parents, and I'll be seeing him on Thursday). Let's hope this goes as well as it did with my godfather!

Hope things go well! =)

[ArlEammon]

Trans women are being murdered, Florian. That's not just in rural areas.
Trans women are being murdered for existing.
People set trans women's cars on fire, terrorize them, and kill them.

We do not have to justify our fear to you for it to be real.

Turning In Grave

[Asmodean_]

BuT SomeOne hAs It wOrSe! YOu'rE noT aLlOweD to hAve EmOtioNs uNleSs you'rE The One ouT of 7 bIlLiOn tHat Has iT ObjeCtiVelY thE WorSt!!!

[Astrella]

I was born and raised in the Dingolfing/Landau area of Lower Bavaria. Can´t get any more rural, conservative or arch-Catholic in our country. Went to Catholic Cloister school in Pullach to finish it.

I´m at least two decades your senior and I know about that stuff.

So please do not try to use that "poor oppressed stuff" on me. Kt was my generation that took up the fight and was met by nightsticks, therefore I´m not really sympathetic to mimimi.

Maybe you should watch the condescension a bit. And I'm pretty sure your generation didn't fight to then be jerks to the newer generation. And all Juniper was doing was sketching out hir situation. Like, no matter where you live coming out as LGBT+ still comes with risks and it's perfectly understandable to be scared.

[The_Snark]

Sometimes it is necessary to be rude.

Sometimes, but I'm not clear on why you think it's necessary here and now? Possibly you're trying to be encouraging by suggesting to Lycundari that it's likely their nephew will react well, but if that's the case you're doing a pretty poor job of it. Maybe it's something else. I honestly can't tell what you're trying to accomplish, here.

[Siosilvar]

It´s not the 50s anymore and heck, even if angst and anxiety stayed the same, it also doesn´t help support that stance.

TW: Descriptions of deaths
You're right, it's not the 50s. You don't have an excuse to be ignorant of what happens to trans folks the world round, and why some might fear coming out.

edit: Maybe you're trying the whole "tough love" thing to try to encourage them? You're supposed to encourage folks to overcome their fears with that tactic, though, not dismiss them. Something like "you're never pleasantly surprised if you never make an effort" or something like that would be significantly more appropriate in tone.

[Delusion]

I have met multiple people who came out as trans this decade and whose family members stopped talking to them because of it, so being nervous about coming out is not at all silly.

[WarKitty]

I was born and raised in the Dingolfing/Landau area of Lower Bavaria. Can´t get any more rural, conservative or arch-Catholic in our country. Went to Catholic Cloister school in Pullach to finish it.

I´m at least two decades your senior and I know about that stuff.

So please do not try to use that "poor oppressed stuff" on me. Kt was my generation that took up the fight and was met by nightsticks, therefore I´m not really sympathetic to mimimi.

Yeah, pretty much all you've managed here is to come across as being rude.

And guess what? Emotional crap hurts. Even if someone isn't at a physical risk, finding out your family doesn't want you as you are is really really hard. And that's definitely a thing that happens.

People get hurt. People get scared, and the fact that it might be worse happening to someone else doesn't f***ing matter.

[Trekkin]

I´m not really sympathetic to mimimi.

So maybe don't come brag about how you're too old to be supportive on a support thread?

[JusticeZero]

There is going to be a bathroom law on the ballot in my area soon, I can just imagine how it is going to feel to turn on the radio when it gets close to the local election time, and I am going to need a lot of hugs.

[WarKitty]

Aside from the obvious issues, what always bugged me about these bathroom bills is that they seem to assume trans people obviously look like trans people, and every cis person is obviously cis. When the reality is that many trans people do "pass", and there are cis people who resemble the opposite sex.

*hugs for JusticeZero*

[Lentrax]

The thing that always bothered me about the bathroom bills was how they plan to enforce them. i think it would be ridiculously expensive to put someone outside of every (but lets face it, it's just going to be outside the ladies) bathroom and checking IDs. There's my tax money, hard at work preventing me from being able to actually express myself according to my rights.

Oh, wait. I'll just use the agendered 'family' bathroom.

[WarKitty]

The thing that always bothered me about the bathroom bills was how they plan to enforce them. i think it would be ridiculously expensive to put someone outside of every (but lets face it, it's just going to be outside the ladies) bathroom and checking IDs. There's my tax money, hard at work preventing me from being able to actually express myself according to my rights.

Oh, wait. I'll just use the agendered 'family' bathroom.

At least if you're in the U.S., that wouldn't even work. For example, if you're in DC, changing the gender on your license is pretty easy - you just have to fill out a form that declares your new gender and swears that you aren't trying to defraud anyone. So someone could have a DC license that reads female and be expected to use the male bathroom in North Carolina.

[Serpentine]

That's something Australia is doing okay in, at least. Our dunnies aren't "legislated" because what? Why? I looked it up recently, and it's never been challenged in court, but it's generally accepted/assumed that trans people using whatever loo they're most comfortable with is covered by our anti-discrimination laws - i.e. they can pee wherever they damn like, because of course they bloody can.

[Sobol]

Sometimes it is necessary to be rude.

Glad I've never encountered such a situation in my whole life.

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Grown a bit more deltoids...

Spoiler: Today's photo

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[WarKitty]

Glad I've never encountered such a situation in my whole life.

I have, but it's always involved the other person being a pretty serious jerk first. It's what you escalate to when you've informed someone multiple times of inappropriate behavior.

[JNAProductions]

There is going to be a bathroom law on the ballot in my area soon, I can just imagine how it is going to feel to turn on the radio when it gets close to the local election time, and I am going to need a lot of hugs.

*Offers hugs and cookies*

Cookies make everything better!

In all seriousness, though, JZ, I really hope that the bill does NOT go into effect.

[John Cribati]

I've made two different photosets of PoC-inclusive Pride Flags on the Blue Hell Site and have yet to be involved in any kind of meaningful discourse over it. Not that I wanted to be at the center of some kind of tumblr discourse , but at the very least I expected to.

[Sobol]

Thanks to this forum, I've started to feel more confident with my English.

Please PM me when I make mistakes or just write grammatically correct but very awkward phrases.

(Articles are especially hard...)

[Florian]

Glad I've never encountered such a situation in my whole life.

You´re not living in a country that raised pessimism and romanticism to an art form (Bad combination, btw., helps turning the pervasive mood of filter bubbles inwards). The Sorrows of Young Werther is something that gets repeated on and on and people don´t notice it...

(Articles are especially hard...)

No worries. Pretty good english for a russian, had a hard time spotting some of the usual patterns inherent to the translation process.

[Lycunadari]

This isn't really lgbt related, I just need a place to talk about it–

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Today I found out that my best friend had a mental breakdown a few weeks ago, and I didn't know and I feel horrible because I wasn't there for her.

We had lost contact for 3 months, which wasn't that unusual, at first- we were both busy with university, and her internet connection was always really unstable so I didn't wonder why she didn't reply in skype the times I tried to contact her. I did start to worry a bit when she didn't answer the SMS I sent her for her birthday (in early July), and a week ago I sent her another SMS asking if she's okay, to which she also didn't reply, so then I was really worried. Two days ago she finally replied on skype with a very short message just apologising that her skype doesn't work right, nothing else. I still had a bad feeling about the whole thing, so I finally decided to send her a friend request on facebook (I usually use facebook exclusively for university related stuff, I can't stand facebook), and today we started talking over the facebook messenger. Turns out she had a mental breakdown and is still recovering, didn't use her computer during that time and still can't use her phone. She still has a hard time leaving the house and is waiting for a place at a mental health clinic. (I still don't know exactly what caused her breakdown, but the clinic she'll go to is specialised in treatment of OCD, so I guess it's related to that.)
I'm really glad we're finally talking again (even if that means I have to use facebook) and I'll visit her at home when my semester at uni is finished, and I'll also visit her at the clinic. But I feel really bad I didn't think to seriously try to get back in contact with her any sooner. I know that there wasn't really a way I could have contacted her short of like, showing up at her place asking where she's been, considering she didn't use her computer. But maybe I could have helped her, at least a bit, considering I have a ton of mental health issues myself. Maybe I could have helped her if I'd tried a bit more to stay in contact before all that happened, when we were just too busy to talk much, if I hadn't been too preoccupied with my own issues. She's my best friend! But what a crappy friend am I if I let myself drift apart from my best friend so much that I don't know when they are in a crisis? She could have died and I wouldn't have known! ...and here I am, making her struggles all about me. I just want to cry.

[Delusion]

This isn't really lgbt related, I just need a place to talk about it–

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Today I found out that my best friend had a mental breakdown a few weeks ago, and I didn't know and I feel horrible because I wasn't there for her.

We had lost contact for 3 months, which wasn't that unusual, at first- we were both busy with university, and her internet connection was always really unstable so I didn't wonder why she didn't reply in skype the times I tried to contact her. I did start to worry a bit when she didn't answer the SMS I sent her for her birthday (in early July), and a week ago I sent her another SMS asking if she's okay, to which she also didn't reply, so then I was really worried. Two days ago she finally replied on skype with a very short message just apologising that her skype doesn't work right, nothing else. I still had a bad feeling about the whole thing, so I finally decided to send her a friend request on facebook (I usually use facebook exclusively for university related stuff, I can't stand facebook), and today we started talking over the facebook messenger. Turns out she had a mental breakdown and is still recovering, didn't use her computer during that time and still can't use her phone. She still has a hard time leaving the house and is waiting for a place at a mental health clinic. (I still don't know exactly what caused her breakdown, but the clinic she'll go to is specialised in treatment of OCD, so I guess it's related to that.)
I'm really glad we're finally talking again (even if that means I have to use facebook) and I'll visit her at home when my semester at uni is finished, and I'll also visit her at the clinic. But I feel really bad I didn't think to seriously try to get back in contact with her any sooner. I know that there wasn't really a way I could have contacted her short of like, showing up at her place asking where she's been, considering she didn't use her computer. But maybe I could have helped her, at least a bit, considering I have a ton of mental health issues myself. Maybe I could have helped her if I'd tried a bit more to stay in contact before all that happened, when we were just too busy to talk much, if I hadn't been too preoccupied with my own issues. She's my best friend! But what a crappy friend am I if I let myself drift apart from my best friend so much that I don't know when they are in a crisis? She could have died and I wouldn't have known! ...and here I am, making her struggles all about me. I just want to cry.

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You didn't do anything wrong. You tried contacting her first through through two different means and eventually through a third one. Doesn't sound like a crappy friend to me. For all you could have known she might just have wanted some space. And now that you know what is going on you are planning on being there to help her. You sound like a great friend to me.