Schlock Mercenary VII: A T.A.D. Too Much Dialogue These Days

[TaRix]

They are similar to how Tagon was after he died and before he got a body built. I don't think we are supposed to know what going on yet.

It is probably similar, but couldn't be exactly the same, unless the backup system was timely enough to have one guy remember taking a missile to the face. Alive Tagon only remembers his kamikaze run from secondhand sources.

[eschmenk]

It is probably similar, but couldn't be exactly the same, unless the backup system was timely enough to have one guy remember taking a missile to the face. Alive Tagon only remembers his kamikaze run from secondhand sources.

Yes. Going by the latest page, though, I don't think the crew members from the Purse knew about shooting them, so their personalities were apparently captured earlier than the others, probably when they were still on the surface. I wouldn't be surprised if the Purse's crew members died somehow, then were resurrected under the entity's control, but I don't know either way.

I'm wondering about what I think are additional people standing in the background of the first panel there. Are they additional crew members from the two ships we know about, or possibly additional ships? Maybe different species? They look too large to be the same species given how far in the background they seem to be, but I don't know if that means anything. Oh, well, we'll hopefully find out soon enough.

[factotum]

I wouldn't be surprised if the Purse's crew members died somehow, then were resurrected under the entity's control, but I don't know either way.

I don't think it's necessary to introduce zombies under the entity's control here--it's easier to assume that it killed the Purse's crew and then took control of their ship directly like any other AI, surely?

[eschmenk]

I don't think it's necessary to introduce zombies under the entity's control here--it's easier to assume that it killed the Purse's crew and then took control of their ship directly like any other AI, surely?

We saw speech bubbles representing them talking to each other as they attacked the freighter. I doubt the AI was talking to itself. There was at least one question and answer, even.

ADDED: Link to support the above

Then on the latest page, which came out after the above was written, it is stated that it was Hazz's voice on the intercom. Although I don't doubt that Hazz's voice could be artificially duplicated, I assume it was probably generated by Hazz's body in this case, given the Q&A a mentioned before. (Looking back, there was less of a discussion than I thought I remembered, but still enough to establish that it seemed as if two different people were talking to each other.)

[factotum]

But if their bodies were under the control of the entity, that would still count as the entity talking to itself, which makes no sense as you point out. Yet it definitely wasn't the *real* Hazz and company aboard that ship because they would have had no reason to fire a missile at their mothership!

[geoduck]

But if their bodies were under the control of the entity, that would still count as the entity talking to itself, which makes no sense as you point out. Yet it definitely wasn't the *real* Hazz and company aboard that ship because they would have had no reason to fire a missile at their mothership!

You're jumping to the conclusion there's only one possessing entity involved here.

[factotum]

You're jumping to the conclusion there's only one possessing entity involved here.

That is quite true, and I suppose 4118-6 could be a container for multiple other entities. More information needed at this point to figure out what's going on, best hope Howard will be forthcoming with that--wouldn't be the first time he's left an interesting conundrum in the air without actually providing any answers.

[Grim Portent]

Perhaps the entity didn't actually possess them as such, just alter the minds in the bodies such that they would act the way they did while backing up the originals inside itself as a roundabout way to have not 'killed' them.

Hell, given that it's a giant super computer AI it's possible it made a copy, convinced the originals in meatspace that what it wanted them to do was necessary/good and they did it while still being the meat brain originals.

[eschmenk]

Perhaps the entity didn't actually possess them as such, just alter the minds in the bodies such that they would act the way they did while backing up the originals inside itself as a roundabout way to have not 'killed' them.

Yes, that is what I was thinking. It might have made just enough of a change to their brains for them to do what they did, or if they died first, it might have used their nannites to repair them, but with that minor change. It could be somewhat like what happened to the cops a few books ago, but with more finesse. (I have no idea why the entity kept the backup personalities, though. Maybe it was lonely or wanted to study them?)

I think they were a too cavalier about killing the crew of the freighter for me to like the idea that the entity simply convinced the original crew members that it was necessary, despite what Hazz said in the current strip. I'm discounting what Hazz said because I think it was just part of a joke. I guess I couldn't rule out the idea, though.

[Grim Portent]

The AIs we've seen before seem to value, if not life itself, the idea of life and free will. It's possible the entity kept copies so it could twist itself around some kind of moral imperative not to kill. Sort of a 'they aren't dead, I can rebuild them later and in the meanwhile they're in a suitable habitat simulation,' thing.

[The Glyphstone]

Tinfoil hat idea: The artifact was a repository for the minds of its builders like someone suggested. It copied out the minds of the current body's occupants and replaced them with the minds of some of its residents, letting them 'live again'.

[Grim Portent]

Tinfoil hat idea: The artifact was a repository for the minds of its builders like someone suggested. It copied out the minds of the current body's occupants and replaced them with the minds of some of its residents, letting them 'live again'.

I can't see them suiciding into a random moon immediately after being resurrected.

Though it just occurred to me that the fact the entity is a stellar enclosure was brought up in comic as part of what makes it impressive and scary, but the Gatekeepers had hundreds or thousands of stellar enclosures, which were presumably maintained by AI more than by the Gatekeepers themselves, so what makes this one so special? Is it that it's solely an AIs memory banks and cpu?

[halfeye]

I want to know what Petey thinks of all this.

[eschmenk]

I'm wondering about what I think are additional people standing in the background of the first panel there. Are they additional crew members from the two ships we know about, or possibly additional ships? Maybe different species? They look too large to be the same species given how far in the background they seem to be, but I don't know if that means anything. Oh, well, we'll hopefully find out soon enough.

Oh, BTW, I looked back at the old strips and noticed that the Purse had more than two crew members. Those could have been the additional crew members who didn't seem to earn a speaking role.

The AIs we've seen before seem to value, if not life itself, the idea of life and free will. It's possible the entity kept copies so it could twist itself around some kind of moral imperative not to kill. Sort of a 'they aren't dead, I can rebuild them later and in the meanwhile they're in a suitable habitat simulation,' thing.

Yes, maybe. BTW, we can't be certain that this is just a computer simulation. The nannites could have been used to build completely new bodies, as what happened to Kaff. I'm not sure how the trees would have been created, but maybe the AI could figure out how the trees would have worked and built them accordingly.

Though it just occurred to me that the fact the entity is a stellar enclosure was brought up in comic as part of what makes it impressive and scary, but the Gatekeepers had hundreds or thousands of stellar enclosures, which were presumably maintained by AI more than by the Gatekeepers themselves, so what makes this one so special? Is it that it's solely an AIs memory banks and cpu?

Yeah, I was wondering about that myself. Maybe it's just that it's not a gatekeeper one and so it seems to be different than anything anyone has found before. You could potentially learn things from it that not even the gatekeepers knew.

ADDED:

I can't see them suiciding into a random moon immediately after being resurrected.

Maybe they really hated their new fat lizard knuckle-dragging bodies? I wouldn't want to look like that.

Another thing is that the idea not very consistent with the current update's joke. That seems to hint that it really was a Hazz who did it.

[factotum]

Another thing is that the idea not very consistent with the current update's joke. That seems to hint that it really was a Hazz who did it.

If you were implanting some sort of controlling intelligence in someone then you'd want it to behave very similarly to the original--see Durkon/Durkula in the OotS strip for a perfect example. So, the suborned crew having behaved similarly to their previous selves isn't really indicative either way, to my mind.

[eschmenk]

Here is my tinfoil hat idea: The entity is a galactic probe that is collecting samples for the Zoojack system. The fat lizards (I forget the species name) in the recent strips may be physical copies that were created in a Zoojack preserve. I have no idea why the originals were killed off, rather than having their memories changed to, "The data we discovered just turned out to be worthless random garbage that's not worth pursuing," though. [ADDED: I guess it could be fishing for additional samples to collect, but that seems very tinfoil-hatish. And it would be a pretty bad screwup if it wound up collecting the Toughs. Who would want to preserve them? ]

If you were implanting some sort of controlling intelligence in someone then you'd want it to behave very similarly to the original--see Durkon/Durkula in the OotS strip for a perfect example. So, the suborned crew having behaved similarly to their previous selves isn't really indicative either way, to my mind.

Glyphstone's tinfoil hat idea wasn't about implanting a controlling intelligence in someone; it was about replacing their entire personality with another person's personality.

Even if you didn't realize that I was responding to Grim Portent's response to Glyphstone's tinfoilhat idea, I had already posted this:

Yes, that is what I was thinking. It might have made just enough of a change to their brains for them to do what they did, or if they died first, it might have used their nannites to repair them, but with that minor change. It could be somewhat like what happened to the cops a few books ago, but with more finesse. (I have no idea why the entity kept the backup personalities, though. Maybe it was lonely or wanted to study them?)

Why did your comment try to convince me of something that I said just a little earlier?

[smuchmuch]

But if their bodies were under the control of the entity, that would still count as the entity talking to itself, which makes no sense as you point out.!

Wouldn't it ?
The redhack gavs were all technicaly copies of Kowalski yet they communicated with each others. Simply ,because they ùmay be reprogrammed by a same central programing doesn't mean they become a hive mind.

[factotum]

Wouldn't it ?
The redhack gavs were all technicaly copies of Kowalski yet they communicated with each others. Simply ,because they ùmay be reprogrammed by a same central programing doesn't mean they become a hive mind.

Being a copy of Kowalski just gave them the same personality and reactions, it didn't actually have them all thinking the same thoughts at the same time. A group of sophont bodies under direct control of a single AI, which is what I thought Eschmenk was talking about, *would* perforce all be thinking the same thoughts at the same time--it's not the same situation.

[Kantaki]

New comic.

I think I like the new medic.
That method of treating injuries has style.
Bedside manners are good too.

[eschmenk]

New comic.

I think I like the new medic.
That method of treating injuries has style.
Bedside manners are good too.

Newer comic.

He/she/it is even creeping Kaff out. Granted, I think this Kaff seems a bit more sensitive so far than the old one did.

[Rockphed]

Newer comic.

He/she/it is even creeping Kaff out. Granted, I think this Kaff seems a bit more sensitive so far than the old one did.

I think Kaff is more disturbed by the Espie's lack of concern about what he is doing than he is disturbed by what is happening.

[hector212121]

I think it comes from being a mechanic. They're looking at the patients from a 'mechanical repair' perspective.

[guttering flame]

I think it comes from being a mechanic. They're looking at the patients from a 'mechanical repair' perspective.

Kind of like regular doctors just without the anesthetics and their sterile operating room.

[eschmenk]

I think it comes from being a mechanic. They're looking at the patients from a 'mechanical repair' perspective.

Yes, but there was also the idea in the last book that loosing limbs wasn't such a big deal for esspies.

Kind of like regular doctors just without the anesthetics and their sterile operating room.

Why do you say that? The esspie medic said that anesthetics were being used and I'm sure it's being sterile. (If it's not being sterile, somebody better stop it!)

I'm sure it's like Rockphed said: it's what the esspie is saying (it's apparent attitude)--not what it's doing--that's the issue. Granted, the emotional impact on the patient would be about the same.

[Douglas]

I'm somewhat concerned about whether the esspie medic knows that reattaching a severed limb isn't as simple for meat creatures as it is for esspies.

[tyckspoon]

I'm somewhat concerned about whether the esspie medic knows that reattaching a severed limb isn't as simple for meat creatures as it is for esspies.

Pretty sure she does; even if she thinks of it like an esspie repair, you still have to make sure all the wires and fluid channels (nerves and blood vessels) are properly reconnected and working. The blood nannies they're all carrying probably go a good way to helping with the fine fiddly stuff like that... and if it comes to it, many of the major characters have spent time in the handy magical regeneration tanks before. M'Conger will be fine, just kind of freaked out by his medic.

[factotum]

I'm somewhat concerned about whether the esspie medic knows that reattaching a severed limb isn't as simple for meat creatures as it is for esspies.

Judging by the current strip, she actually *can* rebuild meat in the same way her compatriots rebuild machines, which actually makes her a pretty awesome doctor...she just needs to work on the bedside manner a little.

[HandofShadows]

Yeah, just a LITTLE on beadside manner.

[The Glyphstone]

So Liz apparently has a full-time job as a caterer of both food and exposition.

[2xMachina]

Can someone explain the joke to me?
I don't get it.

What about the brain of a young mother?