Greatest anime of all time?

[Lethologica]

I feel like I may just be the only person in the world who doesn't like Evangelion.

I dislike Evangelion if I'm in a bad mood. But then, I'm not exactly eager to sit through Citizen Kane or 2001 again, and those are indubitably tremendously influential classics of their medium. Quality is far from completely objective, but it's also far from being completely subjective the way taste is.

[Razade]

I feel like I may just be the only person in the world who doesn't like Evangelion.

You're not. It's utter garbage and I'd write a full length dissertation episode by episode to prove just how utterly up it's own behind it is. It is the "I took a class of philosophy and World Religions in college so let me explain to you how much I really GET every other bit of media out there" of people.

[Mx.Silver]

Well, at least we managed to get through one page of replies without someone starting to complain about how they think one of things mentioned is "utter crap/the worst ever/etc."

Also, where are we on particularly new stuff like Your Name and A Silent Voice?

Well, do you think they're 'must-see' films? As that's what's being asked of us*, and trying to appeal to a consensus view is probably not going to get terribly far.


*which is also the main reason why we're not answering this in the form of 'most historically important/influential series': that wasn't the question being asked.

[Eldan]

Oh, I absolutely hated Evangelion when I watched it the first time. I thought the symbolism was empty and stupid, all the main characters somewhere between unlikeable and despicable (especially Shinji. Oh how I hated Shinji), I found all the mecha fights boring as hell and the story overall nonsensical.

Then I watched it again years later out of boredom and found out I really liked it. Despite the symbolism still being empty and stupid. But I found I suddenly liked the characters and story. And the fights. Can't say why, even, I'm sure as hell not more mature or anything.

[BWR]

Oh, I absolutely hated Evangelion when I watched it the first time. I thought the symbolism was empty and stupid, all the main characters somewhere between unlikeable and despicable (especially Shinji. Oh how I hated Shinji), I found all the mecha fights boring as hell and the story overall nonsensical.

Then I watched it again years later out of boredom and found out I really liked it. Despite the symbolism still being empty and stupid. But I found I suddenly liked the characters and story. And the fights. Can't say why, even, I'm sure as hell not more mature or anything.

That was more or less my experience too. I can't exactly say I like the characters but they became more engaging? sympathetic? relatable?...on the second viewing.
And NGE wasn't the only show that I hated at first and liked later.

More on topic, the real 20 must see anime.

[Celestia]

Well, at least I'm not alone in hating it.

[Hunter Noventa]

Yeah its stuck in licensing limbo. I dont know the exact details, but basically no one is allowed to release it in any format.

Yeah, ADV Films folded and the license for the TV series has gone into Limbo. Makes me glad I got the platinum release when I did.

And I'll the first to admit that Evangelion has major flaws, but something can still be influential despite that. Doesn't mean you have to like it, just recognize that it had a large impact on anime as a whole.

Hell, the first time I saw Evangelion I was like 'Holy crap this is Xenogears all over again', right down to running out of money at the end/disc 2. Of course I loved Xenogears, but that clouded my perception of Eva.

[Ibrinar]

I think for what it is, an episodic anime non comedic anime without overarching story, I can't think of an anime I would consider better than Mushishi in this category. I rated it 10/10 which I almost never do.

But I prefer overarching stories in general. For shounen adventure with fighting type stories I consider Full metal Alchemist and HxH to be at the top of the ones I know. FMA has more of an good story while HxH has semi connected arcs but for creative fighting with a wide range of different abilities it is great.

For children/youth literature in a fantasy world Guardian of the sacred Spirit is pretty great.

Others: Last Exile,Baccano!, FLCL, Haibane Ranmei, others I don't remember at the moment.

[Leewei]

Just about any anime with a soundtrack by Yoko Kanno is worth seeing. She is to the genre what John Williams is to Western cinema. Cowboy Bebop and Ghost in the Shell have already been mentioned multiple times in this thread; she's a huge part of the reason why both series are so successful.

[Rodin]

Yeah, ADV Films folded and the license for the TV series has gone into Limbo. Makes me glad I got the platinum release when I did.

And I'll the first to admit that Evangelion has major flaws, but something can still be influential despite that. Doesn't mean you have to like it, just recognize that it had a large impact on anime as a whole.

Hell, the first time I saw Evangelion I was like 'Holy crap this is Xenogears all over again', right down to running out of money at the end/disc 2. Of course I loved Xenogears, but that clouded my perception of Eva.

My experience was clouded by seeing Rah Xephon first, which is basically Eva with a budget.

Outside of the usual suspects (including a few that people haven't specifically mentioned), I'd like to mention a few older anime for my favorite all-time list.

Trigun - one of the best self-contained, single-season animes I've seen. Also the best Western anime (not counting Cowboy Bebop, which defies genres).
Slayers Next - best fantasy anime by far, despite primarily being a comedy. For some reason I'm rarely engaged by story in anime Fantasy shows, but Slayers Next just sucked me in.
Black Cat - my nominee for "obscure shonen show that nobody seems to have seen". It's fairly old and the low budget shows, but I've been rewatching my DVDs for it the past couple weeks and I still enjoy the hell out of it. The soundtrack is also pretty fantastic.

[Eldan]

Am I the only one who thought that Trigun just wasn't that great? Not even the last few episodes? (Actually, the first half was terrible.)

[Hunter Noventa]

Am I the only one who thought that Trigun just wasn't that great? Not even the last few episodes? (Actually, the first half was terrible.)

I'll admit that I couldn't get into Trigun either. Not my cup of tea.

[BWR]

I tried Trigun twice and it just didn't do anything for me.

[Calemyr]

I tried Trigun twice and it just didn't do anything for me.

Did you watch the whole thing or just the first three? That has a major effect on things.

Trigun is pretty good but it's a trick anime: the first seven or eight episodes present something very different from the rest. When Vash actually draws his pistol for the first time, the game changes and he goes from being a comic relief idiot with inhuman luck to a tortured badass who hides behind a goofy facade as the stakes rise steadily. Vash really, really takes his non-lethal ideal seriously and willingly suffers for it on a level that few do.

That said, while the main characters do get a lot of development after Vash steps up, most of the extras and enemies are one-shots that don't get much attention, and even as a badass Vash can be very silly at times.

If you haven't watched the full thing, I suggest you give it a shot as the show does take a sharp turn into the action and drama that it was ignoring at the beginning. If you have and still don't like it, well, naturally I can't fault you.

[CarpeGuitarrem]

Am I the only one who thought that Trigun just wasn't that great? Not even the last few episodes? (Actually, the first half was terrible.)

I enjoyed it, but it's absolutely dated, especially the animation. (For contrast, I feel that Cowboy Bebop still holds up despite being 20 years old...the exact same age as Trigun.)

I think my only 100% must-watch show is probably Mushi-shi, to be honest. But maybe that's because its melancholy reflection is a perfect bullseye for me. (Moribito is a close second, but because of its pacing, I know it's not for everyone. Monster is my "masterpiece show, but definitely not for everyone".)

[Lacuna Caster]

I feel like I may just be the only person in the world who doesn't like Evangelion.

I felt that you could skip the entire first half of New Century Gospel (I refuse to use NGE) and miss very little (especially given the convenient recap episode at that precise point.) It gets much darker and more business-like at that point, which I think is more to it's strength. In terms of aesthetic structure and wrenching drama, though, it's hard to beat.

Berserk, similarly, has a questionable ending and a weak few opening episodes. But that show just haunted me, man.

GitS probably has the most reliable production values, and Yoko Kanno is fabulous, but it only has... what... two-and-a-half substantially developed characters? Everyone else is a token cipher somehow immune to the festering corruption that pervades both the political establishment and the cybercriminal underworld.

I probably need to watch Cowboy Bebop again.

Since I don't think anyone else mentioned it, and it's a nice change of pace from the above, I'll put in a good word for Bunny Drop.

[BWR]

Did you watch the whole thing or just the first three? That has a major effect on things.

Trigun is pretty good but it's a trick anime: the first seven or eight episodes present something very different from the rest. When Vash actually draws his pistol for the first time, the game changes and he goes from being a comic relief idiot with inhuman luck to a tortured badass who hides behind a goofy facade as the stakes rise steadily. Vash really, really takes his non-lethal ideal seriously and willingly suffers for it on a level that few do.

That said, while the main characters do get a lot of development after Vash steps up, most of the extras and enemies are one-shots that don't get much attention, and even as a badass Vash can be very silly at times.

If you haven't watched the full thing, I suggest you give it a shot as the show does take a sharp turn into the action and drama that it was ignoring at the beginning. If you have and still don't like it, well, naturally I can't fault you.

Honestly, I can't remember how episode I gave it. I doubt I'll give it a third try. There are a ludicrous number of shows, animated or otherwise, that I want to watch or at least give a shot, and while some things I've finished are undoubtedly worse than Trigun I feel no particular desire to try it again.

[Eldan]

I enjoyed it, but it's absolutely dated, especially the animation. (For contrast, I feel that Cowboy Bebop still holds up despite being 20 years old...the exact same age as Trigun.)

I think my only 100% must-watch show is probably Mushi-shi, to be honest. But maybe that's because its melancholy reflection is a perfect bullseye for me. (Moribito is a close second, but because of its pacing, I know it's not for everyone. Monster is my "masterpiece show, but definitely not for everyone".)

I liked the beginning of Monster. A lot. But then it became soooo slow. I kept forgetting things that happened near the beginning and by the end, I had lost interest.

[Celestia]

I felt that you could skip the entire first half of New Century Gospel (I refuse to use NGE) and miss very little (especially given the convenient recap episode at that precise point.) It gets much darker and more business-like at that point, which I think is more to it's strength. In terms of aesthetic structure and wrenching drama, though, it's hard to beat.

And the ironic part is that the first half was still better. The second half was nothing more that pseudo-intellectual, pretentious drivel. It made things confusing with no purpose, and then used its empty symbolism as a shield. "If you don't get it, then you just don't understand how deep and meaningful it is." No, I don't get it because there's nothing to get. It's not a shallow pool; it's an empty pool filled with enough hot air that someone who's not very clever may pretend it's full.

[Lacuna Caster]

And the ironic part is that the first half was still better. The second half was nothing more that pseudo-intellectual, pretentious drivel. It made things confusing with no purpose, and then used its empty symbolism as a shield. "If you don't get it, then you just don't understand how deep and meaningful it is." No, I don't get it because there's nothing to get. It's not a shallow pool; it's an empty pool filled with enough hot air that someone who's not very clever may pretend it's full.

I'm not particularly talking about the symbolism- I'm talking standard stuff about character interactions, infatuation, betrayal, isolation, etc. I like how the angels kept adapting to human defences and eventually figured out how to imitate one perfectly in order to slip past Shinji's guard (a strategy that nearly worked, as it happens.) I don't think you especially need to ascribe some deep mythological import to the Lance of Longinus for that to work.

I won't say that the budget crunch at the end was entirely to it's benefit, but it strikes as being something like one of those half-finished sculptures by michelangelo, where you can see the writhing figure trying to emerge, but the ambiguity leaves half the meaning up to the viewer.

[Peelee]

King of the Hill is obviously the best anime.

to be serious though, I don't want much anime, mostly because I don't like most of what I've seen. I do love Castle in the Sky and Princess Mononoke, as well as the original Dragon Ball and DBZ (and, of course, Dragonball Abridged)

[Yora]

Not sure about how well it's been adapted, but the manga of Monster is phenomenally good. When I got it recommended I was warned that I would want to read through the whole thing in one weekend. And I did. From noon to 4 am, with a short sleep brake, snd then continue at 10 am on sunday until I was done. I said the same thing to other people I recommended it and two of them did as well.

[Jay R]

I've seen very little anime, but Gankutsuou (The Count of Monte Cristo) deserves a mention.

In many ways, it is very close to the original – even including characters like Franz d’Epinay, Luigi Vampa, Peppino (renamed Peppo), Eugenie Danglars, Lucien Debray, and Beauchamp, who are usually not included. It also has scenes like Carnival, the opera, the executions, Albert’s kidnapping, the Count’s arrival in Paris at Albert’s, and Mercedes’s portrait, which are also usually not seen.

It has almost every important character is the original, except Louise d'Armilly (who appears to be replaced by Eugénie's music).

On the other hand, it starts at Carnival, which has been transferred from Rome to the moon, and we see the spaceport in Paris, so there are some real changes as well. [Although the Colosseum on the moon seems awfully faithful to the original.] We do not see the Count’s origin at first. It is, in a very real sense, the story of Albert Morcerf and how is life is changed by the foreign Count he meets, not the story of Edmond Dantes. Gven the SF device of Gankutsuou, that actually makes sense.

And it's true science fiction, not just an adventure story in a futuristic setting. The idea of Gankutsuou is fascinating and changed the whole meaning of Edmond's return.

The rotoscoping makes the backgrounds impressive and real - they really bring you into the science-fictional world. One the other (fourth?) hand, the way they handle coloring the clothes and hair never stopped being a huge distraction. How can you have such lush, immersive backgrounds and continually distract from the story with a cheap, meaningless coloring scheme?

The better you know Dumas's original novel, the more fascinating (and occasionally frustrating) this version is. It is both the most faithful and the most outlandishly distorted version ever made.