Resurrection

[Jasdoif]

Well, if there's no coffin, then all the throat lozenges are wasted.

That's why you have the bottle of cough syrup as a backup.

[jokem]

Unwilling:
1) Control Undead
2) Commanding Undead (through rebuking)
3) Dominate Monster metamagicked with Song of the Dead
4) Command Undead spell
5) Charm Monster metamagicked with Song of the Dead
6) Suggestion music with Requiem feat

Willing:
7) Break Enchantment on someone who became undead under the influence of alignment changing magic (Morality Undone spell or some cursed item), then maybe also Atonement
8) SotD-ed Programmed Amnesia
9) Target of Convert the Unfaithful feature of Evangelist class
10) Some DM-accepted role-playing that the undead understood it's own misery and suffering

2 is much harder to pull off than 1 due to the HD limit for the undead (half your cleric level for commanded undead, twice your caster level for controlled undead).

4-6 would require good Bluff or SotD-ed Modify Memory (maybe enhanced with lowering the Int score, i.e. through SotD-ed Ray of Stupidity) and opposed Charisma check.

3&8 are 9th level spells with metamagic, so they need either epic level, cheesing metamagic cost decrease or using some special prestige class combination: one with house-ruled lowered spell levels or fast progression class (Apostle of Peace, Divine Crusader, Ur-Priest) followed by existing-feature-progression class (Legacy Champion/Uncanny Trickster).

Neither looks very promising for Order of the Stick - their wizard chose Necromancy as one of banned schools of magic and is capable of casting only 8th level spells, allied cleric is too low-level, noone has the right feats or class, Break Enchantment won't work on a vampire.

Personally, I bet on the plot-twist: What if Durkon's hands are tied up just allegorially, not literally - he's just not used to go against all those ridiculous dwarven religional traditions[1]? Only the Giant knows how vampirism really works in OotS world, we are just assuming. But assuming is like breathing - you only notice doing it when you stop[2].

[1]. oots1003
[2]. oots1000

Based upon the latest strip, it looks like Vararsuvius is 17th level (34hr Forcecage) so has access to 9th level spells. Of course after the vampire hit, maybe not... If Limited Wish is accessible, then Restoration might be be available that way.

[Jasdoif]

Based upon the latest strip, it looks like Vararsuvius is 17th level (34hr Forcecage)

Or more likely, 16th level with a caster level boost.

[jokem]

Yes, that makes sense. The limited wish option is still available for Restoration, though. Assuming V has it access.

[Dycedarg]

It's a bit of a quandary, as I can't see any way, either by 3.5 rules or from what we've seen in the comic, to retrieve a body part for resurrection before the vampire is smoke or ash. However, Durkon certainly seemed to think so when he volunteered to raise Malack, and Malack didn't object on that basis, which is at least some evidence that it is possible. Further, from a story perspective it seems somewhat anticlimactic for the result to the raise Durkon quest to be that it was impossible the whole time.

[Kish]

It's a bit of a quandary, as I can't see any way, either by 3.5 rules or from what we've seen in the comic, to retrieve a body part for resurrection before the vampire is smoke or ash. However, Durkon certainly seemed to think so when he volunteered to raise Malack, and Malack didn't object on that basis, which is at least some evidence that it is possible.

I would think the answer to that would be encoded in the question.

i.e.: you cast Resurrection on the vampire's ashes.

[Riftwolf]

There's another possibility without undead.

What if a dead cleric petitioner cast plane shift to return to the Material Plane and raised dead on himself? I'd GM that petitioners lose cleric abilities upon death, but as a thought experiment, is there any RAW that'd prevent this?

[Jasdoif]

What if a dead cleric petitioner cast plane shift to return to the Material Plane and raised dead on himself? I'd GM that petitioners lose cleric abilities upon death, but as a thought experiment, is there any RAW that'd prevent this?

Petitioners can't leave their plane. (I'd also be hard-pressed to accept that a template with static hit dice and CR could allow keeping class levels.)

[Dycedarg]

I would think the answer to that would be encoded in the question.

i.e.: you cast Resurrection on the vampire's ashes.

Ah yes, that would do it, wouldn't it. I'd forgotten how open ended the requirements for resurrection are; I'd been thinking it took a body part. Still, they'd better kill him either in a sealed room or with sun light, or they'll have a heck of a time tracking down where Durkon* chooses to deposit his remains, assuming he doesn't have a coffin. He'd put them somewhere impossible to find just to spite them.

[RatElemental]

Petitioners can't leave their plane. (I'd also be hard-pressed to accept that a template with static hit dice and CR could allow keeping class levels.)

I'm pretty sure that one way or another that means they lose all class abilities (or maybe just ones that take a level higher than 2?)

That does stop someone else from freeing/kidnapping them from their afterlife, though. But even if they could get back to the material plane, they have no feats, no skills, lose all supernatural or spell like abilities, and may or may not have their ability scores capped. Oh and they don't remember their previous life at all, unless their deity wants them to for some reason, in which case they keep their feats and skills but not any of the other stuff.

It'd be like those people in zombie movies that keep their zombie friends/family around. Even if you could pull it off, for all intents and purposes that thing that looks like grandma isn't grandma anymore, if she doesn't remember you or even anything about herself at all.

lotsa edits for clarity/changes made because I wrote this while sleep deprived.

[factotum]

None of that seems to be what actually happens in the Stickverse, though? We've seen the afterlife from a number of viewpoints, and in all cases the people involved (Roy, Jirix, the High Priest of Azure City) remembered their lives and appeared to still have their class abilities.

[Kish]

Bringing in the term "petitioner" serves only to muddy the waters here. If we're talking about OotS, Roy was conspicuously unable to interact with any part of the living world when he was dead. Why would a cleric be more able to cast Raise Dead on their corpse than Roy was to lift his corpse?

[factotum]

If we're talking about OotS, Roy was conspicuously unable to interact with any part of the living world when he was dead.

On the other hand, Soon was just as dead and yet was able to stab Xykon and Redcloak without difficulty, so there isn't any hard and fast rule to this.

[Peelee]

On the other hand, Soon was just as dead and yet was able to stab Xykon and Redcloak without difficulty, so there isn't any hard and fast rule to this.

Soon was bound by an oath, though, which do seen to have significant effects on the spirits.

[Grey_Wolf_c]

Soon was bound by an oath, though, which do seen to have significant effects on the spirits.

So was Roy...

GW

[Peelee]

So was Roy...

GW

Different oaths can be presumed to have different effects. If Eugene's oath was enough to affect his progeny, then I see no reason why other oaths could not have fairly far-reaching effects, within reason.

[Grey_Wolf_c]

Different oaths can be presumed to have different effects. If Eugene's oath was enough to affect his progeny, then I see no reason why other oaths could not have fairly far-reaching effects, within reason.

Indeed. I don't think we can reach any conclusions on who can and cannot cast resurrection spells once dead based on available evidence, and while a given individual having made a vow might be relevant based on the vow made, we cannot generalize from the existence of vows, since they run the full gamut from "observe only" to "kick ass"

GW

[factotum]

I don't think the oath is relevant to the point at hand. Kish was saying that ghosts can't affect the real world, so a ghostly cleric would not be able to cast Resurrect on their own corpse. I just pointed out an example of a ghost who *could* affect the real world. Oaths or whatever don't make a difference to that--Soon was still a ghost despite his oath.

[Fyraltari]

I don't think the oath is relevant to the point at hand. Kish was saying that ghosts can't affect the real world, so a ghostly cleric would not be able to cast Resurrect on their own corpse. I just pointed out an example of a ghost who *could* affect the real world. Oaths or whatever don't make a difference to that--Soon was still a ghost despite his oath.

Soon was a positive-eneregy-based undead so not exactly a ghost stricto sensu.

[RatElemental]

Bringing in the term "petitioner" serves only to muddy the waters here. If we're talking about OotS, Roy was conspicuously unable to interact with any part of the living world when he was dead. Why would a cleric be more able to cast Raise Dead on their corpse than Roy was to lift his corpse?

But of course. Someone just asked a question about if there was RAW that prevented someone from resurrecting themselves. As for OotS, I think the difference might be in that the ghost martyrs apparently never went to the afterlife until after they were destroyed.

[hroþila]

Soon was a positive-eneregy-based undead so not exactly a ghost stricto sensu.

If we can trust Redcloak's analysis (and I think we can)...

I don't think they ARE ghosts. I don't even think they're undead.

Therefore, that they could affect the real world has no bearing on whether ghosts can.

[martianmister]

Exactly. Soon and Ghost Martyrs are different from normal ghosts.