Thoughts on pineapple on pizza?

[Cicciograna]

They say "pizza napoletana' is made this way". Nowhere do they say that it's the only correct pizza or even a particularly good pizza. The designation only means that it's a particular kind of pizza that is unique to one place and culture.

And indeed, I never wrote anywhere that pizza napoletana is THE pizza, the best pizza, the original pizza.
Quite the contrary, I stated that

I would not call that the "original" pizza. It's just one way to making it, albeit one which is rooted in a long tradition: as you say, the recognition is important, but it doesn't render "less good" anything different.

Then, moving on,

"Champagne" is strictly defined but that doesn't mean champagne is at all better than any other wine. It certainly doesn't mean it's wrong to call an Australian or Chilean merlot "wine".

Neither I said that champagne is better than any other wine. We were discussing of what one expects when mentioning a certain kind of culinary product.

[DigoDragon]

If the crust is thin enough to be folded, you’re doing it wrong.

Fan of Chicago style I take it? That's not a pizza, that's a casserole. It's so deep I feel like I should toss a coin in and make a wish.

Isn't that a Calzone, then?

That's blasphemy and you know it. ;)

Proper pizza has a crust thick enough to sop up the grease on your plate.

Even thick crust can be folded. I've had no issues. It's all in the mad NY skills.

[Scarlet Knight]

Even thick crust can be folded. I've had no issues. It's all in the mad NY skills.

Hear ! Hear!

[Rockphed]

Even thick crust can be folded. I've had no issues. It's all in the mad NY skills.

It very much depends on crust thickness, crust doneness, and piece size. Proper pizza has a thick, well done crust that remains almost flat when held level by the edge. Yes, you can fold it, but only uncultured philistines want to.

[Razade]

It's the most that we have, and indeed, in an increasingly globalized world it's an admirable task to preserve the cultural heritage of people.

Totally agree! We should do more!

True, we can tell it to bend over, since they don't have "the power to enforce their guidelines outside their sphere of influence", which is a statement which honestly creeps me out, because it almost seems to be implying that, instead, an organization who has the means of enforcing its propositions has in fact the right of making these propositions. But as far as organizations go, it is indeed an organization, it has official recognitions, for those that recognize it, and thus fits entirely the bill.

It still doesn't say that Pizza Margherita is the only true or official pizza. It simply demarcates it from other pizza.

By all means, go for it. It's interesting your mention of "spite", but you do you.

Is it? It was mostly just being cheeky.

Just don't go around selling it, your customers might be somewhat disappointed.

I mean, I can still sell it. As whatever I want. Disappointed customers just means I can't do it for long.

Cuisine, just as any other human endeavour, has a set of codified guidelines: you can put olives, pineapple, cream, marshmallows and honey on a pizza and call it a Margherita, and in your own world you have all the rights to call it a Margherita. You don't, however, have "the means to enforce your definition" on other people, especially not Italians, who have a different definition of pizza Margherita.

The "codified guidelines" of cooking would be...chemistry. Beyond that, there really isn't.

Now, there's an organization that recognizes a certain variation of pizza, and determines that a specific way of making pizza is called "pizza napoletana". It is a recognition that a lot of other culinary compositions don't have. You are free to recognize it or not, but at this point you are free to adorn your hair with feathers, dancing naked covered in mud, and pretend that what you are doing is Nogaku theatre. Oh look, Nogaku theatre is also intangible heritage recognized by UNESCO.

Sure but again, that only works if you buy into it.

Go try to sell Champagne made in your basement and labelled as Champagne.

As long as I do it in California I am free to do so.

The situation is always the same. You like it? Enjoy it. It's food, for Pelor's sake, and we shouldn't be arguing on what's "official" or not.

I think I've made my point clear that we shouldn't because official or not doesn't enter the equation.

And again, personally I don't give a frack about how it is called, and I feel that everybody should be waaaay more relaxed about it. Heck, I'd try whatever you give me to eat, I would actually indeed have lunch with you, and then bring you to my place and make you food. If we argue over food, OVER FOOD TOO, then Mankind is doomed.

I mean. This is just an internet forum. The other chefs and foodies I hang out with aren't so pretentious as to tell people that it's not real pizza if it's got pineapple on it.

[Grey_Wolf_c]

As long as I do it in California I am free to do so.

You aren't, unless you've been doing it since March 10th, 2006.

Grey Wolf

[Brighteyes]

Pineapple on Pizza is the most amazing thing.
Pineapple on anything is amazing.
Pineapple on pineapple is amazing.

[DeadToRide]

Pineapple on Pizza is the most amazing thing.
Pineapple on anything is amazing.
Pineapple on pineapple is amazing.

Honestly the pizza just gets in the way of the pineapple.

[Florian]

As I mentioned in my first post in the thread, white pizza is excellent, with and even without bacon. I do agree, though, that carbonara with cream is just silly. I suspect it's the result of someone attempting to duplicate carbonara, missing/skipping/bungling several key steps, and using cream to cover for a weak sauce.

Someone is going to have to explain me, though, how a bunch of charcoal-makers-turned-secret society came up it, though.

*Roaring laughter*

Ok, in this case, it´s actually the other way around. "Carbonara" is actually a pretty new invention and hails back to the 60s, when german tourism in Italy started in earnest and the hotels and restaurants there frantically worked out some recipes that would be tasty to the german palate. So they used four ingredients that are known to be wide-spread in german cuisine, cream, smoked bacon, onions and garlic, mixed that with a raw egg for consistence and called it a day.

The more refined forms that we see nowadays, raw egg yolk, freshly pressed citrus, ground pepper and such, is not the original but the attempt to transfer "tourist trash" back into mainstream italian cuisine.

It is tangential to the point, but it is still worth noting, thanks for doing so. There is such a thing as "original pizza", and I approve of it being a protected designation, just as Champagne really should be fizzy wine from the Champagne region. It is good that no-one can make claims they are not able to substantiate, as you said. It just doesn't render any non-original somehow invalid. Just different, which in my books is good.

I'm working in the alcoholic beverages business, so I know a little bit about the whole background, laws and such. A "little bit" prolly means more than 98% of the worlds population, when it comes to that.

A thing like "Champagne" is not only tied to the region, but also tied to regional base products and ingredients. The grapes themselves must come from the champagne region and a good part of the are red, treated in such a way to produce white wine, which is part of the whole deal. The parameters what makes a "Champagne" are far stricter that just "fizzy wine from the Champagne region".

Me, I deal heavily in "Berlin White" style of beer, which includes heavy regional as well as procedural parameters. I'm always a bit of p****d-off when some US craft brewer throws a sour beer on the market and calls it "Berlin White". Hell, even Stone Brewing (Berlin) had the courtesy to consult with the VLB and brewers association before calling their "White Ghost" a "Berlin White".

@Pizza:

I´m an old-school European. Pizza should come from a wood fired, brick build oven, be a simple affair with a thin crust, good red or white base and few but tasty topics. Do I go to Pizza Hut and grab a slice on the go? Yes, but it´s not what I order when I actually want a pizza.
ground
(Craft beer and wood-fired pizza is a great combination and we focus on that at our place. We actually use one of those: http://www.stefanoferraraforni.it/en/)

Edit: My favorite kinds are actually one very old-school and one very new-school ones:
- Margherita with Mozzarella and fresh basil.
- Basic red sauce pizza, topped with Arugula, Prosciutto di Parma and ground Parmigiano after baking.

[Xuc Xac]

A thing like "Champagne" is not only tied to the region, but also tied to regional base products and ingredients. The grapes themselves must come from the champagne region and a good part of the are red, treated in such a way to produce white wine, which is part of the whole deal.

Red wine and white wine are made from the same grapes. Red grapes and white grapes are both white inside and have clear juice. The difference depends on when the liquid is separated from the fruit pulp. If you crush the grapes, ferment the mash, then pour off the liquid, it's red. If you crush the grapes, pour off the liquid, then ferment only the juice without skins and pulp, it's white. If you distill the wine, it's brandy. If you ferment the leftover skins and pulp after making white wine and distill that, it's grappa.

[Florian]

Red wine and white wine are made from the same grapes. Red grapes and white grapes are both white inside and have clear juice. The difference depends on when the liquid is separated from the fruit pulp. If you crush the grapes, ferment the mash, then pour off the liquid, it's red. If you crush the grapes, pour off the liquid, then ferment only the juice without skins and pulp, it's white. If you distill the wine, it's brandy. If you ferment the leftover skins and pulp after making white wine and distill that, it's grappa.

Yes, Blanc de Noir is a thing, as I mentioned.

Don't be so sure about it being a brandy or grappa, tho.....

[TerrickTerran]

love pineapple on pizza. Cool if people don't though.

[DeadToRide]

Red wine and white wine are made from the same grapes. Red grapes and white grapes are both white inside and have clear juice. The difference depends on when the liquid is separated from the fruit pulp. If you crush the grapes, ferment the mash, then pour off the liquid, it's red. If you crush the grapes, pour off the liquid, then ferment only the juice without skins and pulp, it's white. If you distill the wine, it's brandy. If you ferment the leftover skins and pulp after making white wine and distill that, it's grappa.

I mean, kind of. Red grapes can be white at the very center, but depending on the growing conditions and variety is more likely to be red-pink most of the way through. For example when growing an intense shiraz varietal they are generally mostly water starved to intensify tannins, resulting in very small completely black/red grapes.

Blanc de Noir wines are white wines made from red grapes, most commonly Pinot Noir varietal. This includes some traditional champagnes that use the red pinot grape. Generally, when red grapes are pressed and fermented sans skins the end product is a rosé. Basically, with a few specific exceptions, mostly pinot noir or champage, for the vast majority of wines a grape of the corresponding colour is used. Red grapes make red wine or rosés, and white grapes make white wine.

[anhuangdi]

Tastes good. never understood the people who dont like it.. but we're all different I guess!

[kennygill]

Italian government saying it's not a pizza