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2017-11-20, 04:11 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Hearthstone 20: What is your Quest?
So, question for people. I'm playing Arena paladin vs. paladin, and played Stonehill Defender on turn 3. Got a choice between Tyrion and Lich King, and had no other context at that point (my opponent had not played anything but hero power). Which one would you take?
I ended up going with Tyrion, as I think in Arena against a character with no ping hero power, the divine shield adds a lot of value, but it could have gone either way.
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2017-11-20, 04:55 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Hearthstone 20: What is your Quest?
Some new KaC cards have been revealed!
Biggest news, rouge has secrets now. Finally, it was so silly that paladin has secrets and rouge didn't...
2 mana secrets, and the two revealed don't seem too impressive, but they exist, and extend the secret pool by far.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2vxgSLekszI
Gribbler seems funny, but isn't actually good.
Sudden Betrayal is...decent?
Cheat death might be bonkers.
Duskbreaker might spell the return of dragon priest. just too powerful of a four drop for dragon priest.
Runespear is silly. its a joke card, and every set needs a few.
Branching Paths seems good. no "choice" is cost-effective, but the sheer flexibility makes it probably worth.
Level Up, trash card to keep the silver hand dream going I guess.
Mithril Spellstone is pretty good.
Kathrena is awesome for control hunter. might be the finisher it needs in a deck that runs only very few very powerful beasts.
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2017-11-20, 05:38 PM (ISO 8601)
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Last edited by Gandariel; 2017-11-20 at 05:39 PM.
Originally Posted by actual quote from this forum
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2017-11-20, 06:31 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Hearthstone 20: What is your Quest?
If Recruit could pull from your hand as well as your deck it would be a lot more viable; You wouldn't have to worry about drawing your Chompy before Kathrena comes online.
I wonder if there will be "Recruit a Dragon" for Priest?Plague Doctor by Crimmy
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2017-11-20, 06:53 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Hearthstone 20: What is your Quest?
That's intriguing. It does pretty much lock them into adding a minimum of two or three more Rogue secrets in this set, though, just to make sure there's enough that you can actually plausibly be unsure what they might be. And if they don't decide to add some means of rotating cards from expansions into the Classic set, well, it'll be interesting to see how that goes from here - whether we see more Rogue secrets in the future at all, and if so how many. If they want it to be a consistent thing, they either need a core set of secrets that are always in standard or to regularly add several when the biggest batch rotate out.
Anyway, specifics:
Feral Giberer: Joke card, obviously.
Sudden Betrayal: Eh, probably not good. While arguably a better Misdirection, it seems to compare poorly to Explosive Trap in my mind, and even that has come and gone from viability.
Cheat Death: Getaway Kodo+. More possibly viable than Sudden Betrayal, but I'm still iffy on it. Getaway Kodo itself doesn't see actual play, it just gets pulled from Hydrologist. Is one that costs 1 more mana but gives a discount of 2 on the card it returns that much better than the original? Maybe, maybe not. We'll see.
Duskbreaker: Hurray, a good card for Dragon Priest! I hope we get another card or two in this vein this set, I'd like to dust that deck off one more time before Drakonid Operative and Netherspite Historian leave standard.
Branching Paths: ...eh... I dunno. It's overpriced for anything you make it do, but flexible... but dang the cost to effect ratio just doesn't look good whatever you make it do. Hard to judge, I feel.
Level Up: So, a worse replacement for Quartermaster. Hm, well, Lost in the Jungle is a thing... but it's the only thing this really goes with at the moment. Well, Stand Against Darkness, but that's too expensive. Could be good if we get another card in the vein of LitJ or Muster, but without that, probably bad.
(Lesser) Mithril Spellstone: Seems strong. Equipping weapons is something a Control Warrior (which is obviously what wants this) wants to do anyway, and even upgrading it once makes it good. Getting both upgrades is amazing, and not actually hard. If Control Warrior becomes a thing again (and boy do I hope it does), I expect to see this in it.
Kathrena Winterwisp: Oh god, the Highmanes! Ugh, this could bring Midrange Hunter back alright...
The Runespear: ...well, that's value? Kinda? If only you could rely on it doing something useful... yeah, doesn't look good, sad to say. I feel like they're deliberately gipping Shaman these past few sets because they were such a major player in the last Standard rotation.Toph Pony avatar by Dirtytabs. Thanks!
"When I was ten, I read fairy tales in secret and would have been ashamed if I had been found doing so. Now that I am fifty, I read them openly. When I became a man, I put away childish things, including the fear of childishness and the desire to be very grown up." -C.S. Lewis
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2017-11-20, 07:32 PM (ISO 8601)
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Plague Doctor by Crimmy
Ext. Sig (Handbooks/Creations)
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2017-11-20, 08:40 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Hearthstone 20: What is your Quest?
Hm, true, but Vinecleaver hasn't really ever made much of a mark on constructed, thanks to how slow it is. It would be one of the best possible cards for setting up Level Up though, since once it's out you can swing it for more guys at no additional mana cost. Combined with Lost in the Jungle, I could see that bearing experimentation, at the least, yeah.
It still feels like the deck really wants another card that summons Recruits though, since Lost in the Jungle will often want to be played earlier than Level Up, and Vinecleaver only gets you two guys to buff guaranteed, which isn't fantastic on its own. Three with hero power I guess, but that's then 7 mana for three 3/3 taunts...
Eh, well, let's see what the rest of the set brings to go with it. I do find it a bit hard to imagine they're printing Level Up without adding anything else for it to combo with.Toph Pony avatar by Dirtytabs. Thanks!
"When I was ten, I read fairy tales in secret and would have been ashamed if I had been found doing so. Now that I am fifty, I read them openly. When I became a man, I put away childish things, including the fear of childishness and the desire to be very grown up." -C.S. Lewis
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2017-11-20, 10:12 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Hearthstone 20: What is your Quest?
Theres also that guy who adds three recruits to your hand on deathrattle.
NOW COMPLETE: Let's Play Starcraft II Trilogy:
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2017-11-20, 10:56 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Hearthstone 20: What is your Quest?
Toph Pony avatar by Dirtytabs. Thanks!
"When I was ten, I read fairy tales in secret and would have been ashamed if I had been found doing so. Now that I am fifty, I read them openly. When I became a man, I put away childish things, including the fear of childishness and the desire to be very grown up." -C.S. Lewis
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2017-11-20, 11:11 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Hearthstone 20: What is your Quest?
I used to do LP's. Currently archived here:
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2017-11-20, 11:13 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Hearthstone 20: What is your Quest?
Last edited by AmberVael; 2017-11-20 at 11:14 PM.
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2017-11-20, 11:50 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Hearthstone 20: What is your Quest?
They verified on reddit there will be a total of 3 rogue secrets in this set. No current plans for any being added to classic, though that may change.
Anyway, I'm going to take my first shot at judging new cards
Feral Giberer: Agree with the consensus on this one. It's hot garbage. The sprite is cute though. It's the snowflipper penguin of the set. If it were a beast, or had one more health it would have potential.
Sudden Betrayal: This will depend heavily on the last trap rogue gets and how hard it is to play around. I'm leaning poor on this one, but may revise after we see the third trap.
Cheat Death: This I see as actually being really good. Many of rogue's best minions have powerful battlecries you'd love to get off again, and anything that gives extra cards at a discount is almost certain to find a home in a miracle deck. It may be too slow for Keleseth rogue, but if we don't see at least one deck pick this up I will be shocked.
Duskbreaker: Dragon Priest's biggest weakness has traditionally been it has a hard time coming back if it gets out tempo'd. This is a huge swing, basically Excavated Evil, then pay an extra mana to summon a 3/3. Dragon Priest is still sticking around as a lower tier deck, this looks like it has a chance to jump that up a tier.
Branching Paths: The flexibility makes this card amazing. Yes you can accomplish similar effects for 1 mana less (good comparisons are Shield Block and Arcane Intellect), but that's a fair trade for being able to choose on the fly what you want. I fully expect it to be a 1-of in most decks.
Level Up: This seems a bit too expensive. Dude Paladin is super strong in Wild, so I expect it will find a home there... I am not sold on it making the archetype viable in Standard.
(Lesser) Mithril Spellstone: I actually don't like this one at all. Maybe I am just thinking too much about the priest match up, but this curves right into Anduin and gets wiped by Dragonfire Potion. Also since the nerf of War Axe, Warrior's only actually viable weapon is Blood Razor. There may be a tempo warrior in there somewhere, and I've seen some speculation of Dead Man's Hand Warrior running it as a win condition... but I am just not seeing it. I am anticipating it to be dust.
Kathrena Winterwisp: This one will only work if Hunter can find a solid early game package to keep them alive until they can pull their big beasts. Yes you can get some 6-10 mana beasts and make this a huge finisher... but that is a ton of build around. We either need some new non-beast early game minions for hunter, or Hunter needs to find a way to get by on neutral minions plus spells until being able to (hopefully) toss this on curve. That being said... Stitched Tracker, Cloaked Huntress and Putricide are both not beasts, and Tracker getting you either extra Kathrena's or extra big minions (depending on how the deck ends up being constructed), could be real power. Maybe this could finally make the Secret Infinite Value hunter I wanted in KoFT to work? I am not holding my breath, but I am keeping an eye open.
The Runespear: I just took a look at Shaman's spells, and the split is actually fairly even between spells you don't mind random targets on and spells that random targetting can screw you. After all attack for 3 damage and then lightning storm the enemy board? That's really good. Or blood lust your minions? Or Evolve? Or devolve the enemy board? Spirit Echo your own board? These are all great. The worst effects are things like Lighting Bolt, Lava Blast, Jade Lightning, that can hit something on your side of the board and cause problems. Overall I am leaning towards it being potentially playable, but the cost is honestly really high, so unless a Control Shaman archetype pops up, I don't expect it to see play. Definitely doesn't fit into the current Evolve Shaman archetype that is the only real deck we've seen in the last two expansions from them.If my text is blue, I'm being sarcastic.But you already knew that, right?
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2017-11-20, 11:55 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Hearthstone 20: What is your Quest?
Last edited by Gandariel; 2017-11-20 at 11:55 PM.
Originally Posted by actual quote from this forum
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2017-11-21, 12:32 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Hearthstone 20: What is your Quest?
Does Recruit pull the actual minion out of your deck, or does it summon a copy of one?
NOW COMPLETE: Let's Play Starcraft II Trilogy:
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2017-11-21, 12:39 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Hearthstone 20: What is your Quest?
Agreed with Seerow. I don't think Mithril Runestone lines up well against the current meta decks (it gets absolutely dumpstered by Priest, feels too slow against anything else).
Duskbreaker looks bananas (it's excavated evil, 1 mana cheaper, with a body).
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2017-11-21, 12:53 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Hearthstone 20: What is your Quest?
It partially would have depended on your own deck: if you think you'll be able to go face enough to get within range of closing it out with Ashbringer, Tirion is the obvious choice because Paladin doesn't have a lot of tools to deal with a 5/3 weapon outside of neutral cards. Otherwise, if you think that you'd need the advantage of a big 8/8 and the extremely swingy nature of the Death Knight spells (and the chance of Frostmourne), then TLK is stronger.
Recruit Paladin is a dominant deck in Wild. It'll probably see use there at the very least as a budget alternative to Quartermaster, if not as a one-of to function as basically a third QM.
It's a 3-shot Tortollan Primalist attached to a weapon instead of a 5/4 body. It's slow and somewhat less reliable than, say, Medivh's Atiesh, but Shaman has a number of fairly powerful multi-target spells to Discover. The unique issue with this card being in Shaman specifically is that the card's true cost is fairly variable due to Overload being part of the spells' effects. If the Runespear was instead more-attractively priced at 6, it would maybe be a key piece in a midrange Shaman deck.
Pulls like Y'shaarj, from what I remember from the Blizzcon presentation.Last edited by Mando Knight; 2017-11-21 at 12:55 AM.
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2017-11-21, 01:58 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Hearthstone 20: What is your Quest?
So, unrelated.
Warlock and priest are my two most played classes, and a zoo-type Priest deck just popped out, so I wanted to try it.
AAECAa0GBqQD+wWlCYW4AsLOAqvQAgz4AuUE0QryDPC7AtHBAt jBAqvCAuTCAsrLAs7MAqbOAgA=
This is the "official" list.
I've added a Humongous Razorleaf and Nat Pagle and removed one Golakka and the Meat Wagon, to form my newest "Breakfast at Pagle's".
This is because Razorleaf is good, I've always wanted to fit Pagle somewhere (and he does! It's surprisingly good), I don't see many pirates, and I refuse to craft Meat Wagon.
I'm also considering other changes (not super convinced by Barnes).
Anyways, fun deck, I suggest giving it a try.Last edited by Gandariel; 2017-11-21 at 08:54 AM.
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2017-11-21, 05:39 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Hearthstone 20: What is your Quest?
Pulls from deck, without battlecries: https://hearthstone.gamepedia.com/Recruit Qualifies as "summon" but not as "played". Think Deathlord's effect for the enemy.
Last edited by Spore; 2017-11-21 at 05:40 AM.
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2017-11-21, 10:52 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Hearthstone 20: What is your Quest?
Druid weapon is basically Kun but with whatever you want.
If weapon distruction is not in the meta, it's pretty amazing. Best combo is probably with Medivh.Originally Posted by actual quote from this forum
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2017-11-21, 11:17 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Hearthstone 20: What is your Quest?
Cheat death seems tailor made to bring back Miracle rogue by playing Auctioneer->Cheat death. Maybe they'll finally Hall of Fame Auctioneer though now that Rogue has another viable deck.
Also a note for Branching paths is that the +2 attack is permanent not temporary like Savage roar. I think it'll see play in token druid.
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2017-11-21, 11:38 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Hearthstone 20: What is your Quest?
I don't think its like kun...it so so much more...
It does not refresh, it gives.
You want to use it to chew through your attacks ASAP to ramp up to 10 crystals.
Problem is, its completely unreliable to get it until turn 4, and so far druid has no way to force getting it (unlike warrior, who would make this broken)
It does raise the value of molten blade dramathically by the fact it MIGHT become this, then get eaten by another weapon to quickly trigger the ramp.
However...the way this interacts with Medivh and ultimate infestation...this is just dirty...
Good odds of another round of druid roflstomping everyone :\
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2017-11-21, 12:55 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Hearthstone 20: What is your Quest?
Can combo it in Wild with Blingtron. Seems like a good combo piece for Aviana/Kun/Malygos in wild, except that you can play it earlier and if someone destroys it you at least get the benefit of ramping to 10.
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2017-11-21, 06:49 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Hearthstone 20: What is your Quest?
*googles this Druid weapon since nobody bothered to link/explain it*
Twig of the World Tree: 4 mana 1/5 weapon, deathrattle: Gain 10 Mana.
Eh, yeah, not feeling this one. 5 turns to get to its actual use is a long, long time, and it doesn't do much until then. If Druid were a weapon class it would be one thing, since just equipping a new weapon would destroy it, but it's not. Their only option there is Medihv - which, granted, is a good one to combine this with, but only until the next set since Medihv will rotate out then. And even then, does it make that big of a difference over what Medihv can already do? I mean, it might prove necessary to use Medihv at all I guess, if weapon destruction becomes common, but that doesn't strike me as a ringing endorsement of it so much as a warning that Medihv's effectiveness might drop. Plus, it's a two-card, very late-game combo where you can only run one copy of each, and one is much less good without the other. I'm thinking this one's probably going in the dust heap.
Also, Trump's card reveal:
Zola the Gorgon: Neutral Legendary, 3 mana 2/2, battlecry: Choose a friendly minion, add a golden copy of it to your hand.
Hm... combo piece waiting to happen, I suppose. Trump rightly pointed to certain power cards you could play it with, like Aya, Kazakus, or Keleseth. The question is, will such a straightforward value use of it be enough to earn it a spot in genuinely competitive decks despite its poor stats? That strikes me as up in the air, but I could see it. There's been a lot of good battlecries around lately, and those are perfect for Zola to copy. Regardless of that though, I half suspect we'll see it just to enable some crazy combo someday - these sorts of cards almost always seem to.
Eh, I don't know, it could help. Though needing to pay another mana per recruit isn't great, and the initial body is pretty crap... I don't know, it probably needs another, better card to help, but three recruit-summoners is a decent number to make the deck worth trying, I think.
Comparing it to Tortollan Primalist doesn't strike me as a great endorsement, based on my experience with that card in arena. Textbook unreliable card. And yeah, the possible overload cost is pretty bad to throw in on top of its already steep price tag.Toph Pony avatar by Dirtytabs. Thanks!
"When I was ten, I read fairy tales in secret and would have been ashamed if I had been found doing so. Now that I am fifty, I read them openly. When I became a man, I put away childish things, including the fear of childishness and the desire to be very grown up." -C.S. Lewis
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2017-11-21, 08:58 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Hearthstone 20: What is your Quest?
Had a pretty tense game on ladder against a Quest Mage, playing a Dragon Priest, which ended anti-climatically.
The opponent had just drawn her last card when she dropped the combo: Three apprentices + Molten Reflection on one of them + Quest Reward, leaving her with two cards in hand. At the start of the bonus turn she draws her first fatigue card, dropping her to 3 health. Then she plays Antonidas. And then delays for a bit.
I was about ready to concede, feeling like I was being BM'd, but I had some free time so I decided I could wait 90 seconds.
Her final card was Arcane Intellect, drawing two more fatigue cards, killing her.
Upon reviewing the scenario, I realized that if she had played only three apprentices and the quest reward, followed by Antonidas + Molten Reflection on the bonus turn, she wouldn't have overdrawn and would have begun the infinite fireball chain as intended, winning the game. Lucky me, I guess.Awesome OOTS-style Fallout New Vegas avatar by Ceika. Or it was, before Photobucket started charging money.
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2017-11-22, 01:40 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Hearthstone 20: What is your Quest?
More cards reveals, can't link because I'm on phone.
Notably, however:
3 mana 2/4 Neutral "Battlecry, if this is your only minion, gain Taunt and Divine Shield "
Holy cow, this is a strict buff to Reno priest, which was already dominant (especially in Wild, apparently).
I don't know if this is better than Tar Creeper, but now reno decks can run both.Originally Posted by actual quote from this forum
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2017-11-22, 02:37 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Hearthstone 20: What is your Quest?
Last edited by Joran; 2017-11-22 at 02:37 PM.
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2017-11-23, 12:36 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Hearthstone 20: What is your Quest?
Well, fair warning for this week's Brawl: if you get the chance to pick Keleseth, don't. For some reason, he just does not work - even if his battlecry goes off, the cards don't retain the buff when they make it to your hand. I can only assume that means that the game doesn't recognize the cards you're getting each turn as being the same ones from your deck, even though they functionally are.
Toph Pony avatar by Dirtytabs. Thanks!
"When I was ten, I read fairy tales in secret and would have been ashamed if I had been found doing so. Now that I am fifty, I read them openly. When I became a man, I put away childish things, including the fear of childishness and the desire to be very grown up." -C.S. Lewis
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2017-11-23, 01:20 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Hearthstone 20: What is your Quest?
When you play a minion, a copy of them is added back into the deck. So when you summon Keleseth, there's a 2 drop (keleseth) in the deck, so it doesn't trigger. At least that's what I assume the internal logic is. I had someone earlier summon a Finja and then kill a minion to summon his Finja to the field.
Anyway, I had a lot of fun with this one. I actually went through and did a run with each class just because. Went 10-2 went 2-1 with Paladin, went for the second win with it because first opponent conceded on turn 3 for a reason I didn't understand until a few games later. On that note: Firefly and Igneous Elemental? Don't take them in this brawl. It sounds like a great idea during turns 1-3, because they give you great value. But each time they trigger, those 1/2 elementals get shuffled back into your deck. That was what I assume caused my opponent to forfeit after playing Firefly on turns 1 2 and 3, he suddenly realized he was drawing nothing but little 1/2 elementals, effectively making his deck trash. I made the same mistake with Igneous the next game, resulting in my loss with Paladin.
On the other hand, any form of card generation that gets a decent card is great. Shallow Grave Digger, Bone Drake, the triclass discovers, etc, are all really clutch. It's an extra chance to grab a good card, and brings up your overall deck quality quickly. Sherazin in Rogue is also bonkers, because you have enough cards to proc it every turn, and will be able to summon it multiple times. My second loss, playing Warrior, was against a Rogue who had 4 Sherazins that he resummoned 5 back to back turns before overwhelming me. Definitely the biggest surprise of the night for me.If my text is blue, I'm being sarcastic.But you already knew that, right?
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2017-11-23, 01:47 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Hearthstone 20: What is your Quest?
Hm, that might be the case, depending on when exactly the copy going into the deck triggers and resolves, yeah.
I've always played Rogue in this Brawl each time it's shown up - seems like the best class for it to me. You've got the dagger to control chickens in the early game, plus all those coins and 1-drops trigger combos very easily, making things like SI:7 Agent or Jade Shuriken very strong early pulls that help you just snowball. Plus you can pull Edwin Van Cleef or Biteweed (I might have that name wrong; the 2-mana version of Edwin) for a likely easy win. (Or Questing Adventurer, but anyone can get him).Toph Pony avatar by Dirtytabs. Thanks!
"When I was ten, I read fairy tales in secret and would have been ashamed if I had been found doing so. Now that I am fifty, I read them openly. When I became a man, I put away childish things, including the fear of childishness and the desire to be very grown up." -C.S. Lewis
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2017-11-23, 03:56 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Hearthstone 20: What is your Quest?
Hemet, Jungle Hunter is actually hilariously good in this brawl. He nukes all the chickens and coins and spare parts in your deck, and can even get rid of trash cards you picked up when nothing better was offered, as long as they cost less than three. He also doesn't kill the ones in your hand, so if you want something to stick around as an option you can still play him as long as it's also in your hand.
I used to do LP's. Currently archived here:
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My Games:
The Great Divide Dark Heresy - Finished
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House of Glass Dark Heresy - Deceased
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Sea of Stars Rogue Trader - Ongoing