Changing Druid

[8wGremlin]

Can a changing Druid wild shape in to a bear then shape change into its own form?

What stats would it use?
How long would those stats last for, if 2nd level?

Could they speak?

[th3g0dc0mp13x]

I'm sorry your question is baffling me a little bit. For the second part are you talking about the shapechange spell? If so you can't use that spell in wildshape even at level 20. (Unless your an ape and even then it's gonna be weird.) If your asking if you can wildshape into yourself, I'm pretty sure that the playable races aren't considered beasts.

[KingWhipsy]

I'm sorry your question is baffling me a little bit. For the second part are you talking about the shapechange spell? If so you can't use that spell in wildshape even at level 20. (Unless your an ape and even then it's gonna be weird.) If your asking if you can wildshape into yourself, I'm pretty sure that the playable races aren't considered beasts.

I believe it's meant to be changeling instead of changing. As for the answer, I don't know.

[Tubben]

Can a changing Druid wild shape in to a bear then shape change into its own form?

What stats would it use?
How long would those stats last for, if 2nd level?

Could they speak?

Not sure if i understand your question.

If a Changeling is an Druid, he can Wild shape into a bear. He can then return to his Changeling form.
He cant Wildshape into a Changeling, because a Changeling is not a beast.

A lv 2 Druid can hold a wildshaped form for 60 minutes.

Edit: A Wildshaped Druid cant speak, unless the form is able to speak by itself. An Druid who Elementar Wild Shaped into an Elementar could speak. A bear can not.

[DivisibleByZero]

Can a changing Druid wild shape in to a bear then shape change into its own form?

What stats would it use?
How long would those stats last for, if 2nd level?

Could they speak?

If he reverts to his own form, the Wild Shape period ends.

[Sidson]

Changeling can Shapeshifr into humanoid it have seen and back to true form.

Wild Shape lets druid change shape into beast/elemental and back into druid.

Beast/elemental is not humanoid, so Changeling cannot change back into true form by shapechange. But it could change back into humanoid by reversing Wild Shape.

[8wGremlin]

Sorry, yes Changeling using their Shapechanger ability

"Shapechanger. As an action, you can polymorph into any humanoid of your size that you have seen, orback into your true form. However, your equipment does not change with you. If you die, you revert toyour natural appearance."
cite - https://media.wizards.com/2015/downl...Eberron_v1.pdf

1. Druid wild shapes into bear.
2. Changeling uses and action to turn into a humanoid (say elf)
3. What game effects are still in operation?
4. how long do the effects last?

Given that the Druid is 2nd level

[Avonar]

Sorry, yes Changeling using their Shapechanger ability

"Shapechanger. As an action, you can polymorph into any humanoid of your size that you have seen, orback into your true form. However, your equipment does not change with you. If you die, you revert toyour natural appearance."
cite - https://media.wizards.com/2015/downl...Eberron_v1.pdf

1. Druid wild shapes into bear.
2. Changeling uses and action to turn into a humanoid (say elf)
3. What game effects are still in operation?
4. how long do the effects last?

Given that the Druid is 2nd level

Personally I'd rule that as a bear, the changeling no longer has access to the Shapechanger ability as he is technically not a changeling right then.

[DivisibleByZero]

Personally I'd rule that as a bear, the changeling no longer has access to the Shapechanger ability as he is technically not a changeling right then.

.... Which is precisely why the Wild Shape ends when you become yourself again.
Don't overthink it.
If you Wild Shape into a bear, that Wild Shape ends when you are no longer a bear.

[8wGremlin]

What happens if he doesn't become themselves but another Humanoid.


And Wilshape states:
"You retain the benefit of any features from your class, race, or other source and can use them if the new form is physically capable of doing so."

Are you saying that if a Variant human wild shapes into bear they lose their extra feat?

[Aett_Thorn]

What happens if he doesn't become themselves but another Humanoid.


And Wilshape states:
"You retain the benefit of any features from your class, race, or other source and can use them if the new form is physically capable of doing so."

Are you saying that if a Variant human wild shapes into bear they lose their extra feat?

No, but they can only use it if their new form allows. For instance, if the vHuman takes Polearm Mastery, then a bear using their claws wouldn't apply the benefits of it, since the natural weapons aren't a Polearm. However, they would still retain the benefits of Observant, since they still have access to their sense.

[Tubben]

If you are Wildshaped and then shapechange into an elf, you end Wildshape and use the stats of your normal form. It's really that simple.

[DivisibleByZero]

If you are Wildshaped and then shapechange into an elf, you end Wildshape and use the stats of your normal form. It's really that simple.

Seriously.
I have no idea why people are finding this difficult, or why they're confused about which stats to use.
When you are no longer in the form that you Wild Shaped into, your Wild Shape ends.

[Aett_Thorn]

Seriously.
I have no idea why people are finding this difficult, or why they're confused about which stats to use.
When you are no longer in the form that you Wild Shaped into, your Wild Shape ends.

But come on! Bear-elf!

[Quoxis]

But come on! Bear-elf!

The discussion is becoming un-bear-able.

[Corpsecandle717]

@OP

It feels like you're trying to layer your HP poosl so when you reach 0 from your polymoph you then drop into your wildshape HP pool, then when that hits 0 you've got your character hp pool.

I don't think it works that way though:

From polymorph:
The target assumes the hit points of its new form. When it reverts to its normal form, the creature returns to the number of hit points it had before it transformed. If it reverts as a result of dropping to 0 hit points, any excess damage carries over to its normal form. As long as the excess damage doesn't reduce the creature's normal form to 0 hit points, it isn't knocked unconscious.

From wildshape:
When you transform, you assume the beast’s hit points and Hit Dice. When you revert to your normal form, you return to the number of hit points you had before you transformed. However, if you revert as a result of dropping to 0 hit points, any excess damage carries over to your normal form. For example, if you take 10 damage in animal form and have only 1 hit point left, you revert and take 9 damage. As long as the excess damage doesn’t reduce your normal form to 0 hit points, you aren’t knocked unconscious.

Both features indicate you return to your normal form when you're 'knocked out' of your shifted form.

In addition any action you take to change shape (via polymorph or wildshape) automatically recreates a brand new HP pool to work with.

[8wGremlin]

More of a what stats do you whilst in the 'elf' form.
Do you have the bears stats (HP, attacks etc) or 'elf' stats?

I hadn't even thought about the HP issue.

I'm more exploring the problem space of this rules interaction.

[DivisibleByZero]

More of a what stats do you whilst in the 'elf' form.
Do you have the bears stats (HP, attacks etc) or 'elf' stats?

I hadn't even thought about the HP issue.

I'm more exploring the problem space of this rules interaction.

You have neither the bear stats nor the Elf stats. You have your own Changeling stats.
There are no rules interactions.

You Wild Shape into a bear, and your stats change from yours to the bears.
As soon as you are no longer a bear, your Wild Shape ends, and you have your own stats again, regardless of teh form you Shapwchange into, because whiole Shapechanged you have your own stats.

[Corpsecandle717]

You have neither the bear stats nor the Elf stats. You have your own Changeling stats.
There are no rules interactions.

You Wild Shape into a bear, and your stats change from yours to the bears.
As soon as you are no longer a bear, your Wild Shape ends, and you have your own stats again, regardless of teh form you Shapwchange into, because whiole Shapechanged you have your own stats.

I agree the fact that the character has wildshape has no bearing (no pun intended) (well maybe a little) on the Changelings shapechanger feature.

However I don't think the shapechange ability of a Changeling is that cut and dry. The Changeling specifically says it polymorph into any humanoid it has seen. Polymorph says you take on all the statistics of the creature you change into (including mental stats). Given the Doppelgangers history of taking on the forms of the specific people for infiltration. it seems to me the intent is that the Changeling takes on all the stats of the specific individual they're trying to mimic, while retaining their own alignment and personality. There's nothing in the Changeling description that overrides any of the wording in polymorph accept that creature being mimicked is a humanoid instead of a beast.

I'm pretty new to 5e though so there may be some other rules about polymorph that I haven't seen.

[DivisibleByZero]

If and when Changelings ever become official, you can bet that it won't be a polymorph (as per the spell). It will be something more akin to 3e's Alter Self, where your physical form changes but you keep your stats. I guarantee it. Opens up too many shenanigans otherwise.
You have to remember that we're talking about a play test race here, and that UA material is not fully edited and ready for play.