Dragon Ball Super

[Quiver]

Man, Krillin is such a Good Guy.

I mean, he's basically the only Z Fighter who actually, actively contributes to making society better on a day to day basis. Sure, the rest of them chip in when the going get's rough, but the fact that Krillin works as a cop and actively helps people...

I'd say "it makes me like him," but I already liked the guy. But it makes him look even better as a character and a person.

[Lord Raziere]

Man, Krillin is such a Good Guy.

I mean, he's basically the only Z Fighter who actually, actively contributes to making society better on a day to day basis. Sure, the rest of them chip in when the going get's rough, but the fact that Krillin works as a cop and actively helps people...

I'd say "it makes me like him," but I already liked the guy. But it makes him look even better as a character and a person.

Hey, Gohan puts in work at a real job AND is a superhero on the side, don't forget him. and if DB Online is anything close to canon (because Toriyama WAS involved in writing the lore in a big way), Gohan is the one who will finally make ki into a science anyone can understand so that the Earth can be defended without the Z-Fighters.

But yeah, Krillin is one of the real superheroes here. The rest of the fighters are just existing in their own little fighting community.

[Quiver]

Hey, Gohan puts in work at a real job AND is a superhero on the side, don't forget him. and if DB Online is anything close to canon (because Toriyama WAS involved in writing the lore in a big way), Gohan is the one who will finally make ki into a science anyone can understand so that the Earth can be defended without the Z-Fighters.

But yeah, Krillin is one of the real superheroes here. The rest of the fighters are just existing in their own little fighting community.

Man, I forgot Dragonball Online was even a thing. Wasn't some of that continuity adapted for the Xenoverse games? Never played them either...

Anyway, honestly, the latest episode stood out for me in a big way. It might not have been much, but the fact that thre's no flying in the Tournament of Power looks like it could be fun. It almost seems like a throw-back to old school Dragonball, when technique mattered more than Techniques.

... I mean, I know we'll still get flashy techniques and lazer beams, but still. Hoping that the fact that characters can't just fly around means we'll get some cool fight choreography.

[Rater202]

The Time Patrol, the Majin Race, the Supreme Kai of Time, Mira, and Towa were all adapting from Online to Xenoverse.

Incidentally, there are some hints that we might be heading for the Online Timeline: Online Timeline Pan was a badass and Mr. Satan's heir--she took over the Satan style Dojo and all of his other martial arts crap. In Super, Pan is the most badass baby around and Mr. Satan mentions wanting her to be his heir.

Master Roshi is still alive and kicking in Age 1000. Master Roshi claims that Goku and Krillin brought him enough paradise grass to keep him alive and healthy for centuries.

Kid Trunks seems a bit obsessed with swords. In Online, Trunks and Goten started a school of martial arts that combined ki control with swordsmanship.

Krillin rediscovering his fighting spirit... he did take over as the Turtle Hermit and create a new version of Turtle Style martial arts, o that could lead into it...

If Tien shows up and mentions that he's working on techniques that let him gather and focus epic amounts of power, then I'd say Online is confirmed, since that's what the New Crane School was about and Tien had that revelation "After Goku defeated Buu."

[Anteros]

Well, if the last episode was unusually good, this one was bad enough to bring down the average again.

I guess if you're really interested in seeing some of the other universes in Super it might be interesting. I just really have no patience for the Power Rangers stand-ins. It was an annoying character type and out of place for the show when the Ginyu force did it...but at least those characters were unique for the show. Rehashing it with Jaco, and now AGAIN is just too much. It's time for a new idea Toriyama.

[Rater202]

Well, if the last episode was unusually good, this one was bad enough to bring down the average again.

I guess if you're really interested in seeing some of the other universes in Super it might be interesting. I just really have no patience for the Power Rangers stand-ins. It was an annoying character type and out of place for the show when the Ginyu force did it...but at least those characters were unique for the show. Rehashing it with Jaco, and now AGAIN is just too much. It's time for a new idea Toriyama.

Being fans of Super Sentai and similar works is one of the few things Toriyama has in common with his son, and watching the show together is one of the few ways they could bond. Becuase of this, Toriyama has a major softspot for the sentai genre and tokusatsu in general and that's why he keeps including stuff like it.

A lot of the stuff Toriyama does, if it's not a poop joke, something perverted, or something inolving giant hair or shortcuts, has sentimental reasons or i otherwise based on his life expriances

Korrin, the earthly god who lives atop his self-named tower and one of Goku's first truly mystical mentors is based on a pet cat Toriyama had at the time.

Likewise Beerus is based on another one of Toriyama's pet cats--in this case, a cat that got really sick almost died, then miraculously recovered with the vet joking that the cat must have been a god or demon.

[Anteros]

Being fans of Super Sentai and similar works is one of the few things Toriyama has in common with his son, and watching the show together is one of the few ways they could bond. Becuase of this, Toriyama has a major softspot for the sentai genre and tokusatsu in general and that's why he keeps including stuff like it.

A lot of the stuff Toriyama does, if it's not a poop joke, something perverted, or something inolving giant hair or shortcuts, has sentimental reasons or i otherwise based on his life expriances

Korrin, the earthly god who lives atop his self-named tower and one of Goku's first truly mystical mentors is based on a pet cat Toriyama had at the time.

Likewise Beerus is based on another one of Toriyama's pet cats--in this case, a cat that got really sick almost died, then miraculously recovered with the vet joking that the cat must have been a god or demon.

I mean...that's nice and all but it still doesn't make it any less terrible to watch. Or the character design any less lazy.

I can understand why he does it, it's just lazy and bad. (personal opinion)

I'm willing to forgive it since it's Dragon Ball, but if it was any show I hadn't invested 20+ years of nostalgia into I would have probably given up on it by now.

[Rater202]

I mean...that's nice and all but it still doesn't make it any less terrible to watch. Or the character design any less lazy.

I can understand why he does it, it's just lazy and bad.

Think of it like this: Is Toriyama is allowed to do things he likes, then he has more motivation to try to do a good job on the stuff that other people like. Instead of half-assing it. Half of the problems with the Buu saga were becuase he was tired of doing Dragon Ball and just didn't give a damn so he made fun of himself.

Would you rather have arcs with at least one good thing and occasional bits of Toriyama indulging himself, or would you rather have him phone it in and get something of a lower average quality as a result of him being bored with it?

[Callos_DeTerran]

I can understand why he does it, it's just lazy and bad. (personal opinion)

I disagree with you there, but that's also personal opinion. I greatly enjoy the sentai stuff and honestly felt like Toriyama didn't do enough with the evil sentai team stuff when the Ginyu Force was around (and the Ginyus were awesome)!

So to see it come back with the Pride Troopers and still in an antagonistic bent but on the other side appeals to me quite a bit. Plus, at its core, it means we are essentially getting superheroes getting ready to fight the Z-Fighters and that gives me all sorts of tingles.

So for me, this episode is pretty great on seeing the other Universe (particularly Universe 11) stuff but also seeing the other fighters taking it all seriously, including Buu, though admittedly for Buu-reasons. I hope all these reminders that Goku is taking everything so casually does result in a change though, cause its been something that has been brought up quite a bit and for quite a bit now. And it really seems like Goku might end up getting a loss in the Tournament of Power because of it. Not Universe Seven as a whole, but Goku specifically.

[Anteros]

Would you rather have arcs with at least one good thing and occasional bits of Toriyama indulging himself, or would you rather have him phone it in and get something of a lower average quality as a result of him being bored with it?

I mean, in my opinion we're not getting either thing. Battle of the Gods and Return of Freeza were almost universally disliked. The Trunks arc was good, but the ending of it was the worst thing I've ever seen and completely negated/subverted any type of character growth Trunks ever had. Now we have this arc, which is making a huge portion of the fan base actually dislike Goku (quite an accomplishment) and the main thing we have to look forward to is Goku fighting a power ranger, which is not something a lot of people are gonna get excited about. Aside from a few individual filler episodes the entire series has been mediocre to bad for me. I'm watching purely out of nostalgia.

Now, I understand a lot of this is subjective and other people may enjoy these things a lot more than I or other people like me did. That's fine. I'm just saying that in my opinion it has not been good.

I do enjoy that they are giving some side characters the spotlight and making them relevant again, but that alone isn't enough to carry the show for me.

[Delicious Taffy]

Power Ranger is a proper noun and should therefore be capitalised. That said, the Pride Troopers don't quite fit the usual mold for a Super Sentai team, particularly with their identical uniforms. If anything, they're more like a mix between a Sentai and the X-Men, which is definitely not bad by any definition I recognise. Now, a REAL Sentai team, I would actually pay money to see fighting Goku.

[Anteros]

Power Ranger is a proper noun and should therefore be capitalised. That said, the Pride Troopers don't quite fit the usual mold for a Super Sentai team, particularly with their identical uniforms. If anything, they're more like a mix between a Sentai and the X-Men, which is definitely not bad by any definition I recognise. Now, a REAL Sentai team, I would actually pay money to see fighting Goku.

I'm gonna go ahead and not bother capitalizing power rangers. Thanks though.

[Delicious Taffy]

I'm gonna go ahead and not bother capitalizing power rangers. Thanks though.

Somehow, I get the feeling you have some sort of disdain or animosity toward Power Rangers, but I couldn't tell you why.



So, is Dyspo a rabbit-alien or one of Beerus's race? He looks like the latter, but his teeth and association with speed bring rabbits to mind. So far, he seems like one of the more interesting Pride Troopers, if only because of his design. The cyborg dude seems like some kind of reference, but to what, I don't know. Toppo is alright, but those head-veins are just a little too creepy for my taste. Jiren feels like the laziest character design in a while, but his personality might make up for that. Still, their collective gimmick is an entertaining one overall, so a few nitpicks about the individual members isn't too much.

[Anteros]

Somehow, I get the feeling you have some sort of disdain or animosity toward Power Rangers, but I couldn't tell you why.



So, is Dyspo a rabbit-alien or one of Beerus's race? He looks like the latter, but his teeth and association with speed bring rabbits to mind. So far, he seems like one of the more interesting Pride Troopers, if only because of his design. The cyborg dude seems like some kind of reference, but to what, I don't know. Toppo is alright, but those head-veins are just a little too creepy for my taste. Jiren feels like the laziest character design in a while, but his personality might make up for that. Still, their collective gimmick is an entertaining one overall, so a few nitpicks about the individual members isn't too much.

I grew up watching them and like them well enough, I just feel like the character type is really overused in Dragonball and doesn't really mesh well with the normal tone. Especially since it's so overused. Toriyama likes to use silly character types to lighten the mood and ease tension, but when there's 10 different characters in the series that act this way it's too much for me.

I think rabbit guy is definitely the same race as Beerus. They look far too similar for it to be a coincidence.

[Kato]

I think rabbit guy is definitely the same race as Beerus. They look far too similar for it to be a coincidence.

I'd agree but it seems somewhat unlikely.. We don't even know if you can assign a race to destruction gods, let alone if there are mortal variations..
Until we know more I'll blame lazy design.

[Rater202]

Considering that Goku and Vegeta have both been commented on as potential replacement gods of destruction if something happened to Beerus(Whis even flat out said he'd initially only train Vegeta if he agreed to become a God of Destruction), and that unlike the Kaioshin who are all confirmed to come from a specific race, gods of destruction do not have a uniform apperance(With Beerus and Champa as siblings being the odd ones out), I think it's safe to assume that at least some of the Gods of Destruction were once mortals.

[Skitterbug]

So I saw some images from a latest episode I think...

Spoiler

Show

Did Buu lose a bunch of weight?

[Anteros]

Considering that Goku and Vegeta have both been commented on as potential replacement gods of destruction if something happened to Beerus(Whis even flat out said he'd initially only train Vegeta if he agreed to become a God of Destruction), and that unlike the Kaioshin who are all confirmed to come from a specific race, gods of destruction do not have a uniform apperance(With Beerus and Champa as siblings being the odd ones out), I think it's safe to assume that at least some of the Gods of Destruction were once mortals.

That turned out to be a translation error. Whis was actually saying he wouldn't train anyone that wasn't a GoD. He wasn't offering him the job.

I think Toppo is in training for the position though, right? So there's still evidence a mortal can do it.

So I saw some images from a latest episode I think...

Spoiler

Show

Did Buu lose a bunch of weight?

He did, but he's Buu so who knows if it will stick.

[Callos_DeTerran]

I think Toppo is in training for the position though, right? So there's still evidence a mortal can do it.

I thought Toppo was offered the position and turned it down, or was that another mistranslation? Either way, the point stands that being a God of Destruction is a title that is passed to others and not an inherited position by a specific race.

[Anteros]

I thought Toppo was offered the position and turned it down, or was that another mistranslation? Either way, the point stands that being a God of Destruction is a title that is passed to others and not an inherited position by a specific race.

You're probably right. I just remembered he was mentioned as potential candidate somehow. I didn't remember all the details.

[Kato]

So, assuming it was an inherited title, how would two brothers become gods in different universes? Seems like quite a strange way to do things.. Also, does it mean when you become God, you get the appropriate powers or do you need to be a mortal who randomly is waaaaay stronger than everyone else to get offered the job?

[Lord Raziere]

So, assuming it was an inherited title, how would two brothers become gods in different universes? Seems like quite a strange way to do things.. Also, does it mean when you become God, you get the appropriate powers or do you need to be a mortal who randomly is waaaaay stronger than everyone else to get offered the job?

Not even we know how the brother thing works man. Makes no sense, and no one has explained how its possible yet.
and since its Toriyama, we might not ever get a sensible explanation. He might forget, he might state the nonsensical answer in some obscure interview, he might surprise us all and give an episode of how Beerus and Champa became Gods of Destruction as an important flashback to parallel Goku and Vegeta taking their place or something.

From what Whis implies, you need to train to get that strong like everyone else. No shortcuts. But Beerus does seem to have that poke-destroy power that doesn't seem to be an actual combat move or technique but a divine command over reality. Could be that all Destruction Gods get the poke-destroy ability but they need to be great fighters as well to prove a willingness and ability to destroy a lot of things without it. It is the single position as the almighty God of Destruction over your entire Universe after all, got to have high standards of recruitment for something so prestigious. That and the fact that the Destruction Gods are actually the people who are supposed to destroy the bad parts of reality, so they are kind of the protectors of the Universe as well when the Kais aren't enough, so they have to be strong. Its a title and position to make sure that anyone with enough strength and hard work can achieve, because that strength could come from anyone and anywhere.

[Anteros]

If I had to wager a guess, I'd say that once you pass a certain threshold of power you become a candidate for recruitment and they train you from there. It makes a little sense for a set of brothers to make it if they're genetic freaks who trained and fought together.

[Lemmy]

I'm willing to forgive it since it's Dragon Ball, but if it was any show I hadn't invested 20+ years of nostalgia into I would have probably given up on it by now.

Isn't that pretty much the whole show, though?

[Prime32]

So, assuming it was an inherited title, how would two brothers become gods in different universes? Seems like quite a strange way to do things.

Whenever Beerus has something, Champa wants it. How exactly do you think he'd react when he learned that Beerus was promoted to godhood?

They can't both be GoDs of the same universe, and the only other character who looks like a member of their species is from universe 11 anyway.

[Rater202]

They can't both be GoDs of the same universe, and the only other character who looks like a member of their species is from universe 11 anyway.

They have tails and that guy doesn't.

[Lord Raziere]

Whenever Beerus has something, Champa wants it. How exactly do you think he'd react when he learned that Beerus was promoted to godhood?

They can't both be GoDs of the same universe, and the only other character who looks like a member of their species is from universe 11 anyway.

Which explains a lot:
Beerus is the Goku to Champa's Vegeta.

Both Vegeta and Champa are motivated by jealousy towards Goku/Beerus respectively, and despite all their talk about strength they actually have reasons to not be EXACTLY as strong as the person they're jealous of. Champa even has desiring food as a character but not as defining as Beeruses love for it. Both are in eternal competition, but while Goku doesn't really care about Vegeta as a rival unto himself and is just seeking any fight where it comes, Beerus seems to be worried about always one upping his brother in anything he does, or at least can't stand losing to Champa. You can see who is the older brother here.

And if people are curious as to how U-11 can come before U6 and 7, U11 is a counterpart to U2, because they add to 13. U1 and U12 had to be the first universes since they're counterparts and had to add up to thirteen, then U2 and U11, U3 and U10 and so on until the sixth Universe came into being and brought with it the seventh.

Which might actually mean that Six and Seven might be the latest universes to come into being, and Beerus and Champa, the youngest Destruction Gods.

@ Rater: So? Dispo's wearing a suit, it could be hidden. Or Toriyama forgot to draw it, he forgot them on Trunks and Goten. or Dispo's tail is just cut off like the saiyans. I mean he is a superhero who fights bad guys, you'll probably accumulate an injury or two doing that.

[Delicious Taffy]

They have tails and that guy doesn't.

Dyspo lost his tail during his childhood, in an incident involving a tournament, a moon, and unruly behavior.

[Lord Raziere]

Dyspo lost his tail during his childhood, in an incident involving a tournament, a moon, and unruly behavior.

but not before all his companions lost to Toppo. and even then, Toppo won the fight against Dyspo.

[Xihirli]

So apparently 17 surpassed the gods while no one was looking.
And he's really into protecting wildlife, unless he's asked to protect what is actually ALL the wildlife.